Homeschooling adoptees with defiance issues

[HS Mom in NC]

If you are an adoptive parent of a child with defiance issues or you have personally heard an adoptive parent in that situation talk about it, how has it come up in your homeschooling and what, if anything have you done to deal with it?  If you have both homeschooled and sent your child to an institutional setting, what caused you to make the change?  How did the transition go?  What issues came up in the institutional school and how did you deal with them? If your child started out in an institutional school and you decided to homeschool, what issues prompted it?  How did the transition go?  What issues came up at home and how have you dealt with them?

[PeterPan]

ODD and ASD overlap. You might come over to LC and post as well. Are you considering fostering/adopting and trying to know what you're taking on? Or are you trying to help someone else?

 

The challenge with adoption is that, on top of everything else, you may or may not know the genetics to know what you're really dealing with. Severe non-compliance and oppositional behaviors in your own, bio child are mind-boggling and exhausting. To deal with that in an adoption situation would be exceedingly challenging. Like the person is a saint challenging. Like people end up giving up the kids and it kills them challenging. But there are people on LC who've stuck with it and gotten it to work, yes.

 

School for behavior issues? Sure it's on the table. You're going to spend 4 months to a year going through the glorious IEP process, and you're going to fight the school and maybe sue them to get things better. You might end up wanting an alternative school placement, if your state has them.

 

My ds has an IEP and it ain't a pretty one. He has extremely challenging behaviors. In his case he would be placed in a non-mainstreamed classroom and they would use restraint. I've looked at multiple schools, and even though they all say positive this, trained in that, when it boils down to it, they all use restraint. We've worked very, very, very, very hard to get his behaviors calmed down without restraint. The *reason* is because he is so physical, so sensory-seeking, that we felt restraint would backfire and become something he craved even more for calming. 

 

The amount of support it takes both to meet my ds' intellectual needs AND his emotional/physical needs is beyond the scope of what would adequately be provided in our school district at this stage. If the dc is older, it becomes harder. Like I think if I had put him into the system when he was 4, it would have been a tidy slide. He blended in better and the expectations were lower. In a K5 classroom, they aren't shocked if kids get up and walk around or leave or do this or that. However you get in with 10-12 years, now you're seeing bigger gaps. 

 

The other thing is that ODD has more social thinking (less deficits) than autism. So you've got holes in their thinking, but it's very complex. And they're going to notice their peers and have peers as models. So that gets really hard.

 

Personally, I like where we have ended up. We use in-home workers to provide variety and keep everyone fresh. We work on keeping him very connected, and so appropriate behaviors are motivated by relationships. But to do this with one person would be exhausting. And to do it with workers, well that's $$. We take a state disability scholarship and pay for it that way. 

 

The school system will do what they can, and it's going to vary with how overloaded they are, how well the people are trained, etc. I don't disparage the intentions and heart of our school district at all, because I've been in there. He has an IEP and I know what they're offering. In his case, we're able to do better right now at home. But at home doesn't mean *alone*. 

 

As far as priorities, I prioritize social thinking, relationships, language, and a sense of order all while trying to meet needs. He has a gifted IQ, so he NEEDS to be stimulated. If he's not stimulated, he has behaviors. But I don't really try to meet curriculum standards or grade level expectations. My goal is to nurture him as a whole PERSON and let the rest come in as it can. Now that he's approaching 9, I'm starting to think trades and what I can expose him to that he might get good at. I'm thinking either woodworking, which we're doing a little of, or engine repair. Maybe both. I think a trade, a sense that you do something well and have something to contribute to the world, is important. School kind of keeps you from that whole life.

 

But to "do school" and put him through things? Nope, I'm trying to give him a life. It won't matter what facts he can recite if he can't stay calm and hold a job.

Edited August 10, 2017 by OhElizabeth

[HS Mom in NC]

I'm talking about my 12 year old who we adopted when she was a baby.

 

[PeterPan]

Bringing in a behaviorist could be an option on the table, if you found someone with experience with her mix. Ours is a licensed social worker as well, so I think they vary in their background and what they bring to the table.

 

Is she compliant with other people? Like in her hs enrichment program, does she have behaviors there? Sometimes kids have issues at home and hold it together at school. So she might go there and need less supports. She might go there and be so stressed, trying to hold it together, that she comes home and lets it all out.

 

The challenge for homeschoolers doing the IEP process is that the school has no experience with your dc. They're trying to wrap their heads around a complex situation as quickly as possible. So they might just take her in and observe for a grading period. Typically they're going to do as little and provide as little intervention as they have to to have her function. If she can skate by in a regular classroom, they won't care what COULD be done or would be optimal. 

 

I'm saying you could actually ask two questions. One, what is a path that would actually help her, and two how much of that can the school do?

 

To find out what would actually help her, you're wanting private evals, private behavioral consult. To find out what the school could do, well personally I wouldn't play your hand too soon. If you have a private behaviorist you're working with, they could create paper trail to push the school to do the evals sooner, rather than letting them observe for a grading period first. A private person might know the surrounding school districts and give you a suggestion on a better placement.

 

The NOLO book on the IEP process is quite good. Your library might have it. I would advise reading it before you contact the school in this case.

 

When would you be wanting to make the placement change?

Edited August 10, 2017 by OhElizabeth

[bethben]

Mu daughter doesn't have huge defiance issues, but she had enough that it wore me out and made me wonder if her issues with math are due to her issues with me rather than math.  She argues with me seemingly with the assumption I am lying to her about the correct answer to a problem she gets wrong. She just started school and the atmosphere in the house is 100% different.  As my 12 year old says, "There won't be as much yelling around here."  My 18 year old severely disabled son has even picked up on the change and his whining has gone down 90%.  Dd mentioned that at school yesterday, they did math, she got some problems wrong, and she didn't lose it completely (like she does here).   She's a different kid in a classroom which we found when she went to a one day a week program.  She is very willing to do her best for a teacher.  For me, not as much.  Since we just started this experiment, I have no idea what the outcome will be.  All I know is that right now, I do not have the energy to be her parent and her teacher.  

[scbusf]

I have 2 DDs that we adopted from China. Older DD (now 9) was adopted when she was 21 months old. She has always had defiance issues. It turns out, she has anxiety issues easily traceable to abuse she suffered before her adoption. She also had surgery as a baby and probably had very little pain meds and attention from her caregivers. Also, she has a cleft lip and palate, which has resulted in many surgeries and orthodontic treatments.

 

After many years of counseling and now (a low dose of) anxiety meds, it's clear that her anxiety manifests itself as control. When she feels out of control, she lashes out - physically and emotionally. It has been a loooooooong road with her, but I feel like we are making progress. Of course, as she enters her preteen years and tend years, Lord help us all!!!!! I've been telling DH that we need to start installing the window locks upstairs now!!! LOL

 

Oh, she did go to a private preschool when she was 4, but I have homeschooled her since then. We started homeschooling because her older brother had needs that weren't being addressed appropriately in public school. Once he was home, I knew it only made sense to bring all the kids home. I was SURE DD would resent it if he was at home with me and she was in school. But it turns out that homeschooling is best for her, anyway.

 

Please feel free to ask any questions. I know this was a bit disjointed!

[trailrunner]

My son is quite a bit younger, so I'm not sure that I'll be able to provide any insight into how to handle defiance in a 12-year-old, but feel free to PM me or ask questions here if there's anything I can do! Is your Dd in school now and you're considering homeschooling, or is it the other way around? 

 

We've adopted four boys, including Ds7 who joined our family through the foster care system a little over two years ago. He attended half-day public pre-K and K, and we eventually pulled him out to homeschool last year, in December of 1st grade. Ds always struggled emotionally/behaviorally at school, but his anger and defiance had escalated to the point that it was recommended he be transferred to a different elementary school and placed in a multi-grade behavioral support classroom. After one meeting at the other school, it was clear that it was not an option, and we began homeschooling right away. Things aren't perfect at home, but they are so much better. 

 

For us, one of the keys in dealing with Ds's anger and defiance is to always consider the root (for my kid - anxiety/fear, impulsivity, cognitive inflexibility) before dealing with the actual behavior. We aren't dealing with RAD or any other attachment problems, so if that was the case we would have very different factors to consider. 

[rutamattatt]

We adopted our DD19 when she was 13 years old.  Because of the unique international adoption process with her home country, we had to home school her for several months legally.  That is what started our homeschooling journey with all three kids - we pulled the boys out of PS (they had just completed 3rd grade and K) and began homeschooling all three.  

 

When Dd came to our family, we didn't realize the scope of her challenges, and because she was just joining us, the first year was mostly focused on bonding and not academics.  Eventually, DD was diagnosed with ID, FASD, PTSD, anxiety, and attachment challenges.  She is not outwardly oppositional or defiant, but (bless her) she could teach a doctorate level class on the art of passive-aggressive behavior.  This manifested mostly in school time (and never, ever with my husband or in his presence).  One of her biggest challenges is asking for help.  She cannot ask for help - as in, if she was on fire and you were standing next to her with a fire extinguisher and a smile, she would burn before asking for help.  This became a HUGE hurdle during school time as I tried to evaluate her abilities and teach her.  The mother/daughter relationship for her is also challenging due to her past, and adding the extra component of "mom as teacher" was a hurdle we just couldn't seem to find a way around without behavior issues that would consume our day.

 

After year 3 she and I were both really burned out, and school time was more about managing behavior than education or life skill practice.  We had her evaluated by our local public high school, got measurable and concrete information about all her intellectual special needs, and heard what they school could offer her as far as services.  This information and meeting helped my husband understand the behavior challenges he would hear me talk about (but never witnessed...).  We opted to send DD to public school where she spends most of her day in a Comprehensive Development Classroom, although she audits one class with her NT peers.  I was terrifed to send her.  I didn't know if it would increase her behaviors at home or damage our already fragile relationship.  It was a scary decision to make and walk out!

 

But...it has been the best decision we have ever made for her.  She responds very well to her teacher and aides (I will say, we have the greatest teacher in the world for her), and DD and I spend our time as strictly "mom and daughter", which eliminated one large area of stress in our relatioship.  It was also one of the most terrifying decisions we have ever made for her.  ;).  We were very concerned about a number of unique issues she deals with, but her teacher has been VERY good at listening to us, partnering with us, and maintaining close communication with us.  But we didn't know how it would go...it was a huge leap of faith.  For US, it has been great -  for her, for me, and for her brothers who now have more of my attention and energy that previously went to managing her disruptive behaviors during the school day.   But I know every situation is unique.  

 

The most comforting thought I had as we were making the decision to enroll her was that we could always pull her right back out if PS didn't seem to be a good option for her.  It wasn't a choice that had to be for the rest of her educational life.  That made the decision feel (slightly!) less terrifying.

[Pen]

I have an adopted child who went to brick and mortar schools through grade 1, homeschooled grades 2-7, went to brick and mortar grade 8 and will continue there this year, for 9th.

 

Switch to homeschool was because he was not learning in the b&m schools.  Homeschool went well during grades 2-6. Switch back to brick and mortar had a lot to do with defiance and homeschool not going well emotionally for us in 7th grade, and need for more social opportunities.  I tended to think of this as a "teenage boy" issue and did not think of it before as possibly a post-adoption issue.