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How do you prefer classes where everyone is late be dealt with?


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#51 elegantlion

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 02:56 PM

Another start on time vote. If literally no one else is there, I can see waiting 10 minutes maybe one time, then those who were there would get a private lesson. 

 

I run an Supplemental Instructor (like group tutoring) sessions for one of the history classes. We are required to only wait 15 minutes if no one shows. So 15 minutes would be max for me. 

 

If it is standard that the majority run late, I would find another activity or class, I've spent too much of my life waiting on other people. 

 

 


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#52 dirty ethel rackham

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 03:38 PM

I am one who has struggled with punctuality, but I would never expect anyone to delay a class for me if I was running late. When I had younger children, it was especially more difficult to be on time because, no matter how organized I was and how early I had been ready to leave, the kids would always have an issue that need to be dealt with right before we left. Diaper blowouts, potty training, sensory/auditory processing deficit kid taking forever, etc. I did appreciate some things that has more flexible start times, like LLL meetings, and park days.

I am married to Mr. Punctual and my kids are older so it is less of an issue now and I am more likely to be early.

ETA: I do want to emphasize that I value starting on time, even when it was more difficult for me to get there. When I taught classes, I planned a 5 minute leeway/social time to give people a chance to get there and get organized. But those did not delay the end time of the classes I taught.

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Edited by dirty ethel rackham, 17 July 2017 - 03:42 PM.


#53 DawnM

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 03:44 PM

HUGE pet peeve.  If you don't want to start until 3:30, then say 3:30, not 3:00.



#54 Ananda

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 05:11 PM

As someone who struggles with punctuality, I think activities should start on time.  If an activity starts on time, I slink in the back and try to make minimal impact.  If they wait for me, I feel even worse for being late.  

 

One thing I really like though, is when there is an arrival window.  My child's preschool has arrival time from 8:50-9:10.  This makes it easy for me to be "on time".  I can hit a 20 min. window consistently.  But when the start time is really exact and there isn't much tolerance for being early, that's when I struggle.  The way for perpetual late comers to compensate is to aim to be really early.  Then when what happens happens, they end up on time.  But if all goes according to plan and you end up 15 minutes early, often places don't like that either.  Especially if you have little kids, like I have.  



#55 KungFuPanda

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 05:20 PM

I say start ON TIME. Chronically late people will run late no matter when you start, but if it's known that class will start late, the more relaxed people will come late too. That's a whole group that would BE on time if the class STARTED on time.

I once took over a class for a teacher that routinely started 5-10 minutes late. People learned not to come on time. After missing 10 minutes of glass ONCE, most weren't ever late again. It's not their fault. They were being flexible and not showing up until class was likely to begin. This is solely the teacher's fault.
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#56 Caclcoca

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 05:21 PM

Start on time.  I cannot stand to be late.  When I had little kids we were always early for things because I built in time for all the last minute things.  We would just sit in the car until time to go in.  This wasn't always pleasant, but we weren't late.


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#57 gardenmom5

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 06:14 PM

I don't think it is any of your business to "lecture" a teacher about changing a test date.

If a teacher has a philosophy that she wants the students to learn as much as they are capable, and she wants the tests to reflect that in as much as that is possible, then she just might change the test date to achieve that goal.

 

considering my daughter was one of the students getting screwed by her *repeatedly* NOT testing when she said she would (and therefore NOT covering subsequent material) - I had every right to point out the disservice to her students who are actually doing their work.


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#58 unsinkable

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 06:25 PM

considering my daughter was one of the students getting screwed by her *repeatedly* NOT testing when she said she would (and therefore NOT covering subsequent material) - I had every right to point out the disservice to her students who are actually doing their work.


You originally wrote that you once lectured a teacher for changing a test date. Now you're adding that it was because she didn't cover material.

Those are 2 different things.

#59 Elizabeth86

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 06:39 PM

I HATE late and it seems acceptable to be late these days. Not me, I wont wait a minute on anyone. If I can get somewhere with 3 kids 5 and under on time so can anyone else.

#60 gardenmom5

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 06:46 PM

Start the class on time.

In college, my best teachers would also not allow admittance after they started teaching. I mean, anyone who attempted to come in late was asked to leave. One professor also asked any obviously unprepared student (as in called on in class and had not done homework) to leave and "come back next time serious about your education." Can you imagine that with home schoolers?

A local nature center offers wonderful classes for home schoolers, but has taken to locking the classroom door once class starts, no late admits. The classes are free, and local homeschoolers understand this policy and have been conditioned to punctuality - at that venue, at least.

OP, I think your instructor should have given a graceful five minutes and then started the class.

and people thought that scene in legally blonde was made-up . . . :001_tt2: 

 

This.  I had no idea that it was *rude* until I read multiple articles and multiple threads on message boards about it.  Thoughtless?  Silly?  Maybe even annoying.  But I never considered that I was communicating a direct insult to people.  

 

I have changed my late ways, but I will tell you, the inside of me is still late.   :)  I have to consciously tell myself..."it's okay to be a few minutes early.  The worst that can happen is that you sit in the parking lot for a few minutes.  It's not wasted time, because it's worth it to not be rude to the people you are meeting/the class/whatever.  It's okay to be early..."  I still hate, hate, hate being early but it's less hate than I hate being rude, so I deal with it.

 

my sister was chronically late (we rarely see each other anymore).  - it sends a message that their time is more important than those who are there on time.  when teachers/others hold off while waiting for a late person - it reinforces the message the late person's time is more important than those who made an effort to be there on time.

 

 

The main problem is not the latecomers missing out. It's the latecomers disturbing the people who had their act together and were on time.

 

I do feel animosity because the student who shows up late to my class disrupts the others around him who are concentrating on the work.

He also distracts the instructor. Speaking in front of an audience is much harder when your train of thought and speech is constantly interrupted by people walking in.

 

The only acceptable way for the latecomer is to quietly take a seat at the back of the room. Last semester I had a student who was late every.single.time, and proceeded to squeeze through a row to sit in the middle of the lecture hall. He then took several minutes to divest himself of his coat and get his notebooks out of his backpack and created a serious disturbance for all students in his vicinity. I spoke to him numerous times, to no avail.

 

 

I'm currently reading a biography of jimmy stewart's war years.  he was conducting briefings before pilots went out on missions.  one captain was habitually late and would slink in and sit in the back.  he finally blew his stack and proceeded to chew the guy out in front of everyone.  his men were in shock as they'd never seen him lose his temper. (mad yes, lose temper no).  that captain was never late again.

 

You originally wrote that you once lectured a teacher for changing a test date. Now you're adding that it was because she didn't cover material.

Those are 2 different things.

 

you are the one who assumed all material was covered.   postponing a test date would generally preclude material from getting the same coverage because time originally slotted for it - has been compressed by the previous section.

 

or did you think the material continued to be presented - and just no test given?    when the test is required to move on to the next section?  which is pretty standard.


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#61 Mimm

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 06:55 PM

I once was invited to a meal at someone's house at 4pm. Several couples were going. I thought 4pm was an odd time, but there my husband and I were, standing on the front porch at exactly 4pm. (We didn't intend to bet quite so punctual, but hey, it happens.) It was super awkward. The kid answered the door and the mom was upstairs and no one else showed up for a while. She rushed around getting things ready, clearly not prepared for us to be there. I wanted to leave and then come back but that seemed awkward. I just asked if there was anything I could do, then chatted with her kids. The next couple showed up about half an hour later and I heard them say, "Sorry, are we early?" :huh: Everyone trickled in over the next couple hours. It was our first time having dinner with this group, and we didn't know 4 meant "whenever the heck you feel like it."

 

My family is super punctual. They show up a few minutes early and then ask where everyone else is and why they haven't arrived yet. :laugh:


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#62 unsinkable

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 07:04 PM

and people thought that scene in legally blonde was made-up . . . :001_tt2:


my sister was chronically late (we rarely see each other anymore). - it sends a message that their time is more important than those who are there on time. when teachers/others hold off while waiting for a late person - it reinforces the message the late person's time is more important than those who made an effort to be there on time.



I'm currently reading a biography of jimmy stewart's war years. he was conducting briefings before pilots went out on missions. one captain was habitually late and would slink in and sit in the back. he finally blew his stack and proceeded to chew the guy out in front of everyone. his men were in shock as they'd never seen him lose his temper. (mad yes, lose temper no). that captain was never late again.


you are the one who assumed all material was covered. postponing a test date would generally preclude material from getting the same coverage because time originally slotted for it - has been compressed by the previous section.

or did you think the material continued to be presented - and just no test given? when the test is required to move on to the next section? which is pretty standard.


I assumed that you "once lectured a teacher about giving the test the day she said she'd give it - and not holding off becasue the other kids aren't ready."

because that is what you wrote. Nothing about not covering all the material.

#63 OneStepAtATime

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 08:21 PM

I once was invited to a meal at someone's house at 4pm. Several couples were going. I thought 4pm was an odd time, but there my husband and I were, standing on the front porch at exactly 4pm. (We didn't intend to bet quite so punctual, but hey, it happens.) It was super awkward. The kid answered the door and the mom was upstairs and no one else showed up for a while. She rushed around getting things ready, clearly not prepared for us to be there. I wanted to leave and then come back but that seemed awkward. I just asked if there was anything I could do, then chatted with her kids. The next couple showed up about half an hour later and I heard them say, "Sorry, are we early?" :huh: Everyone trickled in over the next couple hours. It was our first time having dinner with this group, and we didn't know 4 meant "whenever the heck you feel like it."

 

My family is super punctual. They show up a few minutes early and then ask where everyone else is and why they haven't arrived yet. :laugh:

There are certain subcultures in the area I currently live where you are NOT expected to show up when the time is stated.  You are expected to show up at least a half hour to an hour or more later than that time.  If you show up on time you are sending the message that you have nothing in your life worth doing and are sitting at home hoping for an invite to something.  The host family is not supposed to be ready for you to show up on time because they also have many things they are doing.   :confused1:   

 

I had never encountered that before and kept showing up on time to events.  No one else would be there except the host family but in one case they weren't there, either.  It was very awkward until someone finally explained it to me.  We started showing up a half hour late, depending on who was hosting.



#64 Seasider

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 08:34 PM

and people thought that scene in legally blonde was made-up . . .

.


Really? I don't think I've seen that movie in its entirety, only bits and pieces when flipping channels.

What's really funny is by the time I was in my junior year of college, those two professors had married one another!
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#65 Tanaqui

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 08:42 PM

There's also subcultures where showing up "on time" is like saying "I just came for the food". You're expected to show up earlier than the stated time and socialize! It's important you get this sort of thing right. But that's for parties and stuff, not for classes.



#66 OneStepAtATime

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 09:19 PM

There's also subcultures where showing up "on time" is like saying "I just came for the food". You're expected to show up earlier than the stated time and socialize! It's important you get this sort of thing right. But that's for parties and stuff, not for classes.

Yep.  Opposite of where I live now but I remember running into that as a younger person in a different location.

 

And dang it, someone needs to post this stuff when you move into a new area.  Maybe on a lot of billboards and in a leaflet for newbies.  'Cause frankly it is hard to keep up with all the ins and outs of what is expected and appropriate.

 

Like the use of Ma'am and sir...seriously, people, post a memo.  

 

:laugh:


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#67 amy g.

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 09:33 PM

My preference is that when anyone who is late more than 2 times, they get dropped from the class.

That just doesn't happen often enough to suit me.
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#68 extendedforecast

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 09:55 PM

Start on time, and penalize the families that are consistently late. Our homeschool coop (this is also done for field trips to a certain extent) requires parents write a separate check that is only cashed if the students are late on the third offense. This has helped tremendously I'm told.

Edited by extendedforecast, 17 July 2017 - 09:56 PM.

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#69 heartlikealion

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 10:01 PM

We're habitually late and I wouldn't expect anyone to hold the class up for us. It's like pulling teeth to get this family out of the house and we live 45 min. from the co-op class, Sunday school class, etc. I am trying to work on this by adding more of a cushion. I even lie sometimes on appointment times.

 

When I say habitually late, I don't normally mean 20 min. If 6 or 7 families are 20 min. late that seems extreme to me.



#70 linders

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Posted 18 July 2017 - 08:57 AM

Start on time. Another person's lack of planning (real emergencies are rarely the cause) should not be my problem.


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#71 SparklyUnicorn

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Posted 18 July 2017 - 09:08 AM

I once was invited to a meal at someone's house at 4pm. Several couples were going. I thought 4pm was an odd time, but there my husband and I were, standing on the front porch at exactly 4pm. (We didn't intend to bet quite so punctual, but hey, it happens.) It was super awkward. The kid answered the door and the mom was upstairs and no one else showed up for a while. She rushed around getting things ready, clearly not prepared for us to be there. I wanted to leave and then come back but that seemed awkward. I just asked if there was anything I could do, then chatted with her kids. The next couple showed up about half an hour later and I heard them say, "Sorry, are we early?" :huh: Everyone trickled in over the next couple hours. It was our first time having dinner with this group, and we didn't know 4 meant "whenever the heck you feel like it."

 

My family is super punctual. They show up a few minutes early and then ask where everyone else is and why they haven't arrived yet. :laugh:

 

Why say 4 if you don't really mean 4? 

 

In what universe does "be here at this time" not mean "be here at this time"?  I'm so confused!!! 


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#72 OneStepAtATime

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Posted 18 July 2017 - 10:27 AM

Why say 4 if you don't really mean 4? 

 

In what universe does "be here at this time" not mean "be here at this time"?  I'm so confused!!! 

 

As I mentioned up thread, in some local subcultures where I currently live it is not expected to show up at the time listed because that makes it look like you have nothing going on in your life.  You want to look busy and filled with purpose and are stopping by after being somewhere else.  It is weird to me and not something I was used to but I had to learn that for certain families/subcultures the time on the invite is NOT the time they expect us to show up.  Half an hour late to an hour or more late is expected.  Showing up on time means there may not even be anybody there.  I know that sounds strange if you aren't used to it but that is the norm here.


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#73 SparklyUnicorn

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Posted 18 July 2017 - 10:32 AM

As I mentioned up thread, in some local subcultures where I currently live it is not expected to show up at the time listed because that makes it look like you have nothing going on in your life.  You want to look busy and filled with purpose and are stopping by after being somewhere else.  It is weird to me and not something I was used to but I had to learn that for certain families/subcultures the time on the invite is NOT the time they expect us to show up.  Half an hour late to an hour or more late is expected.  Showing up on time means there may not even be anybody there.  I know that sounds strange if you aren't used to it but that is the norm here.

 

That makes no sense to me.



#74 regentrude

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Posted 18 July 2017 - 10:48 AM

That makes no sense to me.

 

Doesn't either. A good invitation spells out: "dinner at 7pm. drinks and socializing at 6pm. If you come before 6pm we may put you to work."


Edited by regentrude, 18 July 2017 - 10:49 AM.

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#75 shawthorne44

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Posted 18 July 2017 - 11:46 AM

Doesn't either. A good invitation spells out: "dinner at 7pm. drinks and socializing at 6pm. If you come before 6pm we may put you to work."

 

I would like that invite.   it spells things out precisely.  

 

I was once ridiculously early for a party.  In my defense, she lived in a small house in major_city (seemed like) a long drive away from me.  I'd budgeted a lot of drive time, and there was practically no cars on the road.  I apologized profusely and did genuinely help out.   She had a ton of candles that needed to be lit.  


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#76 heartlikealion

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Posted 18 July 2017 - 11:58 AM

I wish you could do social invites like garage sales... no early birds! LOL


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#77 heartlikealion

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Posted 18 July 2017 - 12:00 PM

I would like that invite.   it spells things out precisely.  

 

I was once ridiculously early for a party.  In my defense, she lived in a small house in major_city (seemed like) a long drive away from me.  I'd budgeted a lot of drive time, and there was practically no cars on the road.  I apologized profusely and did genuinely help out.   She had a ton of candles that needed to be lit.  

 

Depending on how close I was to the host I might just park somewhere a bit away from the neighborhood or go into a store to kill time.
 


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#78 Diana P.

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Posted 18 July 2017 - 12:54 PM

Start on time. Alter the instruction approach for a smaller group if necessary.

Starting late just teaches participants to come later. Also it interferes with those who scheduled things after class.

#79 Mimm

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Posted 18 July 2017 - 01:40 PM

Why say 4 if you don't really mean 4? 

 

In what universe does "be here at this time" not mean "be here at this time"?  I'm so confused!!! 

 

Exactly! I'm willing to be there whenever you want me to, just TELL me when to be there! That's the part I don't get about the "acceptable to be late" subcultures. You're saying one thing (it starts at 4) and expecting everyone else to just understand that that's not true. I know people will take offense to me characterizing this custom as dishonesty but how else are you supposed to feel about it when you did exactly what you were told to do, and then found out it was the wrong thing and you were supposed to do something else that wasn't said, is never said, but you were expected to just understand it. :confused1: :confused1: :confused1:


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#80 extendedforecast

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Posted 19 July 2017 - 03:56 PM

I wish you could do social invites like garage sales... no early birds! LOL


Even that request is ignored in my area for garage sales.

#81 Ellie

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Posted 19 July 2017 - 04:30 PM

I'm sitting at a weekly class my kids take. We got here 30 minutes ago, and it was supposed to start 20 minutes ago. It hasn't started yet because no one else is here. Just my two, out of fifteen or sixteen kids... 6 or 7 families.

I think they should have started the class on time. I have other stuff to do afterward, so even if they go late and my family "gets our money's worth" it's still like a _thing_ you know what I mean?

Do you guys prefer they start late or that they start on time?

 

Absolutely classes should start on  time. Furthermore, students who miss the start of class more than twice should be dropped from the class, with no refunds. 


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#82 Shelly in IL

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Posted 19 July 2017 - 04:34 PM

On time with a graded quiz

#83 Ellie

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Posted 19 July 2017 - 04:43 PM

I once was invited to a meal at someone's house at 4pm. Several couples were going. I thought 4pm was an odd time, but there my husband and I were, standing on the front porch at exactly 4pm. (We didn't intend to bet quite so punctual, but hey, it happens.) It was super awkward. The kid answered the door and the mom was upstairs and no one else showed up for a while. She rushed around getting things ready, clearly not prepared for us to be there. I wanted to leave and then come back but that seemed awkward. I just asked if there was anything I could do, then chatted with her kids. The next couple showed up about half an hour later and I heard them say, "Sorry, are we early?" :huh: Everyone trickled in over the next couple hours. It was our first time having dinner with this group, and we didn't know 4 meant "whenever the heck you feel like it."

 

My family is super punctual. They show up a few minutes early and then ask where everyone else is and why they haven't arrived yet. :laugh:

 

We have friends who like to have get-togethers at their home. Although it's usually a potluck of some kind, they are also preparing something to share, of course. They are never ready when we all arrive at the time they said things were starting. We have discovered that we will finally eat an hour after they said we should be there. And if we are not there promptly, because we're on to them now and sometimes we aren't the first ones there, they will text Mr. Ellie or me to ask if we're coming. ::rolls eyes::



#84 Ellie

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Posted 19 July 2017 - 04:45 PM

Doesn't either. A good invitation spells out: "dinner at 7pm. drinks and socializing at 6pm. If you come before 6pm we may put you to work."

 

See, I've never gotten an invitation that divided socializing time from dinner time from any other time, and I'm kind of old, lol. Maybe this is regional. 



#85 IsabelC

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Posted 22 July 2017 - 11:45 PM

I'm a rabid Start On Time person, despite the fact that we're occasionally the family who is late.  I would explain my policy at the first session, then religiously enforce the start time from then on. Even to the point of locking the door at starting time, and not letting any latecomers enter until a suitable break when they won't be disturbing anyone.  And I wouldn't complain if somebody did that to me, either.  

I can't count the number of times we have busted our gut to be somewhere by the stated time, only to stand around with nothing to do for half an hour or more waiting for everyone else to drift on in. Why bother stating a time if you aren't going to abide by it?



#86 SKL

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Posted 22 July 2017 - 11:51 PM

Why say 4 if you don't really mean 4? 

 

In what universe does "be here at this time" not mean "be here at this time"?  I'm so confused!!! 

 

My Indian friends in the US always clarify:  "Indian Standard Time?" which means 1-2 hours after the stated time.  :p  Sometimes an event is IST and sometimes it isn't.  As if life wasn't complicated enough.  :p


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#87 SKL

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Posted 23 July 2017 - 12:04 AM

Back on the social gathering thing - my folks have messed me up over the years.  It used to be that dinner was always hours after they said it would be.  Since I drive in from a distance, I learned not to bother coming "on time" and I'd target about a half hour before the usual dinner time.  Well as my folks got older, they started serving dinner earlier and earlier.  I would arrive at my usual time and get shamed for being late.  :p  I think it's because the in-laws are used to more punctuality and show their irritation if they have to sit around waiting.  And my younger sister will up and leave the instant her kids act a little restless.  So now I'm the bad guy if I don't come exactly on time.  I try.

 

As others have said, this can be complicated with a long drive, as it's hard to predict the weather, traffic, and road construction delays.  Seems I always encounter some combination of these three - unless I leave early - then it's smooth sailing all the way.  :p  And then I'm bringing my kids into a house full of busy people who would rather not have kids underfoot.  Can't win.  :p



#88 Where's Toto?

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Posted 23 July 2017 - 07:27 AM

Depending on how close I was to the host I might just park somewhere a bit away from the neighborhood or go into a store to kill time.
 

 

I end up doing this a lot.  Or sitting in the car reading since I always have a book with me.  I HATE being late so I often end up early.


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#89 Murphy101

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Posted 23 July 2017 - 09:05 AM

As someone who struggles with punctuality, I think activities should start on time. If an activity starts on time, I slink in the back and try to make minimal impact. If they wait for me, I feel even worse for being late.

One thing I really like though, is when there is an arrival window. My child's preschool has arrival time from 8:50-9:10. This makes it easy for me to be "on time". I can hit a 20 min. window consistently. But when the start time is really exact and there isn't much tolerance for being early, that's when I struggle. The way for perpetual late comers to compensate is to aim to be really early. Then when what happens happens, they end up on time. But if all goes according to plan and you end up 15 minutes early, often places don't like that either. Especially if you have little kids, like I have.


This. I am often thought to be very organized and so on, but the truth is that 11 kids has made me over compensate like no one can imagine. Because when I screw up, it messes them up more than me and that sucks as a mom to know I'm the cause of that stress for them.

If a place didn't allow early arrival, I'd super struggle to get my crap together. My personal mantra is that "If I'm not 15 minutes early then I'm late!" bc I do not know how to be this mystical thing called 'On Time'. If they didn't allow early arrival, I'd sit in the parking lot knitting or whatever until they could go in.

#90 G5052

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Posted 23 July 2017 - 10:55 AM

And sometimes life happens. I'm completely understanding of that.

 

When I taught at the local community college, I once had a class that ended up with only two students by midterms. The rest either dropped or stopped coming. I started with eight.

 

The rule there was that the professor had to stay for 30 minutes if no one came because I live in an area with traffic issues.

 

So on a particular night, I knew that one student wouldn't be there because he was vacationing. I had to hold class because I'm only allowed to cancel once, and I had already cancelled one night when I was in the ER with DH.

 

I arrived early and waited. The other student was typically early, so I emailed and texted her shortly after the start time. Nothing.

 

Finally after 30 minutes, I emailed both students and my dean and went home.

 

The expected student lived in a remote area and had been cut off from the highway and power for three days because of multiple downed trees. They had no internet and couldn't recharge phones.

 

So sometimes you just really can't get there... 


Edited by G5052, 23 July 2017 - 10:55 AM.


#91 wintermom

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Posted 23 July 2017 - 11:29 AM

I prefer not to stay in classes that starts late on a consistent basis. If the class participants and instructor don't show enough respect and value for the course content and for everyone's time to start the class on-time, then it's not worth going. I don't need to waste my time, energy and money on that kind of frustration.

 

For my dc's music lessons, I'm paying a dollar a minute, and the clock starts whether we are there or not. We arrive on time.

 

For my martial arts classes, late participants had to ask permission to join the class at an appropriate time in the lesson, and then they did push-ups before joining the class.

 

It's amazing how organized people can get when there are painful consequences to arriving late. :laugh:  

 

In the OP's case, it sounds like people are being rewarded for arriving late. Not cool, I don't think. 


Edited by wintermom, 23 July 2017 - 11:32 AM.