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Latin? Or Spanish? Or, um....Chinese?


That70'sLisa
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I need help deciding!

 

The short version:

Should I try both DS's at Latin, and DS9 with Chinese?

 

Should both do Spanish, and DS9 with Chinese?

 

Should I just do one, either Latin or Spanish? If so, which one?

 

Or should I have DS9 try the two "easier" languages this year, and save Chinese for later?

 

 

The long version:

 

DS9 and DS11 are going into 5th and 6th respectively. I would like to start them on foreign language this year. DS11 would be doing foreign language basically because "everyone says you should", and in case he goes to college, it fulfills some entry requirements. He has ASD, and even English language can be challenging for him. I  am trying to decide between Latin and Spanish for him.

 

I do not know Latin, but would be learning along with. Outside of probably increasing his English vocab, is there a benefit to him learning Latin over Spanish? We will be using MCT Town level this year, so I am hoping that approach will finally untangle grammar in his poor head, as well as increase his vocab. I guess I'm hoping MCT will give us some of the benefits of Latin without as much work! I already own Latin for Children.

 

On the other hand, Latin sounds like a much more difficult language to learn than Spanish. I took 5 years of French in high school, and so feel more comfortable with the similarities between French and Spanish. Also, we would be using Rosetta Stone, which we own, which would seem far less "schooly" to DS11.

 

DS9, OTOH, seems to have linguistic strengths, if not a gift. He loves words, playing around with words, stories, meanings, etc. He requested to learn Chinese. I would want him and his brother to study at least one language together, and in DS9's case, I think he will pick up language relatively easily. So it seems if he truly wants to learn Chinese, younger is better. Yes? No? Thoughts? I looked at language schools, but all are either WAY too expensive, or on Sundays, which wouldn't work for us. So we would likely be doing Mandarin Chinese through Rosetta Stone. I would be learning Chinese along with him (although honestly, probably more slowly). I like the thought of Chinese because it's his own choice, and also feel it may be a particularly useful language in the next couple decades. Also, since it's so very different, it may really delight my language boy.

 

So basically I am needing the Hive's help to think this through.

 

I cannot do 3 languages. I think I am willing to do 2, but which two?

 

Tell me your thoughts, experiences, recommendations, advice...Hit me, Hive!

 

 

Edited by LisLisaKG75
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Can you do Latin with both together, and let younger do Chinese "on his own" with DuoLingo and / or Rosetta Stone? To see if he's really seriously interested?

 

I think that's where I may be leaning....I'm thinking Rosetta Stone Chinese (Duolingo doesn't have Chinese.)

 

Why do you think Latin over Spanish? (I keep going back and forth over those two, as well.)

 

Thanks so much for the reply, also!

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You might want to ask on the high school/college board, but from my quick Google search it looks like there are colleges that will require you to take a modern language in college if you took Latin as your only foreign language in high school. So, I'd really look into that for a kid who struggles with languages - I'd be inclined to just do Spanish.

 

We use Rosetta Stone, btw, for Dutch (my native language), and I've done all 5 levels of RS Spanish, and I'm currently working my way through RS Russian. If you don't speak the language yourself, you're going to need additional resources to help you with grammar and other things. I'd be very hesitant about RS Mandarin because of the tones - from the reviews I've read, it's not good at distinguishing whether you say things with the right tone or not. And based on my year in Thailand as an exchange student, a lot of non-native speakers struggle with getting tones right (I mean, you could get lucky - I did okay with tones, but I also heard plenty of other exchange students who still butchered tones after almost a full year). So, you'd want to make sure you have lessons with a native speaker on a regular basis. 

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You might want to ask on the high school/college board, but from my quick Google search it looks like there are colleges that will require you to take a modern language in college if you took Latin as your only foreign language in high school. So, I'd really look into that for a kid who struggles with languages - I'd be inclined to just do Spanish.

 

We use Rosetta Stone, btw, for Dutch (my native language), and I've done all 5 levels of RS Spanish, and I'm currently working my way through RS Russian. If you don't speak the language yourself, you're going to need additional resources to help you with grammar and other things. I'd be very hesitant about RS Mandarin because of the tones - from the reviews I've read, it's not good at distinguishing whether you say things with the right tone or not. And based on my year in Thailand as an exchange student, a lot of non-native speakers struggle with getting tones right (I mean, you could get lucky - I did okay with tones, but I also heard plenty of other exchange students who still butchered tones after almost a full year). So, you'd want to make sure you have lessons with a native speaker on a regular basis. 

 

Thanks!

 

Good to know about the tones with RS. RS would probably just be the first year, with a bit of supplementing.

 

And I am still on the fence with Latin or Spanish, Latin or Spanish. Definitely good to know that should he choose the college route, he may need a modern language. Wondering if learning Latin would help him understand English better, though?

 

Thanks for the input - giving me more to think about!

:)

 

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Why not do French since you've studied it? Ds12 is enjoying Chinese with Mike. I don't know how much he is learning since I do not know Mandarin and I am not even trying to figure it out. I'll have to pay for a tutor for high school if he still wants to take it for credit.

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If you want to learn Chinese, you need a tutor to bash through the tones, at least in the first year. The tones are not optional - they create completely different words. Non native speakers usually need a lot of help and correction in order to be able to communicate.

 

For reference,Husband learned Mandarin at college, I learned it as an adult in Mainland China and Taiwan, and both my boys grew up with it.

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I would do Latin for both. Having two beginner languages is a bad idea, that applies for you as the teacher too if you are actually planning on staying a lesson or two ahead to be able to teach.

 

If DS9 is very interested in languages, the Latin base will help him. RS may be a good start for a romance or closely related language (Italian Spanish... German Dutch) but like everyone else said he won't get much, or the right things, or of RS Mandarin.

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The tones are not optional - they create completely different words. Non native speakers usually need a lot of help and correction in order to be able to communicate.

 

Right. They came pretty easily to me, but even then in the beginning I would sometimes slip up with the last word in a question. And when I stayed with the host family of a different exchange student for a weekend, I had to translate what she was trying to say, because while *I* could figure out what she meant when she said the wrong tone, her host family couldn't, because to them tones were just that important that to them she sounded like gibberish when she made a mistake.

 

Good to know about the tones with RS. RS would probably just be the first year, with a bit of supplementing.

 

 

With a tonal language, you're really going to want to make sure you get those right from the start, not after a year of getting them wrong. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure and all that.

 

Could Latin help him understand English better? Probably. Not convinced it's worth doing Latin just for that though - an English grammar book and a Latin roots/suffixes/prefixes book would probably be more efficient. Which language appeals more to your 11yo? Would he rather learn Latin and the classical culture/history that go along with that, or Spanish, a language currently spoken by a lot of people in a lot of countries including the US (I'm assuming you're in the US)?

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We are a non-native family trying to learn Chinese. My Ds goes to the local Chinese language school on Saturday mornings. It's free as it was originally the Chinese community trying to teach their own children, though are more than welcoming. If there is a large Chinese community where you are they might have a similar program.

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Why not do French since you've studied it? Ds12 is enjoying Chinese with Mike. I don't know how much he is learning since I do not know Mandarin and I am not even trying to figure it out. I'll have to pay for a tutor for high school if he still wants to take it for credit.

 

Funny you should mention that! DS11, out of the blue last night, asked if he could learn French! I originally was thinking Spanish because it seems more useful here in the US. Many, many people in our neighborhood speak Spanish as their first language.

 

If you want to learn Chinese, you need a tutor to bash through the tones, at least in the first year. The tones are not optional - they create completely different words. Non native speakers usually need a lot of help and correction in order to be able to communicate.

 

For reference,Husband learned Mandarin at college, I learned it as an adult in Mainland China and Taiwan, and both my boys grew up with it.

 

Good to know it would be best to do during the first year...maybe we'll do Rosetta Stone just for listening and understanding, on his own, and see if he wishes to continue. I've been doing more research, and Chinese seems fascinating. But I really don't have time to get ahead of him...thank you for the suggestions. I think that is so cool that your boys are growing up with it! Were you living in China during their growing up years?

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I would do Latin for both. Having two beginner languages is a bad idea, that applies for you as the teacher too if you are actually planning on staying a lesson or two ahead to be able to teach.

 

If DS9 is very interested in languages, the Latin base will help him. RS may be a good start for a romance or closely related language (Italian Spanish... German Dutch) but like everyone else said he won't get much, or the right things, or of RS Mandarin.

 

Ah, thank you! I wasn't sure if I plan on actually staying ahead or more learning along with, but I bet either way you're right.

 

And yes, he's very interested, but I'm curious as to how Latin would help him more than learning any other language would?

 

Right. They came pretty easily to me, but even then in the beginning I would sometimes slip up with the last word in a question. And when I stayed with the host family of a different exchange student for a weekend, I had to translate what she was trying to say, because while *I* could figure out what she meant when she said the wrong tone, her host family couldn't, because to them tones were just that important that to them she sounded like gibberish when she made a mistake.

 

 

 

With a tonal language, you're really going to want to make sure you get those right from the start, not after a year of getting them wrong. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure and all that.

 

Could Latin help him understand English better? Probably. Not convinced it's worth doing Latin just for that though - an English grammar book and a Latin roots/suffixes/prefixes book would probably be more efficient. Which language appeals more to your 11yo? Would he rather learn Latin and the classical culture/history that go along with that, or Spanish, a language currently spoken by a lot of people in a lot of countries including the US (I'm assuming you're in the US)?

 

The bolded is the rub...I'm not convinced either! MCT seems like it will help with the English the same way Latin would. He would certainly be interested in the gladiators and culture of war, but we're getting a good bit of that with MCT. And since DS11 actually requested French (we were reading a book with French quotes and he was mildly impressed I could read and translate), I may try that on Duolingo for him. I remember enough French that it certainly wouldn't be starting from scratch for me. Although I still think Spanish would be more useful, it helps to stick with DS11's interests.

 

We are a non-native family trying to learn Chinese. My Ds goes to the local Chinese language school on Saturday mornings. It's free as it was originally the Chinese community trying to teach their own children, though are more than welcoming. If there is a large Chinese community where you are they might have a similar program.

 

Oh, that would be awesome! We're in CT, and unfortunately the (almost) affordable ones all meet Sunday mornings, which is a no-go for us. But thanks for the idea.

 

Thanks for all the input. We do 6 weeks on, 1 week off. I evaluate our plans every 6 weeks, so I think I may do this:

 

6 weeks of RS Mandarin for DS9, working on understanding only, not speaking, If he remains committed and interested after that, look for online or real life tutor. If not interested, switch to Latin with LfC the next term.

 

DS11 can explore French with Duolingo for 6 weeks. If he'd like to continue, will look to beef up Duolingo with grammar, readings, possible online convos with native speaker. If not, switch him to LfC.

 

If either switches, the loose plan would be to continue through for the year. I'm all for exploring to discover, but don't want to just hop all over the place constantly, especially as this will be considered middle school for both of them.

 

Feel free to critique/advise, and thank you so much for the thoughtful replies. You all have definitely helped me begin to shape a plan!

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Ah, thank you! I wasn't sure if I plan on actually staying ahead or more learning along with, but I bet either way you're right.

 

And yes, he's very interested, but I'm curious as to how Latin would help him more than learning any other language would?

 

 

Oh I don't think Latin is better than another language. If the goal isn't necessarily a high proficiency in this particular language though, Latin is a good place to be. Working with a highly inflected language will be of benefit to a language-y person. Since the goals are only reading and writing, your study time is more efficient (in a sense). There is also the encouragement factor -- much nicer to say "I've been studying Latin for three years and now I can read the Aenid" vs. "I've been studying Spanish for three years and I can't understand a Disney movie". -- Not saying that will be the case for you but it happens a lot with "gentle" introductions to language"

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I would pick a modern language (Spanish) over Latin for high school as some colleges do not accept Latin, though doing a year or two of Latin first would not hurt.

 

For Chinese, I think RS is fine for an elementary age kid to get some exposure but really prefer a native tutor if you really want to learn the language.

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Not for Chinese though--Latin grammar and Chinese grammar have pretty much nothing in common.

 

 

No they have nothing in common (and there are all those people who claim Chinese HAS no grammar lol), but learning your first foreign language is always the hardest so jumping the hurdle with an easier language can be beneficial. Besides anecdotal evidence, I believe there are some studies related to studying Esperanto for this purpose. My opinion was only to favor Latin because of lack of good resources/tutors for Chinese this year. 

 

If he is language-y, he may not want to stop at Chinese. 

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  • 7 months later...

I vote French for both, and reevaluate a second language for DS9 in a year or so.

 

My DS8 (who has ASD) has used RS Spanish for two years, and he and I would be completely lost if I did not have a fairly strong background in Spanish grammar (4 years in high school and 2 in college).  In RS, grammar is supposed to be picked up through osmosis, so a lot of the time without my guidance he would just be guessing blind without ever being explicitly taught about verb tenses, adjective endings, definite and indefinite articles, etc.  

 

I think RS is playing an important part in DS's language study, but only because we are supplementing it heavily with more grammar-intensive resources and because I have the language background to support his studying and allow him to get a lot more out of RS.

 

Wendy

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I told my dc that Spanish would be our foreign language because that was what I had the most experience with.  However, I didn't remember as much Spanish as I had hoped, and even though we have some local resources, it was a struggle.

 

We more or less dumped Spanish after one year.

 

My three high schoolers and I are now learning American Sign Language together.  We are all enjoying the class (youtube: Bill Vicars/ lifeprint.com).   Just something to consider, especially for your child with ASD who struggles with English.

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I think you should do latin roots and a foreign language--one foreign language for both of them, whichever you choose.  Since you know some French, and one of your children are now interested in it, I would go with that UNLESS you can get a tutor for Chinese (because of the tonal difficulties that others mentioned) or a tutor for Spanish. 

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