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mommy25
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I have five children, two of whom have graduated. This will be my first time with one of my kids in high school that has learning issues.

 

My question is this: I will need to modify her work quite a bit in order to get her through the required classes. If she uses materials that are below grade level so she is able to do the work, can you still give credit for these classes?

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That depends on several factors including goals/where she is heading, etc. Is she trying to get into an ivy league college? Local CC? Vocational trade school? Is she moderately to seriously cognitively impaired or does she have learning Challenges like dyslexia/dyscalculia/dysgraphia/ADHD?

 

What are her areas of struggle and why? What is being done to address her areas of struggle?

 

If she is struggling with reading, for instance, but is capable of understanding High School level material there are resources written at a lower reading level that are considered perfectly fine for High School credit. There are also audio books that can be used. Work on actually reading skills separately while allowing her to use specializes resources and you reading to her for content areas.

 

If she struggles with the physical act of writing but does OK with the cognitive side, use dictation software, typing, scribing for her and incorporate Inspiration Software for help with organizing thoughts using a computer.

 

There are many ways to approach this. It all depends on why she struggles and what the end goals are.

Edited by OneStepAtATime
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Definitely not Ivy League school. Local college or vocational. Don't really know what she wants to do at this point.

 

She has ADD. Struggles with reading, comprehension and spelling. She has binocular dysfunction. She has glasses to help with this. We cannot afford the therapy for this right now.

 

We are working on her spelling skills. I signicfiantly reduce the amount of reading she does. She can write a decent paper but it definitely needs work.

 

I am looking into the Great Courses as a source for history and science to possible reduce book work and reading. I have no idea what to do for a literature program.

 

I can help her with some things but I can't sit through and teach every subject as I have other children to teach. So she needs to be able to work independently somewhat.

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For literature, if she can understand higher works, I would get audio books for her--there are all kinds of classics on audio, and then she would be able to discuss them even if she's not ready to read them yet. Then you can keep working on reading separately from literature. 

 

I do a one-on-one tutoring time with my kids each day for about 30 minutes or so, and rotate what we discuss (we hit skills subjects each day but rotated what we talked about with regard to content subjects). Usually 2-3X a week I had them tell me about their lit. books, and then sometimes we used a lit. guide to discuss in more depth.

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  • 2 weeks later...

She even frowns on just listening to books 😕

 

 

My dd also frowned on just listening to books --until I forced her to. Then she realized that books that she thought were no good when she was "eye reading" them suddenly came alive when she was "ear reading them". I think you don't have to use "classics" exclusively in order to earn a high school credit for literature. Are you ok with her listening to Hunger Games? (just as an example) A lot of public high schools had that for required reading. There is a lot of good lit out there that is not traditionally considered "classic" that would qualify for a high school lit class and would give good opportunity to teach literary analysis skills--and possibly be more engaging to a teen than say... The Scarlet Letter.  If she has never tried an audio book, consider forcing the issue. :grouphug:

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She might not like audio books because she isn't used to listening to them or maybe she has an auditory processing disorder that makes understanding them much harder.  It is possible in a lot of instances to "train her brain" to be able to listen to audio books.  You might try to find something that isn't term dense and have her listen for maybe 15 minutes a day for a bit to try and help her get used to that format.  Divergent is actually easier word wise and would be a book geared for a High School aged contemporary teenager.  Or Hunger Games.  Some of the classics use wording that is more arcane.  For an audio book resistant teen that can be hard to wade through.  You need buy in right now.  And she needs exposure to more vocabulary, concepts, etc.  

 

What is being done for reading remediation separate from exposure to literature?  Has she done any OG based reading/spelling program?

 

Would you have the financial resources to hire a tutor, maybe a college student, to work with her twice a week for reinforcement and support?  If you provided the materials maybe they could just help with assisting her in getting through the materials.

 

There are AGS and Pacemaker textbooks that are written at a lower reading level but contain High School level material.  I am linking a place where you can see the resources and samples of the pages but don't buy from there.   Too expensive.  Buy through Amazon or Abe Books or something resource like that.  Just make 100% certain that the cover art matches from TM to student textbook.  There are several different versions.  Cover art needs to match.

 

Here is an example of AGS World Literature:

http://www.wiesereducational.com/products/ags-world-literature-mm8351.htm

 

Does she type?  If not, you might consider starting her with Touch Type Read Spell for help with all of those skills.  You can usually get it much cheaper through Homeschool Buyer's Co-op.  I'd link but I have to run.

 

Best wishes.

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Wow, thank you ladies. I have been making her listen to books. I have started her with really easy books to start to get her use to it; we'll move on from there.

 

For remedial work in spelling we have been using Apples, Sequential Spelling online, and copywork with dictation. Those have been working very well and she likes it. For reading I chose a lower level of CLE. They have an excellent reading program. The stories are not overly long and she can learn some elements of literary analysis plus some vocabulary.

 

I will look at the AGS textbooks again. I thought AGS was for 5th-8th; at least the ones I looked at were for that grade level. I didn't see any for high school. I was looking at christianbook.com, though. I really liked the looks of them, though. Especially the geography text. I am trying to find a good Geography course for her for next year currently.

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Yeah, might be time to get a good OT eval and a good audiologist eval. For audiology, look for someone who has the full booth set-up to test for CAPD. The screening test is the SCAN3. Around here our univ will run it and do a basic exam for $35. Private is $380. Either way, sounds like you have some issues going on that you need to sort out. On the OT eval, make sure the person is good with retained reflexes.

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OhElizabeth,

 

We are not opposed to doing this at all so long as it is affordable. Maybe it's obvious but how will

this change anything? I will still have to modify her work and choose and do things that help her learn. KWIM? My experience with similar situations is that you get the diagnosis but nothing really changes afterwards. And then you've spent all this money just to "know." What I do as we move forward doesn't really look any different.

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The board has had moms use the Lightening Lit middle school levels for high school. I don't think that the level of the book matters so much as how you teach it. It seems like many literature curriculums mainly cover vocab and critical reading questions to ensure the student understood the events of a story.

 

I like the Teaching the Classics DVDs because they teach examining story elements with children's books such as The Tale of Peter Rabbit by B. Potter using Socratic questions. One could easily use mind mapping to examine character, plot, setting, and/or conflict of any story.

 

There are also curriculums based around watching movies. Whenever DS starts a new book, we try to examine the context, structure, and style of the book. DS has watched a movie or two prior to reading a book. I like the Annenberg Learner site for materials. We have watched multiple productions of Hamlet prior to reading the play. Just examining the differences between a play and the movie could be interesting. The program Shakespeare Uncovered is amazing.

 

One year we studied some poetry and DS took an informal logic class. Those two classes combined were very helpful for examining story element and word usage.

 

Nothing beats an excellent audio recording especially for a story like The Odyssey which was intended to be heard. We have the Mary Pope Osbourne version and the Robert Fagles version read by Sir Ian McKellen. DS started with the easier version and then was able to follow the full version of the story when he was older.

 

I think the important thing when teaching any story is to introduce the material ahead of time. Review the author and his/her biography. Examine potential motivations and genre. Prep the student so that they are ready to learn the material.

Edited by Heathermomster
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If you have a few minutes, google neonatal or retained primitive reflexes and learn about them. Basically, these infant reflexes help the child go through the birth canal, root to nurse, learn to crawl, learn to walk, etc. If ANYTHING gets glitched along there, they don't get used and don't "integrate" properly into the neurological system. That starts a domino process neurologically, so down the road 10 years, etc. you've got a kid with CAPD, with anxiety, etc., having all sorts of symptoms, and the doc is saying put them on meds, do this, do that.

 

So sure, I hear you that there aren't a lot of good interventions for CAPD and it sounds like a rabbit trail. On the other hand, you actually need an explanation. That's pretty stinking serious when the dc is literally only processing ONE sensory input or the OTHER, even with her ADHD meds. I mean, are you reading it the way I'm reading? I know people who find that their MILD, borderline CAPD improves noticeably on meds. You're describing something that is so serious, whatever it is, that even with ADHD meds she's still DRAMATICALLY hampered.

 

So I think you need to see this like an outsider is seeing maybe, that relative to her peers that's a pretty significant effect. I think you'll find that over the next few years the side effects and symptoms of whatever is going on in her neurologically will increase, so that her academics (which are solvable) become less of your worry and her basic function, like her ability to work a job in an environment where she has background noise and has to hear instructions and follow them, rise to the front. 

 

I would be very concerned about what you're describing. What happens when she gets in a noisy environment? Can she work a job? You said vocational school, fine, all for it. All those jobs involve background noise. Maybe she could work at a library. That's about the only quiet job I can think of, and that's going to bore an ADHD person stiff. 

 

Her ability to FUNCTION is going to be much more important to you 4 years from now than what history curriculum you used.

 

Our university can do the audiology eval and an APD screening using the SCAN3 for $35. That's how we did it. Privately it runs about $380 around here. OT = Occupational Therapy, yes. If you can find an OT who is really good with retained reflexes, that would be fine. After going through 5 OTs, I'm now using a PT. It's more important that they're good at them. Or google them yourself. Several people on the boards have had good luck with PTs. But it's not something all PTs are trained in. It's just like the PT or OT got interested and got the extra training. After all these years, I'm going to get myself checked. You could say I put that much stock in it. Just took me a long time to find someone I trusted enough to think they could actually do anything.

 

So I agree with your cynicism that these providers will take your money and not help. Ironically, this amazing PT costs LESS than we've paid for other people! She sees you once and gives you a month of homework. Maybe ask around to your friends, network. Find out who has kids with APD or OT issues and just network. We found this PT through a psych. The audiologist place might have suggestions. Sometimes it takes time.

 

If you eventually find someone who is worth the money, I think you'll learn a lot through the evals. Personally, I would want that audiology eval and SCAN3 sooner, rather than later. You really need to start eliminating causes of those symptoms and get some explanations.

 

Start somewhere with evals, eliminate things, work through it. If your insurance will cover an SLP eval, that would be another way to go. Sometimes an SLP can do the SCAN3. Won't be a full booth, but still sometimes they'll do it. You're at least wanting the screening portion. And an SLP might turn up some other explanations for why she's resisting audiobooks. You shouldn't have to *force* someone to listen to audiobooks. If all the pieces are there, she ought to be enjoying them. That's your big clue that something is amiss, that something major has gotten missed. It's certainly not explained by the ADHD or dyslexia.

Edited by OhElizabeth
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Heather,

 

Thank you. I will look into some of the curriculum you suggested. I especially like what you said, "I think the important thing when teaching any story is to introduce the material ahead of time. Review the author and his/her biography. Examine potential motivations and genre. Prep the student so that they are ready to learn the material." I think that is an excellent idea and one I am going to implement. 😊

Edited by mommy25
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OhElizabeth,

 

Thank you so much for your thorough response. :) I really do appreciate what you are saying. I just want to be careful not to give into fear that my daughter will not be able to handle life. She is very organized, keeps her room clean and basically organizes our whole house. She babysat twin 3 yo girls and a 5 yo boy yesterday just fine. She is a hard worker and I think she'll do fine at whatever God calls her to do.

I do see the importantance in figuring out the exact issues. It never hurts to know. But if it begins to look like a bunch of rabbit trails and lots of money without results then we will have to decide what to do at that time. I have to believe that God will bring someone along to help her if that's what she needs.

 

I did call a local university here to see if they offered those services. The receptionist didn't know who to transfer me to. I did leave a message so we will see :)

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I did mention that and she didn't seem to know so they probably don't. I may call IU or Purdue and see if they have an audiology department.

 

Also, can you send me the link to your phonics lessons? I remember you mentioning that before. I want to see if it would benefit her in anyway. I'm not sure if it will be overkill with every thing else we are doing.

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It looks like Riley at IU does SPD but I'm not seeing APD listed. Just so you know, if you drive over to OSU (probably 3-4 hours from where you are), you'd be at one of the best in the country, and the eval is $35. For reals.

 

I did russian at IU a couple summers, so it's kind of old stomping grounds for me. :)

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Heather,

 

Thank you. I will look into some of the curriculum you suggested. I especially like what you said, "I think the important thing when teaching any story is to introduce the material ahead of time. Review the author and his/her biography. Examine potential motivations and genre. Prep the student so that they are ready to learn the material." I think that is an excellent idea and one I am going to implement. 😊

 

I agree with Heathermomster, and for comprehension I will add....pre-teach any new vocabulary. To make sure she understands the words, don't just have her memorize them. Have her learn the words and then use them in her own sentences. Being able to use the words will indicate whether she really understands.

 

Also, it helps to know more specifically what her struggles are with comprehension. DS12 can answer explicit comprehension questions about basic parts of the story, but he cannot understand inference. So he can understand the literal meaning of sentences but doesn't understand underlying meaning or statements that only suggest but do not state things outright. Figurative language trips him up. And nonlinear story lines, where there are flashbacks or if the story starts in the middle and the reader is supposed to understand what must have come before.

 

If she has these kind of problems, choose her reading selections carefully. It's not just reading level that will be important to consider, but the structure of the story and the language used.

 

DS12 also benefits from hearing the stories out loud instead of reading silently. And it helps greatly to read things multiple times. This year at school, we get his assignments in advance, so that we can read them to him at home before they are introduced in class. We stop and explain every little thing to him, so this first reading is pretty choppy. But then when he reads the selections with his class in school, he can follow much better. And then his intervention teacher will also read the selections with him during his pull-out sessions, so he is reading some stories three times.

 

Even though he can read on grade level (he does not have a reading disability), he is not reading independently on grade level. He is getting a lot of support. I suspect he will not be able to understand most traditional high school texts when he is in high school (he is sixth grade this year).

Edited by Storygirl
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I see you have been using CLE. We were using it before we enrolled in school, and I liked it.

 

I'm not sure what level you are using. At least some of them have the students read the stories twice -- the first day alone, and the second day aloud. I would suggest switching the order and reading it aloud the first day and silently the second.

 

If her level does not have this two-day structure (not sure if all levels do), consider reading each selection twice anyway, even if it means moving slower through the program.

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