Adulting School

[Jean in Newcastle]

This is not scientific or anything but my ds19 says that those friends of his with helicopter parents are afraid to try things on their own. This is partly because they were kept from doing things and partly because their parents (usually the mother) is super particular about how things are done so they don't feel like mistakes are ok. I'm pretty sure that ds19 isn't looking down his nose at "kids these days, sheesh ".

 

 

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[teachermom2834]

Letting teens attempt independence and try to figure things out for themselves has a cost not only in time but sometimes money.  We have found that we have to accept that as part of the process.  Allowing teens to learn things on their own also means that you do not berate them, lecture, belittle them for making a mistake or asking for help. My teens, who in my opinion are very independent, ask for grown up opinions all the time.  It is surprising to me because I married young and would not have asked my parents' advice on adulting things.  I didn't want to look stupid, be told I'd made a big mistake, etc.  I do see a fair amount of that in the crowds I run in.  Berating, punishing, mocking, etc. kids and teens over pretty understandable growing up mistakes.  If my kid took the car for a cheap oil change and bit on a $60 air filter we would talk about it, show him what he could have done differently, give him words to use the next time he is in that situation and let it go.  We wouldn't tell the story on FB, or to the grandparents, or continue to bring up the air filter for the next year.  

 

Teens learning the ropes takes patience on the part of the parents and a willingness to roll with whatever mistakes they make in a calm manner with a teaching moment.  

 

It is no doubt easier to do these things for your teen to make sure they get done correctly, efficiently, and inexpensively.  

Edited February 25, 2017 by teachermom2834

[Lanny]

I just read an article about this in an email newsletter I received yesterday.  Astonishing.  Sad.  Tragic that these people are so unprepared to be adults.

[regentrude]

I don't know, my university friends have in some cases taught several generations of students.  They find these ones particularly anxious and fearful.  The data collected from student services and adolescent mental health sources says there has been a really significant increase in those reporting anxiety and depression.  Other kinds of problems like bi-polar aren't rising so it isn't just that more people will ask for help now, it seems to be particularly anxiety.

 

I just had this conversation with a friend who is a psychologist at the university's counseling center. They are seeing a huge increase in students with anxiety and depression; she has been here for decades, and the rise is very concerning.

[KungFuPanda]

I'm not miffed that the class exists. There are always gaps in any education. Any time there is enough demand for a certain group of skills a class can form. It matters that they want to learn, not who dropped the ball.

 

I do NOT remember being taught specific life skills in the military. Maybe my memory is faulty or it's changed in the last 25 years? Other than an insane level of cleanliness that's impossible to maintain without a squad of captive laborers, I can't think of being taught these things in the Army.

[regentrude]

Do we really know that people in their 20s today are more helpless than we were?  Are they more afraid to ask questions and figure things out?  Or is that based on a few anecdotes or a cynical view of people younger than ourselves in the vein of, "Kids these days! Sheesh."  

 

 

In general I do not see young people as helpless. I teach college and am surrounded by  young people who, for the most part, are quite capable of managing their lives and figuring things out.

 

I think this may be more an issue of the outliers standing out very much and being memorable: I, for example, remember the kid who had never crossed a street at age 13, but the countless kids who have been riding their bikes and walking the neighborhood are the usual, so don't stand out.

There is, probably, a certain lack of independence due to helicopter parenting. Kids who never get the opportunity to try things and make mistakes won't develop a healthy sense of their own ability and potential. I see those too - in the parents who email me because their sophomore kid cannot figure out basic info on the course catalog.

Edited February 25, 2017 by regentrude

[Bluegoat]

I'm not miffed that the class exists. There are always gaps in any education. Any time there is enough demand for a certain group of skills a class can form. It matters that they want to learn, not who dropped the ball.

 

I do NOT remember being taught specific life skills in the military. Maybe my memory is faulty or it's changed in the last 25 years? Other than an insane level of cleanliness that's impossible to maintain without a squad of captive laborers, I can't think of being taught these things in the Army.

 

So, I'm in Canada,so it might be different.  I joined in 1998, I think?

 

We did have some very odd direct stuff, like hygeine.  I found that weird but my dh tells me that they did get recruits who didn't know this basic stuff.  Bed making.  Keeping your room clean.  Also keeping yourself and your stuff organized, many people learned basic vehicle maintanence.  I can strip wire effeciently and know how a car works because of the army.  Some admin stuff too - keeping records together, writing letters or reports, how to make a call.

 

I am pretty impractical, really, I think the army was responsible for most of my concrete skills at these things until I had kids.

[Bluegoat]

In general I do not see young people as helpless. I teach college and am surrounded by  young people who, for the most part, are quite capable of managing their lives and figuring things out.

 

I think this may be more an issue of the outliers standing out very much and being memorable: I, for example, remember the kid who had never crossed a street at age 13, but the countless kids who have been riding their bikes and walking the neighborhood are the usual, so don't stand out.

There is, probably, a certain lack of independence due to helicopter parenting. Kids who never get the opportunity to try things and make mistakes won't develop a healthy sense of their own ability and potential. I see those too - in the parents who email me because their sophomore kid cannot figure out basic info on the course catalog.

 

My feeling is that those outliers are now a larger group, and maybe even other kids have higher levels of certain kinds of stress. When I was a kid, you are right, there were some parents who were more strict.  Now it seems like the proportions are different. 

[Jean in Newcastle]

At college orientation, they talked to the incoming students about how they were expected to manage college on their own. And they sent out an email to the parents specifically spelling it out. They were not discouraging behind the scenes support, but mommy or daddy taking over basic things like contacting professors etc. They specifically mentioned that this was due to a rise in helicopter parenting. Obviously those of us who don't helicopter, just rolled our eyes because we wouldn't have done those things anyway. I wonder if it stopped the helicopter parents from trying.

 

 

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[EmseB]

I'm not miffed that the class exists. There are always gaps in any education. Any time there is enough demand for a certain group of skills a class can form. It matters that they want to learn, not who dropped the ball.

 

I do NOT remember being taught specific life skills in the military. Maybe my memory is faulty or it's changed in the last 25 years? Other than an insane level of cleanliness that's impossible to maintain without a squad of captive laborers, I can't think of being taught these things in the Army.

 

We were given a really basic class on how to read an LES and they kind of went over money management at that point.  The basic warnings not to go out and buy a fancy car or start spending like crazy just because you're not paying for housing and such. And we got an STD/sex class.

 

Still, people did those things, and still, people got their cars repo'd and got in trouble with creditors. They still were irresponsible sexually.

 

And there was the cleaning stuff, but that was more about following instructions, and keeping communal living spaces clean when a lot of people are living the same space.  I was thankful for those standards because 60 people in one space can get gross quick without them. And even still there were other recruits who didn't take showers or brush teeth.  Blech.

 

I think basic training, too, gave me confidence to know I could handle stuff.  I mean, it was an artificial sort of pressure, but it did really make me feel like I could handle stuff in a pinch and not freak out.  I think basic does that for a lot of people.

[regentrude]

At college orientation, they talked to the incoming students about how they were expected to manage college on their own. And they sent out an email to the parents specifically spelling it out. They were not discouraging behind the scenes support, but mommy or daddy taking over basic things like contacting professors etc. They specifically mentioned that this was due to a rise in helicopter parenting. Obviously those of us who don't helicopter, just rolled our eyes because we wouldn't have done those things anyway. I wonder if it stopped the helicopter parents from trying.

 

Probably not. A friend of mine is a prof and got called by a mom, asking whether her son had been in class. ???? And that the kid should call mom, because he had not called in a  while. Of course, prof is not allowed to give info to the parent; she just told the kid to call his mother. The poor guy was absolutely mortified that mom had done that.

 

I get few emails from parents, but our secretaries tell me they regularly have parents call and pressure them to enroll their kids in already full courses. Not good.

[Jean in Newcastle]

Probably not. A friend of mine is a prof and got called by a mom, asking whether her son had been in class. ???? And that the kid should call mom, because he had not called in a  while. Of course, prof is not allowed to give info to the parent; she just told the kid to call his mother. The poor guy was absolutely mortified that mom had done that.

 

I get few emails from parents, but our secretaries tell me they regularly have parents call and pressure them to enroll their kids in already full courses. Not good.

 

See, that is the sort of thing that makes me wonder if some of this isn't a new phenomena and not just us forgetting about our youth.  I remember quite well making mistakes on my first checking account etc. and learning how to navigate the adult world.  But I don't remember parents doing this sort of thing with professors.  I suppose there might always have been "that" parent who did, but I don't think it was a common thing at all. 

[regentrude]

See, that is the sort of thing that makes me wonder if some of this isn't a new phenomena and not just us forgetting about our youth.  I remember quite well making mistakes on my first checking account etc. and learning how to navigate the adult world.  But I don't remember parents doing this sort of thing with professors.  I suppose there might always have been "that" parent who did, but I don't think it was a common thing at all. 

 

No, this is definitely a new thing. The people who have been around for a few decades don't recall this happening way back when.

[lllll]

nm 

 

Edited March 2, 2017 by --Kathy--