where to start for more social interactions?

[suenos]

Long time lurker and only occasionally a poster here...hope y'all don't mind if I jump in again with a question...

 

DS 9 has had a rough time with social interactions/group settings. As in lots of fails, kicked out of a homeschool group, trouble with other kids treating him badly - purposely winding him up, or excluding him from play, etc.  He's severely ADHD, dyslexic, SPD, lots of trouble with emotional regulation/frustration tolerance.  And after all his troubles acquired anxiety, too.  

 

Ok, that's been the trajectory.  We started him on Straterra this past fall and the change has been enormous. He's gone from 3 - 6 meltdowns daily (hitting himself, screaming, throwing things, sometimes hitting others) over frustration/emotions/anxiety, to hardly any.  Like we're down to 1 episode every couple of weeks.  And lately his interactions with people have been so positive - I can now see how much he was picking up on negativity from people so often (because of his behavior) and how different it must be for him to instead have people respond nicely to him. 

 

Shoot I've written a book already and I'm trying not to!  Anyways, it's time to start easing him into group/social situations again.  I'd like to see him make a couple of friends and get involved in an activity or two.  Where would you start?  Any suggestions about how to talk to group leaders/parents when I make overtures?  Any advice for sniffing out good groups/classes vs. bad fits for SN kid?  

 

We've got exactly 1 other homeschool group option in my region - it might be a good one, but I want to start off on the right foot - probably not just tossing him into a big park day group, iykwim. Ideas or btdt advice?  Or maybe I'm also looking for courage...I'm pretty nervous about this - for him and for me too - I'm sure I've got a little PTSD from all the 'fails' too.  :closedeyes:

 

Anyways, tia for reading and any thoughts...

 

 

 

 

 

[Pawz4me]

Have you searched to see if there are any social skills classes available in your area? There's a small non-profit here who provides classes for kids with ADHD, who are on the spectrum or simply need some help in that regard. They also have events for adults who want to work on their social skills. So . . . maybe check for something similar?

[suenos]

Thanks Pawz4me - we tried a social skills class pre-meds and he got asked not to come back...that he couldn't be calm enough to benefit.  I think now would really be different.  So that's a good reminder - I can check in for another one soon. 

 

[suenos]

nt

Edited February 14, 2017 by suenos

[OneStepAtATime]

I agree, if you could find a social skills class (maybe one at a different place so no bad memories or associations) that might help.

[lmrich]

What does he like to do? I would look into things that make him happy. Art classes, music, sports, outdoor stuff....

[suenos]

He likes to play pretend and run around, lol. And play video games and watch 'science videos' and discuss 'Trump News' and 'genetic editing'. He loves stories of any kind and acting them out.  He likes to swim, but not sure about the competitive atmosphere of a swim team... I am not at all crafty or artistic...and he has fine motor challenges galore, but he's expressed interest in learning to draw or paint...just not sure about his perfectionism issues with this...

[suenos]

I like the 'make him happy' part - thx! I've been thinking about that a lot...like what might he really enjoy and go from there...

[PeterPan]

Like the others, I'd STRONGLY encourage you to get him through some social thinking materials before you put him in anything requiring serious social thinking. Doesn't have to be a group, though it could be. You can go to SocialThinking.com and order the materials yourself and use them. They group things by age, but I'm thinking you'd start with Social Detective or... Anything you do like that at home would *complement* what they would do in a social skills group.

 

Don't think of it so b&w, like out or not out. Like the others are saying, you could put him in a highly structured, highly preferred setting where the behavioral expectations are pretty low and he blends in, somewhere he's likely to do well. I agree, from your list, swim lessons would be perfect for that. 

 

Once he can go to swim lessons and have appropriate behavior on the way there, during the class, and on the way back, add the next thing. Like maybe by then it's summer and you do a summer camp for basketball. A little more complicated setting, a little bit longer class, but the session is only a week if you're lucky, kwim? 

 

If that goes well, then you could try another class that is a little less preferred, like art camp for a week, to see what happens.

 

Do you go to church? Are you open to church? After some socials skills work, as you see things going better, you could try to put him into a Sunday School class. You'd want to make sure there's enough support. I'm trying my ds in a new one, and I'm going to be talking with the teachers to make sure they give me feedback.

 

We did the progression I'm talking about, slowly stepping up the complexity of the situation as we got more social thinking work into him. For my ds, it worked really well. There are things that bog him down. Like if we're late, he's toast. If he can't follow the game in a sports class, he can have an extreme reaction. I usually try to stay and observe. By the end of the summer, with that gentle ramping up and lots of work, he was able to do a one week lego camp! Like that was maybe 2 hours a day. And his behavior there wasn't ideal. Like he didn't notice the name of his partner he was supposed to work with and basically did all the work himself, etc. But he stayed in the room, complied, worked the plan, didn't have behaviors.

 

It will be obvious when you think about it, but sports are going to have a higher percentage of kids with ADHD. No I wouldn't jump right to team unless he has already had lessons. Small group classes would be better. I've kept my ds swimming several days a week for a couple years now, and that's how we did it, just at the Y. Now he's on team. I really like the regular class progression. It has a lot of structure. We got a lot more behaviors with ds when we moved over to team. It's so competitive, so he was trying to pass kids and get really aggressive. They have more in a lane, so his social thinking issues are more obvious. If the coach isn't careful, he ends up waiting, so then he has waiting behaviors. Because teams can have wide ranges in ages, he could be splashing or having behaviors toward some kid who is MUCH OLDER who is really getting frustrated! 

 

So for my ds, starting in team was, well it was a real step up. That was after 2 years of solid year round regular classes multiple days a week. It just really, really taxed him for where he was. For him, the smaller classes and the assumption of needing more attention, more patience in the regular classes fit him.

 

Our Y has a gymnastics progression that is recreational level before team. That would be a stellar option for your ds. 

 

My ds doesn't do well in soccer as a team sport, because he doesn't seem to have the whole group think going to understand where the ball is, who has it, what the goal is of the team, etc. But for just ball handling, like to do a week of camp where they drill, he has really enjoyed that. 

 

Like I said, a lot of your sport camps are used to handling energy and redirecting inappropriate behaviors. They usually have a pile of strategies. It can happen that a dc really can't comply, even with that level of help, but given that your ds is on his meds now, I'll bet he'd be fine in sports classes. 

[suenos]

OhElizabeth - thank you!   Your description of soccer is so spot on it made me laugh out loud.  DS did soccer at 6 - seemed like a natural fit - he runs, he's fast, he kicks things.  But in the group - oh my!  He cared less about who had the ball - group think - huh?!  He convinced the kids on his team to turn over and around the goal (light-weight structure apparently) during a game (!) so the other team couldn't score. It was funny, but sorta not.  

 

The sports classes is a conundrum.  He is very physical, but a perfectionist.  So competitive stuff is not likely to work well. Hmm... I do take your point about stepping things slowly.  I'm thinking about private or small group swim classes this spring...then IF it's a good fit, a low key city rec center swim team this summer.  

 

I've been perusing the boards on 'social thinking' books, curriculum. It's time to do more of that too...Thanks for the suggestions! 

 

Sunday school at church is not an option.  We are not Christian.  Don't mean that with any rancor...just to clarify. 

 

A one week Lego camp would be a huge accomplishment for my DS - so I just mean - wow, way to go! That's big.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

[PeterPan]

If you bring in a behaviorist (BCBA), they could do the Social Thinking instruction for you *and* they could bring in other kids to do group play. 

 

Honestly though, even after 9 months, we don't do that with my ds. Right now, I pay adult ABA tutors to play with him. They're college students, but we put play on the list. An adult can defend themselves, stay safe (hopefully), and slowly increase demands. For us, having him play with ABA workers who are very intentionally interacting, making demands, taking data on his behavior, etc. has gotten BETTER results than if we just randomly plopped him in with kids and hoped he'd infer.

 

For us, bringing in workers was the best way to stretch his social skills. We play a LOT. I try to make sure that the school work they do together also has collaborative elements, so he can build that skill. Think about how much of play with kids actually involves give and take. Can your kid do it? Mine couldn't. So it takes adult workers who are being paid to put up with that stuff. At first, they put up with a LOT. Then they kinda slowly start making demands. Like oh, I know you want to build it that way, but I'm going to build mine *this* way. Boom, crash, meltdown. And they work through it. But next time it goes a little better and they keep stretching. Ds wouldn't have learned all that by the cause/effect and inference-driven random approach of playing with kids. The kids would give up and be offended. Kids wouldn't come back when we invited them over. So that's why I pay adults. Slower, but safer for everyone and works.

Edited February 14, 2017 by OhElizabeth

[Lecka]

I think if you are looking at a Park Day and wondering how he will do, take him to visit some playgrounds before the Park Day.

 

See how he does.

 

If he has something he might take that might make kids want to play with him -- that is a possibility. There are pros and cons but if it would make him a lot more comfortable, or be a way for kids with the same interest to come up to him, it might work out well.

 

From what you have said I am optimistic, it sounds like he has come a long way :)

 

Here there are certain parks and times of day when 9-year-olds may be out, but he could play with younger kids too.

 

Sometimes kids are at the park with already-made friends and not interested in playing with other kids. But if there are a lot of kids there may be a group game going on, or just some onesies here are there who would like to play.

 

I don't think there are potential kids to play with every time you try a park, but sometimes there will be.

 

And then you don't have to worry about him making a bad impression at the Park Day where you hope he will make long-term friends.

 

It can also let you see if he gets along with some kids, but they need to have a certain interest.

 

Would also let you see if the boys his age at Park Day are cliquey. I think that can be very hard to tell, but it would be too bad to think it was your son if other kids were cliquey or just didn't like to play something he did that he could do with other kids at a park.

 

You also might plan with him to take breaks at Park Day if it is very long for him to be so unstructured. It is probably long and low structure.

 

You can make it shorter, or call him to take snack breaks, or take a book for him to take a break.

 

If he time is too long for him, plan on making it shorter or on doing breaks of some kind, that he would like and be willing to do.

Edited February 14, 2017 by Lecka

[PeterPan]

If not park days, have you thought about the pool this summer? He likes to swim. When I take my ds, we take toys, pool toys, so kids will come up and ask to play. Like we take a nerf football or little diving sticks you can dive for. When you take soft toys like that, kids will come try to play and teach him things. And sometimes it's TOO much, like with more boys, bigger boys, and he gets frustrated. But really, it's a good strategy for us. And play in the pool changes so quickly, that if it's not working it's not an offense to say oh we're done with that now and put it away. Or they blow the whistle for break. Or you make an excuse.  

 

Park days can be really good! But my ds can get stuck or too controlling or be too rough. I have to supervise that a lot more. With the water, it's sort of more subdued, and the sessions are shorter, making it easier to monitor.

Edited February 14, 2017 by OhElizabeth

[suenos]

These are great ideas y'all and the concrete suggestions are giving me much needed courage to do what I know we need to do for our little guy. Lecka - thanks for your optimism!  He has had some success at just finding kids to play with at the park.  Sometimes not, and you're right - often it's not him.  Kids can be...not open sometimes.  Another thing I was thinking was that before going to a park day, I might join them at one of their meetup like events - I've seen group trips, like to a local play and other things. I could pick something DS likes to do.  That way we could meet some of the group and scope it out in a situation without a huge amount of interaction with a big group. 

 

I can't wait for summer to go to the pools - you're right, OhE, somehow the fact of being in the water keeps things tamped down.  Well, except for water guns.  :closedeyes:  It's been awhile, but we had rules. "What are the rules for water guns?" "No babies, no kids who say 'no' or 'stop it,' no adults - unless they spray me first and don't spray too close." 

 

 

[PeterPan]

No, I wouldn't let him take water guns. Our pool doesn't have signs up saying the rules for toys, but it seems like people only bring in *soft* toys. So you might try that. They make these really nifty foam water shooter jet things. They come in packs of 2 for like $5. Those would be fun! But yeah, you'd have to be careful. Me, I just stick to soft toys as that seems to be the norm. 

 

Amazon.com: POOF Power Spiral Football (Colors may Vary): Toys & Games You can buy these at Target or wherever inexpensively. If your kids are little (to jump in the 3-4') or allowed to swim in the deep end, you can throw it up and have them jump into the pool to catch. I noticed other boys were really good at extending their bodies, where my ds was very fixed. So like he'd just stand there and watch the ball sail past! So I usually find some physical goal to work on to help him imitate how I see other boys moving to catch balls. Like I'll say hey try to JUMP when you catch it or hey I'm going to throw to the side and you try to REACH. And sometimes we'd do sort football flying catches where he leaps to catch it and makes a big splash. He wears goggles obviously. I just have him imitate whatever I see other kids doing. 

 

Amazon.com: Water Sports Dive Sticks: Toys & Games Our diving sticks were from Walmart, but they look kinda like these. They're soft. I've seen some that are like squid with soft tentacles, and those would be good too.

 

I found a bag of soft balls at my MIL's, and I'm excited to try them. Though goodness knows why I need a whole bag, lol.

 

I can't remember if the foam covered water shooters got him in trouble. Even if the lifeguards allow it, like sometimes he won't have appropriate behaviors. 

 

[suenos]

Just wanted to update y'all.  DS wanted to go to a homeschool group activity - an arts and crafts thing at a library reserved room.  We went this week and he did very well!  Even talked to a couple of kids.  We left a little earlier than everyone else - reached the end point of his ability to sit/focus.  I know it sounds silly to be so encouraged by this - but simply participating in a group activity appropriately hasn't generally been something he could do (sometimes, but definitely not usually).  

 

We also went by a small theater group and signed DS up for a small kids drama class.  It sounds good for him - talked to the director and instructor beforehand and when we went there to sign him up the interaction between DS and the class leader was really positive. I'm nervous for him, but hopeful. I'll definitely talk a bit more with the class leader about DS and strategies to help him do well without disrupting the class for the other kids.  Starts in a month - it's an 8 week class - 1 hr once a week. 

 

Next big decision is whether to try out park day with a HS group again.  DS wants to, which is a good sign - when things were going so badly for him he didn't want to go anywhere or play with any kids.  Thinking about it...and thinking about plans/strategies to help ease him into it.

 

Anyways - just wanted to say thanks for the encouragement and advice!

 

P.S. OhE - laughing at the soft toys vs water guns thing - yeah, we didn't bring the water guns - just one of the main pools we'd go to always had kids with them. I like those dive sticks - and yes, having toys that he can share with other kids helps a lot! ;)   

 

 

[Lecka]

Awesome!!!!!!!!!