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How flexible can course titles/topics be and still count for high school credit?


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DD has decided she wants to get an education degree along with biology, with the plan of getting a PhD in biology and eventually doing a great deal of outreach as well as research. She wants to be someone like Kristen Stanford(who was able to get the Lake Erie watersnake to the point that it could be removed from endangered species lists, largely due to education and outreach in the community).

 

And, the fact is, I'd kind of rather see her do her education classes locally than the bio major specific ones. I' m not concerned with slotting in the general ed requirements (like English Composition 1 or Probability and Statistics), but how flexible can I be with college courses not normally taught in a high school? For example, can I list the "Literature for Children and Adolescents" course as an English class? What about "History of American Education"? Is there any place to stash "Teaching in Urban Environments" or "Child Psychology and Development?"

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Those sound like English and History credits to me.

 

Teaching in Urban Environments would be Occupational Education in my state, as at least one credit is required. Otherwise it's and "Other Elective"

 

Child Psychology is under History and Social Sciences.

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First, does your state have specific homeschool high school requirements that must be met in specific ways in order to "be legal" about your homeschooling? That's the first hurdle to clear. Most states are pretty relaxed, so if that is your situation then you can move to the next level of thinking/planning.

High school required classes and transcripts are largely for the benefit of making students "college prep" -- to have the required skills for college level work, and the required coursework to meet college admission policies. The college expectations of what that typically looks like is something like this for a student going into a STEM field:

4 credits = English (roughly 1/2 Lit. studies, and 1/2 Writing/Composition)
4 credits = Math (Alg. 1 through Pre-Calc.)
4 credits = Science, with labs
3-4 credits = Social Studies (1 credit = Amer. History; sometimes: 0.5 credit each = Gov't and Econ)
2-4 credits = Foreign Language (same language)
1 credit = Fine Arts (can be performance/creation of Fine Arts, or "Appreciation")
4-8+ credits = Electives (can be academic electives (additional courses in the first 5 subjects above beyond the requirements, or dual enrollment in the area of student's interest, or other -- PE, Health, Computer, personal interest, etc.)

Since it sounds like your DD would in essence be working towards a college degree simultaneously with a high school diploma, much of the college courses would double dip with your high school requirements, so probably a lot of the dual enrollment would cover your high school requirements. However, there are a few things that you probably won't be able to be very flexible with:

English
What specific works of Lit. you cover is not a concern to colleges, as long as you are doing what is typically done in high school Literature classes:

- reading / discussing / analyzing / writing about the works of Literature
- researching the author/times of the works
- learning about literary devices and how they work
- learning about literature topics

If the "Literature for Children and Adolescents" course is about these types of activities, then yes, it would count towards an English credit. However, if it is about training teachers how to find and use Literature in the classroom, then no, that is really an Education application and would be best listed under a separate subject heading of "Education".

Composition 1 would work fine for the Writing / Composition portion of the English credit. What colleges want from the writing portion of high school English courses is that the student learned, and can put into practice, good writing for a variety of types of papers (essays, reader responses, research papers with citations, etc.). So whatever you use to cover your English credits, you'll want to make sure your student understands and "is fluent" with:

- the writing process
- paragraph structure
- how to develop a supported argument
- how to proof-edit
- writing in format (APA, MLA, Chicago)
- in-text citations and works cited or bibliography pages

Literary analysis essays are also very useful to learn how to write a complete thesis statement and how to analyze a work and develop a supported argument (specific supporting examples and commentary), and I recommend making sure that at least 2 of your 4 years of high school include Literature in the traditional form, even if your student is headed in a STEM field.

Math
Colleges expect that the student has mastered Alg. 1 through Pre-Calc so that the student has the necessary foundation for taking required college maths for the degree program -- Statistics, Calculus, and other Advanced Maths, depending on what STEM field the student is going into. Colleges are not concerned about *when* the student mastered the Alg. 1 through Pre-Calc., as long as the student is continuing to progress into higher math levels beyond those high school maths while in high school. JMO: I would make sure to complete the Alg. 1 through Pre-Calc. to get that checked off before moving on to college-level maths like "Probability and Statistics".

For listing these on your transcript: for example, if your DD completed Alg. 1 in 6th, Geometry in 7th, Alg. 2 in 8th, Pre-Calc. in 9th, then continue with the college level maths with dual enrollment throughout high school, and list the 3 maths done in middle school in a separate section with the heading of "High School Credits Completed Prior to 9th Grade", and then list the dual enrollment courses under the Math subject heading.

Social Studies
Many many colleges require a total of 3-4 credits of Social Studies, with 1 credit being American History, and 0.5 credit each of Government and Economics. And by American History, colleges mean the key historical / social / political / economic events of the past 400 years of this country's colonial and federal history. And by Government, they mean American Government -- the Constitution, in-depth about each of the 3 branches of our gov't, the election process, etc. So "History of American Education" will NOT substitute for American History.

One possibility to streamline a credit like American History is to self-study and take the CLEP test, which could also possible count for college credit towards a degree program (all degrees have general ed. requirements in the Social Sciences, which includes History, Geography, etc.). Of course, it would depend on the university's policies about CLEP whether or not DD's future university accepts CLEP credits, or if that specific History CLEP would count towards the degree, or not.

However, "History of American Education" would work as one of the other non-specified required Social Studies credits. Or it would work as as academic elective as part of the 4-8 credits of Electives that college admission policies typically require. However, I think your best bet would be to list the Education coursework under its own subject heading, which is more likely to make her coursework "shine brightest", and will allow colleges decide for themselves how they want to sort out those credits.

An example of a possible transcript:

High School Credits Completed Prior to 9th Grade:
course .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  credit .  .  . grade
Math: Algebra 1 . . . . . . . . . . 1.00 . . . .  X
Math: Geometry . . . . . . . . . . 1.00 . . . .  X
Math: Algebra 2 . . . . . . . . . . 1.00 . . . .  X
__________________________

CREDITS COMPLETED IN HIGH SCHOOL:

English
course .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  credit .  .  . grade
English 9 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .1.00 . . . .  X
ENG 101: Composition 1* . . .1.00 . . . . X
* = course completed as dual enrollment through XYZ community college

Math
course .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  credit .  .  . grade
Pre-Calculus. . . . . . . . . . . . . 1.00 . . . .  X
MAT092: Prob. & Statistics* . 0.50 . . . . X
* = course completed as dual enrollment through XYZ community college

Social Studies
course .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  credit .  .  . grade
World History & Geography . .1.00 . . . .  X
History of the U.S. I & II***. . . 2.00 . . . .  pass
Government. . . . . . . . . . . . . . 0.50 . . . .  X
Economics. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 0.50 . . . .  X
*** = CLEP coursework and exams: 11-5-18 & 4-2-19

Education Major Coursework
course .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  credit .  .  . grade
Teaching in Urban Environ.**  . 1.00 . . . .  X
EDU210: Hist. of Amer. Ed.* . . 1.00 . . . . X
PSY223: Child Psych./Dev.**** 1.00 . . . . X

* = course completed as dual enrollment through XYZ community college
** = open source course, ABC university
*** = course completed as dual enrollment through DEF university

And finally, just a general tip for counting credits:

College courses that are below a 100-level designation are not college level, so these credits do NOT transfer as college credit and they do NOT accrue at the rate of 1 semester = 1 credit of high school credit, but instead are a direct 1:1 rate of 1 semester = 0.5 credit. Also, courses that have a course number below 100 will not transfer as college credit that meets college degree requirements. I mention all this, because our local community college has a "Probability and Statistics" course with a 092 course designation, meaning it is high school level, not college level.

BEST of luck to your budding scientist! Warmest regards, Lori D.

Edited by Lori D.
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And, the fact is, I'd kind of rather see her do her education classes locally than the bio major specific ones. I' m not concerned with slotting in the general ed requirements (like English Composition 1 or Probability and Statistics), but how flexible can I be with college courses not normally taught in a high school? For example, can I list the "Literature for Children and Adolescents" course as an English class? What about "History of American Education"? Is there any place to stash "Teaching in Urban Environments" or "Child Psychology and Development?"

 

Lit for Children and Adolescents is a literature course, no problem, and possibly an overall English course, but it would depend on how it's set up and what it covers. 

 

History of American Education could be one history credit, I would imagine, but I would want at least two to three more standard history courses as well. 

 

Teaching in Urban Environments is an elective. 

 

Child Psychology is psychology, which usually falls under a social studies elective. 

 

I'd fill in a slot here or there as needed, but I'd be leery of substituting too many major-specific courses for standard high school courses.

 

First, some colleges don't like to see that, and some won't accept it as college credit if you used it to fulfill high school requirements (if that matters). And, for me, it's important that my students get a lot of straightforward history, so very specific topics and/or courses that count as broader social studies or social sciences are electives, they don't displace the four years of history. 

 

If you are just wondering where to place such credits, I'd put them where they will have the most impact if it could go two ways. For example, I probably would list the History of Education in her history section, because history credits over the minimum stand out more than electives over the minimum.

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First, some colleges don't like to see that, and some won't accept it as college credit if you used it to fulfill high school requirements (if that matters). And, for me, it's important that my students get a lot of straightforward history, so very specific topics and/or courses that count as broader social studies or social sciences are electives, they don't displace the four years of history.

I think everyone has to decide how far out-of-the-box they want their homeschools and the resulting transcripts to be.

 

OP's DD sounds like a pretty out-of-the-box kid. If following her dreams leads to an unorthodox transcript that's not necessarily a problem. Yes, she may have to look a little harder to find a college that gives credit where credit is due, but in return she gets to do her education her way, which is a great reason to homeschool.

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In going back to get my degree all reformalized, I have done three different transfer credit evals with three different schools. Essentially all said the same thing: we will take the basic 101 stuff, we won't take anything over 7 years old, and you have to take your education courses with us. The degree lisencure is a BA in mathematics with endorsement and an MA in science education with endorsement. Having previous degrees did not matter. I could transfer 65 credits at the most generous school and those were essentially just 100 levels across the board

 

As much as it would be wonderful for her to knock out many of her degree requirements for education, I would be leery of thinking you can kick off too many this far ahead of the game. If she wants to take the course, that is always great, but much like the biology stuff, she might find it actually hard to transfer the courses into her major later.

 

If there is a direct transfer agreement, you probably will have much more luck. This does then limit her 4 year choices.

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At this point, I'm less worried about transferring and more about finding something for her to do for the next few years. She says she doesn't want to graduate early, has not been thrilled with any of the high school choices, and would definitely rather take college classes with papers and multiple tests vs sitting for a single AP exam.  She has a large stack of classes that could theoretically count for high school, but except for ticking boxes for prerequisites, I've largely assumed that we wouldn't use them for such-it was more a case of "do the next thing" than anything else.

 

I also think anxiety is playing into it. A lot of her grad student friends are very concerned about whether funding to do research will exist by the time they graduate (and some are very concerned about funding now). The idea that you might need a day job to pay for your field biology hobby until you get a big break is looming pretty large right now, and I think she feels teaching is a good choice for someone who wants to research creatures mostly active in the summer months in the Northern Hemisphere anyway. That will hopefully fade with time, but if sitting with class listings and trying to plan out high school including as many college classes as possible is making her feel she's more in control, I'll take it-particularly when she can take the classes inexpensively. 

 

 

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What I would do is sit down and figure out what she *has* to have for high school classes. For example, I saw a lot of colleges list that they wanted kids to have 3 years of science, 1 or 2 with labs, but would only specify that they required biology, or biology and chemistry. That leaves you room to do a 3rd credit or more of more elective sciences.

 

I saw similar things in history--they'd specify 3 years of history, but only say that 1 of the credits had to be US history, or maybe they'd specify US and World, or some might list government--again, leaving you room for history elective credits.

 

So, if you know where she might like to go, or a list of 5-10 schools your family would consider, find out what the requirements are to come up with what she *has* to do--and then it's fine to fill in with some electives that fit in those major categories, or to count them as electives beyond any core requirements. 

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I also think anxiety is playing into it. A lot of her grad student friends are very concerned about whether funding to do research will exist by the time they graduate (and some are very concerned about funding now). The idea that you might need a day job to pay for your field biology hobby until you get a big break is looming pretty large right now, and I think she feels teaching is a good choice for someone who wants to research creatures mostly active in the summer months in the Northern Hemisphere anyway. That will hopefully fade with time, but if sitting with class listings and trying to plan out high school including as many college classes as possible is making her feel she's more in control, I'll take it-particularly when she can take the classes inexpensively. 

 

Oh, that's depressing, but nonetheless a reality.  Take a look at STEP at Stanford, which gets you a masters and a teaching credential in 12 months.  

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