Textbooks that are easy to do as audio

[PeterPan]

Ok, I ought to know this and am feeling like a goober that I don't. What are my options for science textbooks at a 4th-8th grade level that are easy to switch over to audio or use with TTS or turn on for audio? Cannot require wifi. Like some of the new fangled interactive texts require wifi, and I can't have that. 

 

I know Apologia has audio cds for their elementary series. If I did that, he could listen but couldn't follow along. Or maybe that doesn't matter? Like maybe he just sits, listens, looks at the pictures, and we turn the page? 

 

See, I've got another ABA worker coming and could use some things that are independent work or more self-empowered. He really, really is keen on science, so anything he could be self-empowered with and drive himself would be awesome. And in my chatting with Barton and watching her video here (36) Bright Solutions for Dyslexia - Timeline I'm realizing textbook reading by ear is something we aren't getting done. They do some science read alouds with him, and it's fine. I just think we could step it up a bit. But intriguing is essential and audio option is essential.

 

I'm also realizing our new worker could do the TOPS lentil stuff. I like doing the one that's all mathy, but the really open-ended, more themed one will drive me crazy. I think that one I'll dump on the worker, hahahaha...

[kbutton]

I am going to recommend something totally different.

 

I think if you go with isolated ear-reading of texts, you are going to fuel more hyperlexia, and he might parrot back more things using echolalia vs. repeating things in his own words. I think you need something that involves dialog and that gets him to think through things and use a variety of language to do so. I think you need something hands-on, but something that a tutor can implement.

 

Ta-da:

 

http://www.pandiapress.com/store-5/    

 

You won't like it, but I think your DS might. I think a tutor can do a lot of it, but you might need to prep some of the household items for the labs. They sell lab kits that have all but the household stuff, but the tutor might not have time to set up a lab and do it the same day. Most of the time, it would work out, but sometimes you might have to prep a bit, but it has a very, very clearly laid out schedule with what you need for each lab.

 

It's scripted, but it's flexible--I know because I used two of the books, and I could make it work. But the tutor would have the scripted, (mostly) open and go support that she needs. 

 

The chemistry would be easier for a non-science person to implement than Earth and Space. We liked Earth and Space okay, but it was too fiddly for what we learned. However, my husband is science-y in the right way and probably would've made it more fun.

 

Chemistry though? I LOVED IT. The book looks at atoms from the inside out and then outside in. It's both big-picture and linear, and I would say that the demonstrations are quite concrete. There were a few that could be skipped or that were more for the sake of having fun with a concept, but most of them really actually made the concepts click. They are very much demonstrations vs. experiments, but they were good for that. There is some writing with the lab sheets, but it's minimal, and the tutor could easily do it.

 

I have not used biology or physics because i either had other materials already or we were doing it with a co-op, and it would've been too pricey.

 

I would also suggest short videos with discussion/short books (or topical books like Usborne encyclopedic books) over a textbook. He needs language to be with people and always have some back and forth quality in order to help him learn to translate thoughts into multiple words, sort ideas into hierarchies (part of prioritizing data that's coming in), etc. 

 

My $.02.

 

 

[PeterPan]

That's a *really* good point about the language. And you're right that I hadn't made a connection between his previous, obvious hyperlexia and what he was doing now. Just had totally forgotten. You work on something and think it's just gone, dealt with. I'm going to get him a fresh baseline on his language before we do some intervention. It may be that the gap has become more obvious again, since we haven't explicitly been working on language.

 

I hadn't really looked at the REAL science curriculum, so that was interesting. Unfortunately, the ABA workers we have coming in aren't of a caliber to do that. They don't even get done SIMPLE things I give them. They'd never get that science done. And I don't think it fits where his language or ability to connect with print is either. He'd just totally fade out. 

 

The BJU science 4 fits him easily, so I'm going to show him the videos and see what he thinks. It has a lot of analysis and creative thinking/application, like the zoo days we go to, and it's easy to scribe and adapt to disabilities. I think he'd like the independence of the videos, and he liked the science 2 when we did it in K5. The other thing I noticed from doing the BJU Heritage Studies and Science 2 back then was their careful repetition of language. It was really good about filling in gaps for him, because they were using the same terms and constructions over and over, very intentionally. And because it's so interesting and has pauses to do things, he would end up talking about it. BJU is very careful to scale the language of their instructors to the target audience. That works to our advantage.

 

Remember, when I say ABA tutor, these people are just kids, college students. The prep nothing, do nothing, and come in with very few skills beyond the basic training from the behaviorist and a stable personality. They aren't skilled or certified or trained or qualified in ANYTHING academic. And working with his behavior is challenging enough that they basically can't DO anything but open and go. The most complex they've been able to do is a science kit. Any time I've tried to get them to do more, they flop. It's not like a qualified tutor who happens to be working on behavior. This is someone working on behavior who is willing to supervise him doing a little academics. They'll tell him they think he could try harder on his handwriting or praise his effort, but they're not really TEACHING. They aren't qualified and can't handle it. They are minions who enforce behavior and compliance for an idiot-proof, totally obvious, read and do what the thing says, kind of plan.

[kbutton]

That's a *really* good point about the language. And you're right that I hadn't made a connection between his previous, obvious hyperlexia and what he was doing now. Just had totally forgotten. You work on something and think it's just gone, dealt with. I'm going to get him a fresh baseline on his language before we do some intervention. It may be that the gap has become more obvious again, since we haven't explicitly been working on language.

 

I hadn't really looked at the REAL science curriculum, so that was interesting. Unfortunately, the ABA workers we have coming in aren't of a caliber to do that. They don't even get done SIMPLE things I give them. They'd never get that science done. And I don't think it fits where his language or ability to connect with print is either. He'd just totally fade out.  I wasn't expecting him to connect with the text. I was expecting that he'd connect with the tutor, and they would do it together. It's fine if this curriculum would not work for that.

 

The BJU science 4 fits him easily, so I'm going to show him the videos and see what he thinks. It has a lot of analysis and creative thinking/application, like the zoo days we go to, and it's easy to scribe and adapt to disabilities. I think he'd like the independence of the videos, and he liked the science 2 when we did it in K5. The other thing I noticed from doing the BJU Heritage Studies and Science 2 back then was their careful repetition of language. It was really good about filling in gaps for him, because they were using the same terms and constructions over and over, very intentionally. And because it's so interesting and has pauses to do things, he would end up talking about it. BJU is very careful to scale the language of their instructors to the target audience. That works to our advantage. I know nothing about BJU science to compare.  RSO science is very Charlotte Mason approach, and sounds like what you are saying about BJU, so we're definitely not expressing things in equivalent ways.

 

Remember, when I say ABA tutor, these people are just kids, college students. I remember. I also remember that you said you were going to throw a TOPS kit at them. The open-ended theme one. RSO is far more cut and dry (I think, but it's been a while since I saw TOPS. I liked the idea of TOPS but thought it was too open-ended and required too much prep). RSO strikes me as being more foolproof, plus it gives them activities to do together, which builds on the people thing, the language thing, the "be on the same page with me" thing. I thought those were goals. If not, they are the goals I was trying to keep in sight, so that is why I suggested what I did. The prep nothing, do nothing, and come in with very few skills beyond the basic training from the behaviorist and a stable personality. They aren't skilled or certified or trained or qualified in ANYTHING academic. And working with his behavior is challenging enough that they basically can't DO anything but open and go. Then why would give them an open-ended TOPS kit? If I sound like a broken record, it's on purpose. I honestly thought RSO was somewhere between "open-ended kit" and your assertion that they can't do much with him. You don't have to like my idea, but I don't think it's unrealistic given that you were going to have her do a TOPS kit with him.  RSO would require a little prep from you, but of the kind where you lay out the materials each session and the like. It's not like "study" kind of prep. It's fine if it's too much, but it's scripted, not completely open-ended and not soul-sucking as you've described things. The most complex they've been able to do is a science kit. Any time I've tried to get them to do more, they flop (Is it their fault they are flopping? Many, many competent people would struggle to teach open-ended creative things in the same situation.). It's not like a qualified tutor who happens to be working on behavior. This is someone working on behavior who is willing to supervise him doing a little academics. They'll tell him they think he could try harder on his handwriting or praise his effort, but they're not really TEACHING. They aren't qualified and can't handle it. They are minions who enforce behavior and compliance for an idiot-proof, totally obvious, read and do what the thing says, kind of plan. Minion is not usually seen as a positive term. 

 

[Lecka]

I think if you are asking them to do stuff that shouldn't be that difficult, and they can't make it work bc they can't do it and handle behavior issues at the same time, you need to consider either addressing the behavior issues or adapting to the behavior issues.

 

It is where you are. You can't just wish you weren't.

 

The tutors not being as good may also contribute, I'm not saying it doesn't, but are you saying they couldn't do this stuff with a kid who didn't present any challenges? And if it is the case, okay it is unrealistic to ask them to do it.

 

If it is not the case, I think you need to look at being more realistic about current levels or about focusing more (within a balance) on the behavior and engagement side.

 

I also think -- unless a certain thing is just bad or boring, you can look for a new shiny thing when really the shiny thing is not where the problem is, it is more with behavior and engagement issues that really can be worked on without a shiny new program.

 

If that is a factor, you are better off having the tutor play to their strength, whatever that is, so they have most of their focus on working in behavior and engagement instead of trying to figure out a new-to-them program.

 

Anything they have experience or strength with will leave them with more of their mental energy for behavior and engagement type of things.

[Heathermomster]

I hate Facebook so can't see the video you linked.

If you are wanting your child to practice reading non-fiction, maybe take a living book approach. You can download texts through BARD, Bookshare, LA, or use the Claro app.

When DS was younger, we used the following text and built a popsicle stick bridge:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1885593309/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I also used a ton of Evan-Moor Science publishing materials which can be purchased as pdf files. DS did not start using non-fiction text books in earnest until 5th grade. Outside of maybe short reading comprehension exercises from a publisher like Galore Park and their Junior English series, I just wouldn't be in a hurry to introduce a science text book until later.  Junior English passages contain fiction and non-fiction comprehension exercises.

Edited January 11, 2017 by Heathermomster

[prairiewindmomma]

My kid completely falls apart trying to listen to the Apologia texts.  It's just too much info coming via audio when he's not really engaged on the topic.  I get it. I find that I tune her out as well after a bit.  She is very, very wordy and the concepts fly by quickly.

 

He does fine with the SOTW texts on audio.  There's a stronger narrative and we're not fighting vocabulary.

 

We've moved ds (now in 5th) to Pandia Press history after completing the SOTW cycle. I agree with kbutton on two points:

1. Pandia Press materials are VERY straightforward, with very clear task lists, and the history is very quick to go through, imo, if one is on task. My 14 yo sometimes steps in teaching my 10 yo, and this is something I can hand to him and it gets done.

2. At some point, behavior becomes the top priority.  We hit that wall last year (4th).  I was bending myself into all kinds of crazy contortionist positions to accommodate and engage and in reality, he really needed to build the skill of persevering at something he was not interested in, but that needed to be done,  for at least three minutes.  We went from epic meltdowns at home over writing one line of text to having the OT have him work at writing for 45 minutes straight over the course of six months.  For real.  Does the kid still have dysgraphia and a long abc list of other issues? Yes.  Do we use ideal materials all of the time? No, but I'm teaching the kid in front of me.

[PeterPan]

I've been watching him over the last few days, and he's such a huge consumer of information via other ways, I'm realizing ear reading a non-fiction text probably isn't our highest priority right now. Heathermomster, yes we've done some bridge building with K'nex and enjoy it!

 

Prairie, that is such a profound topic, it makes me take a deep breath. Like on the one hand, we want to rearrange things and do things our kids engage with. And it's true people in general learn better when it's coming from an angle they find interesting. But I also agree with you that once you add the autism component there's this challenge of them figuring out they COULD be interested in something or COULD enjoy doing something. It's the relational component that is missing that makes it hard for them to say ok I'll engage with this topic because this other person finds it interesting.

 

Now he's doing that with the Zoo Days and doing really well now. He actually asks questions and will pet the animal visitor. It's a big thing! Two years ago when we went, he would just sit there the whole time, not interacting. So I agree with you that it brings something fresh if I have the ABA workers do some content curriculum with him where the whole point is to choose to interact and engage because we're together. 

 

It's kind of iffy on how good the videos are for that. I'm sort of split in my mind. Like the videos are REALLY good instruction! They make careful use of repeated vocabulary, control the language, etc. They have better science thinking than most homeschool-generated curricula. It's good stuff! And when he watches them, he enjoys and wants to do the things. Then he gets impatient. And that's where I'm split in my mind, like whether that's a good thing to work on or not the goal. But I agree if we always set it up as "don't bother to engage unless it's perfectly at your intellectual level and enchanting" well then he's gonna be a pistol. My dd is a bit of a pistol on that, and my ds could just be horrible. But I also think it's possible to get to the same place (working on engagement) while using things that are more on-level for him. Problem is, it's very possible the workers just flat can't do it. That's just reality. Now I found something super cool *I* can do with him, but I'm just really not inspired/hopeful that they can. I think it's more likely they'd either not get things done or do things in a basal, unprovocative way, bereft of all thought, questioning, and analysis. Then we might as well not have bothered. We might as well have done something they were going to be able to do WELL. It matters what the workers can do WELL.

 

I'm just thinking out loud there. Thanks for the feedback on the apologia audio. That totally makes sense, so I'll scratch that. I haven't decided if I want to hand SOTW to the workers. I got the activity manuals for 1 and 2, and the activities would be fun for him. I thought about rearranging the books by country/region. I'm not really a lover of SOTW on a lot of levels. 

 

I'm not sure I want to do task/list driven history like Pandia Press. I know people do it. I hate history to start with, and I just, well I guess I just have strong feelings about it. Like I'd rather do NO history than do horrible history. Like I'll read Horrible Histories with him and let him watch documentaries and read DK books and encyclopedias of planes before I'll do a curriculum like that. But that's just me. Apparently it's an issue I have, lol. I want his brain to be *organized* for history he does, and history like that, with task lists, don't improve brain organization. I'd rather just let him study a few strands that interest him (planes, geography, etc.) and then let that organize his brain. 

 

It's kind of curious that I don't have the same strong opinions about science that I have about history, hmm. Hate must be a strong motivator, lol.

 

I guess I'm kind of giving up. He sorta likes the gr 4 science and sort of seems bored. I think it could be good and worth doing. He also liked the gr 6 and 7 samples, but I don't want to bump that high, I don't think. But if I get the gr 4 videos and he grows quickly bored, I've wasted money, sigh. Don't know. It just seemed like an easy, tidy option. I'm definitely planning on doing the Critical Thinking Through Science book with him Developing Critical Thinking Through Science/Book 2 Grade 4-6 (#8703): June Main, Paul Eggen: 9780894554223: Amazon.com: Books I just don't think that alone is probably enough.

[kbutton]

DIerdre Lovecky (Different Minds--yeah, I know it's dry) says that 2e kids with ASD often need information presented wholistically (top down), and then ALSO linearly, so I would think a bit about letting him organize his own brain, lol! I mean, he's going to whether you give him the information or not. He's not going to take multiple perspectives easily, so he's already bent toward making up his own mind. I don't think that imposing a bit of organization is going to *hurt.* I am saying this lightheartedly but seriously. I would also point out that my son's greatest struggles with ASD are in organizing/labeling/contextualizing "big thoughts" about abstract information. He sort of gets stuff, but it never quite clicks all the way without some human intervention and very straightforward teaching. Every time. That doesn't mean he doesn't have intuition, collect thoughts, match up idea, and think deeply on his own, but it's wonky in a way that I'm not sure how to describe. Being disciplined about doing things in an orderly way (which can still be creative and not dry) has been excellent for him. It's not soul-sucking.

 

Another thing to consider for science...http://www.eagleswingsed.com/product/considering-gods-creation/ 

 

I was given this curriculum, and I didn't know what to think of it for a long time. It had a lot of cutting and things. It covers a huge range of topics, and they can be scaled for a variety of ages up through maybe 7th or 8th grade. Anyway, I decided to stop being intimidated by it, and it's pretty cool. We have done science more topically, so the overview thing doesn't really fit as a year of science for us, but I pick and choose things from the book as they coincide with a topic we're hitting with whatever I find in the book. So, we're doing Apologia Flying Creatures at co-op (talk about chaos--great INFORMATION, random, awful, and mismatched materials, organization, etc.). I found several topics in CGC, and I pulled out those pages. We do one (about 15-20 minutes of work if I cut stuff for my younger kiddo), and we're done. It's easy peasy. One of the things that your DS might like is the Zoo Adventure book. On the left-hand page, the book has room for a picture of the animal (draw it, photograph it, print from the internet, whatever), and then the right hand page has a hierarchical list of things you circle, check, etc. about what kind of animal it is (mammal, etc.), where it lives, habitat, diet, shelter, etc. He could easily work on a page like that from a living book, your zoo thing, a video, Wild Kratts, etc. There are also other activities that talk about classifying animals. All of those skills are really good brain skills for kids, particularly kids on the spectrum. It reminds me in many ways of Montessori work.

 

Anyway, you can see online what all the curriculum covers. If you use it all, there is a CD with songs on it to learn the stuff you're discussing. It's short, sweet, to the point, and has good brain organization tasks. It covers a variety of topics, and it does not involve much writing. It would be interactive.

[kbutton]

Let me try that link again: http://www.eagleswingsed.com/product/considering-gods-creation/ 

[kbutton]

http://www.eagleswingsed.com/product/considering-gods-creation/

 

If this doesn't work, just google the title, lol!