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We are going to live abroad!


EndOfOrdinary
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My husband has agreed to teach abroad! Only, I cannot tell anyone since we do not know anything concrete, so I am going to tell you guys. I just want to jump up and down and squeal eeeeee!

 

This is a conversation that has started and stopped for a good five or more years. I want to go just about anywhere. I fly by the seat of my pants and have serious wanderlust. He is a muller. He has to think about things for.ev.er. Tonight he came to the conclusion that he wants to go for it. He admitted he has been scared about going somewhere where he is the minority - a very large, white male who stands out a lot and does not speak the language. After the recent events in our counrty, he feels like he might just need to experience that in order to come home and do some good.

 

The major convension where he would be offered jobs is in February. So we do not know anything until then. However, the likelihood of a job offer in February is about 85-90%. He would interview with over a dozen schools, and then see how it goes.

 

Right now, we essentially get a list of what we need to square away in order to move. When we find out where we will be for the five year tour, then the specifics start.

 

The kiddo and I are SO excited. Right now everyone is hoping for Albania.

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My husband has agreed to teach abroad! Only, I cannot tell anyone since we do not know anything concrete, so I am going to tell you guys. I just want to jump up and down and squeal eeeeee!

 

This is a conversation that has started and stopped for a good five or more years. I want to go just about anywhere. I fly by the seat of my pants and have serious wanderlust. He is a muller. He has to think about things for.ev.er. Tonight he came to the conclusion that he wants to go for it. He admitted he has been scared about going somewhere where he is the minority - a very large, white male who stands out a lot and does not speak the language. After the recent events in our counrty, he feels like he might just need to experience that in order to come home and do some good.

 

The major convension where he would be offered jobs is in February. So we do not know anything until then. However, the likelihood of a job offer in February is about 85-90%. He would interview with over a dozen schools, and then see how it goes.

 

Right now, we essentially get a list of what we need to square away in order to move. When we find out where we will be for the five year tour, then the specifics start.

 

The kiddo and I are SO excited. Right now everyone is hoping for Albania.[/

 

We spent a year living in Southern Spain with our kids and it was wonderful. Great idea to start getting ready early!

Edited by blueninjamum
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The current short list that everyone can agree on is Albania, Costa Rica, Egypt, Morocco, and Nicaragua. India and Ecuador are very strong maybes. I am allergic to ginger (as in complete anaphylaxis) so India makes me very nervous. Ecuador is not doing all that well in stability and that makes my husband nervous.

 

Currently, we need to get a passport for kiddo (a much larger undertaking since 9/11 considering my husband is not bio-dad) and get all of his dental/orthodontics all figured out. We have to learn what the process is for transporting our dog overseas, figure out exactly where our cars are going to go, consider renting our house, find someone willing to house my husband's firearms. It is all a bit crazy when I write it out.

 

And I get to seriously revise our high school plan! AP tests are now a much slimmer option than previously, though many of the schools do offer a few. A tour is generally five years and that means Ds will graduate high school abroad. Living overseas and learning another two languages through immersion is definitely a plus on an Ivy application, but it doesn't make up completely for the lack of American testing.

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Wonderful! I'm seriously jealous. I worked in the Middle East years ago and loved it. If I could work abroad (or be rich enough to travel), I would in a heartbeat. Please keep us posted on your adventure.

I am hoping to reignite the blog which our family used to write regularly. We fell off the horse after returning from our Pacific Crest Trail hike, but this is enough to get my behind back in gear.

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The current short list that everyone can agree on is Albania, Costa Rica, Egypt, Morocco, and Nicaragua. India and Ecuador are very strong maybes. I am allergic to ginger (as in complete anaphylaxis) so India makes me very nervous. Ecuador is not doing all that well in stability and that makes my husband nervous.

 

Currently, we need to get a passport for kiddo (a much larger undertaking since 9/11 considering my husband is not bio-dad) and get all of his dental/orthodontics all figured out. We have to learn what the process is for transporting our dog overseas, figure out exactly where our cars are going to go, consider renting our house, find someone willing to house my husband's firearms. It is all a bit crazy when I write it out.

 

And I get to seriously revise our high school plan! AP tests are now a much slimmer option than previously, though many of the schools do offer a few. A tour is generally five years and that means Ds will graduate high school abroad. Living overseas and learning another two languages through immersion is definitely a plus on an Ivy application, but it doesn't make up completely for the lack of American testing.

 

Congrats! Very exciting. We know lots of teachers and their families where we live, both working for international schools and local schools. 

 

Vaccinations are something to add to the list, particularly for the more tropical destinations. HepB takes six months to arrange, for example.

 

Pets can be prohibitively expensive to import/export, but families we know who do take pets consider them family. 

 

We've loved our adventure, and while living abroad will test anyone's flexibility, the experience is priceless. I'll just add that in our country, we are minorities, but European/white is a privileged minority. In many places, racism (against for example Indians in the Middle East) is strongly institutionalized, and the low-status minorities have so few rights people can treat them as slaves. So you get a very different experience, being a minority, but I feel personally even more privileged by my skin here than in the US or Europe. 

 

A friend of mine spent a couple years at an international school in Albania and had a good experience. Good luck with the process!

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That sounds awesome! This caught my eye because my dh was asked to apply for a position in Seoul. The whole thing could happen in about six months, I think.  We have the same issues about getting ready - what to do with the dogs? (Korea is not big-dog friendly). I think I can keep them enrolled in our current program as long as we maintain a residence here and come back for annual testing. We also have a kid in braces, who needs jaw surgery eventually.

 

Giving the kids the experience of living internationally is a huge deal. I do have a little concern - we moved from a city to a tiny native village when my oldest was a sophomore. It was REALLY hard to move to where not only was she an ethnic minority, but she wasn't the one kid who wasn't related to all the rest (they were at least 2nd cousins). Moving to an area with an American population would be easier.

Edited by ondreeuh
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We have lived 'overseas' (since we don't really have one home country any more) so if there is any advice I can give please let me know. Is your husband going to be teaching at an English language International School? If not, somewhere like Albania you might have issues with socialisation for your kiddo (ask me how I know about this ...) Also double triple check things like the internet speed and electricity in wherever you end up living.
 

 

Living overseas and learning another two languages through immersion is definitely a plus on an Ivy application, but it doesn't make up completely for the lack of American testing.

 

 

Would also caution about being too wedded to the immersion language learning - great opportunity esp. with a bright kiddo, but be aware that it is not always as easy as 'we will be there and we will just absorb this stuff' (though you probably already know that) especially if the kid is already got a lot on their plate academics wise. And it is also very hard if you are living in an English speaking ex-pat community (another ask me how I know ...)

 

ETA - and check and check again the legalities of homeschooling in whatever country you are going to - in some countries it is just not legal.

Edited by nobeatenpath
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We have lived 'overseas' (since we don't really have one home country any more) so if there is any advice I can give please let me know. Is your husband going to be teaching at an English language International School? If not, somewhere like Albania you might have issues with socialisation for your kiddo (ask me how I know about this ...) Also double triple check things like the internet speed and electricity in wherever you end up living.

 

 

Would also caution about being too wedded to the immersion language learning - great opportunity esp. with a bright kiddo, but be aware that it is not always as easy as 'we will be there and we will just absorb this stuff' (though you probably already know that) especially if the kid is already got a lot on their plate academics wise. And it is also very hard if you are living in an English speaking ex-pat community (another ask me how I know ...)

 

ETA - and check and check again the legalities of homeschooling in whatever country you are going to - in some countries it is just not legal.

 

Our experience of socialisation in China: we deliberately moved into an apartment complex with an inner courtyard where the children played, and where there were no other foreigners.  The boys were aged 4 and 8, so much of the play was more-or-less non-verbal (running around, etc.).  We accidentally arrived with a playground toy that wasn't available in China, and this really helped to make a position for the boys in the area.  The parents of the local children all wanted their children to learn English - of course, by weight of numbers, Chinese was the language of the playground, so my boys learned.

 

In addition, we had a household helper who only spoke Chinese.  She played with the boys for hours (we bought a bi-lingual Monopoly set).

 

We also socialised through the expat community a bit, but most of the boys' social time was in the apartment complex.  I altered our timetable, as most of the Chinese children were only free to play after 9pm.

 

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We have lived 'overseas' (since we don't really have one home country any more) so if there is any advice I can give please let me know. Is your husband going to be teaching at an English language International School? If not, somewhere like Albania you might have issues with socialisation for your kiddo (ask me how I know about this ...) Also double triple check things like the internet speed and electricity in wherever you end up living.

 

 

Would also caution about being too wedded to the immersion language learning - great opportunity esp. with a bright kiddo, but be aware that it is not always as easy as 'we will be there and we will just absorb this stuff' (though you probably already know that) especially if the kid is already got a lot on their plate academics wise. And it is also very hard if you are living in an English speaking ex-pat community (another ask me how I know ...)

 

ETA - and check and check again the legalities of homeschooling in whatever country you are going to - in some countries it is just not legal.

I imagine Albania is like most other European countries where most kids speak fluent English. (Re socialization). Of all the things to worry about, socialization would not be front of mind for me.

Re testing: i further imagine one can take the SAT in Mars at this point, but APs might be worth looking into.

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I asked an Albanian I know and knows about education law and it seems Homeschooling is illegal in Albania (not sure how member above does it - perhaps ask her?) There are always exceptions - for example if you are serving with NATO - but such exceptions may not apply to you and this is something I suggest you think about. If you do decide to 'fly beneath the radar' be aware of how this could affect everything from your husband's position to how people interact with you to joining local sports teams. I know people who have managed this in Germany where it is also illegal, and it can be easier if you are a foreign citizen, but it can sometimes be incredibly stressful.

 

Sorry, I really don't want to be a downer - we have lived in four different countries in the past eight years so you know, I am not against the whole idea! And you are obviously someone who looks in to things and considers them. I just have met more than one family that has moved overseas and been overwhelmed by the difficulties they have encountered - heck if I knew how certain things were going to work out here in Istanbul I would have asked for us to choose somewhere else instead. It is exciting, a huge opportunity and can be amazing. But I suggest you do your best to contact people 'on the ground' who are living where you intend to go; make sure that you speak to people who will be in as similar a situation to yours as you can (have children, live in the neighbourhood you are considering); and don't be overwhelmed with the whole idea that the US is so terrible that anywhere else will be better*. For example India, which you list above, has HUGE wealth inequality, entrenched endemic corruption, religious violence and incredible bigotry against many groups. Albania also has serious problems with corruption, press freedom and sexism. Not saying a country has to be perfect to live in - I mean, I live in Turkey! - and if you are living in an expatriate community you are immune from a lot of the worst problems, but it is worth remembering that just because it is not the US doesn't mean it is automatically better than the US (and I am not an American!)

 

*I am not saying that is you specifically, but I have come across more than one US family that has stated this as a reason to move lately.

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I imagine Albania is like most other European countries where most kids speak fluent English. (Re socialization). Of all the things to worry about, socialization would not be front of mind for me.

 

 

I don't know Albania, but it has a very, very different history from much of Europe, so I'm not sure that that's a safe assumption.

 

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I don't know Albania, but it has a very, very different history from much of Europe, so I'm not sure that that's a safe assumption.

 

I'm familiar with Albania and its history. I'm not worried about OP's child socialization, of all the things.

We could go into what "much of Europe" actually means anymore, but that's not useful to anyone.

Edited by madteaparty
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Sorry, but most 10 year olds in Albania don't speak English. Of course if the OPs husband is teaching at an English language based school there is a lot more scope for meeting kids who do.

You know, I have it on extremely good authority that most 10 year olds where OP would be located actually do. But I'm not going to get into it with strangers on the Internet.

OP, you have my contact.

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My husband would be teaching at an International school that is highly regarded (to the extent that in certain places his years could transfer to vested retirement years here in the U.S.). Our family is personally connected with over a dozen individuals who have used the organization both previously and currently. We would be in a relatively large city with a moderate to high income bracket since the school is private education. Though, I am sure, there are sections of Albania which are not the most "modern", or safe, or friendly, those places exist right here in the closest Big City. Yes, Albania's history is a bit sorted and has had some dramatic points in the last forty years, but currently the U.S. is turning firehoses and dogs on its Native people for wanting to protect their water supply. So it is all rather a big crap shoot.

 

As for homeschooling, much like military, diplomatic, and political ex pat children, we would not be considered Albanian citizens. We are considered U.S. citizens on specialized work visas. This allows us to homeschool our child as long as we are "not directly and flagrantly insulting the native culture." Secondly, if Ds' studies are centralized out of the U.S. via the internet he is considered to be privately educated within the United States and it is even less of an issue.

 

Such a visa only allows me to work in a few specific ways (Albania is a poor country, so my work would mainly be limited to jobs which required or were enhanced by the use of English - or at least that is the formal information we have been given.) When we have more specifics, I can actively look into personal employment if it will be needed. In some instances, cost of living is low and base pay is high. In that case, we can evaluate if I will be actually gaining income, or more volunteering, or telecommuniting. If I telecommute, the situation is even simpler. Then my business is landed in the U.S. and I am not considered a "dependent to my spouse."

 

There is a cultural education and rules class that Ds and I will have to attend when we know exactly where we will be. It is mandantory for all "dependents." I have to fill out a statement and write up three personal essays showing I understand the expectations which go along with traveling. They are directly attached to Dh's application to any school where he applies. They are not messing around with family. It is just as important to them that the placement works.

 

We would be placed in a dwelling by the school with verified high speed internet so that my husband could do the necessary work from home. Running water, electricity, furniture, the whole deal. This was the only major caveat for me. I live a very significant portion of my life online and so does Ds.

 

My son is currently conversational and academic in Spanish, very close to conversational and fairly academic in Latin, and can read Greek pretty well. I am actually far less worried about his language and socialization than I am mine :). English is also listed as one of the top three predominant languages in Albania. That was a big plus for my husband, who speaks only English and does so with a Southern accent at that :)

 

We have friends right now in Croatia (soon to be going to Albania) homeschooling their kids and Vlogging the experience. Lots of kids speaking English, openly homeschooling, high speed internet, standard apartment. Essentially it is a lot like here in the U.S.

 

Right now the only two giant hang ups are the dog (Ds caveat was that Gideon had to be able to be able to go) and that we have a full run of approximately 16 AP classes scheduled for the next five years instead of community college or an early entry program. While he could take the classes online or self study, taking the tests would be a bit iffy. It is being considered that Ds and I would just fly back for the month of May to visit and then he could take them while we were home.

 

And who knows, it might be that Morocco or Costa Rica offer him a great job. Maybe something fantastic will appear from Outer Mongolia or Western Bhutan that we cannot even imagine right now. The uncertainty is a situation that requires coming to terms with how little we all really know about tomorrow. You should plan. You should consider. Then you just have to let go and enjoy it.

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That sounds awesome! This caught my eye because my dh was asked to apply for a position in Seoul. The whole thing could happen in about six months, I think. We have the same issues about getting ready - what to do with the dogs? (Korea is not big-dog friendly). I think I can keep them enrolled in our current program as long as we maintain a residence here and come back for annual testing. We also have a kid in braces, who needs jaw surgery eventually.

 

Giving the kids the experience of living internationally is a huge deal. I do have a little concern - we moved from a city to a tiny native village when my oldest was a sophomore. It was REALLY hard to move to where not only was she an ethnic minority, but she wasn't the one kid who wasn't related to all the rest (they were at least 2nd cousins). Moving to an area with an American population would be easier.

Korea! How exciting. I will cross my fingers for you.

 

I was a kid who had to have my jaw completely reworked with orthedontia. I am very thankful now, but it was an ordeal at the time. Good luck!

 

My mom has mentioned the idea of having Ds enroll in the school Dh would be teaching at for a similar situation. She watched so many kids try and break into the social scene when she lived in Dubai. Similarly, many wealthy families there are tangentally related somehow. The new kids had a very hard time if they were trying to enter into non-expat communities. Luckily, it looks like we will be joining a fairly major metropolis wherever we are.

Edited by EndOfOrdinary
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As for homeschooling, much like military, diplomatic, and political ex pat children, we would not be considered Albanian citizens. We are considered U.S. citizens on specialized work visas. This allows us to homeschool our child as long as we are "not directly and flagrantly insulting the native culture." Secondly, if Ds' studies are centralized out of the U.S. via the internet he is considered to be privately educated within the United States and it is even less of an issue.

 

 

Fantastic! So glad this is not going to be an issue for you.

 

Luckily, it looks like we will be joining a fairly major metropolis wherever we are.

 

 

We thought that with Istanbul - population of 15 million, very cosmopolitan, high number of ex-pats - but it didn't work out that way. That said, if you are affiliated with a school you are halfway there. Is there an option for your son to 'flexi-school' and maybe attend your husband's school for things like art, music or sport classes? If you have a choice in where you are going to live, see if you can talk to people in that neighbourhood already - not just about other kids but things like transport links, driving times etc. That has been a big one for us - we miss out on opportunities some times because they are just so hard to get to.

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  • 1 month later...

Hey all! Thought I would throw out a bit of an update. The job fair is 20 days away.

 

All the formal paperwork has been submitted and vetted (Dh's certification, transcripts of degrees, formal recommendation and supervisor observations, ect). He has registered for the job fair, gotten the days off of work for the whole fair, and reserved a hotel. Now he has to add any and all "supplimentals" to the digital portfolio for recruiting schools to look at. These are things like recommendations from previous students or parents, youtube videos of lessons, personal statements, personal webpage, pinterest classroom pages, additional awards, prezi accounts....the list goes on and on of various other resources you can show them. It is a lot and takes so much time.

 

Now my job is to make him look like a rock star with flashy online stuff, formalizing all his business cards, making his resume graphic (it is really old school), and getting all his clothes to look snazzy. He hates all of those things and if I do not help will drastically procrastinate.

 

Ds' job is to start understanding that online classes are definitely a must if we are going to do this. Homeschooling is illegal in many countries and thus, dh is directly disqualified from recieving a job in these places if we cannot verify "outside education." Luckily, that is not very extensive. Showing two classes is enough. It merely means that Ds needs to start organizing himself. Time management is a bit illusive still.

 

Passports, shots for the dog, rehoming the cat, and language learning will all happen once we have an idea of where we might be going. By mid February, we should.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Currently, Kuwait City and Istanbul are vying pretty heavily for Dh's affections. He is so very fly-by-the-seat-of-his-pants that he wants to spend his extra day before the fair setting up interviews with other places. I am an extremely strong INTJ. Our taxes are already done, high school is planned, language software and a generic packing list are waiting for any confirmation, I am thinning things already, I just cannot handle the ambiguity! So I am taking deep breaths.

 

Dh has never interacted with the level of money most of these schools are dealing with. I cater extremely high end weddings in the local tourist town and my father was a high end residential architect. It is a very different world and takes some time getting used to. If anything, I am beginning to wonder if that will be the biggest hurdle for him in person. He is a major shmoozer, so it will probably be just fine.

 

He leaves tomorrow!

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US Embassy families are currently on Ordered Departure (involuntary evacuation) from Istanbul. I live in a different city in Turkey. I'm happy to answer any questions you have, but I'd suggest reading the travel.gov website on Turkey.

Edited by diplomum
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