JanOH and other upper level HOD users

[KeriJ]

Could you share how you tweak/use HOD guides from MTMM on up?

[Tenaj]

I had one in MTMM last year.  We changed the StoryTime Box to be independent reading and didn't do any of the activities.  We dropped the History Project unless it was a mapping assignment.  We did the Nature Journal as written but he hated it so I'm considering changing that up for the next one through.  Of course, I have to remember that my ds who was using that guide likes drawing, but it's not really an 'artsy' guy so it was pure torture for him.  For a child with a different personality it may have been fine.

 

The Bible Quiet Time book is a really great study but last year we were doing Bible as a family so we didn't end up doing that one.   For grammar we used Fix-It Grammar and he used IEW for writing for part of the year after we monkeyed around with different things for a while.   We really dropped the ball on literature  We didn't do any lit analysis and I just made sure he was reading a book throughout the year. It's been a learning curve for him this year to jump into the Bob Jones Lit but he's going pretty well with it.  I may try to add some lit in for my next guy through this guide just to make the transition a bit more smooth.

 

We did use the science as written but for my next kids I'm planning at this time to use Apologia starting in seventh grade.  I tried to jump the same ds into Apologia biology this year and it's been a failure.  I think it's mainly because he's just not used to textbooks after using the living book style of HOD for so many years.  I'm still struggling to balance the need to learn to read from a textbook and study for a test (heading into college) with the style of HOD with living books and no tests.  

 

For WG I haven't really done a lot of tweaking.  The living library is being read on his own time with no schedule and no activities.  He just reads one and when done moves into the next.  So far, he's stayed pretty much on target with those, I just check once in a while.  I have dropped a lot of the activities/games in the Mapping the World text . . some of them just seem to be pretty juvenile for the high school age group.  There is also a lot of busywork.  So, the only activities we are doing are the review activities.  But once again, this guy is not an art-guy. He really enjoys the geography drawing lessons but the extra games and such would not be a good use of his time.     I've changed up Bible to a Explorer Bible Study which he picked out.  We're doing WWS 1 and Fix-It Grammar along with the lit schedule in the guide.  As I mentioned before, we were trying Apologia but it wasn't working with this kid so I just ordered the PAC Integrated Chemistry and Physics set and am anxiously awaiting it's arrival on Monday.  We'll be starting over in science and just work into the summer.  I think I am going to add in the tests or at least quizzes.  Trying to thwart some of the issues I've seen in my older kids who didn't really know how to study for a test when they went to college thanks to my more laid-back CM style :)

 

We have found that we just can't do four day week in high school with HOD despite how it's scheduled!  He always ends up with at least a few assignments left over for Friday and sometimes more than a few  - LOL!  There is an awful lot of material to pack into a four-day week.

 

Edited to add:  Forgot one major difference is that we use Saxon Math rather than the math scheduled by HOD.  I've adjusted it so that we don't worry about doing a lesson a day as that kept pushing us behind in the rest of our subjects.  Now, we work for 45 minutes to one hour on math everyday and just stop at that point.  Usually a whole lesson can get done but sometimes that means one lesson is spread over two days.

Edited October 21, 2016 by JanOH

[KeriJ]

Thank you!! So helpful!

[Janeway]

I had one in MTMM last year.  We changed the StoryTime Box to be independent reading and didn't do any of the activities.  We dropped the History Project unless it was a mapping assignment.  We did the Nature Journal as written but he hated it so I'm considering changing that up for the next one through.  Of course, I have to remember that my ds who was using that guide likes drawing, but it's not really an 'artsy' guy so it was pure torture for him.  For a child with a different personality it may have been fine.

 

The Bible Quiet Time book is a really great study but last year we were doing Bible as a family so we didn't end up doing that one.   For grammar we used Fix-It Grammar and he used IEW for writing for part of the year after we monkeyed around with different things for a while.   We really dropped the ball on literature  We didn't do any lit analysis and I just made sure he was reading a book throughout the year. It's been a learning curve for him this year to jump into the Bob Jones Lit but he's going pretty well with it.  I may try to add some lit in for my next guy through this guide just to make the transition a bit more smooth.

 

We did use the science as written but for my next kids I'm planning at this time to use Apologia starting in seventh grade.  I tried to jump the same ds into Apologia biology this year and it's been a failure.  I think it's mainly because he's just not used to textbooks after using the living book style of HOD for so many years.  I'm still struggling to balance the need to learn to read from a textbook and study for a test (heading into college) with the style of HOD with living books and no tests.  

 

For WG I haven't really done a lot of tweaking.  The living library is being read on his own time with no schedule and no activities.  He just reads one and when done moves into the next.  So far, he's stayed pretty much on target with those, I just check once in a while.  I have dropped a lot of the activities/games in the Mapping the World text . . some of them just seem to be pretty juvenile for the high school age group.  There is also a lot of busywork.  So, the only activities we are doing are the review activities.  But once again, this guy is not an art-guy. He really enjoys the geography drawing lessons but the extra games and such would not be a good use of his time.     I've changed up Bible to a Explorer Bible Study which he picked out.  We're doing WWS 1 and Fix-It Grammar along with the lit schedule in the guide.  As I mentioned before, we were trying Apologia but it wasn't working with this kid so I just ordered the PAC Integrated Chemistry and Physics set and am anxiously awaiting it's arrival on Monday.  We'll be starting over in science and just work into the summer.  I think I am going to add in the tests or at least quizzes.  Trying to thwart some of the issues I've seen in my older kids who didn't really know how to study for a test when they went to college thanks to my more laid-back CM style :)

 

We have found that we just can't do four day week in high school with HOD despite how it's scheduled!  He always ends up with at least a few assignments left over for Friday and sometimes more than a few  - LOL!  There is an awful lot of material to pack into a four-day week.

 

Edited to add:  Forgot one major difference is that we use Saxon Math rather than the math scheduled by HOD.  I've adjusted it so that we don't worry about doing a lesson a day as that kept pushing us behind in the rest of our subjects.  Now, we work for 45 minutes to one hour on math everyday and just stop at that point.  Usually a whole lesson can get done but sometimes that means one lesson is spread over two days.

If it helps, the people I know who are in college after using living books in high school all do very well in college. Better than the ones who used textbooks even. Public school k-12 textbooks are nothing like what is used in college. ANd college tends to use a lot of real books and little of textbooks outside of science and math.

[Tenaj]

If it helps, the people I know who are in college after using living books in high school all do very well in college. Better than the ones who used textbooks even. Public school k-12 textbooks are nothing like what is used in college. ANd college tends to use a lot of real books and little of textbooks outside of science and math.

 

I understand what you are saying, and I will definitely continue to use living books for much of our schooling, but having had now three college students, I have found that my kids are more successful at college when they have learned how to take notes out of a textbook, take notes from a lecture situation, and study for a cumulative test before they leave home.

 

None of my olders have chosen to take online classes as part of their high school experience, so I need to create a similar 'classroom' experience in at least one subject so they have that experience.  Math tests don't quite cut it so we have generally used science as our more 'formal' subject for lack of a better term.  My current freshman has been out of Apologia science for three years now (he finished up his science requirements early) and it's been quite a learning curve for him to remember how to study for a test.  I'm convinced it's a skill that sometimes homeschoolers miss out on.  

 

It's just something I'm very aware of right now as I've seen the same adjustment period from two of my three college students.  The one that didn't have problems, taught herself to get A's on the original Apologia science tests when she was in 7th grade after bombing the very first test.  She never got less than a B on any other tests in that series and that's not an easy accomplishment but she had taught herself how to study something that two of my other kids didn't catch onto.

 

I accept much of the blame because I was more concerned with them mastering the material rather than doing well on tests and the two do not necessarily mean the same thing.  Some combination of the two is ideal.  

[Serenade]

 

 

We have found that we just can't do four day week in high school with HOD despite how it's scheduled!  He always ends up with at least a few assignments left over for Friday and sometimes more than a few  - LOL!  There is an awful lot of material to pack into a four-day week.

 

 

 

My high school student was only able to get through about 19 weeks of the HOD World History program in one entire year.   His (our) learning curve was so, so steep.  When he started, he couldn't even get through 4 scheduled days in a 5-day week -- it would take working into the weekend to finish it.   And he wasn't doing Pilgrim's Progress at all.

 

It was all of the required writing that made it difficult for him to do a scheduled day in just one actual day.   This year, he is pretty much doing a day for a day -- he can do the history writing assignments much quicker than he did last year.  The literature assignments are still tough for him and take him way longer than I wish, but at least he is mostly able to keep up with them.  I do think too much English is scheduled each day -- figure in 30 pages in a complex book like Count of Monte Cristo, along with answering the various lit analysis questions, and then a grammar or writing assignment on top of that, and  my student pretty much never finishes the English portion in less than 2 hours a day, and 2 hours is a good day.  :-)

 

That said, the World History program has been very good for my son in regards to his writing -- he had to write so much that he can write much more quickly than he could last year.  I imagine it's just because he had so much constant practice.   This program forces a student to write, and it was just what my reluctant writer needed.  However, he will be moving on to a new program shortly -- he can no longer afford to spend so much time on history and English.

[Tenaj]

 

 

  I do think too much English is scheduled each day -- figure in 30 pages in a complex book like Count of Monte Cristo, along with answering the various lit analysis questions, and then a grammar or writing assignment on top of that, and  my student pretty much never finishes the English portion in less than 2 hours a day, and 2 hours is a good day.  :-)

 

 

 

That's why I've chosen to switch out the Rod and Staff English for Fix-It Grammar.  It's quick and it only takes about 15 minutes a day (maybe less).  Three of my kids work on it together.  I also have switched out the writing program and I try to take a look at the day's writing.  If there is a lot of writing in the other subjects, I skip writing for that day or modify it or split the WWS assignment into two days.  

 

I've also let go of the idea that every box needs to be completed in the Notebooking pages.  If we are having a day where we get behind for some reason or have a day that's not fitting into the time we have (early basketball practices kill me) we just skip a notebooking assignment and call the reading good.

[3girls4me]

Do you feel like the best way to be prepared for HOD high school is to do the earlier HOD programs? If not, what sorts of things would you suggest to prepare to start the WG program in 9th grade? Sounds like there is potentially a steep learning curve. We do fairly rigorous programs at our house and did CtC last year but sounds like it ramps up quite a bit!

[Allison TX]

We are long time HOD users.  With the exception of a couple of short detours with Notgrass, we have used HOD for almost 10 years.  My oldest has used all the guides from Bigger up through US 2 high school, and we've tweaked it almost every year.

 

My kids all use different math (mostly TT),foreign language (RS), and comp/grammar.  We have tried most of HOD's suggestions for comp/grammar and they usually don't click with my kids.

 

My 8th grader is currently using MTMM and she reads a chapter from the Bible daily, and works on memory verses instead of the scheduled Bible study workbook.  She loves the nature journaling, but we use it in our own way.  She reads the storytime books herself.  She doesn't do the economics, history projects, or maps.  I've also taken The Elements out, it hasn't been a hit here with any of my kids.  When my boys used MTMM they did use the economics and maps, but didn't do the projects, and they read through the New Testament instead of the scheduled study.

 

World Geography has been my boys least favorite HOD year.  They both used a different Bible study and foreign language.  They didn't do any of the artsy projects, but did draw the maps.  I changed the science to one lesson a day because two was too much.  One read the living library books, and the other chose not to.  On e used BJU lit, and the other hated it so we dropped it.  One used EIW, the other used IEW.

 

One of my boys used Notgrass World History for the history and Bible for about 2/3 of the year, but used the HOD World History guide for Living Library, Art, Biology, and Literature.  He wanted a more streamlined year without reading from so many different books, however, he missed HOD and he went back to using it the following year.  The other son used it more as written but without Living Library, and he used LTOW  for comp. He aslo used a different Bible study.

 

For US 1, my oldest used it as written, except the living library.  We ended up dropping The Noble Experiment about half way through the year, and he used LTOW for comp.  My other son is using US 1 this year and he loves it! He chose not to do the Living Library.  He loves the scheduled creative writing, which really surprised me.  He is using a different Bible study and we decided not to use The Noble Experiment.  He also is using Chem 101 dvd's with some extras because he is NOT a science guy.

 

My oldest is using US 2 this year and has been enjoying it.  He is not using the Personal Finance, speech, or Living Library.  He loves the science this year and the Bible study.

 

We really love HOD, but I have learned to tweak it to fit our family and each of our kids.  It does have a lot of reading and writing, but we just figure out every year how to balance it.  At first I felt guilty about not using it entirely as written, but the I remind myself that is a benefit of homeschooling.  I have tried to put together my own thing, but I always return to HOD.  The work is mostly interesting and  very nicely balanced. And my two oldest kids have done great with the English and Reading sections of the ACT.  Hope this helps a little!   

 

 

[Tenaj]

Do you feel like the best way to be prepared for HOD high school is to do the earlier HOD programs? If not, what sorts of things would you suggest to prepare to start the WG program in 9th grade? Sounds like there is potentially a steep learning curve. We do fairly rigorous programs at our house and did CtC last year but sounds like it ramps up quite a bit!

 

There is a lot of work but I think that most programs have a leap at that level because high school is going to be a step up from middle school.

 

There is a lot of writing so strong writing going into it is a must.  The narrations are longer but that didn't seem to throw my ds at all.  The days are just longer than middle school which is to be expected.

 

The reading level does increase but if you've been doing rigorous I don't think your children would have any trouble jumping in at any point.

 

Don't be afraid to make adjustments so it fits your kid's abilities and interests.  I think for some reason it's harder to switch things around in HOD because it's all so neatly scheduled.  But our best years with HOD have been when I change it up to meet our needs.

[3girls4me]

There is a lot of work but I think that most programs have a leap at that level because high school is going to be a step up from middle school.

 

There is a lot of writing so strong writing going into it is a must. The narrations are longer but that didn't seem to throw my ds at all. The days are just longer than middle school which is to be expected.

 

The reading level does increase but if you've been doing rigorous I don't think your children would have any trouble jumping in at any point.

 

Don't be afraid to make adjustments so it fits your kid's abilities and interests. I think for some reason it's harder to switch things around in HOD because it's all so neatly scheduled. But our best years with HOD have been when I change it up to meet our needs.

Thanks!!

[Serenade]

 

 

I've also let go of the idea that every box needs to be completed in the Notebooking pages.  If we are having a day where we get behind for some reason or have a day that's not fitting into the time we have (early basketball practices kill me) we just skip a notebooking assignment and call the reading good.

 

 

This is one of those things I wish I could have done, but I just can't.  I can't envision leaving one of the sections on a note booking page blank!   It would look so empty.  Silly, I know. 

[Serenade]

There is a lot of writing so strong writing going into it is a must.  The narrations are longer but that didn't seem to throw my ds at all.  The days are just longer than middle school which is to be expected.

Just wanted to add here, that my son was a weak writer going into the program, which is probably why we had such a steep learning curve. Still, I believe the program was really good for my son because he became a much better writer due to all of the required writing. For my son, this ended up being the most worthwhile part of the program, even if he might not quite agree with me!