Is this normal for a 5 yr old?

[Janeway]

Does this sounds like a phase? Or should I start worrying?

 

My daughter just turned 5 yrs old. She is still cutting her hair. We have locked all the scissors up. Literally, they are locked away. We found that putting them up high did not work as she would climb for them. She went through all my makeup on herself and her dolls and was repeatedly told no. I finally started putting the makeup so high that I could not even reach it. If I need it, I have to go to my husband to get it down, so I rarely wear make up now. So she found markers. We already banned markers from the house over this, but somehow, another couple more showed up. I have no clue how. I can only guess that she or her brother brought it home from school as they both go to school. She has written all over her body, including her face. To give credit on this one, for some bizarre reason, her 12 yr old brother wrote on his arm first and then she imitated. And then this led to her entire body and her face. Last week, she chopped off all her hair. Now she has very short hair, as in, as short as her brothers' hair. I also found now that she has used nail polish, no clue where it came from as it is black nail polish and we have never owned such a thing, and used it on dolls. I cannot even find the nail polish, but she assures me it is nail polish. I keep telling her no. I even spanked her after she cut off all her hair. She never asked for a shorter hair cut. She simply took a scissors and cut off her hair. She also enjoys cutting up books, clothes. Oh yeah, found one of her dresses cut up. She likes the dress and was all crying when we threw it away. It is too cut up to be repaired or worn again. With the dolls, I have put them up in the past when she wrote on them. But as soon as she gets them back, which would be weeks later, she returns right to doing it I have been catching her writing in books and on walls. She has all the paper she could possibly want. And now, with no markers around, she took my dry erase markers and started writing on things.

 

I think it is unreasonable to for me to have to put locks on everything at her age. But she does not take care of her things and she gets in to other people's things. My husband says she is turning in to a monster. I do not know what to make of this. None of the older kids ever did anything like this. I am at a loss.

[luuknam]

Seems a bit much. Is she bored a lot? She might need more supervision/interaction.

 

ETA: markers could've been hidden under couch cushions or w/e. If you've never owned black nail polish though, I'd wonder if it's possible she's pocketing stuff at stores or friend's houses. Theft (seems like such a big word) is not uncommon in kids that young.

Edited October 1, 2016 by luuknam

[catz]

I have a friend whose daughter cut her own hair constantly for a year and was constantly into makeup, etc.  My own daughter did some of this honestly.  She did cut her hair.  She did destroy my make up and some shoes at points.  

 

Can you just fill a bin with stuff she can cut up?  Fabric, various textures, paper, feathers, craft foam, etc?  I'd be looking to make sure she had positive outlets for creativity.  I'd also make sure I was connecting with her in positive ways every single day.  Tomato staking and plenty of hands on parenting and cuddling.  There would be little to no alone time.  

Edited October 1, 2016 by WoolySocks

[heartlikealion]

What does she say when you ask her questions? Like, "Where did you get that black nail polish?" "Why did you cut your dress?" "Why did your cut your hair?" Is she trying to use her own hair or clothes to dress up the dolls?? Would she like a new medium for art like canvas instead of paper? Modeling clay or something? You may have already offered such things. I don't know.

 

Have you asked her direct or open ended questions to get more information? Seems like maybe we're missing some root cause. I really have no idea.

[OneStepAtATime]

:grouphug:  :grouphug:  :grouphug:

 

That honestly does seem outside the norm.  Has she been seen by your pediatrician?  Have you discussed this with them?  Are there any other areas where her behavior has you concerned?  Is she under any stress?  Does she do this outside of your home?  Has teh school mentioned anything?  Have you asked her why she does these things when you are not reacting to what happened?  As in when things are calm and she has not just exhibited the behavior?

 

Agree with the above, is she possibly very bright and very bored?  

[catz]

I'd be concerned about stress or something else going on too?  Is your toddler high needs?  Did she just start kindergarten?  Any other stresses or changes going on at your house?

[Janeway]

What does she say when you ask her questions? Like, "Where did you get that black nail polish?" "Why did you cut your dress?" "Why did your cut your hair?" Is she trying to use her own hair or clothes to dress up the dolls?? Would she like a new medium for art like canvas instead of paper? Modeling clay or something? You may have already offered such things. I don't know.

 

Have you asked her direct or open ended questions to get more information? Seems like maybe we're missing some root cause. I really have no idea.

I know why she cut her hair. She was playing Rapunzel and got to the scene where the prince cut off all her hair. She had her brother be the prince. It was the night before school pictures.

[Janeway]

:grouphug:  :grouphug:  :grouphug:

 

That honestly does seem outside the norm.  Has she been seen by your pediatrician?  Have you discussed this with them?  Are there any other areas where her behavior has you concerned?  Is she under any stress?  Does she do this outside of your home?  Has teh school mentioned anything?  Have you asked her why she does these things when you are not reacting to what happened?  As in when things are calm and she has not just exhibited the behavior?

 

Agree with the above, is she possibly very bright and very bored?  

It is possible she is bored. She wants me to read to her all day long. I do read about 50 books a day, not exaggerating. But, she wants more more more. 

[bolt.]

I think that she sounds unusually "busy" for her age, although most kids around that age do have an incident of two of, well, let's call it "destructive exploration and/or creativity". The activities are not themselves unusual, but the persistence and quantity of the events is a bit much. I think she might benefit from an evaluation if you can get one.

 

For now, there are some things you are doing that are not helping.

 

I think that the idea that a child can be "a monster" is a problem. (I know it's s figure of speech, but it turns a conduct issue into a character issue, which is both inaccurate and unhelpful.) Framing the issue as a character issue makes it (1) very hard for you-parents to be helpful, (2) very hard for you to want to approach her as a helper, and (3) even if you did, it makes it hard for her to believe you want to help her.

 

While spanking might seem like a deterrent, you can tell that it doesn't usually help an impulsive and driven child to resist their impulses: it's painful, but it's too far away so children don't always process it (or any threat) as something relevant or realistic.

 

What does (usually) help is (as you are doing) limiting access to temptations, and a ton of supervision. You can include supervised (guided, limited time) access to the desired items, with clear instructions for how to use them properly. You can also try role play teaching towards 'what to do instead' -- with a positive collaborative attitude.

 

As long as she feels the idea of 'trouble looming' -- that threatening feeling is likely to reinforce the techniques she has learned to be sneaky and persistent. Try to replace that with positive ways to gain access to what she wants. Get her to view you as someone should helps her have good fun, not someone who is her opponent in these things. It will be an important shift for both of you.

Edited October 1, 2016 by bolt.

[ktgrok]

I'd give her some washable markers! And some kid safe makeup to play with! And maybe that playdoh set where you can make and then cut the hair of the creature. And the doll head that lets you put make up on the face and style the hair. Etc etc. She's trying to tell you what she wants to do (design hair/makeup/clothes) so give her stuff to do that with, that is kid safe and washable. 

 

And every one of my kids has cut their hair. Every one of them. And gotten into makeup. It's pretty normal. They aren't trying to be bad, they are trying to be beautiful. 

 

Heck, my mom says both my sister and I did it too. And when I did it it was right before she had important company coming over. oops. I just wanted to get pretty for company like my mom was. Nothing mean spirited or naughty at all. 

 

I also cut most of my doll's hair. 

 

Get the girl stuff that is easy to clean up,a nd let her have at it. 

[Janeway]

I think she has too much stuff. I suspect she can't play properly with anything because her room is trashed. I think that instead of getting her one more new thing to destroy, I should take away 90% of what she does have so she can get in to her room and play.

[AK_Mom4]

I survived two of these kids. Oldest DD was the artist - everything got drawn on whether it was appropriate or not. Sharpies and markers were locked in a cabinet until she was about 7. Her younger brother was the Dissassmbler. Everything had to come apart. I lost many many mops to his curiousity - if I didn't put it away in the (locked) pantry, i would find it in pieces.

 

For us the fix was lots of things that were OK to mess with and keeping the bad ideas out of easy reach. I bought a set of thrift shop dolls for a few dollars - DD drew all over them then her brother took them apart. Every piece of cardboard got decorated before leaving the house. Thrift store alarm clocks and devices got taken apart and then tossed. DS eventually graduated to making cardboard swords and armor and then on to robotics kits. DD drew on the backyard fence and driveway with chalk (and of course covered herself in it!)

 

Oh and hair.....she cut her hair. She cut her brothers hair. I finally limited her to thrift shop doll hair cuts and that seemed to help her get it out of her system. It was all creativity and impulse stuff here, so having better outlets all the time was enough to get it under control.

[bookbard]

Read simplicity parenting, if you want to cull toys. It's helpful.

 

Re the makeup and drawing on self - that is normal. My kids are constantly decorating their faces with markers, my daughter will often go through phases of setting up a "make up table" with whatever she can find. I know there are other kids doing it because I've read blogs with similar stories. I don't forbid it, but I just make sure it's all non-toxic. If she's going to put stuff on her face, I want it to be easily washed off. 

 

In terms of the hair cutting, I haven't had that. Now it's short, will she let it be? 

[City Mouse]

She sounds very impulsive, but not totally out of the range of "normal". When she was 5 or 6, My DD cut her long hair two days before her dance recital. It was all I could do to make it presentable for the recital. When I asked her "why" she said it was getting in her face right then and she wanted it gone. I have also been through the drawing on things stage. I have what is now a very cute picture of my DD covered in her own artwork. There was a time, when the only art supplies we had at home were Crayola Color Wonder- the stuff that only shows color on special paper.

 

Both of my kids were diagnoses as ADHD at 9yr old, so I do see what you describe as a red flag.

[The Girls' Mom]

She sounds exactly like my niece.  That child was a walking tornado.  Cute, but destructive.  She repeatedly cut her hair, destroyed dolls, drew on walls, made "concoctions" out of anything and everything, poured things out of containers, and climbed every vertical surface she could get near.  She was very sneaky, and very good at it.  She ruined the carpet and paint in nearly every room of their house.  She was like this until she was around 10. 

 

She's 17 now.  Looking back, she was extremely smart and had a LOT of energy.  She was curious about everything, and loved being creative.  She was going to explore and satisfy that curiosity, no matter who told her no.  Punishments had no effect other than to make her sneakier.  She finally grew out of most of it.  She's still mischievous, but funnels it into harmless pranks.  (She still does things at my house like hiding your phone or putting a few dried beans in your bag of chocolate chips.)  

 

Anyway, she needed a lot of ways to use her smarts and energy.  Giving her boxes of junk to play with was very effective.  As was letting her decorate her dolls as she saw fit and letting her rearrange her room to her heart's content.  

Contrary to what adults around her said, she didn't turn out to be a felon ;)  She's actually a pretty great young lady.  Super smart, a little sassy, and headed for great things.  

 

[ILiveInFlipFlops]

My 11-year-old still does some of this stuff *sigh* IMO, it's not that unusual at 5--well within the range of normal, especially for a curious, intelligent, creative, easily bored kid. 

 

ETA: If DH called one of my kids a monster, there'd be some hell to pay. 

Edited October 1, 2016 by ILiveInFlipFlops

[trulycrabby]

As another poster suggested, I would get her a bunch of thrift store dolls and let her cut their hair and draw all over them.

 

If she is not already active, she might need some physical exercise.

[Janeway]

My 11-year-old still does some of this stuff *sigh* IMO, it's not that unusual at 5--well within the range of normal, especially for a curious, intelligent, creative, easily bored kid. 

 

ETA: If DH called one of my kids a monster, there'd be some hell to pay. 

Yeah, well..yeah..just that. About dh. We have been arguing over this stuff. I am quite unhappy over his attitude. But, we are not supposed to complain about our husbands here, so I will just leave it at that.

[heartlikealion]

I know why she cut her hair. She was playing Rapunzel and got to the scene where the prince cut off all her hair. She had her brother be the prince. It was the night before school pictures.

 

Oh no! Well, at least her reason sounds harmless. She just wanted to look like Rapunzel. And sounds like she just wants to dress up her dolls.

 

Is she too old to enjoy Color Wonder markers? Because they only work on that special paper.

 

[38carrots]

Are you the same poster who has a college-age son who requires a lot of driving? Are her behaviours getting worse since the driving started? In this case, could be stress. DD cut her hair when she was 5 when I was away for 4 days. Thankfully, not too short.

 

 

[J-rap]

One of my dd's was either 6 or 7 when we realized we had to hide all the scissors.  She was cutting everything:  her hair, all the seatbelts in our car! and more.  It was really bad!  Until she was about 10 years old, she had to ask permission to use scissors in our house.  Boy does she get teased about it now!  None of our other children did that, and I can't explain why our dd did that.  She was otherwise perfectly normal and happy.  She did like to keep busy, so I suppose that was part of it, even though we always had lots of things to do on hand and she had 4 siblings to play with.

 

Anyway, she is much older now, and perfectly normal and happy.  :)

 

[Farrar]

I would try to be as non-judgmental as possible about as many of the things as possible. It's her appearance. It's her dolls and toys. It's her walls. Of course, you can't be buying tons of new clothes and so forth, but I'd try to let go of as much as you can. And then don't get her new nice toys (she's clearly not a "toys" kid, so it's hardly a punishment), do follow your instincts and clean out her room and get rid of a lot of the stuff, and then follow the great suggestions here about making bins of stuff she can cut up and destroy. Do you live somewhere with a creative reuse center (a "scrap exchange" or "scrap center")? If so, that would be a great place to get her things to play around with. I would also keep a special bin of things she can use that you routinely replace if you're able to - so washable markers and safety scissors and washable paints. And make it the cheapie stuff and keep replacing it to keep it looking appealing in the hopes of keeping her away from the sharper scissors, the nail polish, the dry erase markers, the sharpies, etc.

[Wheres Toto]

I agree with it's a little bit poor impulse control but mainly completely normal.

 

I have a few pictures of my oldest covered with marker, she cut her hair a couple times and wrapped a comb up in her bangs one time and we had to cut it out.  In kindergarten for some reason she cut the uniform dress of the girl sitting next to her.  

 

I know I carved designs into the top of my mothers hope chest when I was pretty young.

 

My younger daughter draws on walls and anything else she sees, cuts random things, and hides the evidence.  She's not as bad as she used to be but for a while we didn't allow any scissors at all.  For her play-doh helped a lot, with lots of the tools including the little plastic scissors and knives.  Now she likes stringing beads on pipe cleaners or the plastic twine.  I think keeping her fingers busy is the key.  She does like to draw so we provide lots of paper of all different sizes and colors, little blank books (Target has them in their dollar area a lot), she hates coloring books but doodle books or journal type things she likes.

 

Good Luck.

[rebcoola]

I was this kid my younger DD is also this kid it gets better with age but never goes away.  I have been bored while watching a family movie or something and pick up a pen and just  start doodling on myself or whatever is around.

 

 I agree with PP she needs a safe way to get these impulses out.  We have a kid craft table everything in their can have absolutely anything done to it.

 

Tiring out both brain and body helps here to both DD and I are gifted, impulsive and high energy.  So a lazy Saturday with mostly free play will likely be a disaster- a day with gymnastics, drama club, school work, board games, and park time will be a good day.

[ktgrok]

When you clear out some of the old toys, do NOT make it a punishment .Seriously, she has no clue she's being naughty. I mean, she knows you are mad, but her reasons aren't bad. Just do it to make the room nicer for her, then get her the stuff she DOES want. Which seems to be art supplies, dress up, etc. Keep all that stuff (but only washable!!!!! Crayola washable makers come off easily, and their crayons are great too. Stick with Crayola though, other brands are much less washable no matter what they say), and get rid of the stuff she doesn't play with. 

[Janeway]

Are you the same poster who has a college-age son who requires a lot of driving? Are her behaviours getting worse since the driving started? In this case, could be stress. DD cut her hair when she was 5 when I was away for 4 days. Thankfully, not too short.

Not me, sorry.

[ILiveInFlipFlops]

Yeah, well..yeah..just that. About dh. We have been arguing over this stuff. I am quite unhappy over his attitude. But, we are not supposed to complain about our husbands here, so I will just leave it at that.

 

Ah, sorry to hear that  :grouphug:

[chocolate-chip chooky]

I'd suggest an involved project that involves cutting and colouring. I'd be thinking that she's probably intelligent, creative and bored.

 

I remember that we made our own copies of some of my daughter's favourite books. We made our own of every single page and then tied it together as a book.

 

These were long projects and really kept her busy and engaged. Sometimes I'd write the text, sometimes she would, sometimes we'd type it and print out the text.  Then we'd draw the pictures. Sometimes I'd draw the outline and she'd have to collage it in or colour it or paint it. 

I'm imagining your daughter with a stack of magazines and needing to cut out lots of small squares of a range of greens to get that tree picture just right.

 

The books that we made this way are really lovely keepsakes now many years later. Heaps of literacy learning happened and it was purposeful and productive for a bright and creative young child.

 

Anyway, my point is that cutting and colouring are not bad. She maybe just needs an intellectually stimulating way to do it.