Should I be upset?

[gardenmom5]

I'm not going to say anything to her. I guess there is not point -- she is who she is.

 

It's just frustrating because it is such a small office. And she doesn't even try to be a team player.

 

One a similar note---- My office is the Board of Health. We get a lot of complaints from people that their neighbors are hoarders and the yards are full of junk. Then the hoarder neighbor comes in yelling that he is being harassed and should not have to cut his grass, which is chest high, or throw away 10 rusting bicycles because they are not a hazardous material. To me, if you put yourself in any type of group, whether you choose to live in a neighborhood or work in a small office or go to the movies ....

JUST PLAY NICE IN THE SANDBOX!!

 

You don't get to be the nudge in the group. You don't get to annoy every freakin' person around you. I just find that so selfish.

 

hoarders generally have mental health issues, whether recognized or not.  (mil is a "minor" hoarder, and she still has mental health issues.)

for someone with mental health issues (and your coworker could well have some) - playing nice in the sandbox is incomprehensible.  it's not that they necessarily don't want to, but they may not even know what that means.

[Jean in Newcastle]

I would not want to be in a work environment where people were forcing me to be a part of unsolicited social gatherings and judging my financial and social decisions when it is actually none of their business.  I think that is a lot more rude than anything reported about this "problem employee". 

[Home'scool]

I have worked elbow to elbow with this woman for over a year. Without making too broad an assumption, she can afford a small gift. This is based on knowing the vacations she goes on and the gifts she buys for family and friends.

 

So the other part of it is whether or not she should have to buy a gift. No, she doesn't have to. Just like she doesn't have to say "good morning" when she comes in (she never does), or doesn't have to be pleasant when given a job assignment (the excuses alone as to why she cannot do something take all morning) etc. etc.

 

She doesn't have to do any of those things. But I can then state that I find her rude. It's a 10 minute gathering to have some coffee cake and be happy for someone's good fortune. If that feels like being forced into something unpleasant than I stand by my assertion that she is an unpleasant person who is a real drain to be around.

[TechWife]

I don't understand the upset.  I also don't understand why a grandmother would be having a shower.  Is the grandmother going to be raising the children?  I would let it go. 

 

I don't understand, either. I've never heard of a shower for a grandmother. 

[TechWife]

I have worked elbow to elbow with this woman for over a year. Without making too broad an assumption, she can afford a small gift. This is based on knowing the vacations she goes on and the gifts she buys for family and friends.

 

So the other part of it is whether or not she should have to buy a gift. No, she doesn't have to. Just like she doesn't have to say "good morning" when she comes in (she never does), or doesn't have to be pleasant when given a job assignment (the excuses alone as to why she cannot do something take all morning) etc. etc.

 

She doesn't have to do any of those things. But I can then state that I find her rude. It's a 10 minute gathering to have some coffee cake and be happy for someone's good fortune. If that feels like being forced into something unpleasant than I stand by my assertion that she is an unpleasant person who is a real drain to be around.

 

Honestly, it's inappropriate for you to make assumptions about her financial situation. Simply because someone can afford a small gift doesn't mean they are obligated to give a gift. If she would rather spend her money on her vacations and gifts for her own family and friends, that's her right. 

 

I have never understood the necessity for office gatherings. Since you were all talking about pregnancy for months, I'm assuming that you have already shared your pleasure with your co-worker. Gifts between co-workers should be given privately and the presence or absence of gifts is not evidence of the co-worker's ability to function on a team. Work is about work. Yes, we all like to work in a pleasant environment, but there is no need to expect people to spend time with each other socially. 

[SKL]

I don't know, it always rubs me wrong when someone is declaring that someone else "could afford to" or "could manage to" or "it's the least they could do."

 

There are many things I could afford to do, that I choose not to do, because I have chosen to do something else instead.

 

I don't support most charities, because I choose to support certain specific ones instead.

I don't volunteer at school, because I serve others instead.

 

I don't "cook" every night, because I choose other activities with my kids instead.

 

In fact, I don't say "happy birthday" on facebook, and believe it or not, I have my reasons which are based in good will.

 

I don't like the idea that anything I "could" do but choose not to do is a reason for others to judge me.  It's up to me to set my priorities as best I know how.  And I try to respect others' right to do the same.

[Valley Girl]

You have every right to be upset with a coworker who is not pulling his or her weight or is deliberately rude. Those issues are best addressed with management.

 

As to whether or not it's "right" to be upset because she apparently behaved politely but did not provide a gift herself, I think maybe you were expecting too much from someone whom you indicate isn't into the office friendship thing.

 

You said you work in a small office. Did the "we" who agreed to hold the shower include this woman? Or was she just told it was happening? Did she know it was going to be more than cake (if there was cake) and good wishes?

 

If not, perhaps she was peeved at not being asked if she wanted to participate in such an event.

 

Or perhaps she thinks "grandmother showers" are silly and overdoing things. (I know I once reached a point where I had to say enough to work-related celebrations because things just got out of hand.)

 

Maybe she just didn't want to spend the money for whatever personal reason she has, which is nobody else's business.

 

Does she normally participate in similar work gatherings (birthdays, etc.)? Or does she opt out? If she normally opts out and she wasn't part of the decision process, it might have been better to take Grandma-to-Be to lunch and give her the gifts at that time if your wanted to do something nice for her.

 

Honestly, I'd just let this one slide and reconsider where and how you observe workplace celebrations so that those who want to participate can do so without having to deal with unpleasant people while those who don't want to participate don't feel imposed upon.

 

 

[Anne in CA]

It seems like the real issue is that to the OP, not giving a small gift was the straw that broke the camel's back. IME the straw that broke the camel's back is almost always more emotional than rational. No one should have to buy a gift for anyone at any time. If I don't want to give my own kids Christmas or birthday gifts, I don't have to. Period. It's not for anyone else to judge. The thing that struck me is that the OP got lucky that the rude coworker didn't have some kind of fit over the gathering in the first place. With someone like that I would say that the OP got a best case scenario where the rude coworker was actually pleasant and didn't run to higher management complaining about a gathering on company time or make snide comments about the gathering or be generally unpleasant in some other way during the party. I would have been delighted that the rude coworker didn't ruin the gathering, the lack of gift wouldn't have bothered me a bit.

 

The OP is just done with this other person and now whatever they do is going to make her angry. If the OP wants to keep this job she is going to have to pass lots of bean dip and try to ignore the problem coworker. The problem coworker has a good thing going. She doesn't do more work than she has to and no one calls her on it. That sort of person never leaves a job like that. 

[Bluegoat]

I think showers for grandparents is a very strange idea. 

 

I also do not think one is obliged to bring a gift to a party, and it's rude to expect one.

 

It seems to me the issue is with her generally impossible behavior.

[Laura Corin]

I'm not going to say anything to her. I guess there is not point -- she is who she is.

 

It's just frustrating because it is such a small office. And she doesn't even try to be a team player.

 

One a similar note---- My office is the Board of Health. We get a lot of complaints from people that their neighbors are hoarders and the yards are full of junk. Then the hoarder neighbor comes in yelling that he is being harassed and should not have to cut his grass, which is chest high, or throw away 10 rusting bicycles because they are not a hazardous material. To me, if you put yourself in any type of group, whether you choose to live in a neighborhood or work in a small office or go to the movies ....

JUST PLAY NICE IN THE SANDBOX!!

 

You don't get to be the nudge in the group. You don't get to annoy every freakin' person around you. I just find that so selfish.

 

I would be irritated by a co-worker who didn't pull their own weight, but the other examples given I see as just individuality: offices are odd places where one is forced to be social and join in things that one has no interest in, or even might object to.  Being polite about the babies is a concession - I don't think that she should be obliged to give a gift.  And a neighbour with long grass and bicycles?  Their property, their choice.  Unless the hoarding is causing a health hazard beyond the boundary, it's not my business.

Edited September 27, 2016 by Laura Corin

[SKL]

This thread has me remembering some of the awkward things from when I worked in an office.

 

I was informed that a whole group was laughing about the fact that I wear white socks on weekends.  (Not in a nice way.)

 

I was considered a social misfit because I didn't know much about basketball, didn't drink, and wasn't thrilled to be invited to drink at a bball game.

 

I hated networking activities, which we had to do a lot.

 

I brought lunch to save money.  While traveling with the team, I brought snacks and ate/worked in my hotel rather than sit for 2 hours watching the partners get drunk and describe their favorite scenes from American Pie - AGAIN.

 

I took up the cause of a secretary who was being laid off weeks before her pension would vest, because that was gonna affect one of the millionaire partners' bonus.

 

I was usually late to the 8am "marketing meeting" and had little to add, since I hadn't taken anyone to lunch on the company's dime that week.

 

I would come in at 10am after working until 2am the night before.

 

Probably 100 other "career limiting moves" that I prefer not to remember.

[GoodGrief]

I'm thinking of the party planning committee from my favorite show ever, "The Office". Also Elaine from Seinfeld and the office that did the incessant celebrations ("Get well, get well soon, we wish you to get well!") Of course, then she became addicted to the afternoon cake  :lol:

 

Yeah, I think the appropriate thing here is to let this one go, giving her the benefit of the doubt. It sounds like three of you are super tight, and she's kind of on the outside. She may not have even realized that you were including her in this, if there is a pattern of the three of you hanging out without her. If other work stuff is a problem, it's time for a meeting with management.

[MistyMountain]

Not getting a gift for a shower would be a complete non issue to me. I would not dwell on that at all. I could care less about people buying new gifts for a baby/babies they know. Who knows what their financial situation is or how they feel about buying new things.

[happi duck]

Alongside "you don't get to annoy every person around you" is you don't need to get annoyed/stay annoyed.

 

Imo, better to choose to not be annoyed than hope someone else changes to your expectations.

 

Of course, actual work issues should be taken to the boss. For example: Never says good morning=forget about it, comes in an hour late everyday=talk to the boss.

 

Just my two cents!

 

.

Edited September 27, 2016 by happi duck

[QueenCat]

No, you should not be upset as far as how she handled the shower. Gifts are not required at this sort of thing. It would have been ruder for her to say nothing then to "ooh and aah" over the gifts displayed. But really, it probably would have been better to do this sort of thing at a coffee shop after work. And then she would have had the choice to truly not be there. And that would not have been rude either.

[38carrots]

She possibly has Asperger's. I wouldn't be upset over the lack of the "shower" gift, but I'd make sure her work responsibilities are made very clear to her.

 

I can see how this could be the last straw, though. It is not easy to work with someone like that. :grouphug:

[MomatHWTK]

Gah! This is why I enjoy freelancing. I don't think the unnamed co-worker is the PITA in this situation. I would blame it on sunny McSunshine who expects everyone to be just like her or they are rude. Just don't say good morning and get over yourself. If someone isn't taking assignments report it to a supervisor. Gossips and finger pointers are just as toxic to the work environment as people who just want to mind their own lives and do their jobs. 

[Bluegoat]

Something I think needs to be made clear - there is never an expectation of a gift.  Not bringing a gift is not rude.  People do not have to "pay" to be invited to a party, or to wish others well.

 

Expecting a gift, however, is considered very rude.  Like, Miss Manners and Emily Post would both have heart attacks.

[elegantlion]

I'll add a different perspective on the gift giving. If you work with hoarders, she may be sick of the giving of "stuff."  Some people when they've been around people who hoard gain a less is more perspective about gift giving in general, moreso if it's for a grandmother instead of the actual mother. 

 

She may be the kind to show up with diapers and a casserole after the birth of a child instead and never tell anyone. Maybe she is a class A lazy person and didn't want to shop. I would let it go though. 

[QueenCat]

She possibly has Asperger's. I wouldn't be upset over the lack of the "shower" gift, but I'd make sure her work responsibilities are made very clear to her.

 

I can see how this could be the last straw, though. It is not easy to work with someone like that. :grouphug:

 

I wasn't getting the impression of AS from the op.......... Aspergers is far more than just social awkwardness.

[gardenmom5]

I wasn't getting the impression of AS from the op.......... Aspergers is far more than just social awkwardness.

 

whether she has aspergers or not, I've no idea.  there are other things besides asd that can cause awkwardness. 

aspergers is a spectrum.  I have a diagnosed by the 'child dev. center at a major medical center child' aspie.  with today's knowledge of aspergers, I very likely would have been diagnosed (as a girl - who are still overlooked.), so I speak from that.   there are many causes (genetic here - even know the gene.  treating the gene has done a lot).

today - almost know one who knows me would ever guess I was that bad.   I do still have areas - but as an adult, I've learned to hide a lot that hasn't been overcome.

[Home'scool]

Gah! This is why I enjoy freelancing. I don't think the unnamed co-worker is the PITA in this situation. I would blame it on sunny McSunshine who expects everyone to be just like her or they are rude. Just don't say good morning and get over yourself

 

 

So this point started me thinking --- does it make me Sunny McSunshine (not mad at the name, it's kinda cute haha!) to expect a basic level of manners from someone?

 

If I bump into someone I always say "excuse me" but if someone else bumps into me is it okay for them to just move on and not acknowledge it?

 

If a coworker sneezes, or yells out "ouch" because they stubbed their toe, is it okay to just ignore them because I don't feel particularly "sunny" that day?

 

In my mind, it's not about expecting everyone to be like ME, it's about being taught common manners.

 

I fell like people who DON'T do these things are the ones who need to get over themselves.

 

I am not necessarily a morning person, but when I come down into the kitchen I always say Good Morning to whoever is in the kitchen. I shouldn't be so wrapped up in my own crabbiness that I can't say hello. If I enter an elevator and someone is in there I will say a quiet "hello" acknowledging them. Does that make me a pain in the butt?

 

I don't know. Seems to me basic stuff to say good morning when you come into a small office with people you work with all day. I think the world would be pretty lousy if it was run by people who didn't think so.

 

 

 

Edited September 28, 2016 by Home'scool

[Jean in Newcastle]

You are only responsible for yourself and the minors in your care. 

[wintermom]

So this point started me thinking --- does it make me Sunny McSunshine (not mad at the name, it's kinda cute haha!) to expect a basic level of manners from someone?

 

If I bump into someone I always say "excuse me" but if someone else bumps into me is it okay for them to just move on and not acknowledge it?

 

If a coworker sneezes, or yells out "ouch" because they stubbed their toe, is it okay to just ignore them because I don't feel particularly "sunny" that day?

 

In my mind, it's not about expecting everyone to be like ME, it's about being taught common manners.

 

I fell like people who DON'T do these things are the ones who need to get over themselves.

 

I am not necessarily a morning person, but when I come down into the kitchen I always say Good Morning to whoever is in the kitchen. I shouldn't be so wrapped up in my own crabbiness that I can't say hello. If I enter an elevator and someone is in there I will say a quiet "hello" acknowledging them. Does that make me a pain in the butt?

 

I don't know. Seems to me basic stuff to say good morning when you come into a small office with people you work with all day. I think the world would be pretty lousy if it was run by people who didn't think so.

 

I worked in a small office and 3 / 4 people were cheerful. The fourth, I found out later because he didn't advertise this, was in constant back pain. He also had a different personality than the other 3 people. Maybe after a year of working with this person, you really know nothing personal about her, only that she doesn't act like you do. Therefore, she's a poor co-worker. 

[Laura Corin]

 I think the world would be pretty lousy if it was run by people who didn't think so.

 

Do what makes you happy.  You want to be the kind of person who does all those things and sees them as the gold standard, but other people might see it differently.

 

I work in a small office with someone who is very loud (in decibel terms and also in personality terms).  She also gives too much information (for my taste) on all possible subjects.  And I don't like the way that she describes parenting her kids.  There are probably things that I do that drive her crazy too.  Absent bullying or criminal activity, I'm not prepared to say that I am right and she is wrong.  By her lights she is a kind and considerate person - I just don't always receive it that way.

 

When I lived in China, I was told that I said 'thank you' too much.  I was told that it was odd, particularly between people who were close, where the relationship was established and no 'thank you' was necessary.  I couldn't stop myself, but it made me understand that much of polite speech is a habit and 'impolite speech' does not necessarily denote ill will.

[MistyMountain]

So this point started me thinking --- does it make me Sunny McSunshine (not mad at the name, it's kinda cute haha!) to expect a basic level of manners from someone?

 

If I bump into someone I always say "excuse me" but if someone else bumps into me is it okay for them to just move on and not acknowledge it?

 

If a coworker sneezes, or yells out "ouch" because they stubbed their toe, is it okay to just ignore them because I don't feel particularly "sunny" that day?

 

In my mind, it's not about expecting everyone to be like ME, it's about being taught common manners.

 

I fell like people who DON'T do these things are the ones who need to get over themselves.

 

I am not necessarily a morning person, but when I come down into the kitchen I always say Good Morning to whoever is in the kitchen. I shouldn't be so wrapped up in my own crabbiness that I can't say hello. If I enter an elevator and someone is in there I will say a quiet "hello" acknowledging them. Does that make me a pain in the butt?

 

I don't know. Seems to me basic stuff to say good morning when you come into a small office with people you work with all day. I think the world would be pretty lousy if it was run by people who didn't think so.

I do not fawn over people who stub their toes or say hi to strangers on the elevator. The majority of strangers do not say hi either. I do not greet people just because I walk into a room with them. I sometimes say bless you but there are plenty of times I do not. It is certainly not something I expect from people. Expecting other people to act a certain way is setting yourself up for dissapoinment. I never even think of those things and it is not that I am intentionally rude or hate people but I am definitely not cheerful or bubbly. You probably would not like me very much. Edited September 28, 2016 by MistyMountain

[Arcadia]

In my mind, it's not about expecting everyone to be like ME, it's about being taught common manners.

 

I fell like people who DON'T do these things are the ones who need to get over themselves.

Your "common manners" may not be my "common manners". For example, saying "Bless you" when someone sneeze. Saying "Good morning" was not the office culture in the places where I worked, people get their coffee from the office coffee maker machine and start their workday so that they can leave office on time before the evening traffic jam gets worse.

[Plink]

You don't like her. Fine. You don't have to.

 

Working hard to convince us that you are justified in disliking her isn't necessary, and only sets you up to be viewed as judgmental.

 

It is okay to not give gifts.

It is okay to not say good morning.

It is okay to not say hello to each person in the elevator.

It is okay to not gush over minor toe-stubbing injuries.

It is okay to not say gesundheit every time a coworker sneezes.

 

Honestly. Just know that she doesn't do these things and move on. It isn't personal, and it isn't worth your emotional energy.

[SKL]

So this point started me thinking --- does it make me Sunny McSunshine (not mad at the name, it's kinda cute haha!) to expect a basic level of manners from someone?

 

If I bump into someone I always say "excuse me" but if someone else bumps into me is it okay for them to just move on and not acknowledge it?

 

If a coworker sneezes, or yells out "ouch" because they stubbed their toe, is it okay to just ignore them because I don't feel particularly "sunny" that day?

 

In my mind, it's not about expecting everyone to be like ME, it's about being taught common manners.

 

I fell like people who DON'T do these things are the ones who need to get over themselves.

 

I am not necessarily a morning person, but when I come down into the kitchen I always say Good Morning to whoever is in the kitchen. I shouldn't be so wrapped up in my own crabbiness that I can't say hello. If I enter an elevator and someone is in there I will say a quiet "hello" acknowledging them. Does that make me a pain in the butt?

 

I don't know. Seems to me basic stuff to say good morning when you come into a small office with people you work with all day. I think the world would be pretty lousy if it was run by people who didn't think so.

 

Sounds like an introvert/extrovert difference.  I'm an introvert.  I also tend to get very deep into whatever I'm working on and tune out the sounds around me.  It would be pretty normal for me to NOT notice another person entering a room or sneezing or leaving.

 

Now if you said "good morning" to me first, and I wasn't deeply buried in my work, I would probably respond.  But it probably would not occur to me to say it first.  I don't feel the need to hear "good morning," so I wouldn't assume everyone else needed that.  Those who need a sunny "hello" exchange in order to start off on the right foot are free to initiate it.  I won't complain, but honestly, it doesn't do anything for me.

 

I don't ever say "good morning" at home.  More like "get up and get shaking, it's X o'clock."  People feel the love anyway.  (Though I might need some coffee for it to be fully turned on.)

 

So you may be wrong in thinking your greetings etc. are a contribution to everyone around you.  To some, to those similar to you, yes.  To others, nope, sorry.  You haven't enriched them and they don't owe you.

[gardenmom5]

op - I'm getting the impression from reading your posts you'd have preferred jawm responses, as opposed to another way of looking at the situation.

 

eta: I hope my impression is incorrect.

Edited September 28, 2016 by gardenmom5

[Bluegoat]

Some people just aren't into social chatting.  I think there are downsides to that which it can be useful for an adult to realize and modify behavior to some extent.

 

OTOH, there is something to be said for just accepting that the other person is a little different. 

[MomatHWTK]

Yeah, strangers saying hello to me in an elevator is just way too much in my space. You are just a walking talking obligation creator. You have created this "common manners" rulebook in your head and then expect everyone else to follow it. It seems a little unreasonable to invade other people's peace then judge them for not being thrilled about it. 

 

http://biblehub.com/nlt/proverbs/27-14.htm

A loud and cheerful greeting early in the morning will be taken as a curse! 

 

In my book, any greeting before a full cup of coffee would be too loud. 

 

I have learned to ignore extroverts who vert on everyone around them. But, that doesn't mean I have to respond and encourage them. I try to follow a 'do not engage' policy. 

 

(Cleary, I have forgotten my rules this week.)

Edited September 28, 2016 by MomatHWTK

[kitten18]

OP, I get it. Sounds like you work in close quarters and she's really unpleasant to be around.

[maize]

So this point started me thinking --- does it make me Sunny McSunshine (not mad at the name, it's kinda cute haha!) to expect a basic level of manners from someone?

 

If I bump into someone I always say "excuse me" but if someone else bumps into me is it okay for them to just move on and not acknowledge it?

 

If a coworker sneezes, or yells out "ouch" because they stubbed their toe, is it okay to just ignore them because I don't feel particularly "sunny" that day?

 

In my mind, it's not about expecting everyone to be like ME, it's about being taught common manners.

 

I fell like people who DON'T do these things are the ones who need to get over themselves.

 

I am not necessarily a morning person, but when I come down into the kitchen I always say Good Morning to whoever is in the kitchen. I shouldn't be so wrapped up in my own crabbiness that I can't say hello. If I enter an elevator and someone is in there I will say a quiet "hello" acknowledging them. Does that make me a pain in the butt?

 

I don't know. Seems to me basic stuff to say good morning when you come into a small office with people you work with all day. I think the world would be pretty lousy if it was run by people who didn't think so.

You sound like a thoughtful, kind, and polite person.

 

I think you will be happier if you try to avoid analysing or worrying about the behavior of others. Be grateful you've not been appointed judge or jury over anyone else's politeness; policing ourselves is quite enough responsibility for any of us.

 

Shirking of actual work responsibilities can be brought up with your superviser; anything else--let it go, for your own sake.

Edited September 28, 2016 by maize

[Miss Peregrine]

If you sneeze around me, I would expect you to say, "excuse me" or nothing at all. I would not expect to be expected to say, "bless you."

 

 

[Spryte]

If you sneeze around me, I would expect you to say, "excuse me" or nothing at all. I would not expect to be expected to say, "bless you."

 

Yes, same here.  I wonder if this is partly regional.  Though maybe not, DH and I grew up within 200 miles of each other (well, I moved around a lot, but the majority of my formative years were within 200 mi of him), and I generally say some form of bless you, while he does not, and doesn't expect it.  I'd go so far as to say he finds it annoying, actually.  We both say, "excuse me," after sneezing, and that seems to do the trick.

[sassenach]

It's wrong to obligate someone to give a gift. This wasn't a voluntary party, it's her work place. Going to work should not obligate a person to purchase a gift.

[sassenach]

Very honestly, nothing you have said (OP) has added to your case against her. If anything, I feel sorry for her. It sounds like she is being nitpicked to death. I'm sure she finds her workplace less than pleasant and friendly.

 

 

[QueenCat]

whether she has aspergers or not, I've no idea.  there are other things besides asd that can cause awkwardness. 

aspergers is a spectrum.  I have a diagnosed by the 'child dev. center at a major medical center child' aspie.  with today's knowledge of aspergers, I very likely would have been diagnosed (as a girl - who are still overlooked.), so I speak from that.   there are many causes (genetic here - even know the gene.  treating the gene has done a lot).

today - almost know one who knows me would ever guess I was that bad.   I do still have areas - but as an adult, I've learned to hide a lot that hasn't been overcome.

 

I wasn't being flippant in my comment to the poster who suggested AS. Like you, I have a vast knowledge of the spectrum. From my own child and working with others, both professionally and in my personal life. Mine too was diagnosed at a major autism clinic associated with a major medical center. I was merely pointing out that social awkwardness does not equal Aspergers. So many people are now associating the two, which in my experience, makes it even harder for people who actually are on the spectrum.

[QueenCat]

So this point started me thinking --- does it make me Sunny McSunshine (not mad at the name, it's kinda cute haha!) to expect a basic level of manners from someone?

 

If I bump into someone I always say "excuse me" but if someone else bumps into me is it okay for them to just move on and not acknowledge it?

 

If a coworker sneezes, or yells out "ouch" because they stubbed their toe, is it okay to just ignore them because I don't feel particularly "sunny" that day?

 

In my mind, it's not about expecting everyone to be like ME, it's about being taught common manners.

 

I fell like people who DON'T do these things are the ones who need to get over themselves.

 

I am not necessarily a morning person, but when I come down into the kitchen I always say Good Morning to whoever is in the kitchen. I shouldn't be so wrapped up in my own crabbiness that I can't say hello. If I enter an elevator and someone is in there I will say a quiet "hello" acknowledging them. Does that make me a pain in the butt?

 

I don't know. Seems to me basic stuff to say good morning when you come into a small office with people you work with all day. I think the world would be pretty lousy if it was run by people who didn't think so.

 

I think those are basic manners but nothing to get so worked up about. And totally not related to not buying a gift for a quick workplace event.

[luuknam]

there are many causes (genetic here - even know the gene.  treating the gene has done a lot).

 

How did you find out? What are you doing to treat it?

[Wheres Toto]

I worked in a smaller department in a large office until recently.  I think you may be expecting too much out of this person.

 

 

So this point started me thinking --- does it make me Sunny McSunshine (not mad at the name, it's kinda cute haha!) to expect a basic level of manners from someone?

 

If I bump into someone I always say "excuse me" but if someone else bumps into me is it okay for them to just move on and not acknowledge it?

This I would expect because it is basic manners if you actually walk into someone.

 

If a coworker sneezes, or yells out "ouch" because they stubbed their toe, is it okay to just ignore them because I don't feel particularly "sunny" that day?

I do usually say "bless you" for a sneeze unless I don't even hear it because I'm involved in what I'm doing or I don't consider us "together".  If I'm having a conversation with the person who sneezes, I'll say "bless you", if we are just in the same room doing our own thing, I might not.  I'm not sure about the stubbed toe thing - what would I be expected to say?

 

In my mind, it's not about expecting everyone to be like ME, it's about being taught common manners.

 

I fell like people who DON'T do these things are the ones who need to get over themselves.

 

I am not necessarily a morning person, but when I come down into the kitchen I always say Good Morning to whoever is in the kitchen. I shouldn't be so wrapped up in my own crabbiness that I can't say hello. If I enter an elevator and someone is in there I will say a quiet "hello" acknowledging them. Does that make me a pain in the butt?

I might say Good Morning if the person acknowledges my presence but if they are distracted, on their phone or just staring into space, I probably wouldn't say anything.  Same with the elevator.

 

I don't know. Seems to me basic stuff to say good morning when you come into a small office with people you work with all day. I think the world would be pretty lousy if it was run by people who didn't think so.

I probably wouldn't think to distract everyone from their work unless they looked up and we made eye contact when I entered. 

 

 

Sounds like an introvert/extrovert difference.  I'm an introvert.  I also tend to get very deep into whatever I'm working on and tune out the sounds around me.  It would be pretty normal for me to NOT notice another person entering a room or sneezing or leaving.

 

Now if you said "good morning" to me first, and I wasn't deeply buried in my work, I would probably respond.  But it probably would not occur to me to say it first.  I don't feel the need to hear "good morning," so I wouldn't assume everyone else needed that.  Those who need a sunny "hello" exchange in order to start off on the right foot are free to initiate it.  I won't complain, but honestly, it doesn't do anything for me.

 

I don't ever say "good morning" at home.  More like "get up and get shaking, it's X o'clock."  People feel the love anyway.  (Though I might need some coffee for it to be fully turned on.)

 

So you may be wrong in thinking your greetings etc. are a contribution to everyone around you.  To some, to those similar to you, yes.  To others, nope, sorry.  You haven't enriched them and they don't owe you.

 

I agree with this.  I'm definitely an introvert.   My last job we worked in cubes with high walls so you could hear things but not see.  In order to get my work done, I basically had to tune out all that noise going on around me.

 

The company I worked for was in the process of changing to an "open floor plan" when I left.  Cubes that were joined together, shared desk space, completely open.  Sounded like a nightmare to me.  It's not at all on the list of reasons I left, but I'm sure I would have had a very hard time working in that new set-up.

[heartlikealion]

If you sneeze around me, I would expect you to say, "excuse me" or nothing at all. I would not expect to be expected to say, "bless you."

 

If I don't sneeze at someone, I don't know that I would necessarily say anything. I sneeze into my arm or a tissue and the other person is free to say or not say anything. "Excuse me" sounds like an apology, like if you interrupt the speaker with your sneezing or spread germs in their direction.

[myfunnybunch]

Good golly.

 

It's also not playing nice in the sandbox by expecting others to play with the sand *your* way. Or by your definition of "common manners." I became much happier (and less annoyed) when I stopped expecting other people to conform to the expectations in my head and started meeting them where they are. You don't have to be bff's. It's genuine good manners and real playing nice to give others grace. For that matter, when people are genuinely accepted, they tend to be more patient, more polite, more open, more mannerly. It may be that she's very well aware of her social position in the office and is suffering anxiety and uncertainty over it.

 

I know I said it upthread, as have others, but I think it bears repeating: If her *work* performance is causing friction in the workplace because she's not doing her job well or properly or in such a way as to burden others, that's a workplace problem.

 

Otherwise, your annoyance is your responsibility. And this from someone who could probably make a career of being perpetually annoyed by others because people are freakin' annoying. I just (usually) know that it's me being annoyed and let it go.

[eternalsummer]

I'm not going to say anything to her. I guess there is not point -- she is who she is.

 

It's just frustrating because it is such a small office. And she doesn't even try to be a team player.

 

One a similar note---- My office is the Board of Health. We get a lot of complaints from people that their neighbors are hoarders and the yards are full of junk. Then the hoarder neighbor comes in yelling that he is being harassed and should not have to cut his grass, which is chest high, or throw away 10 rusting bicycles because they are not a hazardous material. To me, if you put yourself in any type of group, whether you choose to live in a neighborhood or work in a small office or go to the movies ....

JUST PLAY NICE IN THE SANDBOX!!

 

You don't get to be the nudge in the group. You don't get to annoy every freakin' person around you. I just find that so selfish.

 

 

I am a lot more live and let live, I guess.  I don't see how high grass or rusting bicycles are actually hurting anyone, particularly.  Sure, it reaches a point of being against code (in theory, a community agreed-upon contract), but until then I don't see why you should get to dictate what someone else does with their property just because you don't like to look at it.  Should he also have to paint his house a certain range of colors and have certain types of window coverings and not have flamingos in his yard?

[eternalsummer]

Do what makes you happy.  You want to be the kind of person who does all those things and sees them as the gold standard, but other people might see it differently.

 

I work in a small office with someone who is very loud (in decibel terms and also in personality terms).  She also gives too much information (for my taste) on all possible subjects.  And I don't like the way that she describes parenting her kids.  There are probably things that I do that drive her crazy too.  Absent bullying or criminal activity, I'm not prepared to say that I am right and she is wrong.  By her lights she is a kind and considerate person - I just don't always receive it that way.

 

When I lived in China, I was told that I said 'thank you' too much.  I was told that it was odd, particularly between people who were close, where the relationship was established and no 'thank you' was necessary.  I couldn't stop myself, but it made me understand that much of polite speech is a habit and 'impolite speech' does not necessarily denote ill will.

 

 

In our family we don't say "thank you" as a formality either.

 

I also don't say hi to everyone entering an elevator, or bless everyone who sneezes, etc.

 

I find those things obnoxiously impositional, to be honest, because then I have to respond/interact.  I don't want to interact.    I am not demanding that the other person interact, but they seem to demand that I do (by talking to me without invitation to do so).

 

But I don't judge people for it, I am just annoyed.

[gardenmom5]

How did you find out? What are you doing to treat it?

 

 

I started taking dudeling to a DAN!, who is also a naturopath.  My dh was skeptical, and would only support it after he talked to one of his clients who coordinates services for asd kids.  she told him  even the most affected, benefit from DAN!.  

 

 there are at least three genetic mutations that can play a role.  I'm homozygous for one that causes nutritional deficiencies - with a cascade effect of other problems.  so, we treat that.   it is based upon the results of genetic testing, and then micronutrient testing.

 

my dd also uses the same cocktail that he takes for anxiety.  (after years of struggling with regular drs and rx  - she's finally stable and doing much better. she was really skeptical too.)

[gardenmom5]

I am a lot more live and let live, I guess.  I don't see how high grass or rusting bicycles are actually hurting anyone, particularly.  Sure, it reaches a point of being against code (in theory, a community agreed-upon contract), but until then I don't see why you should get to dictate what someone else does with their property just because you don't like to look at it.  Should he also have to paint his house a certain range of colors and have certain types of window coverings and not have flamingos in his yard?

depends if there are community rules about those things.  I've learned some areas have lots of neighborhoods with HOAs - who do dictate such rules.

 

cities and counties usually only care if it's health, safety, attracts vermin, etc. related.

 

there was a tree on hwy 101 on the Olympic peninsula that had a flock of pink flamingos . . . i'm so sorry they took them down.  I loved that tree.  it made me laugh every time I saw it.

Edited September 29, 2016 by gardenmom5

[marbel]

I am a lot more live and let live, I guess.  I don't see how high grass or rusting bicycles are actually hurting anyone, particularly.  Sure, it reaches a point of being against code (in theory, a community agreed-upon contract), but until then I don't see why you should get to dictate what someone else does with their property just because you don't like to look at it.  Should he also have to paint his house a certain range of colors and have certain types of window coverings and not have flamingos in his yard?

 

They might be if a neighbor is trying to sell their house and the chest-high grass and rusted bicycles are turning off potential buyers.  

Edited September 29, 2016 by marbel

[Laura Corin]

They might be if a neighbor is trying to sell their house and the chest-high grass and rusted bicycles are turning off potential buyers.

Irritating, but still not my business. Their garden, their standards.