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Making decisions you never thought you'd have to make.


Donna
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When dd was very young and someone first clued me in to her potential in music, I felt an overwhelming sense of responsibility more than anything. As she has grown, most decisions, though some seemed huge at the time, now seem not so big (choosing a teacher, agreeing to a performance opportunity, attending a camp, choosing curriculum, etc...) in that we could backtrack if things didn't go so well.

 

Now, making choices like focusing high school a certain way seem to cut off another route to life, at least temporarily, so they seem to have more gravity...do we go all in or walk both lines and when do we need to make that decision? But still, dd can learn anything she wants to learn so she would easily be able to go back and pick up courses she needed to pursue whatever degree she wanted in college even if she had to take those courses in college.

 

Last week, a huge opportunity/choice for dd presented itself very unexpectedly. One of those choices I think will be difficult to backtrack from should we allow her to take it and one where I am completely undecided as to whether or not this is the right time. If dd were a couple years older (or an adult..heh!) it would be a no-brainer but I am unsure how this opportunity might play out at her age. (I am researching, talking to others in this field whose opinions I trust, and am in discussions with the person who presented the opportunity...luckily we have time before an answer needs to be made.)

 

My main goal has always been for dd to maintain her love for playing music above anything else and if she decides she wants to make a career of it, I want her to be able to do it on her own terms (though I would prefer her to at least have a back-up plan). To this decision, she is telling me "yes, please!!" but she doesn't have the same concerns for herself that I have as her mom. Ever wish you had a crystal ball??

 

I don't want to get into specifics at this point but maybe more looking for others who are on a similarly crazy ride with their AL and who feel like they are just bouncing along making it up as they go. (I always think dd should have been born to at least one musician parent who knows what they are doing.)

 

When have you felt like you were standing at a crossroads with your AL and one path precluded ever taking another? How did you go about making choosing? Was it as life altering as you thought it would be? 

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This thread may be helpful http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/581384-what-if/

 

Also, I will say that in my experience, it is almost always possible to go backwards. I know quite a few people who were performing or in a top conservatory in their teens who actually went away from music as a career entirely, and as long as there's at least a halfway solid high school background academically, it's not a big deal. A kid who spends their teens or even early 20's touring and decides that they're done often isn't really that much older than a typical college student and can pick up their adolescence where they left off, so to speak. It does provide a radically different life experience, but it's not the case where you can't decide, at age 21, to go become an accountant. I actually know someone who went through his PhD in Musicology-and then started designing websites professionally. He now teaches IT at the college level.

 

And the fact is, a kid with a passion doesn't have a "normal" childhood/adolescence anyway. It doesn't really matter if they get a chance to play at Carnegie Hall every night, or if they're languishing at the local PS and going home to practice and feed that drive. It still is the driving force, and that is categorically different from a child/adolescent who plays in the school band and practices when they think of it, but isn't driven by it.

 

All that is to say, if you'd consider it a definite yes in a few years, and she is dying to do it, not in the "oh, that sounds like fun, down the road" but in the "yes, I need this now. And I will bulldoze through everyone and everything to get it!" sense, I'd seriously consider it right now.

Edited by dmmetler
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It hit us at the end of first grade, though we didn't appreciate it until after third (last year). DS9 will never be able to rejoin a traditional b&m school. He is already 3-5 years ahead of the most accelerated charter in the country.

 

Honestly, we would rather he have the choice. He won't understand the consequences of his decisions until he is in his early twenties, but by then he will be well into grad school. There's just no turning back without serious consequences.

 

At the same time, how could we have held him back? The depth we provide is intense already. It only accelerates him further.

 

ETA: I do have to agree with the above - no decision at an early age is truly final. It simply becomes a question of timing and consequences. Our current range of vision only runs through the next 8-10 years, and consequences impacting education and happiness.

Edited by Mike in SA
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Not my kids but my ex-schoolmates did put academics on the backburner (minimum done) to pursue intensive acting, dancing, sports from elementary school age to high school. Some went to college via the matured path later.

 

Two of my elementary school classmates are child actresses. One has no interest in academics so getting a high school diploma and later an associate degree was her aim. The other wanted to be in the medical profession, she has to study to get As but can cruise for Bs. She did study like crazy in 12th grade for Cambridge exams and did get accepted into medical school (UK system).

 

What all of my friends have in common is that financially they could stay with their parents as long as they need, and their parents did pay for college down the road regardless when. Like a single friend need full financial help from parents until her late 20s because performance fees aren't enough to make ends meet.

 

Since she is your youngest, I'll say go for it. No younger siblings to "inconvenience".

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Yes, I have been there and am still standing there, to be honest.  It seems at times like life with her is a constant crossroads and that we are always, always waiting on an answer or decision from somebody.

 

I can honestly say that if I had to do it again, i would have taken paths that allowed my daughter to pursue her interests but kept her more in line with her chronological peers.  I would have preserved her "teenage years" so to speak.  We kept thinking that our decision would allow her to find peers, people like her and they didn't. Now,  funnily enough she has finally found a friend who is very close to her in age and ability but he is about to leave for college and she is going to grad school.  All those grad school peers who are in her classes, they like her and like to spend time with her but she is not their "friend" they don't socialize outside of work.  And work is another issue itself. She is teaching 4 recitations this fall and her students will all be older than she is. The other grad students get together at bars at the end of the week to grade together and she can't even get in.  She wants to volunteer with several outreach opportunities in our community and she is too young to participate in them. Its not that she can't find another opportunity its that our world is based on an assumption about how old you will be at certain check points in life and being substantially younger prevents you from fitting in.  I know that she will outgrow this eventually, but right now it stings for her and she always, always is the one that gets talked about in whispers and professors give her advice that they wouldn't give to her peers no matter how many times over she proves herself.

 

I don't know what crossroads you are at but I would really suggest that you consider all the future implications of the choices you have. Some paths will definitely be opened and some closed by your decisions  and remember that no matter how mature your daughter seems she cannot understand how the decisions that are made will affect a life that she hasn't lived yet.  Someone explained this to me and I didn't believe them and didn't listen and you probably won't listen to me, but our children, no matter how advanced, will really, truly only be children once. No matter how un-childlike they seem to be.

 

Now that I have said all that, I do not regret the choices we made. They opened many more doors than they closed and made my daughter who she is today.  But...if I could do it again, I would have made many different choices starting about three years before the "final" big choice was made.

 

And we are at the crossroads again, this time as a spectator because while my daughter is only 19 she is now fully an adult. She has graduated from college and is totally financially independent.  She has been accepted to a fully funded Phd program and has a highly interesting job offer from a government agency and she has one year to decide which path to take.  If she finishes the PhD, surely they will be interested in hiring her again in four years and if she takes the job surely they will pay for her to complete a PhD and yet  we have no crystal ball.  

 

Enjoy the ride, try not to look back too much and remember that a 14 year old with the executive function skills of a 20 year old is still only 14.

 

(By the way, I have read your blog and realize that your decision is probably music performance related and that does put a different spin on things as you are probably looking at delayed academics rather that accelerated academics but I think that some of my points still stand.)

Edited by Tania
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Yes, I have been there and am still standing there, to be honest.  It seems at times like life with her is a constant crossroads and that we are always, always waiting on an answer or decision from somebody.

 

Thank you so very much for sharing Tania. I loved your whole post but am only quoting this part in case you are uncomfortable (I keep going back and taking down posts due to how uncomfortable I am sharing too much). We are in the spot you were a few years ago, wondering if we really should be going ahead with these very adult decisions.

 

I agree that children are only children once, but how DO you balance these very ADULT goals with that childhood? I have NO idea. I feel so torn in many directions. The kid who said he will apply early to colleges but commute from home is now saying he would like to live in dorms. How to I reconcile myself with that? This might not be Donna's concern but this is a grown up decision and one I want to honor but also strike down because I am not ready to see him go off like that. Not now. Not so soon. But I might decide to because I have trusted him all this while, maybe I should have more faith?

 

I think you can take SOME decisions back, it just takes some time to reset fully and switch paths. But there are some you cannot take back. Some things in life were only seen through science fiction shows and crappy horror movies. In today's world, I feel like so much more can actually happen that I don't want to.

 

Donna...is there any way at all that she can take a trial run? E.g. for DS, we have to decide about dorm life. He is now getting a small taste of that living away from home in a dorm for a summer thingy (for a month and a half). He has a single room so not exactly the real thing, but it at least gives us both a chance to see him figuring it out (in an albeit safer environment).

 

Another thought, if you haven't applied to DYS or PG Retreat yet, I suggest doing so. There are other parents with a wealth of experience who might give you more data points.

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I agree that children are only children once, but how DO you balance these very ADULT goals with that childhood? I have NO idea. I feel so torn in many directions. The kid who said he will apply early to colleges but commute from home is now saying he would like to live in dorms. How to I reconcile myself with that? This might not be Donna's concern but this is a grown up decision and one I want to honor but also strike down because I am not ready to see him go off like that. Not now. Not so soon. But I might decide to because I have trusted him all this while, maybe I should have more faith?

 

If it helps your decision any, my daughter, who is now 19, says that 14 and 15 year olds do not ever belong in dorms.  I am sure that she would be glad to pm you more if you would be interested.  

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Thank you all for sharing!

 

I wanted to quote a number of your posts but couldn't figure it out so I am going to try to respond without quoting.

 

Yes, dmmetler, I gave up on the idea of a "normal" childhood for dd a very long time ago but I do guard her down time and make sure she has a time for a childhood, however different it may look. I am not worried about her academics at this point. She is accelerated academically at this point and after a lot of soul searching and research, I think I have figured out how to merge her interests and goals with my ideas for keeping a back door/escape hatch open for another year or two at least. I do know she can learn anything she wants to learn if she needs it whether it is in the next four years of high school or later in college.

 

We would consider this decision a definite "yes" in a few years if she continued down this path. It is a huge opportunity for taking her "career" to a new level. She has been on a "trial run" of this lifestyle progressively for a number of years but the past year or so is having more and more involvement as things are building and snowballing more quickly and she is thriving and loving every opportunity and moment.

 

This opportunity would make everything more "official" and at the same time take much of the work off of me (for the past year I feel like I am working a second job) but possibly take some choices out of my hands (still discussing how much this might be the case and this will affect the decision we make in the end). It also might require me to change my involvement in my own work for the next few years which is a huge consideration for me but this may become the case whether or not we say yes to this opportunity, unless I were to put the breaks on everything with dd. 

 

I hear you, quark...How do we balance very adult goals with childhood? Why wait...but at the same time what is the rush?  I don't know the answers to these questions that seem to only have answers in hindsight. I know she is still only 14 no matter how mature she is and I know she doesn't have the ability to think ahead or think about the possible consequences but then, really, do I? Or are all the consequences I fear only in my own mind...fear of the unknown? In reality, this could be the best choice in her life...but the mother/worrier side of me fears an early end to her childhood and the loss of her love of making music. Not knowing is the hard part.

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I hear you, quark...How do we balance very adult goals with childhood? Why wait...but at the same time what is the rush?  I don't know the answers to these questions that seem to only have answers in hindsight. I know she is still only 14 no matter how mature she is and I know she doesn't have the ability to think ahead or think about the possible consequences but then, really, do I? Or are all the consequences I fear only in my own mind...fear of the unknown? In reality, this could be the best choice in her life...but the mother/worrier side of me fears an early end to her childhood and the loss of her love of making music. Not knowing is the hard part.

 

:grouphug: At every step we can only plan based on what we know and that's all I am able to do for now. Regarding what's the rush, that's the thing...it doesn't feel like a rush. It feels right. All of it feels right (the dorms part I do question). I know this is the right time for him. And usually I don't realize that he is that much younger, but when I do, that's when it hits. This feeling of being shortchanged 3 or 4 more years. Of worrying about his safety.

 

Regarding your own needs, that's something to think about very carefully. I have consciously decided to put my professional needs aside. This decision causes the least amount of stress all around. My work is such that I can do it online and at home. But I know myself. I know that I will become very invested in any project I undertake and I have to ask myself if I am willing to take it on and if I do, how that will affect his studies if he will commute from home/ go far away early.

 

It might be helpful to start writing a checklist of all the pros and cons for what it is you need to decide for her, and then another list for you. Or combine all of it. I don't know if that helps you but seeing things down in black and white is usually a game changer for me. It helps me focus and spells out more clearly the options that we have ahead of us.

 

Good luck Donna. Whatever happens, you know you have us here rooting for you and DD.

 

Edited for typos (hopefully caused not by age but by typing on a new keyboard).

Edited by quark
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Regarding what's the rush, that's the thing...it doesn't feel like a rush. It feels right. All of it feels right (the dorms part I do question). I know this is the right time for him. And usually I don't realize that he is that much younger, but when I do, that's when it hits. This feeling of being shortchanged 3 or 4 more years. Of worrying about his safety.

 

Regarding your own needs, that's something to think about very carefully. I have consciously decided to put my professional needs aside. This decision causes the least amount of stress all around. My work is such that I can do it online and at home. But I know myself. I know that I will become very invested in any project I undertake and I have to ask myself if I am willing to take it on and if I do, how that will affect his studies if he will commute from home/ go far away early.

 

It might be helpful to start writing a checklist of all the pros and cons for what it is you need to decide for her, and then another list for you. Or combine all of it. I don't know if that helps you but seeing things down in black and white is usually a game changer for me. It helps me focus and spells out more clearly the options that we have ahead of us.

 

Good luck Donna. Whatever happens, you know you have us here rooting for you and DD .

Thank you, quark! I go back and forth with myself between feeling like this is a logical next step, an amazing opportunity, and shocked that the person offering it is who he is then on the other hand thinking she has plenty of time in her life to take this step why rush it.

 

Putting my professional needs aside is something I have done partially by working part time so I can homeschool but the money I make has been kinda necessary for our budget (mostly paying for music-related expenses)...depending how things went, all that could change. I also enjoy what I do and feel a bond with my "kids" (patients) but would put it aside for a few years for dd's benefit. Realistically, she only has a few more years of needing me.

 

I do make those checklists but at the moment, I need to obtain a bit more information. I am dragging my feet a little by waiting until next week to make a phone call and talking to others I trust in the field in the meantime.

Edited by Donna
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I think I have an idea of the opportunity... and I will not give you any suggestions... but you said "I always think dd should have been born to at least one musician parent who knows what they are doing."  So I thought I might share a bit from that angle.  

 

I am not a musician, but I do know some parents who *are* working, professional (some very well known) classical musicians with kids who play classical music at a very high level.  I have talked to them about their perspective on raising these kids and the decisions they make when unusual opportunities are offered to their kids at unusual ages.  In every case, these parents have applied the brakes.  Every case. 

 

I can chat specifics with you about it if you want, but I wonder if you might get similar ideas chatting with working professional (well-known) musicians in your dd's genre, those with kids, and asking them what they would do if it was THEIR child (ask them to really imagine it IS their actual son or dd by name). These people already know the pros and cons and how the experience could affect a child.

 

Chin up.

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If we're voting, I vote for "let her go for it." If one of my kids ever showed a passion and drive like that, I wouldn't hesitate. Normal childhood and adolescence is not all it's cracked up to be. Better to pursue the opportunity for greatness.

That sounds very tempting... but I think it depends on the opportunity (the particular experience). I didn't use to think so... but I have had a number of discussions lately with parents making these decisions IRL and they have "stories" to share that are very eye-opening.  These are people that have BTDT themselves (they have achieved greatness in the same area, often starting when they were teens). I notice a pattern in the choices they make for their kids...

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I have had a number of discussions lately with parents making these decisions IRL and they have "stories" to share that are very eye-opening.  These are people that have BTDT themselves (they have achieved greatness in the same area, often starting when they were teens). I notice a pattern in the choices they make for their kids...

Also teachers... the parents mention specific teachers who have a reputation for working with unusually talented children at an unusually young age -- the parents have said that the teachers counsel extreme caution.

 

The OP might also talk with parents of kids who, for example, work in movies **(in Hollywood or on Broadway) at a young age or compete in the Olympics at a young age (I'm thinking ladies gymnastics or ice skating)... I think there may be similar considerations.  (Obviously not everyone chooses to apply the brakes.)

 

edited to add **

Edited by zaichiki
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If it helps your decision any, my daughter, who is now 19, says that 14 and 15 year olds do not ever belong in dorms.  I am sure that she would be glad to pm you more if you would be interested.  

It's not about whether or not we trust them (the younger-than-typical kids) or how mature they are, but "Do we want them exposed to certain things at such a young age?"  Even if we are confident that they would make the right (safe, legal, etc.) choice, do we want them to be exposed to it before they have to be?  After all, there's no going back.

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I think I have an idea of the opportunity... and I will not give you any suggestions... but you said "I always think dd should have been born to at least one musician parent who knows what they are doing."  So I thought I might share a bit from that angle.  

 

I am not a musician, but I do know some parents who *are* working, professional (some very well known) classical musicians with kids who play classical music at a very high level.  I have talked to them about their perspective on raising these kids and the decisions they make when unusual opportunities are offered to their kids at unusual ages.  In every case, these parents have applied the brakes.  Every case. 

 

I can chat specifics with you about it if you want, but I wonder if you might get similar ideas chatting with working professional (well-known) musicians in your dd's genre, those with kids, and asking them what they would do if it was THEIR child (ask them to really imagine it IS their actual son or dd by name). These people already know the pros and cons and how the experience could affect a child.

 

Chin up.

 

Thanks, zaichiki, for the input.

 

I have actually been talking to numerous people, all at the top of dd's genre. Dd is very lucky/blessed to have a very large group of "friends" who are considered the best in the genre. Some, who work with the man who approached us, gave their input as to the type of person he is and his reputation. Others who gave input/opinions about the opportunity...people who have chosen various paths (some strictly professional musicians and others who have another profession but perform/teach on the side) and who I believe have my dd's best interest in mind but especially other women in the genre who have children themselves because I thought they might share a unique perspective.

 

The man has a wonderful reputation...everyone who knows him has told me he is honest, genuinely enjoys his work, and does not approach just anyone (as is evident by the people he works with).

 

I've also talked to the man (numerous emails and phone conversations) and shared my concerns and reservations. He's been very blunt and shared the pros and cons others have discussed with me as well. Also, he is willing to "play by my rules" so to speak...meaning we have the final say on anything dd is involved in, she never goes without me until she is much older, and he would work one year at a time (maintaining an open escape hatch for dd).

 

We don't have to make a final decisions yet...the music world books far in advance so if we do decide to take advantage of the opportunity, nothing much will happen until next year around this time and no contract will be signed for months. The uniqueness of dd's age will be less evident in another year as we know a number of young people not much older than that performing in the genre at various levels.

 

Zaichiki, since we do have time to look at all angles, I would love to hear some of the specifics you've heard in case there are some considerations no one has brought up yet...maybe a pm or email? 

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since we do have time to look at all angles, I would love to hear some of the specifics you've heard in case there are some considerations no one has brought up yet...maybe a pm or email? 

Sent a PM including some considerations I've discussed with other parents.  I'm sure you've heard them already... Keep in mind that classical music may be very different from Irish traditional music with respect to some of these concerns.

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