bettyandbob Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 He's white and will never be a police officer or soldier. He's intellectually disabled. He will always need help. He has apraxia and can communicate verbally only a little bit. He has anxiety. When he's anxious he cannot communicate at all. At some point he will not live with his parents. At some point we won't be able to take care of him. He will outlive us. He has to live somewhere. I've made a point of having him be a part of our community as much as possible. It's good for him and it challenges him to do more. Despite his apraxia he was successful being fully included in regular classes in public school through elementary grades. In middle school he took one regular class and did well (home ec). He has done day camps where he was the only camper with special needs. He has done summer swim team in the neighborhood for years. He grocery shops with dh weekly (and the cashiers ask for him if he doesn't go) and he goes to church with dh. So he's out and about and people know him. But not everyone knows him. This is a densely populated area. So, when I see the incident in Florida I am scared. I was terrified when the incident of the man with down syndrome being choked to death by off duty police for refusing to leave a movie theatre happened. The way that incident occurred I could absolutely see my ds meeting the same fate because he would shut down and not be able to do anything except refused to move and moan when he was stressed. Just a couple weeks ago I sat on the floor of a grocery store with ds for 30 minutes (we were on vacation and being away from home is hard sometimes). There was no moving him--he's 5' 6" and 150# and not fully grown. So we just sat and I talked calmly until he was ready to get up and go to the car. What if that was a caregiver who didn't have patience of mom and so he became more agitated and did more disruptive things. If law enforcement were called how would they respond? This is a training problem. I know the issue is bigger for minorities. I do think percentage wise minorities are feeling the affects of poor training and systemic problems in police training than persons who have disabilities, but since my ds has disabilities that side of it is personal to me. There needs to be a fix to help everyone feel safe and trust police. It's going to take a long time. So, I don't know if my ds will be safe in his own community where people do know him--a lot of people, but not everyone. 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 I'm sorry, Diana. That hurts my heart. <3 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katy Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 I'm sorry. That must be scary. I wonder if you called the police department, if your family could take part in the routine training they give for officers for interacting with people who are disabled? That way, for your son at least, he could meet many of the officers. If there was ever an incident, hopefully someone who was sent to respond would know him. And if not, at least the officers would have some additional training on how to handle interactions with the disabled. 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happi duck Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 (hugs) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alicia64 Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 I'm nervous for my two boys and they don't have special needs. I'm so sorry. I wonder if a desensitization program around police would help. In other words, having hin be exposed to uniforms on a regular basis. Maybe the police would help with this? Take care, Alley 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sneezyone Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 I started and stopped multiple comments. All I've got are hugs. :grouphug: 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bettyandbob Posted July 21, 2016 Author Share Posted July 21, 2016 It's not about him being familiar with police in general. He is. The young man in the movie theater incident idolized police--that didn't help him. It's not about police knowing him. He's met safety officers at school. He could meet police at the local station. But I live in a densely populated area. There is no way for every officer in the district to know him. And then there are new officers moved into the precinct... Really, my ds is known to way more of the community than most kids with his level of disability. Thinking that ds should get to know local LE puts the responsibility for prevention on ds. Honestly, ds isn't capable of having this responsibility. Also since I live in the DC area we are not just talking about one local county, there are layers and an layers of various LE here. If it is the responsibility of persons with disabilities and their caregivers to introduce them to LE so that officers who might come to scene will know the person, then we might as well say persons with disabilities cannot be a part of the community. It isn't safe for persons with disabilities to ever be a part of the community because they cannot get to know most of the officers in the community. It is the need for training. The need to understand how to de-escalate whether it's group of people or one agitated person. Gut response appears to be all wrong by LE. Are we to really assuming anything held by an agitated person is a gun. My ds plays with (fiddles with) anything when he's agitated -- this means he could be seen pacing and holding something in his hands if he were agitated. Are we to assume that anyone who doesn't respond to verbal orders is willfully not responding (what about persons who are really scared, what about persons who do not understand the spoken communication). 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mom25girls Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 This hurts my heart. I'm so very sorry. Praying that the obvious need for training creates a national change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 (edited) I'm in your boat with you. It's especially concerning because my intellectually disabled son LOOKS completely normal. If you were to pass him on the street, you wouldn't know he's disabled until you try to hold a conversation with him. Yes, I'm concerned about his future safety. Edited July 21, 2016 by Kinsa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katy Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 I'm sorry, I certainly didn't mean to put the onus on you. I was only thinking about preventative actions, and that perhaps meeting police and being involved in training personally would make YOU feel better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ottakee Posted July 21, 2016 Share Posted July 21, 2016 I'm in your boat with you. It's especially concerning because my intellectually disabled son LOOKS completely normal. If you were to pass him on the street, you wouldn't know he's disabled until you try to hold a conversation with him. Yes, I'm concerned about his future safety. It is a fear here too. My son would most likely be able to respond as he is quite verbal. My one daughter though would likely freeze or panic or get aggressive if highly pressured..........but to her advantage she is a female and only 95 pounds and 4'10"....vastly different than a young black male that is 200 pounds even if they have the same disability and functioning level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TechWife Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 I understand. My son has ASD. I have had the same thoughts. Ds is verbal, but can be argumentative, in addition to problems responding to social prompts. I really am very choked up by this entire incident and I really can't articulate things in a logical order. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravelingChris Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 I am very sorry. MOre training is key. Better educated police too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anne in CA Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 I am very sorry also. I believe you have genuine reason for your concern. You are going to have to set him up for success the best you can and hope he can find a good group home where he will be cared for and loved and kept secure. But at the end of the day, your worries would be mine in the same situation, and it reminds me to have empathy with people who appear to be unreasonable. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elegantlion Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 :grouphug: :grouphug: to you all dealing with these conversations or thoughts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mamiof5 Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 I'm so sorry!! Will pray for better training. Very frightening :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucyStoner Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 (edited) I understand. I also have sons with ASD and the thought has crossed my mind, especially with the highs and lows of puberty affecting how well my older son's medication works. I worry. Not as much as I worry about my nephews who are black but worry nevertheless. I'm so sorry people have to contemplate these realities. Hugs to you and your son. Edited July 22, 2016 by LucyStoner 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MomatHWTK Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 Yes, once my ASD was old enough to look "big and intimidating" my fear level went up. He wears a medic alert bracelet, but that's not necessarily going to help in a tense situation. The as LS mentioned, I know it would be more fearful if we a family of color. It seems our world is in a vicious cycle right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbutton Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 Yep, one kiddo with ASD/ADHD and sensory defensiveness, and one with apraxia and APD. The one with APD literally doesn't comprehend speech at a normal rate and is very slow to respond, gets flustered, etc. Both are also gifted and could be frustrated enough to mouth off if they are not frozen/reactive in a negative way (ironically, some people can get out a pun or something snotty easier than something rational). Get either of my kids in a crowded or noisy situation, and one of them amps up physiological while shutting down mentally, and the other goes functionally deaf and is not able to understand what you say to him. I used to worry about kiddos like mine getting tasered. That seems pretty minor now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laurie4b Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 I totally agree with you on training. It's something we should be demanding of our state legislators, local LEOs, etc. Every officer needs basic training in recognizing characteristics of people who are not neurotypical. De-escalation is especially important in these situations, but in nearly all situations, it's the best protection for the suspect, for by-standers and for LEO. I would think a good LEO would be traumatized for life if he found he'd killed someone who didn't understand/couldn't respond. No way to reverse that error. We really need to get out of compliance-mentality policing: ask, tell, force, consider noncompliance a threat. That should be the exception based on assessment of the individual situation, not the rule. I think now is a good time to be contacting our law-makers and making ourselves heard about what we want in law enforcement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeremmy Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 I was recently thinking the same thing for a Deaf individual that doesn't verbally speak. I'm sorry that you have to personally deal with these worries. That would be nice if there was a way for you to have input into officer training with people like your son. You're right that that puts the onus on you and is unfair, but I fear that only people who have real-life experience will be able to make a positive impact at this point. I don't know if department's are unwilling or just unable to effectively train their officers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lecka Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 (edited) I went to a speaker earlier this summer named Dennis Debbaudt. He came to our town and spoke about safety issues and ways to work on safety skills. He spoke one day at the police department and one day at an autism workshop. I got a lot of great ideas. I bet his PowerPoint or a video of him might be available on the Internet. Edit: really, he was very good, I would recommend looking him up. Edited July 22, 2016 by Lecka 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lecka Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 (edited) A civic group arranged for Dennis Debbaudt to come and to hold a training at the police station also. They do a lot for autism in my town, they have "adopted" it as one of their causes. So that is how it happened here. Edited July 22, 2016 by Lecka Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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