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Do I mention this or just let it go?


fairfarmhand
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But I didn't say any of that to HER.

 

I'm not a chatty at bedtime mom. She knows that. WE talked about prom the next morning. She generally comes in and goes to bed after this stuff and we talk the next morning. That's what we did.

 

We looked at Facebook pictures, checked out the venue online so she could show me what the location was like.

Right, I had no way of knowing all this. At my house growing up I would have chatted with my mom and been very excited she she would have wanted to know how my night was. If she had looked at me, remarked on how I should have been more considerate to her and sent me to bed (which is what I got from your post), I would have been upset. Obviously, as I tried to caveat, that was my perspective. If you all have another dynamic, then that's not something I can comment on.

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Thankfully the dress is ok.

 

We weren't sure about care instructions for that particular fabric, so we were going to look that up after prom before we cleaned it.

 

So we didn't know whether the water would ruin it or not.

Well that's good news! So, no need to be hurt or upset on either side!

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I think when you give a gift to someone, ideally you let it go once you give it to them. I don't blame you at all for feeling hurt and shocked initially, but I wouldn't hold it against your dd or make a big deal out of it. That just seems like something a group of teens would do while having fun. It's just water and maybe the dress is really fine anyway.

 

If impulsiveness is an issue in general and not considering others feelings, that might be something to comment on and work on while she is still under your roof. I might say "when someone gives you a gift, trashing it in front of them isn't the best way to show appreciation".

 

I also think if this is a kid that in general doesn't take care of things, next time she needs a formal, that's a $20 trip to a thrift shop instead. Don't set yourself up for disappointment and set her up to be a disappointment.

Gosh, seems like there is something in between "custom made formal" and $20 from Goodwill.

 

I for one never would have had a second thought about participating in a water fight in a prom dress. I still wouldn't. I value experiences over material things and it took me a long time (because of society's messages that life is too short for X / no THING is more important than friendship or family, etc.) to realize that some people did not share my laissez-fairs attitude towards material possessions. It never would have occurred to me that someone would make a dress to be seen and not worn hard. I could not wrap my mind around that and even now it is in the category of "well, everyone has their 'things'".

 

As an adult I realize that I should not accept handmade gifts with this attitude but as a teen my reaction would have been--"I thought you didn't mind if I wore it." Like... Gosh, what did you think happened at proms, mom?

 

As an adult I empathize with fair farmhand, but in terms of expectations I'm more in the "a muddy dress is a well worn dress" camp.

 

You may have created something worthy of being a museum piece but it is unrealistic, IMO, to expect a kid to treat a piece of clothing like that.

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I don't think you did anything terrible, fairfarmhand.  I would have been shocked and disappointed after all that time, effort, and hard work, too, especially since the dress would have been handed down to other children. You had a natural reaction. You didn't scream or freak out. You didn't berate her over and over again. You quietly, calmly expressed your feelings ONE TIME. (Would that I always had such self-control.)

 

Parents have feelings, too, and at some point, children need to learn that their actions impact others. I get that your DD got caught up in the moment and was impulsive. It happens. So I would not pursue the topic with her further. Regarding comments that seem to suggest your DD should somehow have been warned not to get wet, I would never have thought to add "don't get in a water fight" to my pre-prom list of instructions.

 

I'm glad you and DD were able to talk happily about the prom events and hope the dress isn't ruined.

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I agree with you and GailV.

 

Wanton destruction of what most know to be expensive clothing, handmade or not, just seems wasteful, tacky, and immature to me. Even if it can't be reused, we would sell it or donate it. Heck, that's what we'd do even with our cheap clothing.

 

This isn't a 10 year old. This is a nearly full grown adult woman who knew better and just didn't care. And I think that's why your feelings are hurt, understandably IMO. Accidents happen, but that it was purposeful would upset me too.

 

I don't think you need to mention it again, but I would have difficulty making a dress for her that couldn't be machine wash and dry. I'd feel that's a lot of work and money and time for something she doesn't seem to care that much about. I wouldn't resent that really bc some people are just like that. But if they don't care about me doing it, then there's not much point to me doing it. It I wanted my yarn to be a wadded ruined mess in a closet or trash can, I wouldn't bother to knit it first. I imagine I'd feel the same about sewing.

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I make quilts for people, in case that was a pertinent distinction. Would I be upset if a quilt was ruined? Probably, but I also give them to people with no strings and tell them I want the gifts to be used. My boys have torn a quilt I made for them by jumping on the bed. So it's not that I didn't understand handmade or impulse behavior causing destruction.

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So I have to ask...did you get pictures? That would help me feel better about the dress.

 

I would feel like you do, but I would not try to convey my hurt in a way that would shut down an actual productive conversation.

 

I would require her to pay for the cleaning. You never know when an opportunity might arise to either wear it again or bless someone else by passing it along to another.

 

(ETA this from someone who spends lots of time sewing, mostly complicated costumes)

Edited by Seasider
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I would never have thought to add "don't get in a water fight" to my pre-prom list of instructions.

 

 

 

I don't think anyone would have thought to put that on the list! I'm glad she had fun!

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I make clothes including formals but this would not have bothered me.  I feel that I gave the dress as a gift and it was loved. The owner gets to do what they want to it.  To me this would be like getting upset that someone took an item I made them and took it apart to remake something else.  Nothing to get upset over.  

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Gosh, seems like there is something in between "custom made formal" and $20 from Goodwill.

 

 

 

As an aside, my daughter has gotten some beautiful formal dresses in thrift shops and clothing exchanges that she proudly wears in public that were $20 or less.  In some cases, much less.  That were probably worn by a teen once or twice. I didn't say this as a jab at all, but as an real option that many people are perfectly happy with. 

 

I am a needleworker and a sewer.  I TOTALLY get the attachment we get to the fruits of our labor.  This winter I lost one of my very favorite pair of stranded needlework mittens I knit.  Not only that, but they were lined with a 2nd hand knit cabled pair of mittens I also made.  This happened months ago and I'm still bummed about it!  But life happens.  Stuff is just stuff.  Things get lost and get dirty.  The next pair of mittens I make myself (which are in progress!) will have my name and number on them.  ;)   I don't gift hand made stuff to people who I don't think will truly appreciate having a handmade item.  And that doesn't mean I don't love them.  I just show love in different ways to them. 

Edited by WoolySocks
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I'm old enough to remember the days when many of our things were hand-made or special care or expensive, and needed to be treated carefully.  It was a regular part of how we were raised.  That is why we had "play clothes" and why we had clear rules for where dirt from outside needed to be contained and where we could eat etc.  Nobody would have needed to tell me to be careful of my prom dress; I would have thought about it on my own - what kind of fabric is this etc.

 

I think that generally, things are a lot different now because most things are easy to wash, durable, and not very expensive to replace.  And, I've even been known to let my kids go to school with a faded stain on their light-colored blouse if it didn't come out in the wash - something that would give my mother fits.  As a result, my kids have a very different way of viewing our things.  No, we do not behave like barn animals, but we only have a few rather obvious rules.  I could probably see my kids thinking a wet prom dress was no big deal at all.  I can't really blame them, unless I've spent the time to teach them how it needs different treatment.

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I find it interesting the different perspecives between the people who do handmake special items for others and those who don't.

 

No, I sew for my kids too. I haven't made a prom dress yet as my oldest is 12, but I have made many other items for them.

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I'm old enough to remember the days when many of our things were hand-made or special care or expensive, and needed to be treated carefully.  It was a regular part of how we were raised.  That is why we had "play clothes" and why we had clear rules for where dirt from outside needed to be contained and where we could eat etc.  Nobody would have needed to tell me to be careful of my prom dress; I would have thought about it on my own - what kind of fabric is this etc.

 

I think that generally, things are a lot different now because most things are easy to wash, durable, and not very expensive to replace.  And, I've even been known to let my kids go to school with a faded stain on their light-colored blouse if it didn't come out in the wash - something that would give my mother fits.  As a result, my kids have a very different way of viewing our things.  No, we do not behave like barn animals, but we only have a few rather obvious rules.  I could probably see my kids thinking a wet prom dress was no big deal at all.  I can't really blame them, unless I've spent the time to teach them how it needs different treatment.

 

Yeah, and people didn;t have many clothes. That's why ladies wore aprons ALL the time when working.

 

I have a series of pictures of my Grandmother. She was in a club that had yearly formal dances/dinners. In virtually EVERY picture, she's wearing the same dress with a few variations. Different collar, different sash, different accessories, but the same simple dress. She was not poor. I'd say upper middle class. But she was a sensible lady,

 

When I was a teen, I got one formal dress in high school. The idea of buying a new dress just for variety for the same kid who wore the same size was just not entertained.

 

Things are different now.

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This conversation is starting to remind me of a Buddhist sand mandala or the Good Friday sawdust carpets in Guatemala.  These painstaking works of art are intended to be destroyed, and knowing that going in probably helps.  Nothing lasts forever after all.  :)

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I find it interesting the different perspecives between the people who do handmake special items for others and those who don't.

I only started knitting the last couple of years. I don't think my response would change.

 

I simply don't have much respect or patience for wanton destruction just for the sake of being "fun".

 

It wouldn't matter to me if it had been store bought. Though obviously I also wouldn't be stressing over making the next dress if that were the case.

 

My oldest daughter loved a used dress we bought her and was in tears because she leaned across her sister and didn't know little sister's toes had wet nail polish on them. Ruined the dress and she hadn't even had a chance to wear it out of the house once. It was a used dress, I think we paid about $25 for it. And it was an accident. She wasn't in trouble or anything. She had several other dresses to chose to wear. But she was really upset.

 

I don't think it's about handmade or not.

 

Some people just don't care about waste, money or otherwise, or don't seem to respect other people's work.

 

I do agree with not giving gifts with strings. But I'm also not big on giving something to someone I know won't appreciate it or might purposely ruin it. I wouldn't get extremely mad about the ruined dress. It was a gift and know you know it's maybe not the most suitable gift for this person.

 

I once made a pair of gloves with luxury yarn for someone. They said they loved them and wanted more. Great. But then they were laughing that their new puppy ruined them when they were playing tug of war with them. No, the puppy didn't do this by accident, she did it on purpose to play with him. Ă°Å¸ËœÂ¯ Uh. Yeah. I'll still give a gift, but no more handmade knits for her from me.

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When I was a teen, I got one formal dress in high school. The idea of buying a new dress just for variety for the same kid who wore the same size was just not entertained.

 

Things are different now.

 

Yes, my mom got me a very nice white dress (on sale) when I was about 16.  It was for graduation and everything else I needed to dress up for.  My mom talked about my using it for my wedding if I ever got married.  (It was not a long dress.)

 

I didn't go to prom, but if I had, it would have probably been in that same dress.

 

My younger sister also wore that same dress for some events.

 

Edited by SKL
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I make quilts for people, in case that was a pertinent distinction. Would I be upset if a quilt was ruined? Probably, but I also give them to people with no strings and tell them I want the gifts to be used. My boys have torn a quilt I made for them by jumping on the bed. So it's not that I didn't understand handmade or impulse behavior causing destruction.

An accident by a young child is just part of life. For that matter, an accident by an adult is too. It's not like food never stains formal wear. But if I made a quilt for my child and they purposely took a pair of scissors to it? Yeah. I'd be thinking they don't need a new quilt anytime soon and I'd be both hurt and ticked.

 

Her daughter is nearly a grown adult and not a child anymore.

Her daughter didn't accidentally get caught in a downpour, she purposely engaged in a water fight.

 

Not the same.

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I only started knitting the last couple of years. I don't think my response would change.

 

I simply don't have much respect or patience for wanton destruction just for the sake of being "fun".

 

It wouldn't matter to me if it had been store bought. Though obviously I also wouldn't be stressing over making the next dress if that were the case.

 

My oldest daughter loved a used dress we bought her and was in tears because she leaned across her sister and didn't know little sister's toes had wet nail polish on them. Ruined the dress and she hadn't even had a chance to wear it out of the house once. It was a used dress, I think we paid about $25 for it. And it was an accident. She wasn't in trouble or anything. She had several other dresses to chose to wear. But she was really upset.

 

I don't think it's about handmade or not.

 

Some people just don't care about waste, money or otherwise, or don't seem to respect other people's work.

 

I do agree with not giving gifts with strings. But I'm also not big on giving something to someone I know won't appreciate it or might purposely ruin it. I wouldn't get extremely mad about the ruined dress. It was a gift and know you know it's maybe not the most suitable gift for this person.

 

I once made a pair of gloves with luxury yarn for someone. They said they loved them and wanted more. Great. But then they were laughing that their new puppy ruined them when they were playing tug of war with them. No, the puppy didn't do this by accident, she did it on purpose to play with him. Ă°Å¸ËœÂ¯ Uh. Yeah. I'll still give a gift, but no more handmade knits for her from me.

 

OK, but she did not ruin the dress.  It seems she did not think water would ruin it - and it didn't.  So I think "wanton destruction" etc. is a little harsh for the present situation.  Had she intentionally rolled and wrestled in the mud, the reactions here probably would be different.

 

 

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I'm so sorry.  I like to sew too and know how much an act of love it is to make something like that for someone.  

 

Is the dress really and truly ruined?  Can you get it dry cleaned and pressed and salvage it?  

 

I wouldn't express anymore disappointment to my Dd.  Teens can be careless and unintentionally hurtful, that's just how it goes.  I can't imagine she would want to  do anything to hurt your feelings or that in the moment thought that plain water would damage a dress.  As a teen I would just imagine that the dress would dry out and be as good as new.  

 

I'm really sorry your hard work was ruined.  I'm sure she appreciated it and had a great time in her lovely gown.

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When I was a teen, it was my job to do the laundry.  Some of our bedspreads were beautiful matching quilts that my late great grandmother had made for my parents' wedding present.  One day somebody puked on one of the bedspreads and I wasn't too thrilled about having to clean it.  I waited too long and it ended up with mildew, which was a permanent stain.  Yeah, my mom was not too pleased.  I did not realize my actions were going to permanently damage the quilt, but I was out of line.  My mom did tell me off at the time, but she didn't bring it up again.  I guess she figured I felt guilty enough and learned my lessons.

 

My, there are so many lessons we all have to learn.

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Thankfully the dress is ok.

 

We weren't sure about care instructions for that particular fabric, so we were going to look that up after prom before we cleaned it.

 

So we didn't know whether the water would ruin it or not.

Oh I'm so glad the dress is going to be okay!

 

I would definitely sit her down and explain that she should never assume that in the future though.

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Honestly, I can't imagine being upset over this. Sounds like she liked the dress and had a good time. Dresses for those types of occasions are rarely worn again anyway. I would let it go.

Why would water ruin the dress? I think it's great they had fun and she enjoyed herself and even as an adult it wouldn't occur to me to be upset over water on a dress, or that it was some sign of disrespect for the person who made it. Sounds like good fun to end a great night to me.

 

I wouldn't say a word because I don't think she actually did anything wrong. I know you and this daughter have history but in this case? It's not really her. I mean, even silk and wool aren't ruined by water, they can be cleaned so long as their dyes are properly set. Very few fabrics are truly dry clean only.

Edited by Arctic Mama
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I just hope that none of the other kids with whom she engaged in the water fight were wearing clothing that could be ruined by the water.

Hmm.... Remembering the plethora of rented tuxes at proms when I was in high school too. I wonder if they would be able to return it after that.

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Just musing here since I don't have kids who are going or have gone to a prom. (I didn't go either.) I always thought the prom was a chance to dress up in way people rarely do and have a somewhat grown-up function. Do kids not grasp that dressing up (in many cases spending a good chunk of money)--doing their hair, buying a fancy dress, etc.--signals that the event is not your average picnic and that perhaps a different standard of behavior is expected? A water fight at a casual picnic is not big deal. At a formal dress event? I think I'm glad my guys haven't expressed any interest in these events (at least not yet).

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An accident by a young child is just part of life. For that matter, an accident by an adult is too. It's not like food never stains formal wear. But if I made a quilt for my child and they purposely took a pair of scissors to it? Yeah. I'd be thinking they don't need a new quilt anytime soon and I'd be both hurt and ticked.

 

Her daughter is nearly a grown adult and not a child anymore.

Her daughter didn't accidentally get caught in a downpour, she purposely engaged in a water fight.

 

Not the same.

Sure it's not the same. Just like taking scissors to the dress to deliberately destroy it isn't the same as engaging in a spontaneous water fight that didn't ruin the dress. But honestly, I've more or less encouraged water play as a fun way to get messy without ruining clothing. To me, that's one of the better ways to have fun because stuff will dry with no lasting damage. The intent was never to damage the dress. If there were deliberate destruction of the dress for the sake of destruction (like cutting it) I'd see your point.

 

It's funny, though, because the OP talked about the kid acting impulsively, but it seems her reaction to the dress being soaked was impulsive too -- she didn't know if the dress was ruined or not. No one did, apparently, but she assumed it was.

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Oh by the way, that scene in It's a Wonderful Life always freaks me out.  You know what I'm talking about?  Back then, every one of those outfits would have been expensively destroyed.  In real life nobody would dare go back home after that.  :P

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I don't make things by hand but I  do a lot for everyone in my family, and  I totally understand where you are coming from OP.  I think your feelings are justified.  I would have felt the exact same way.  I think kids and adults need to learn respect and appreciate what others have done for them. And sometimes when they don't figure it out on their own, it needs to be brought to their attention. :grouphug:

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If it's in formal clothing that is highly likely to be permanently ruined, then I think it is.

We simply differ in opinion then. I'm not sure what kind of clothing would be ruined by water that I wouldn't know about it ahead of time and take extra care, especially if I was going to be eating and drinking and dancing in it, and have others around me doing the same. I just would not freak out about a water fight at prom as wonton destruction. It seems pretty darn tame to me.

 

As for rented tuxes, I'd frankly just be more careful in general because the garment is not my own. But I probably wouldn't worry if it got wet.

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OK, but she did not ruin the dress. It seems she did not think water would ruin it - and it didn't. So I think "wanton destruction" etc. is a little harsh for the present situation. Had she intentionally rolled and wrestled in the mud, the reactions here probably would be different.

 

 

I know right? It's water, not scissors and a torch. Good, clean fun.

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I would probably (unfortunately) reacted the way you did after the prom.  But today--in the long run, I'd want to ask about the great time she had, and make sure those memories were the ones she remembered about prom, not my reaction.  

 

Later, when the two of you are ready to get it cleaned, you might discuss the importance of taking special care of special items.  You probably do need to discuss the impulsivity on a separate occasion.  

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Just musing here since I don't have kids who are going or have gone to a prom. (I didn't go either.) I always thought the prom was a chance to dress up in way people rarely do and have a somewhat grown-up function. Do kids not grasp that dressing up (in many cases spending a good chunk of money)--doing their hair, buying a fancy dress, etc.--signals that the event is not your average picnic and that perhaps a different standard of behavior is expected? A water fight at a casual picnic is not big deal. At a formal dress event? I think I'm glad my guys haven't expressed any interest in these events (at least not yet).

It's a dance. With crazy pop music blaring and kids jumping around dancing. The "bad" kids at my high school were drunk or stoned. Everyone was dressed nicely, but it's not like a dance out of a Jane Austen novel, IME. Even the "good" crowd of kids I could totally see getting into a water fight as a spontaneous thing at the end of the night.

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It's a dance. With crazy pop music blaring and kids jumping around dancing. The "bad" kids at my high school were drunk or stoned. Everyone was dressed nicely, but it's not like a dance out of a Jane Austen novel, IME. Even the "good" crowd of kids I could totally see getting into a water fight as a spontaneous thing at the end of the night.

 

I may be out of touch, but not enough to expect teenagers to pretend they are at an Austen gala. However, I still think there's value in kids learning that certain behaviors have a time and a place, no matter how much fun they may be. They'll appreciate knowing the difference when they're adults navigating social events in the business world some day.

 

ETA: I totally respect that people have wildly different opinions on this. I'm cool with that and hope they are, too.

Edited by Reluctant Homeschooler
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The thing is with many formal things is the colorfastness of the trims vs. the fabric. So one can bleed onto the other.

 

Another thing is that some formal fabrics wrinkle oddly when wet. I've had one dress shrink when it got wet, transforming from a flat fabric to a more seersucker texture. Other fabrics spot when wet, drying with weird color variations.

 

Formal fabrics are just different.

Yes. I might be more understanding to a child who had never been clued in before.

 

But in most homes that make things, the kids know. Or I would think they would.

 

I know my kids have seen me knit a garment and then block it and mutter epithets bc it bled if I forgot to add vinegar or it was a delicate fiber or whatever or have accidently washed a sweater and had to had it down to a younger sibling afterward. They have worn a tshirt in various pools and seen the color damage. Or they have gotten in the creek or lake or a puddle and seen the damage to their clothing. They have gone to dinners and had spills. Because children do these things, and learn from them as they go and I'd expect long by the time they are 18ish, they've connected the cause and affect.

 

I'm rather confounded that it seems common many adults don't. Or just don't care either way I suppose. I'd guess it's because we live in a such a throw away society.

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I may be out of touch, but not enough to expect teenagers to pretend they are at an Austen gala. However, I still think there's value in kids learning that certain behaviors have a time and a place, no matter how much fun they may be. They'll appreciate knowing the difference when they're adults navigating social events in the business world some day.

 

ETA: I totally respect that people have wildly different opinions on this. I'm cool with that and hope they are, too.

 

I totally agree and an average high school prom is not something I really think is valuable, but I don't think there is any attempt at the vast majority of them to be teaching any kind of formal etiquette. That's just not the kind of party it is, despite the formal attire.

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We had prom and "after-prom." After-prom (in casual dress) was where you were supposed to chill out and not worry about your clothes. :P

Us too. All the proms had Prom and after prom. Prom was very formal dinner and event for about 2 hours and then afterwards we had a casual party of sorts. Some changed and some didn't, but I don't remember any girls not being concerned about keeping their hair and attire nice. God help the guy who mussed the hair or dress. Lol

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I'm sorry, and I can understand your reaction in the moment.  It perhaps was based at least as much if not more on not what happened to the dress but on her seemingly uncaring attitude.  In the moment I'm sure I would've had a weird mesh of confused feelings if I were you.  I'd feel happy for her that she had fun and also flabbergasted and a little hurt all at once, and would probably just be left standing there with a dazed look and frozen silly smile.  haha  

 

I'm sure she appreciated it a lot, and felt proud to have it.  She for sure just never made the mental link that her getting it wet was being careless or might damage the dress.  High school (and older) kids are a strange mix of independence and inability to quite understand the ripples of their actions.  I still remember and am embarrassed by things I did as a teen that I'm sure hurt my sweet mother.

 

Put it this way.  Would you rather she have had a sad time but at least came home with a dress that wasn't in a water fight, or a really fun time with a wet dress?  I know you would choose the second, and given the dress wasn't actually damaged, I'd let it go.

 

I think it's fine to tell her that you quite honestly were a little miffed about the dress given all the time you put into it creating it, but you know it wasn't damaged and you're really happy she had fun.  Then, I'd put it behind you and happily listen to her evening.  But, she can also be part of the chore of getting it fixed up/cleaned/pressed so that she can use it again some day or hand it down to a sister.  

 

 

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