S/O Guns and Open Carry...is it a right just for White Men?

[umsami]

I'm making this anonymous, so I hope people will be honest. 

 

There was a picture a few days ago about some "patriots" with their automatic weapons and ironically face masks on....following a Muslim woman...in Texas.   I wondered if people who are pro-open carry are as comfortable with non-white males open carrying?  

 

 

How would you feel if you saw a bunch of hijab-wearing Muslim women with rifles slung over their shoulders at Starbucks?

 

What about a group of black men?

 

What about a bunch of Sikh men?

 

I'm going to be honest and say I am not comfortable with anybody open carrying.... but yes, I'd probably look twice at a bunch of hijab-wearing women, or men in thobes/galabayas...or a group of black men...or whatever.   I also think that these groups are less likely to exercise that right because they know that it would be viewed as threatening by some and they may get themselves shot or arrested.  

What do you think?

Edited December 3, 2015 by umsami

[Tanaqui]

There is no option for "No, where I live I'm not comfortable with it no matter who is doing it".

 

Geez, I didn't even like it after 9/11 when we had soldiers walking around with guns.

[umsami]

There is no option for "No, where I live I'm not comfortable with it no matter who is doing it".

 

Geez, I didn't even like it after 9/11 when we had soldiers walking around with guns.

 

OK....added it. :)  I feel that way too. I remember when I used to go to Italy a lot by train, and being weirded out by the police officers/soldiers in the train station with their rifles.  It was just so strange/foreign to me.

[Amira]

Yep, I need to be able to say that I don't want any open carry with the exception of trained and uniformed LEO.

[Sneezyone]

Black men die for carrying knives, let alone guns, openly. Even walking around a store or home from the store after purchasing a gun makes them vulnerable to state santioned killing. I do not support open carry because everyone does not share equally in that right and open/concealed carriers make deadly mistakes too often.

[debi21]

Even law enforcement open carrying is a little weird. It's intimidating and uncomfortable for anyone to be open carrying. But then, you don't know who is carrying concealed anyway. At least those guns are smaller? And they have registered to have a permit?

 

[Amira]

Even law enforcement open carrying is a little weird. It's intimidating and uncomfortable for anyone to be open carrying. But then, you don't know who is carrying concealed anyway. At least those guns are smaller? And they have registered to have a permit?

 

I agree with you about the open carry. But since I don't think we're going to disarm law enforcement anytime soon, I'm okay with some of them, as needed, not concealing their weapons. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

When I think open carry, this is not what I imagine.  I think of a handgun in a holster at one's side.  Or something like that.  Not some mega big arse gun at the ready. Is that really what open carry means?! 

 

Yuck. 

[QueenCat]

I wish that concealed carry wasn't permitted because then I don't know who around me is wearing a weapon. I'm okay with open carry because I can see it and decide whether or not I want to stay around it.

[HRAAB]

Seeing anyone with a gun strapped to them makes me head in the opposite direction. Armed men/women in a group would make me way more nervous than one man/woman with a weapon. I would get out of there pronto.

 

Yes, I am afraid of guns. In my life I've known of too many people who have died from accidental gun shots, three under the age of 18.

 

I didn't answer your poll because honestly it makes me very uncomfortable with myself. I'm going to give this some thought.

[umsami]

When I think open carry, this is not what I imagine.  I think of a handgun in a holster at one's side.  Or something like that.  Not some mega big arse gun at the ready. Is that really what open carry means?! 

 

Yuck. 

 

I think it obviously depends on the person...but yes, they can (in my state) have a gun like this.

 

I remember being in line at the Target pharmacy to pick up some meds.  The gun in front of me had two holsters, with a handgun in each.  It made me and the kids really uncomfortable.  I also wonder how safe it was because it would seem that somebody else could have easily grabbed one of the guns.  I'm assuming they were loaded.

[SparklyUnicorn]

I'm not comfortable seeing anyone carry a gun either except maybe a police officer.  It really would make no difference what the person looked like otherwise. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

I think it obviously depends on the person...but yes, they can (in my state) have a gun like this.

 

I remember being in line at the Target pharmacy to pick up some meds.  The gun in front of me had two holsters, with a handgun in each.  It made me and the kids really uncomfortable.  I also wonder how safe it was because it would seem that somebody else could have easily grabbed one of the guns.  I'm assuming they were loaded.

 

yuck

 

I've never seen anything like that in my life.

[LMD]

That picture is awful. That poor woman.

 

I wouldn't want anyone open carrying. It doesn't happen here. Only police officers carry.

[HRAAB]

I think it obviously depends on the person...but yes, they can (in my state) have a gun like this.

 

I remember being in line at the Target pharmacy to pick up some meds.  The gun in front of me had two holsters, with a handgun in each.  It made me and the kids really uncomfortable.  I also wonder how safe it was because it would seem that somebody else could have easily grabbed one of the guns.  I'm assuming they were loaded.

 

In Walmart one time my dd was poking me like crazy.  There was a man looking over the produce that a big gun of some type over his shoulder.  My dd was wondering if we could report him.  As far as I know, it's legal.  We quickly made our way to another part of the store.  He was white.  I mention that because of your poll.

 

My nephew, a young black man, loves guns and has numerous ones.  He likes big ones; well, ones that look big to me.  He is in law enforcement.  If I saw him with one, I wouldn't necessarily like it, but I wouldn't be at all nervous.  I know him personally.  That makes a huge difference.

[NicksMama-Zack's Mama Too]

 

I'm not a fan of open-carry as it freaks people out. However, I see a few people here and there open-carry in as I live in a heavy military and LEO area and it doesn't bother me at all. Most people I know conceal carry if they carry at all.

 

I have seen photos of Israeli teachers with rifles slung across their backs. Apparently, it's the norm there.

[Catwoman]

That picture is awful. That poor woman.

 

I wouldn't want anyone open carrying. It doesn't happen here. Only police officers carry.

:iagree:

 

Same here. Open carrying is not legal in our state, so it makes me incredibly uncomfortable when I am in another state that allows it and I see someone walking around in public with a visible weapon.

 

I assume I am especially sensitive to it because it isn't something I grew up with, but I would be lying if I said it didn't make me uneasy. I see no reason for open carry other than for law enforcement officers, but I know others have no problem with it. I suppose if I had always lived elsewhere and my friends and family members regularly open carried, I might view the situation differently.

[Jkacz]

I feel very uncomfortable and angry seeing that. I have a CCL and do occasionally carry concealed. But the idea that someone would open carry like that for the purpose of intimidation is appalling.

 

And just FTR - it is highly unlikely that is an "automatic weapon". An automatic weapon is one where you pull the trigger once and multiple bullets come out. A semi-automatic means that 1 pull = 1 bullet. Most guns (not revolvers) are semi-automatic. Automatic weapons are already highly regulated.

[Hikin' Mama]

I'm not anti-gun, but I'm really not comfortable with anyone open carrying, except police officers.

[PinkyandtheBrains.]

 

 

 

How do I know who is the "good guy with a gun" and who is the bad guy?

[Chelli]

Open carry of handguns becomes legal in Texas at the beginning of the year. I'm not a fan, neither is my dh who has his concealed and carry license. We both think it's a stupid law that shouldn't have been passed. No one I've talked to plans on taking advantage of the law. I did see one man open carrying a handgun at Kroger about a month ago. It did make me nervous and squicky feeling and it had nothing to do with his skin color. I would have felt the same way about anyone open carrying. I think the entire idea is appalling. 

 

I also think it's stupid to be able to open carry rifles and shotguns which has been legal in Texas for a while as evidenced by that horrific picture in the OP. I wish others had stood in front of those idiots creating a safe area for those entering the mosque to walk. Similar to how people would try to drown out the voices of the Westboro Baptist folks. I go out of my way to talk to and be over the top friendly to the Muslim people I see as we are out and about in the Houston area. I want them to know that not everyone is like those idiots in Irving. 

[Spryte]

That is a chilling picture. Chilling. :(

 

I'm not pro-open carry for anyone but law enforcement. Adding a mask to it just makes it more intimidating and frightening for the woman being followed.

[Slache]

You should absolutely not be allowed to wear a mask while you open carry. Those men are disgusting and that's harassment and a hate crime. He's not a white man carrying a gun, he's a man in a mask carrying a gun. What exactly is he hiding?

[Hikin' Mama]

P.S. If I saw IRL the situation shown in that picture, I would call the police pronto.

Edited December 3, 2015 by Hikin' Mama

[justasque]

P.S. If I saw IRL the situation shown in that picture, I would call the police pronto.

 

To do what?  In open carry states, the man in the pic is not breaking any laws.

[ashfern]

I don't mind handguns. Anyone with their face covered bothers me. The long guns make me nervous. We were flying internationally around the Gulf War time. It was weird that the police/military in the airports had rifles. We go out to lunch to a restaurant that has police (plain clothes not uniforms) with handguns on their hips and that doesn't bother me. I don't know enough about the requirements for open carry to make an informed choice on your poll.

[Hikin' Mama]

To do what? In open carry states, the man in the pic is not breaking any laws.

I guess nothing then. I would offer her a ride in my car then. I would be scared for her.

 

ETA: For all the reasons listed later in this thread, I would offer her a ride AND call the police.

Edited December 4, 2015 by Hikin' Mama

[HRAAB]

Open carry of handguns becomes legal in Texas at the beginning of the year. I'm not a fan, neither is my dh who has his concealed and carry license. We both think it's a stupid law that shouldn't have been passed. No one I've talked to plans on taking advantage of the law. I did see one man open carrying a handgun at Kroger about a month ago. It did make me nervous and squicky feeling and it had nothing to do with his skin color. I would have felt the same way about anyone open carrying. I think the entire idea is appalling. 

 

I also think it's stupid to be able to open carry rifles and shotguns which has been legal in Texas for a while as evidenced by that horrific picture in the OP. I wish others had stood in front of those idiots creating a safe area for those entering the mosque to walk. Similar to how people would try to drown out the voices of the Westboro Baptist folks. I go out of my way to talk to and be over the top friendly to the Muslim people I see as we are out and about in the Houston area. I want them to know that not everyone is like those idiots in Irving. 

 

Why are you not a fan of open carry but concealed weapons are okay?  I don't understand.  Does open carry cause more panic?  I know seeing weapons on a person makes me really nervous.  On the other hand, at least I know who has a gun.  Concealing one seems less honest.  We don't own any handguns and really aren't into guns so there is a lot about guns I don't understand.

[maize]

I've never seen anyone open carry, other than law enforcement types. 

 

Otherwise I've only seen guns in a target practice or training context. 

 

I prefer it that way.

[QueenCat]

Why are you not a fan of open carry but concealed weapons are okay?  I don't understand.  Does open carry cause more panic?  I know seeing weapons on a person makes me really nervous.  On the other hand, at least I know who has a gun.  Concealing one seems less honest.  We don't own any handguns and really aren't into guns so there is a lot about guns I don't understand.

 

We have guns but don't "carry" (ours are strictly for "sport"-- target shooting) but I totally get where you are coming from. I don't get why people have more problems with open carry than concealed carry.

[Tanaqui]

I don't get why people have more problems with open carry than concealed carry.

 

Because of situations like that loser in the picture stalking a Muslim woman. (Also, at a bare minimum, I'm thinking open carry has got to mean no covering your face. Geez.)

 

[MSNative]

To do what? In open carry states, the man in the pic is not breaking any laws.

Isnt he breaking anti-stalking laws? I mean I would be uncomfortable with anyone following me like that-with a gun, a knife, a bottle, anything. That's freaking wrong

 

https://www.victimsofcrime.org/our-programs/stalking-resource-center/stalking-laws/federal-stalking-laws

[MSNative]

To do what? In open carry states, the man in the pic is not breaking any laws.

Isnt he breaking anti-stalking laws? I mean I would be uncomfortable with anyone following me like that-with a gun, a knife, a bottle, anything. That's freaking wrong

 

https://www.victimsofcrime.org/our-programs/stalking-resource-center/stalking-laws/federal-stalking-laws

[HRAAB]

Because of situations like that loser in the picture stalking a Muslim woman. (Also, at a bare minimum, I'm thinking open carry has got to mean no covering your face. Geez.)

 

I understand that she wouldn't be as frightened or nervous if the weapon was concealed, but would she be any safer?  Personally, I don't think it looks very civilized to see people walking around malls, stores, downtown areas carrying weapons, but other than how I perceive the looks of it, does it have a bearing on safety?  Why is concealed carry preferable?  Because it doesn't look/feel as threatening because you can't see the threat?

 

I just find it hard to believe that a person can mask their face and open carry.  Boggles my mind.

[QueenCat]

Because of situations like that loser in the picture stalking a Muslim woman. (Also, at a bare minimum, I'm thinking open carry has got to mean no covering your face. Geez.)

 

I'd rather KNOW they have the weapon than not know because it's concealed.

[bolt.]

Question about "carrying" -- suppose a person is going hunting. Does it count as "carrying" as they bring the gun out of their house, drive in their truck, to their destination, and walk all around their hunting expedition, then drive home again? If so, I think that those sorts of activities should be fine (or at least parts of it) -- it would be odd if they had to carry them in cases or something to avoid "open carry" problems.

[Hikin' Mama]

Why are you not a fan of open carry but concealed weapons are okay? I don't understand. Does open carry cause more panic? I know seeing weapons on a person makes me really nervous. On the other hand, at least I know who has a gun. Concealing one seems less honest. We don't own any handguns and really aren't into guns so there is a lot about guns I don't understand.

I guess for me it's because a person carrying around a gun like that seems to be doing so to intimidate people. Usually people who go around trying to intimidate people are bullies or worse. While I'm not against concealed carry, I do think a person should have adequate training to be able to get a permit. I AM against women carrying them around in their purse. I don't think it is at all safe. And again, I am not anti-gun. All of the men in my family are hunters, but none of them walk around in public, where they will be doing NO hunting, with their guns. My dad was incredibly safe with guns and I guess it colored how I view the treatment of guns. If he had to take one in to have it fixed, it was unloaded and in a hard case, not slung over his shoulder. He didn't even store guns and ammo together and both were locked up.

 

I know several people who think it should be okay to open carry your gun into Starbucks, but I am completely against it. I see no purpose in that. And I see absolutely no purpose in following women around with a gun. NO freaking purpose!

[bolt.]

Funny story: I was at s Christian family camp and one family had an air rifle. They were sensitive that not everyone might want to see it (or want the small children to see it). Therefore, one of the young teens of that family carried it -- draped in a blanket (and looking really self-conscious as only young teens can) across one of the public areas.

 

I was just thinking: "What made you think that would look *less* suspicious?!?" -- an air rifle looks like an air rifle. An air rifle under a blanket looks like a rifle! There was not an adult in the whole space that didn't notice.

[Tanaqui]

Question about "carrying" -- suppose a person is going hunting. Does it count as "carrying" as they bring the gun out of their house, drive in their truck, to their destination, and walk all around their hunting expedition, then drive home again? If so, I think that those sorts of activities should be fine (or at least parts of it) -- it would be odd if they had to carry them in cases or something to avoid "open carry" problems.

 

Yeah, I was thinking that too. I'm not 100% opposed to responsible, ethical hunting, though it's not an activity I think I'd enjoy (I don't even like it when my cats bring a mouse into my home), and hunting generally does require some sort of weapon. (Unless you're hard core and run your prey to death, I suppose.)

[Hikin' Mama]

Question about "carrying" -- suppose a person is going hunting. Does it count as "carrying" as they bring the gun out of their house, drive in their truck, to their destination, and walk all around their hunting expedition, then drive home again? If so, I think that those sorts of activities should be fine (or at least parts of it) -- it would be odd if they had to carry them in cases or something to avoid "open carry" problems.

The people I know put them in cases for transport and then carry just the gun while hunting. The thing with hunting is that you are not walking around where there are a bunch of other people. At least where I've hunted (I don't hunt anymore, not my thing), it's not like I'm walking down the sidewalk where someone else might wonder what the heck I'm doing with that gun. I'm out where the wild game is, and as such it is usually not heavily frequented by many other people.

[Laura Corin]

I said that I wouldn't be comfortable for anyone to be carrying a visible gun.  But actually, I sometimes see hunters pottering through a village on foot with a gun in a soft case on their back and a dog at their heels.  That doesn't worry me, and I suspect that that's because I know the specific purpose for which they are carrying it: to kill animals.  

 

Some guy in ordinary clothing carrying a gun as he went about his normal life: I would assume that he was carrying it to potentially use against people, possibly me. 

[swimmermom3]

When I think open carry, this is not what I imagine.  I think of a handgun in a holster at one's side.  Or something like that.  Not some mega big arse gun at the ready. Is that really what open carry means?! 

 

Yuck. 

 

Oh honey, I have an article for you:

 

Walking Through Texas With a Gun and a Mission -

 

The first picture should give you an idea of some people's open carry goals. Scroll down a bit and you will see a group photo that includes a young boy, a baby in a baby carriage and a whole bunch of "big arse" guns. The group was told to "look approachable" or something like that.  If you read the story, the first part is about the drunk with a gun that approaches the group with guns.

[Bluegoat]

I said only law enforcement but probably shouldn't have.  I m ok with it if I can see the person has the gun for  purpose - they are or were hunting, or walking in the woods, or whatever.  It would only bother me if they looked like they were nutters, or unreliable.

 

I do have  problem with the idea of people having concealed guns, but that is illegal here, and you cn't really walk round with  pistol anyway.

[Katy]

Meh.  I think if it's true they were following her around, those guys were harassing her, and if I were her and I were being followed I would have called the police and asked for a restraining order if they followed me after making more than one turn.

 

Generally I think those who are carrying holstered weapons are not a threat.

People carrying hunting weapons in hunting season are not a threat.

 

Even though I am generally supportive of gun rights, I think people who open carry rifles into places to make a political point are jerks and it's bad behavior designed to scare people.  Having been raised in a stand your ground state, being a jerk with a weapon is at best foolish and at worst deadly.  Don't be a jerk.

[swimmermom3]

I think it obviously depends on the person...but yes, they can (in my state) have a gun like this.

 

I remember being in line at the Target pharmacy to pick up some meds.  The gun in front of me had two holsters, with a handgun in each.  It made me and the kids really uncomfortable.  I also wonder how safe it was because it would seem that somebody else could have easily grabbed one of the guns.  I'm assuming they were loaded.

 

The part in bold is what I don't get. Who is this guy? Wyatt Earp?  He is expecting a shoot out in the street?

 

I grew up on a couple of acres with horses. My dad had guns. He seldom went hunting, but guns in a rural area with livestock are always a handy thing. I just thought of them as tools.

 

In the mid 1980s, dh and I lived in Montana.  Guns were carried in bars, which wasn't always a good plan, but for the most part, people were discrete and not in your face. Of course, everyone had a rifle (?) on their gun rack in their pickup and cars were seldom locked. I never thought to much about it. Maybe because there were ranchers and hunters and it all seemed right for the place.

 

While I have not yet crossed the line to where I believe we should ban private gun ownership, I could see myself getting there with some of the attitudes I currently see.  Montana, where guns were sort of necessary, is a whole different place than an urban setting with a big, loud, white guy toting his "big arse" gun around that is way overkill for self-protection, because we will all be impressed with how big his, er, "gun" is. :tongue_smilie: He's making a statement and his need to make a statement makes me question his judgement when it comes to his ability to safely handle his gun.

[Guest]

I heard about that incident and thought it was ridiculous - when grown men try to intimidate innocent women they're just as bad as the terrorists they claim they hate.

 

I'm not a huge fan of open carry. I prefer concealed as I think it leads to less posturing.

[Ravin]

I live in Arizona, where open carry is legal and you don't need a permit to conceal carry. The only people I have seen open carry are white and Hispanic men. The only ones I have seen carry long guns around town were white males.

 

While it is technically legal for anyone, there is definitely privilege at play (and/or machismo).

[Guest]

Open carry of handguns becomes legal in Texas at the beginning of the year. I'm not a fan, neither is my dh who has his concealed and carry license. We both think it's a stupid law that shouldn't have been passed. No one I've talked to plans on taking advantage of the law. I did see one man open carrying a handgun at Kroger about a month ago. It did make me nervous and squicky feeling and it had nothing to do with his skin color. I would have felt the same way about anyone open carrying. I think the entire idea is appalling.

 

I also think it's stupid to be able to open carry rifles and shotguns which has been legal in Texas for a while as evidenced by that horrific picture in the OP. I wish others had stood in front of those idiots creating a safe area for those entering the mosque to walk. Similar to how people would try to drown out the voices of the Westboro Baptist folks. I go out of my way to talk to and be over the top friendly to the Muslim people I see as we are out and about in the Houston area. I want them to know that not everyone is like those idiots in Irving.

That's where we are at - neither of us likes open carry by anyone.

[swimmermom3]

To do what?  In open carry states, the man in the pic is not breaking any laws.

 

The fact that the man is wearing a mask and following a Muslim woman could send a signal to a "good guy with a gun." The photo is very threatening. Not only is the masked gunman an ass, he's stupid.

 

[creekland]

Right now I'm ok with pretty much anyone as it's rifle deer season in PA, so seeing folks with rifles out is extremely common.

 

Even when it's not deer season, it can be relatively common to see guys with hunting weapons either hunting or target shooting.

 

Outside of those situations, I'm not ok with it except for law enforcement.

 

There's no need to take any sort of weapon into "civilization" and definitely no need to follow someone while masked.