Jump to content

Menu

Jeub family sends half of their kids to school


Rebel Yell
 Share

Recommended Posts

I have never heard of this family before today, but apparently they are well-known to many homeschoolers.

 

I am surprised that I agree with much of the article. For us, there is no charter school for high school nearby, plus my girls are 11th & 9th grade and wish to continue being homeschooled. But if 6 or 7 years ago there was a good charter school, located nearby, with all of the benefits my girls would want (performing/creative arts options) then my story might be different...

 

http://www.chrisjeub.com/our-first-day-of-school-after-23-years-of-homeschooling/

 

Thoughts? :lurk5:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I can relate to his stance on legalism, but I don't understand why he seems to feel such a strong need to defend his choices.  Families change, circumstances change.  Kids grow and parents' roles change.  Change happens.  I don't see the need to defend making different choices to fit different circumstances.

  • Like 12
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I know them. Wow. That's one of the last families I ever expected to put their kids in school. And it sounds like it is, in part, due to the recently exposures of so many patriarchal groups and their leaders.

 

The lifestyle aspect of homeschooling is still a big pull for me right now, but, good luck to them and I hope their kids have a good year! I wish we had charter schools in Australia, I might think twice if we did. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I can relate to his stance on legalism, but I don't understand why he seems to feel such a strong need to defend his choices.  Families change, circumstances change.  Kids grow and parents' roles change.  Change happens.  I don't see the need to defend making different choices to fit different circumstances.

This was my response too.  But I don't share his culture apparently because the kind of legalsm regarding homeschooling is not one I have and not one I've encountered.  But then I haven't really spent a lot of time in homeschool activities.  

  • Like 7
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I can relate to his stance on legalism, but I don't understand why he seems to feel such a strong need to defend his choices. Families change, circumstances change. Kids grow and parents' roles change. Change happens. I don't see the need to defend making different choices to fit different circumstances.

I think because a number of people were calling to express their concern, as he states in the article.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think because a number of people were calling to express their concern, as he states in the article.

 

Yep.  He's well known in some circles, and him putting some of his kids in school would be a Very Big Deal to some of the people who have followed him and his family.  It would be somewhat akin to the Duggers putting their kids in school.  

  • Like 8
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I only vaguely know who they are, but I'm glad they have some solutions that will work for their family. Of course, that whole area seems to support alternatives to brick and mortar public school, provides lots of hybrid sorts of options, etc. We looked at that area briefly and were impressed at how many just plain choices parents have for schooling. I'm not saying I'd opt for a charter school over homeschooling, but we have very limited options in that respect anyway.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've never heard of this family either.  But, I was happy to see the article.

 

One thing that has bothered me about homeschooling over the years is the lack of humility I see from some folks. You know, the people who loudly proclaim "homeschool is the only way" and "my kid will walk into a public school over my dead body."  So often, I've seen those people end up with kids in school and suddenly, they want people to forget how loudly they beat the homeschool drum.  And, in some cases, they  start beating the public school drum just as loudly.  Like any convert, I guess.

 

So it's nice to see some long-term homeschoolers stand up and say "things have changed; we've changed; here's what we're doing now; no big deal."  

 

(Since I don't know anything about this family I am not accusing them of not having humility about homeschooling.  That part is just a general comment about something I've seen personally.)

 

 

 

 

  • Like 7
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well said.  He makes some excellent points, and kudos to him for calling out the Patriarchal Movement for what it is.

 

 

Sadly, not every family has access to quality educational alternatives. There is no shame in making the best choice you can for each individual child.  It was good for him to say that.

  • Like 10
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have no idea who he is but like other posters, I'm glad to see the article. Too often people see homeschooling or brick and mortar schooling as the only way. But at our house, education is decided on an individual basis. What's good for one may not work for another. You know? So it's nice to see he is embracing a B and M school for half his kids. :)

 

Sent from my VS985 4G using Tapatalk

  • Like 5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Never heard of them but am happy they are doing what is best for their kids.

Personally, I have never been one of those public school is the devil government trying to control my kids. And have always viewed our homeschooling as a one year at a time kind of thing.

As anyone who has read my posts these past few years knows my oldest has put me on a roller coaster of go to high school or not. Ultimately, he is doing his senior year at home, in case you were wondering.

I admire people who can admit their needs have changed and are taking charge of meeting those needs.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

How so?

 

(I only skimmed the post)

 

He's one of those "everything I do is God's way" everything the government does is "Hell's way" types.

 

He gave himself a dodge because this brick and mortar school is a "charter school," so part of the "anti-Hell's way movement" in his mind.

 

Wacka-A-Doodle.

 

Bill

  • Like 5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Chris Jeub has written several things about turning away from legalism that sounded really encouraging.  But I think it's telling that his 4 oldest children are estranged from their parents.  

 

Given what one of them has written about their homeschooling, I'm glad that the younger kids are getting the chance to go to school.

  • Like 6
Link to comment
Share on other sites

At first I thought I hadn't heard of them but now I realize that I have.

 

I hope Tibbie is right that they're slowly realizing that need to change. There's hints of that in there. But also, as Bill pointed out, hints that he possibly hasn't changed enough to not end up with all his kids estranged. And presumably being willing to meet the adult children and make some amends would be step one, not blogging about how they're changing.

 

It's interesting to me too that he's in such an insulated world that to him, how homeschooling has changed is that it has become more legalistic. Actually, Chris Jeub, how homeschooling has changed is that it has become much more diverse and more secular. And your little corner has reacted by becoming more legalistic.

  • Like 32
Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

It's interesting to me too that he's in such an insulated world that to him, how homeschooling has changed is that it has become more legalistic. Actually, Chris Jeub, how homeschooling has changed is that it has become much more diverse and more secular. And your little corner has reacted by becoming more legalistic.

 

The patriarchal type homeschooling families that I know (all No Greater Joy or ATI people) don't seem to be aware that secular homeschoolers, or homeschoolers of other faiths, even exist. It's really bizarre, but when one does the math this is a bubble that's been forming for over 20 years.

 

Their kids are not OK. They know less of the world than their parents who were public schooled a generation ago. JMNSVHO.

  • Like 17
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The patriarchal type homeschooling families that I know (all No Greater Joy or ATI people) don't seem to be aware that secular homeschoolers, or homeschoolers of other faiths, even exist. It's really bizarre, but when one does the math this is a bubble that's been forming for over 20 years.

 

Their kids are not OK. They know less of the world than their parents who were public schooled a generation ago. JMNSVHO.

 

This is like when I look at the Duggars and think... how can they not be aware of other resources than sending Josh off to a Christian work camp yet again? But even though they're in the spotlight and think they're so media savvy and all, they're actually completely insulated. Their world is so very small. And this family's is as well.

 

Here, the charter schools are sort of the opposite of insulated. They're full of multiculturalism and things like community based learning and so forth. If only the kids were going to a charter like that.  :tongue_smilie:

  • Like 7
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Isn't this the family in which 100% of the older kids have turned their back on their parents' lifestyle as they've left home, some of them telling tales of control and abuse?

 

Maybe the parents are waking up and realizing that they will lose all their children if they don't change.

Yes, I recall this to be so. That does please me, however poorly they have chosen in the past. This leads me to believ that they are using critical thinking, which many such families don't do. The Duggar thing, and Vision Forum almost assuredly have woken them up.

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

They're a sweet family and have been more ready to admit mistakes and make changes over the years than many. I've been on the blog for, gosh, six or seven years? Chris writes debate material of very high quality and their cookbooks are excellent :D

 

They are a Chrisrian family I've very much appreciated and admired precisely because they resist legalism, even in things they feel very strongly about, and don't make commands where the bible doesn't. I hope this is a great turn for them, as homeschooling isn't the right fit for every family in every season. And some kids are better served in group settings whole others do better one on one with mom.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

They're a sweet family and have been more ready to admit mistakes and make changes over the years than many. I've been on the blog for, gosh, six or seven years? Chris write debate material of very high quality and their cookbooks are excellent :D

 

I've been reading the daughters' testimony concerning little boys wearing makeup to hide the bruises on their faces, daughters being whipped 40 times for being rebellious, adult children being told they aren't allowed to speak or to question their father's authority...

 

if all of that is true, they are not a sweet family, and I don't know how their cowed children are supposed to be able to debate anyone.

 

(The link I posted above leads to more links. It's a rabbit hole.)

  • Like 18
Link to comment
Share on other sites

No clue who they are.  I do have a question though.  I will add the quote below.  Can someone explain it?  I don't really get it.

 

Your family may have prospered in this environment, but this hurt the Jeubs. I cannot recall anything good that has come from my attempts to set up legalistic formulas to raising my children—homeschooling included. God has been a bit rough with me whenever I’ve tried.

So much family dysfunction and personal bondage can be trailed back to downright awful ideas. Homeschooling itself isn’t an awful idea, but it got hijacked along the way by hierarchal, manipulative and legalistic folks. Like wondering Israelites trying to make their way in their newfound freedom, some erected idols and worshipped that which they thought brought their freedom.

Yes, I’m talking of legalism, patriarchy, and ideas of the like. If you are a brand new homeschooler, you may not know what I’m talking about. Good. Homeschoolers are ridding themselves of these harmful ideologies, my family included.

Meanwhile, back in Egypt, the people left behind made some significant changes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

They're a sweet family and have been more ready to admit mistakes and make changes over the years than many. I've been on the blog for, gosh, six or seven years? Chris write debate material of very high quality and their cookbooks are excellent :D

Hmmm, sweet family who has no contact with multiple children? Hmmm.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've been reading the daughters' testimony concerning little boys wearing makeup to hide the bruises on their faces, daughters being whipped 40 times for being rebellious, adult children being told they aren't allowed to speak or to question their father's authority...

 

if all of that is true, they are not a sweet family, and I don't know how their cowed children are supposed to be able to debate anyone.

 

(The link I posted above leads to more links. It's a rabbit hole.)

There has been some discussion on that as to whether it is accurate or not. They're the first to admit they d made mistakes and bought into things like the Pearls before deciding it was bad ideas based on faulty logic. Their oldest also rebelled big time and recently came back in contact with the family - so I always wonder what was hurt feelings and anger and what was accurate.

 

They haven't spoken much on the details and I've only ever looked into it cursorily. It's not something I have seen them promote in their writing since I've been following, so I'm optimistic in believing that if there were issues in the past there haven't been since then.

 

I have no interest in defending them - if you want to email them directly and ask I wouldn't be surprised if Chris discussed it with you personally. I've found them to be a blessing to my family in their work and wisdom, and quite level headed. But they're not perfect and they're not gurus, either.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There has been some discussion on that as to whether it is accurate or not. They're the first to admit they d made mistakes and bought into things like the Pearls before deciding it was bad ideas based on faulty logic. Their oldest also rebelled big time and recently came back in contact with the family - so I always wonder what was hurt feelings and anger and what was accurate.

 

They haven't spoken much on the details and I've only ever looked into it cursorily. It's not something I have seen them promote in their writing since I've been following, so I'm optimistic in believing that if there were issues in the past there haven't been since then.

 

I have no interest in defending them - if you want to email them directly and ask I wouldn't be surprised if Chris discussed it with you personally. I've found them to be a blessing to my family in their work and wisdom, and quite level headed. But they're not perfect and they're not gurus, either.

 

Having looked more than cursorily, I observed that several other children are at odds with their parents and outspoken about the abuse in the home. It's not just the eldest daughter whom they called rebellious.

 

I hope the younger children will have a better life and receive a better education. I hope the parents will continue to study humility; none of us are perfect and it's amazing how we can (and should) change and grow over the years of raising our kids.

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

He's one of those "everything I do is God's way" everything the government does is "Hell's way" types.

 

He gave himself a dodge because this brick and mortar school is a "charter school," so part of the "anti-Hell's way movement" in his mind.

 

Wacka-A-Doodle.

 

Bill

 

Charter school. Public. Funded by public monies.

 

 

 They have had to learn to live Monument together in a way worthy of human beings: human beings who we a re told in the Bible are made “in the image of God,â€

http://www.monumentacademy.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Monument-Academy-Philosophy.pdf

 

That kind of stuff pisses me off.

 

:glare:

 

Yes. Very much a part of the problem.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Charter school. Public. Funded by public monies.

 

 

Their philosophy is full of right to the brink and a toe beyond religious language like:

 

We are committed to strengthening souls

 

Charter schools like this make me crazy. It's clear that they're religious and they're trying to walk some line but you can easily guess that in practice they fail and this is not separation of church and state - it's a school with a religious agenda getting public monies.

  • Like 7
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm not arguing this, just putting it out there.

 

Every school has a worldview they espouse, be in religious in flavor or secular. So long as they are abiding by the materials and admission guidelines of their state and the applicable federal statute, I see no issue. We have charter and immersion charter schools of multiple slants here, including the linguistic schools, Islamic schools, Protestant and Catholic charter hybrids, and your run of the mill Montessori and Waldorf based (and don't kid yourself that there isn't a strong worldview being espoused there!) charters.

 

I'm technically in a charter school - an umbrella school through a school district where I report to a contact teacher, outline ILPs for my students, report grades, progress, and materials, and receive reimbursement for certain expenses. I can use Sonlight, for example, but portions go unfunded because they violate the materials guidelines for reimbursement. But most of the curriculum is just fine. Same with Calvert, Kolbe, Bob Jones UP, etc etc. I can spend our time however I want provided I am clocking a certain volume of time in core subjects and approved materials. This is not unusual.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Their philosophy is full of right to the brink and a toe beyond religious language like:

 

Charter schools like this make me crazy. It's clear that they're religious and they're trying to walk some line but you can easily guess that in practice they fail and this is not separation of church and state - it's a school with a religious agenda getting public monies.

 

Makes one wonder how that war on xianity is going. 

 

:glare:

  • Like 5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm not arguing this, just putting it out there.

 

Every school has a worldview they espouse, be in religious in flavor or secular. So long as they are abiding by the materials and admission guidelines of their state and the applicable federal statute, I see no issue. We have charter and immersion charter schools of multiple slants here, including the linguistic schools, Islamic schools, Protestant and Catholic charter hybrids, and your run of the mill Montessori and Waldorf based (and don't kid yourself that there isn't a strong worldview being espoused there!) charters.

 

I'm technically in a charter school - an umbrella school through a school district where I report to a contact teacher, outline ILPs for my students, report grades, progress, and materials, and receive reimbursement for certain expenses. I can use Sonlight, for example, but portions go unfunded because they violate the materials guidelines for reimbursement. But most of the curriculum is just fine. Same with Calvert, Kolbe, Bob Jones UP, etc etc. I can spend our time however I want provided I am clocking a certain volume of time in core subjects and approved materials. This is not unusual.

 

Every school has a worldview... but that worldview is not allowed to be religious because otherwise it violates the separation between church and state. That violates not just federal or state statutes, but the whole Constitution. Your at home charter can fund materials that are secular. But then you can teach them however you want because you're not a paid educator by the state with other people's children. Not so for a b&m school. Those teachers are not allowed to impart a religious worldview.

 

What I mean by this charter school trying to walk a line is that their philosophy statement reads like they're trying to follow this law, but also like they're trying to cue people that it's a religious school. For example, they're a "back to basics" school. Totally fine. Also coded, but okay. They make it completely clear that they teach the Bible, but try to couch it among other choices for "literature." It's fine to teach the Bible as literature, but specific lit choices in the philosophy statement? Reads as coded. Ditto the choice of carefully chosen quotes from classics that include the word "soul" to indicate how important that is in education. It's trying to walk that line - this is a quote from a great ancient philosopher. But then you end up with them just outright saying they're educating kids' souls. NOT okay. The soul is a religious idea. Yes, one shared by many religions and ancient peoples, but still a religious idea. You can't do that. That, with all the coded language, makes it clear that their agenda is religious. Now, how that plays out in the classroom and the materials, I don't know, but I'd bet my hat that there are some more things that step over the line.

  • Like 12
Link to comment
Share on other sites

What do you consider religious? Is naturalism religious? Cultural Jewish centers? Explicit abrahamic religious instruction? General worldview alignment with mainstream materials utilized?

 

The line is not easily drawn, and the state isn't endorsing religion to allow variation in publically funded institutions, inside a particular set of guidelines. Admissions, materials used, level of exposure, and handling of students and their personal beliefs all dictate this.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm not arguing this, just putting it out there.

 

Every school has a worldview they espouse, be in religious in flavor or secular. So long as they are abiding by the materials and admission guidelines of their state and the applicable federal statute, I see no issue. We have charter and immersion charter schools of multiple slants here, including the linguistic schools, Islamic schools, Protestant and Catholic charter hybrids, and your run of the mill Montessori and Waldorf based (and don't kid yourself that there isn't a strong worldview being espoused there!) charters.

 

I'm technically in a charter school - an umbrella school through a school district where I report to a contact teacher, outline ILPs for my students, report grades, progress, and materials, and receive reimbursement for certain expenses. I can use Sonlight, for example, but portions go unfunded because they violate the materials guidelines for reimbursement. But most of the curriculum is just fine. Same with Calvert, Kolbe, Bob Jones UP, etc etc. I can spend our time however I want provided I am clocking a certain volume of time in core subjects and approved materials. This is not unusual.

 

Why Waldorf schools don't get considered as "religious" is a mystery to me.

 

I don't really get the distinction in education funding between "religious" and "non-religious" in the US.  It's just so arbitrary.  You can set up a Marxist or Waldorf school, but not a Buddhist one?  I'm glad that isn't what happens here.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

What do you consider religious? Is naturalism religious? Cultural Jewish centers? Explicit abrahamic religious instruction? General worldview alignment with mainstream materials utilized?

 

The line is not easily drawn, and the state isn't endorsing religion to allow variation in publically funded institutions, inside a particular set of guidelines. Admissions, materials used, level of exposure, and handling of students and their personal beliefs all dictate this.

 

I don't want to see charter schools which are publicly funded be any kind of religious.  I don't want church schools, Islamic schools or Yeshivas or schools of the flying spaghetti monster receiving public funds.  There have been a number of charters closed over being thinly veiled religious schools.  I actually consider a charter school that takes public money and quietly or not so quietly has religious affiliations to be committing a form of fraud.  

  • Like 17
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Isn't this the family in which 100% of the older kids have turned their back on their parents' lifestyle as they've left home, some of them telling tales of control and abuse?

 

Maybe the parents are waking up and realizing that they will lose all their children if they don't change.

 

It's actually 3 out of the 4 oldest children. One of them has restored her relationship with her parents in spite of having married a Muslim.

 

Daughter number 3, in particular, has written extensively about her claims of abuse during the past year and has come out as sapiosexual.

 

I'm very familiar with this family having been involved in homeschool speech and debate for the past 8 years.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Every school has a worldview... but that worldview is not allowed to be religious because otherwise it violates the separation between church and state. That violates not just federal or state statutes, but the whole Constitution. Your at home charter can fund materials that are secular. But then you can teach them however you want because you're not a paid educator by the state with other people's children. Not so for a b&m school. Those teachers are not allowed to impart a religious worldview.

 

What I mean by this charter school trying to walk a line is that their philosophy statement reads like they're trying to follow this law, but also like they're trying to cue people that it's a religious school. For example, they're a "back to basics" school. Totally fine. Also coded, but okay. They make it completely clear that they teach the Bible, but try to couch it among other choices for "literature." It's fine to teach the Bible as literature, but specific lit choices in the philosophy statement? Reads as coded. Ditto the choice of carefully chosen quotes from classics that include the word "soul" to indicate how important that is in education. It's trying to walk that line - this is a quote from a great ancient philosopher. But then you end up with them just outright saying they're educating kids' souls. NOT okay. The soul is a religious idea. Yes, one shared by many religions and ancient peoples, but still a religious idea. You can't do that. That, with all the coded language, makes it clear that their agenda is religious. Now, how that plays out in the classroom and the materials, I don't know, but I'd bet my hat that there are some more things that step over the line.

 

And then there are the not-even-coded gems like:

 "In the first instance it holds that before a person can think, he must have something to think about. That something is a fact: Adam named the animals first, not thought “critically†about them. "

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Daughter number 3, in particular, has written extensively about her claims of abuse during the past year and has come out as sapiosexual.

 

I hadn't heard the term sapiosexual before so I looked it up. I like this definition from Urban Dictionary:

 

A shibboleth used by poseurs attracted to the appearance of intelligence rather than actual intelligence. People genuinely attracted to intelligence know that the word “intelligence†is derived from the Latin “intelligereâ€; that the Latin participle for wisdom is “sapiens,†not “sapioâ€; and that the Latin “sapio†means something that tastes good.

I totally identify as a sapiosexual so I find that guy with the bowler hat and handlebar mustache banging out his screenplay at the coffee shop on his Royal typewriter while sipping his no-foam, decaf, soy latte and stroking his monkey totally hot. What? No, seriously. He’s got a for real monkey. He must be smart.
:laugh: 
  • Like 8
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...