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Spencerian Penmanship?


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My 7yo is interested in learning this style of cursive. Has anyone used it with a 21st century kiddo? If so, do you recommend purchasing the copybooks in addition to the theory book from archive dot org?

 

He is using older editions of HWT for printing and is slightly delayed--below grade level but not to the point of needing an OT. I am a bit unsure about whether I should teach him HWT style cursive first and then switch to Spencerian when he is a bit older or whether he would be better off just printing or typing his schoolwork and enjoying cursive as an artistic hobby.

 

He is very musical but does not have any other hobbies in the visual arts. My other children are older and of the era when cursive was a school subject that they struggled with in third grade and pretty much stopped using in high school.

 

I was firmly in the "low self esteem about my messy handwriting" camp until my late 30s, when I had a postcard pal who helped me to enjoy calligraphy in a light hearted manner. I had a lot of fun with italic, but would be self-teaching Spencerian a few steps ahead of ds.

 

I'd love to get some input from the Hive on this. Thanks bunches!

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I'm teaching my kiddo with motor planning issues Spencerian. If I'd known about them before we'd started, I'd have picked italics, but since we've started, we might as well carry on! 

 

I'd say that if he's interested, let him do it. I don't see any good reason to teach him to write three different times, so I'd skip on the HWT cursive. If you have a look in the blog link in my siggie, you'll find a couple of slightly modified Spencerian worksheets to let him have a play with.

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My 6 yo requested Spencerian for the summer. I purchased the copybook set but not the theory book. He is ahead in fine motor, but not dramatically. The sizing in the copy books was on the very edge of what he was capable of. The first week or so I enlarged the pages for him, but that was bothersome. We moved to doing each letter in the wet, dry, try method of hwot. That worked well, and then we moved to paper. The lowercase letters are very similar to other fonts, with the exception of p, q, and c. We did not get to uppercase letters. That is where Spencerian is really different. My plan is to practice just lowercase in schoolwork over the school year and learn capitals next summer. I'll just have him print capitals for now. In retrospect, I should have done NAC plus the Spencerian theory book. Then I could have used the child friendly NAC book but subbed in Spencerian for the c, p, and q.

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You'll want to have him use a fountain pen. Also, you could cut the books apart so he can lay each page flat on the writing surface (and yes, he should definitely sit at a desk or table, with good posture, rather than schlubbing around on the sofa or the floor, lol).

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We only do cursive at the moment, but plan to move to Spencerian when my daughter is 7-8.  Personal experience says get the copybooks, I thought they were helpful, and my daughter (even though she's not ready) looks at the copybooks with desire, lol.  

 

Agree with the fountain pen and the posture.  I would also research how to correctly grip a little more than the theory book states, so that you can be sure he starts off right, it will make a big difference. 

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Thank you so much! Please keep 'em coming.

 

I'm definitely planning on using a fountain pen. I have been taking notes on other handwriting threads all summer but would still love suggestions, experiences, and help narrowing it down. ;)

 

ds has been saying that he thinks this will make a good 8th birthday present and I think that's a realistic timeframe, since I want to get him quality supplies. We're going with the copybooks and also a paper copy of the theory book for me, since I like paper books and I'm not sure if the one from archive dot org is the original one that goes with the copybooks.

 

We have the technology to enlarge the copybooks and also the gear for wet-dry-try, which is NOT for sale this year, but I may pass along the wooden letters and throw in some micromachines to drive on them because that's where ds was this time last year.<------SERIOUS MOMMY BRAG!!!!! ds has EARNED this!!!!!!!

 

So one more thing I want to throw into the cart is QUALITY paper to print the scans out on. What do you think of this?

 

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001I8ZYAO?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=ox_sc_act_title_1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

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It is not good to switch back and forth.

 

Pick a hand that comes with a theory book and make sure you understand the underlying theory. Do not draw the letters; use the theory.

 

People notice the capitals first. That really is not what you should be looking at. Capitals can be tweaked.

 

Do you want vertical or slanted? Remember if you pick slanted, you should really teach the student to write their numerals slanted, too, and that affects math class.

 

Do you want short or long ascenders and descenders? The proportion of Spencerian is much different than HWOT.

 

Do you want the "d" and"t" to be the same height of the loop letters, like "l", or shorter?

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My father (born in 1935) thinks I should wait until third grade because ds won't be physically mature enough until then. What does the Hive think?

 

I've seen both the second half of second grade and the beginning of third grade.

 

This isn't a passing whim. He's seen beautiful penmanship from the late 1800s and early 1900s in family documents, old books, and on the internet and has said he wanted to learn how to write like that for at least half a year.

 

I've shown him Palmer and other simpler styles but he seems to have his heart set. I'm up for the challenge, but I need to start studying the theory book NOW and make time to practice on my own.

 

Hunter, you may be right about the attraction being just the flourishes on the capitals. These are good questions to ask ds as well as myself. He already objects to some of the HWT lower case printed letters and adds curls to the bottom of his t's and a's. He has always insisted on starting his 6's in the middle instead of the "starting corner" and it just didn't seem like a hill I wanted to die on.

 

I have a completely different attitude towards handwriting than I did the last time I had a second grader. I want cursive to be a joy and a relaxing artistic expression for my little digital native, not an unpleasant task to slog through.

 

His handwriting will be unique and special and a part of who he is for his whole life and I do think it is reasonable to let him have some say in the matter since he cares. My other kids didn't express any preference other than, "My hand hurts!" and "I'm terrible at this (D'Nealian)! I can't do it! It's boring!"

 

HWT did the job for my homeschooled millenials and I have fond memories of teaching it and cute samples of their handwriting for scrapbooks and memory boxes, but they didn't retain ANYTHING!

 

They have printed their signatures on checks and other documents since high school age.

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Thank you, Helen. He is transitioning from the kindergarten lines to the 1st grade lines in HWT printing, so I definitely made the right judgement call in ordering those early to allow lots of quality time with my scanner and photo editing program. :)

 

Michael Sull has also written a Spencerian curriculum for modern children:

 

http://www.spencerian.com/americancursivepromotion.html

 

http://www.seattletimes.com/life/lifestyle/art-of-penmanship-on-cusp-of-resurgence/

 

Has anybody used that? Do you think it is more appropriate for modern younger children than the original? Was it worth the extra money to you? Would it have been worth skipping a meal, an item of clothing, or a book to you if that was what the difference in cost represented in your own budget?

 

TIA

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I say let him try if he is interested.  He can always take a break and work on something a little simpler if he gets too frustrated.  We haven't attempted Spencerian at our house yet, but we do put a lot of emphasis on penmanship.  

 

We have enjoyed these pens: http://www.amazon.com/Pilot-Disposable-Fountain-Assorted-90029/dp/B00092PRCA (starting at about age 6)

 

Years ago I enjoyed reading around and watching videos on the Peterson Directed Handwriting website.  (I haven't been back over there in a long time, so i don't know what it's like now.)  A lot of their advice and suggestions stuck with me, like doing gross motor activities before putting pen to paper.  We've had a lot of success with writing in a salt box (shoe box lid) to memorize strokes and letter formation before actually trying it on paper.  All of that to say, I wouldn't neglect the many activities and exercises you can do leading up to writing with pen and paper.  Or, if the writing gets difficult/frustrating, have him take a break and try those other exercises for a while.

 

Also, I wanted to post a penmanship series we are enjoying pieces of.  You may already have your heart set on Spencerian, but (just in case) this might be a way you could work your way up to it more gradually if needed.  Or perhaps others reading this may be interested.  We have only used some of the cursive portions so far.  From the beginning the author encourages drawing borders around the finished page and she gives example that can be copied.  I thought my not-so-artsy son wouldn't get into this, but he really enjoyed it.  In book 5b (I think) she teaches versals, which are large ornate medieval letters sometimes used at the beginning of a chapter.  FYI the series is Catholic.  http://www.penmanship.ca/product-category/penmanship-books/ 

 

At least take a look at Book 10 (European Handwriting).  That one alone has been on my radar for a long time.  I had planned to throw it in our mix eventually even if we didn't use any others in the series.  (But it turns out we are using others as I was running out of things I liked.) http://www.penmanship.ca/shop/book-10-european-handwriting/

 

 

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Michael Sull has also written a Spencerian curriculum for modern children:

 

http://www.spencerian.com/americancursivepromotion.html

 

http://www.seattletimes.com/life/lifestyle/art-of-penmanship-on-cusp-of-resurgence/

 

Has anybody used that? Do you think it is more appropriate for modern younger children than the original? Was it worth the extra money to you? Would it have been worth skipping a meal, an item of clothing, or a book to you if that was what the difference in cost represented in your own budget?

 

TIA

 

No, but thank you for posting it! (Uh, I don't need a collector edition. How about a pov people edition?)

 

 

Your boy  might need to begin by writing letters in a tray of flour and all that kind of stuff over again with the Spencerian. But that's ok. He has plenty of time to practice.

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No, but thank you for posting it! (Uh, I don't need a collector edition. How about a pov people edition?)

 

 

oops. There's an 80 page $17.50 softcover instructional text, among other things, here:

 

http://www.spencerian.com/images/MichaelSullSpencerianCatalog2015.pdf

 

The $85 complete penmanship kit with handcrafted wooden oblique penholder isn't in my ds' future either, even if I wear nothing but old sheets, go on a catfood and garbage only diet, and read nothing but public domain books.

 

 

(((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((Rosie))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

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Don't feel too sorry for me. I'm broke at the moment because I've spent all our money on tickets to the ballet and I cracked the sump of the car while doing our nature studies. Really? Who asked that rock to be there? It had a whole mountain to roll about on. Personal space, Rock, personal space!

 

I do wish these blighters sold ebooks though. Anything with student pages should be sold as ebooks!

 

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Trying to search with just my phone is frustrating. I couldn't figure out what was necessary for Peterson or the prices.

 

The Michael Sull curriculum looked easier to buy, never mind less expensive.

 

I think I'm sticking with Spalding, but I've been yet again looking at slanted, stroke based hands.

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