Salt question

[creekland]

I know I could try google, but I love tapping into the Hive mind - and technically I'm wrestling with Butternut Squash at the moment, though obviously, not for this two minute break... I'm hopeful when I come back I'll just be able to read answers.   :coolgleamA:

 

How much salt people need differs considerably.  I need tons (or so it seems) and my blood levels will get up to normal, sometimes barely.  If I don't add oodles of salt to my food (or eat salted foods like from restaurants) on almost a daily basis I'll get horrid headaches and salt cravings.  My mom is similar, so it's probably inherited.

 

Hubby gets probably 1/6th or less of what I get and is fine hardly ever adding salt even to our homecooked foods that have none, yet his blood numbers test higher than mine (still in the normal range).

 

Why the difference?  What in the world is my body doing with all the extra?  Creating it's own little salt mine somewhere?  It's certainly not in the blood nor is it raising BP.  Hubby's BP is higher than mine.

[TranquilMind]

I am just like you.  I need salt!  My husband thinks anything and everything I make is far too salty, even when I go light on the salt.

 

My BP is low.  I must need it. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

I recently read about a condition where the milder forms are often compensated for by high salt intake (and doing so does not cause BP problems for them).  I cannot for the life of me remember what it is called.

One of my kids is like this.  He craves salt like crazy.  I find everything too salty on the other hand.

 

 

[momacacia]

Low blood pressure can be a symptom of Adrenal Fatigue. One of the (many--irritating! ;)) things the adrenals do is regulate sodium/potassium in the body and (I think I have this correct?) thereby in part regular blood pressure. So, low adrenals often results in low bp. It can be helpful, if you're a slow starter in the mornings (ie, have low morning cortisol) to have some good quality sea salt in your water first thing in the morning. This helps keep bp more stable in the mornings, hence giving you a feeling of more energy and not like you're going to black out until 11am.

 

This is how I am often. The mornings salt drink (about 1/8 tsp in 16oz) can really help my morning go better and doing this consistently helps on a more consistent basis. But, I *know* I have AF, have done cortisol testing, etc., so it's not like it's related to much else for me. I really try to stick with good quality sea or Himalayan salts (though I love me some restaurant food as much as the next girl). But no, if you're like me you're not making a salt mine, you're body is dumping it. The salt will help the adrenals, but it is more compensating for the dumping and letting the adrenals rest for having to make/release cortisol to deal with the low bp.

 

**I'm sure I don't have all my science right when it comes to the above, but it's my general lay understanding---and gets me where I need to be to feel better. Take it with a (dare I say it) grain of salt! :)

[MeAndTheBoys]

Curious.  I crave salt and my BP is low.  DH never salts anything (and we don't eat a ton of processed food) and his is high.  We are both thin.

 

B

[Spryte]

I used to crave salt. I am now on a high salt diet per doc's instructions. I have POTS, and adrenal insufficiency. Salt plus extra fluids increases blood volume, which helps with POTS symptoms. Some people with Addison's (like I have) are also "salt wasters" and require more to compensate.

[Greta]

Great question, and I would really love to learn more about this! I'm on a ketogenic diet, and I know that increases your need for salt (because your kidneys do not retain nearly as much salt if you drop your carb intake below 60g per day). Even so, I seem to need more salt than the other ketogenic dieters that I know. I had until recently been getting 4000-4500mg of sodium per day (significantly more than the USRDA limit of 2300!) and even so I was still suffering from symptoms of hyponatremia. I've very recently increased it to 5000, and so far I am feeling better.

 

And my blood pressure and my blood sodium levels are both at the low end of normal. I will check them again in a few months since I've increased my salt intake even more. But I'm not worried. Since I'm at the low end of normal, I've got some wiggle room. And getting my blood pressure up a little bit might be beneficial - I get lightheaded a lot.

[creekland]

Hmm, I sense google in my future at this point anyway since some of you are losing me with your answers... adrenal fatigue, POTS, etc.

 

I don't think my BP is low, but honestly, I don't even know what low numbers would be, so who knows?

 

I'm definitely not a slow starter in the morning (my mom is though).  I slow down in the evening.

 

I can handle foods (taste-wise) without salt.  I add salt to my food to avoid the awful headaches that come from not getting enough of it.  With those come salt cravings and at that point I could eat salt without it being on anything (not spoonfuls).  Salt water is ok too.

[creekland]

I recently read about a condition where the milder forms are often compensated for by high salt intake (and doing so does not cause BP problems for them).  I cannot for the life of me remember what it is called.

One of my kids is like this.  He craves salt like crazy.  I find everything too salty on the other hand.

 

Ok, any chance your brain neurons got dusted off yet?  I need more options.  ;)

 

Low blood pressure can be a symptom of Adrenal Fatigue. One of the (many--irritating! ;)) things the adrenals do is regulate sodium/potassium in the body and (I think I have this correct?) thereby in part regular blood pressure. So, low adrenals often results in low bp. It can be helpful, if you're a slow starter in the mornings (ie, have low morning cortisol) to have some good quality sea salt in your water first thing in the morning. This helps keep bp more stable in the mornings, hence giving you a feeling of more energy and not like you're going to black out until 11am.

 

This is how I am often. 

 

:grouphug:  I read about this this morning and it certainly sounds awful to deal with.  I hope things get better!  It doesn't sound like "me" though, esp the whole fatigue bit, so there has to be another reason out there somewhere.  Thanks for mentioning the possibility though.  I've found I like to expand my knowledge of a variety of health things that might be affecting my peers.  It helps me understand more overall - and be more compassionate.

 

I used to crave salt. I am now on a high salt diet per doc's instructions. I have POTS, and adrenal insufficiency. Salt plus extra fluids increases blood volume, which helps with POTS symptoms. Some people with Addison's (like I have) are also "salt wasters" and require more to compensate.

 

More  :grouphug: .  POTS and Addisons also seem frustrating to live with.  I had never heard of either, so again, I appreciate the chance to learn about them.   I hope things improve for you!

 

So... still stumped and wondering what the cause is for others of us!

[SparklyUnicorn]

I vaguely recall seeing it in a book I was reading.  I'll go and look at it later on today to see if I can figure it out.

 

 

[creekland]

My MIL is similar. Her sodium and potassium were finally tested and found to be much too low, unfortunately due to cancer.

My own mother craves salt. Her entire family salted everything, even certain fruits. Thankfully I didn't acquire ( or inherit) that.

 

I can't add a like to your post due to your MIL.   :grouphug:

 

Hubby's family salts fruits.  I can't do that. :ack2:   He has to try to intercept mine to see that they don't get salted.

 

I don't like salt with sweet.  I don't even like salted chocolate.  I can't do salt on garden salads either.   I either need salt with a typical salted food or by itself.

[kiana]

I love salt. My bp's low (typically 105/65). Now I'm getting all paranoid. 

[creekland]

I love salt. My bp's low (typically 105/65). Now I'm getting all paranoid. 

 

I'm not really paranoid about it, but we could be in the same boat.  That's similar to my bp at home (or donating blood) too.  It goes higher at dr appts  :glare: , but I don't think it does in general.

 

What I find interesting is that my Na level is borderline low and likely would be low if I didn't put effort into keeping it high enough.  My Cl level is perfectly fine.  If salt is NaCl... but I guess that's the chemical reaction of digestion - pulling those elements apart.  Why Cl isn't high is also interesting to ponder.

 

Nothing else (tested) has been remotely out of line - just Na coming in borderline low.  That was last Sept and March anyway.  In a couple of weeks I'll find out what it's all like now with having changed my diet, etc.  I like that our community has inexpensive 'open to the public' testing.  For those of us who are more prone to DIY, it's very valuable (and cheap - something like $62 for all of the basics + Thyroid and H1aC or whatever that one is, $35 for those who just want the basics).  When I went through a Dr office, just the thyroid test alone (same test) was $80.  Here it's $12.

[creekland]

I used to crave salt. I am now on a high salt diet per doc's instructions. I have POTS, and adrenal insufficiency. Salt plus extra fluids increases blood volume, which helps with POTS symptoms. Some people with Addison's (like I have) are also "salt wasters" and require more to compensate.

 

Spryte (or anyone with experience), can you tell me a tad bit more about Addison's.  I could start another thread on it I suppose, but it seemed ok to add to this one since it's not that old.

 

There are definitely times (not constant) when my bp gets lower (90s over lower 50s or upper 40s) and Addisons is one that came up as a possibility to consider, esp with the salt craving (not high on K though), lack of appetite, etc, but I only tend to feel tired if my pulse is also low (50s or low 60s) and I never get gastro issues (nausea, etc).  Are your symptoms totally classic or is it hit/miss with some of them?

 

I've got to get going to school and need to end my research now... so I'll admit I'm cheating and seeing if I can glean some from the Hive.   ;)  If not, that's ok...  I'll look more into it at my next free point.

[Spryte]

Spryte (or anyone with experience), can you tell me a tad bit more about Addison's.  I could start another thread on it I suppose, but it seemed ok to add to this one since it's not that old.

 

There are definitely times (not constant) when my bp gets lower (90s over lower 50s or upper 40s) and Addisons is one that came up as a possibility to consider, esp with the salt craving (not high on K though), lack of appetite, etc, but I only tend to feel tired if my pulse is also low (50s or low 60s) and I never get gastro issues (nausea, etc).  Are your symptoms totally classic or is it hit/miss with some of them?

 

I've got to get going to school and need to end my research now... so I'll admit I'm cheating and seeing if I can glean some from the Hive.   ;)  If not, that's ok...  I'll look more into it at my next free point.

 

My symptoms aren't classic, but I have a ton of stuff going on that all sort of interacts and creates its own soup of symptoms. So my experience won't be typical.  My bp doesn't tend to go that low, unless I'm in major distress of some kind.  I do have intermittent nausea, and gastro issues.  Salt cravings, yes.  My skin doesn't darken in the folds or scar tissue, at least not terribly so.  I am fatigued often, and do not recover from illnesses well (case in point, I have been dealing with food poisoning all week and need to stress dose, but still not recovering as quickly as I think I should).  All of my symptoms are exacerbated by heat and humidity.  

 

We were clued in to this through a saliva test, then moved on to the typical 24 hour urine collection and blood work.  Most people get diagnosed through an endocrinologist.  

 

If you suspect Addison's, please do get checked.  It can be life threatening, if you go into a crisis.  Symptoms for that would be nausea, leg pain, severe fatigue... and more.  It can also be dangerous if you're in a car accident and go into shock - coming out can require an injection.  A medic alert bracelet is a good idea.  

 

And just for trivia ... did you know Kennedy had it?  And had a doc who traveled with him, to manage it?  :) 

[Guest]

Low blood pressure can be a symptom of Adrenal Fatigue. One of the (many--irritating! ;)) things the adrenals do is regulate sodium/potassium in the body and (I think I have this correct?) thereby in part regular blood pressure. So, low adrenals often results in low bp. It can be helpful, if you're a slow starter in the mornings (ie, have low morning cortisol) to have some good quality sea salt in your water first thing in the morning. This helps keep bp more stable in the mornings, hence giving you a feeling of more energy and not like you're going to black out until 11am.

 

This is how I am often. The mornings salt drink (about 1/8 tsp in 16oz) can really help my morning go better and doing this consistently helps on a more consistent basis. But, I *know* I have AF, have done cortisol testing, etc., so it's not like it's related to much else for me. I really try to stick with good quality sea or Himalayan salts (though I love me some restaurant food as much as the next girl). But no, if you're like me you're not making a salt mine, you're body is dumping it. The salt will help the adrenals, but it is more compensating for the dumping and letting the adrenals rest for having to make/release cortisol to deal with the low bp.

 

**I'm sure I don't have all my science right when it comes to the above, but it's my general lay understanding---and gets me where I need to be to feel better. Take it with a (dare I say it) grain of salt! :)

Yup to both the salt and blood pressure. Low carbing and my crapped out adrenals are the reasons. I get so depleted that salt doesn't even taste salty when it hits my tongue :o

[creekland]

If you suspect Addison's, please do get checked.  

 

Thanks for your response.  I don't know that I suspect it just yet.  I'm at the stage of starting with what I know and filtering through oodles of possibilities to consider - using the salt part from this thread and all the rest from this one:  (you don't have to read it, of course, just saves me typing)

 

http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/571892-ok-all-knowing-hive-give-me-ideas/

 

The (really) low BP (at times) is something of a surprise to me.  I was actually checking it to see if it went too high too often...  It rarely gets high.  It stays in the 100/60 - 125/80 range in general, but there are times when it gets low (some mornings, too much exercise, might be factors - still checking on it to see if there are patterns).  

 

This gives me a new "x" to consider though.  It happens enough to get my attention.

 

Researching from that I stumbled across Addison's - then doing a search on the Hive to see if anyone had more info brought up this salt thread I'd made back in Aug.  Then I ran out of time...

 

Overall, I'm looking for anything that seems like it could be possible, then I'll test what I can to see what happens (while watching over the next month or two) to see if there are common denominators to more easily figure it out.  There are quite a few factors in the mix, but no particular "cause" that seems to put them all together.   :glare:

[Guest]

Just be aware that many Americans have a degree of adrenal fatigue. Out and out Addisons is a different matter and much more rare. Don't freak yourself out with Google, but do find a good integrative medicine doctor who will actually investigate your symptoms and listen to you :)

[creekland]

Yup to both the salt and blood pressure. Low carbing and my crapped out adrenals are the reasons. I get so depleted that salt doesn't even taste salty when it hits my tongue :o

 

Adrenal fatigue or similar is also something I'm considering - esp due to all the radiation the head took on a year ago.  I'm mainly missing the "fatigue" part though.  That's missing from Addison's too - plus - it doesn't take me long to recover from colds, etc.  I actually rarely get colds - very rarely.

 

Too many puzzles, but I've got time to keep puzzling over them.

 

I have upped the salt though - significantly at this point (fast food anyone?).  It seems to help overall.

[Guest]

Deleted details ;)

 

Adrenal fatigue sucks.

[creekland]

My own presentation 

 

Thanks for sharing and I didn't quote in case you want to delete.

 

That doesn't sound like my situation at all, so I suppose I need to put this one on the highly unlikely list - which is where most things end up either from the beginning or upon a closer look at them.

 

It is rather frustrating to be honest, but it's a plus in its own way since I don't want to be dealing with them either.  

 

:grouphug:  to you.

 

Meanwhile there has to be something causing my stuff.  I'll continue to plod along to work on finding out what it is or at least what common denominators I can change to fix it enough to not get frustrated with it.

 

This morning I noticed a "nice"  :glare: bit of swelling under my armpit - likely drainage from the same thing causing the ear issue (other thread) I'm guessing.  It only hurts if I put pressure on it directly, so not a biggie in the overall scheme of life, but annoying to notice something else I wouldn't have dreamed up if I were writing a book.

[creekland]

Just be aware that many Americans have a degree of adrenal fatigue. Out and out Addisons is a different matter and much more rare. Don't freak yourself out with Google, but do find a good integrative medicine doctor who will actually investigate your symptoms and listen to you :)

 

Oh, and I'm not freaking out with Google.  It takes a lot for me to freak out to be honest.  I'm using it as a tool 'cause as far as the doctors are concerned, it's stress.  I just disagree with them.  It doesn't match stress (or my expectations) either, nor is anything else stressful in my life.

 

I want to be really certain with any of my thoughts/conclusions/what's happening prior to even mentioning anything to a doctor.  Then too, it'll only get mentioned if I can't figure out how to live with it myself.

 

In an ideal world their (better) knowledge would be able to figure it out, but alas, I live in the real world and this one isn't easy - giving me some consolation considering I couldn't figure it out to begin with - but adding a bit of frustration that I went through various doctor appts for nothing (well, eliminating some things isn't totally nothing, but it hasn't helped).

[Spryte]

Creekland, are you checking your pulse rate? Mine tends high. That's POTS related. Check out potsplace.org or net or com.

[Guest]

I'm glad you're not susceptible to Dr Google - I'm a big researcher as well, and so long as you don't actually assign yourself the worst case scenario you're good ;)

 

The lymph thing isn't unusual if you're fighting an infection. It's more odd without one. Definitely hunt down a good doctor - I went through three or four practitioners before I found one who was willing to research and test everything until we had answers, and then referred me to another specialist when she hit a dead end. Love her, and she is actually a nurse midwife! So it doesn't have to be an MD, necessarily.

 

You're on my prayer list already, but keep us posted as to how you're doing. :grouphug:

[Guest]

Curious.  I crave salt and my BP is low.  DH never salts anything (and we don't eat a ton of processed food) and his is high.  We are both thin.

 

B

 

Same here.  

 

My MIL, you can't even have salt in the kitchen when you are cooking--it's too much for her.  She also has a blood disorder, so there might be something to that reaction, not just "I'm healthier than you are."  (She's a great wonderful MIL--it's just that after all the NO SALT IT'S GOING TO KILL YOU "health" info of the past few years, I am a little sensitive.)  :0)

 

[creekland]

Creekland, are you checking your pulse rate? Mine tends high. That's POTS related. Check out potsplace.org or net or com.

 

Mine used to always be fairly average (I think) in the mid 70s to low 80s.  Now the majority of the time I test it it's in the lower 60s but can run down to the lower 50s or up to the upper 80s at various times.  I haven't figured that difference out yet either, but I can tell when it's low due to getting cold and hand numbness getting worse (plus if it's quiet I can hear it). I can't tell when it's high unless I hear it (or check it).  It's the same way with the BP.  I can tell when it's pretty low (now that I've tested it a few times).  I can't tell when it's high without testing it as that "feels" the same as normal.  Either normal or high (with both) are nice as I tend to feel good then.  ;)  The pulse rate and bp are not connected as far as I can tell.

 

I've only started looking at these things (pulse and bp) more closely a couple of weeks ago, and since I'm working full time until the end of the month, my "experimenting" and researching time is rather limited.  I'm supposed to be grading quizzes on photosynthesis now actually...

 

I'm glad you're not susceptible to Dr Google - I'm a big researcher as well, and so long as you don't actually assign yourself the worst case scenario you're good ;)

 

The lymph thing isn't unusual if you're fighting an infection. It's more odd without one. Definitely hunt down a good doctor - I went through three or four practitioners before I found one who was willing to research and test everything until we had answers, and then referred me to another specialist when she hit a dead end. Love her, and she is actually a nurse midwife! So it doesn't have to be an MD, necessarily.

 

No time to hunt for doctors either at this point.  The soonest I could think about doing that is Dec, then the boys are home for the holidays, etc.  I am sort of hoping to figure out some common aspects of all of this during my busy time though.  In Jan I should be able to get more blood tests (Na and others) via testing done at our school to see if there are any odd trends, etc.

 

If there's any infection, it's one without any other symptoms (fever, fatigue, etc).  I have no idea if that's possible.  The way my body is quirky with symptoms, I suppose it could be even if that's not normal.

 

Prayers are definitely appreciated.  I'd love it if the body started doing its job and fixed itself.