Can you tell me how/when you use the AoPS videos?

[Grantmom]

Hello all,

I have read a description on here of how people use the videos in AoPS but I can't find anything now with my search.  Can anyone tell me how/when do you use the videos on the website?  

 

For example, the chapter starts out with problems, introducing you to new material you haven't seen before.  Then it goes over the solutions to those problems and discusses that material.  Then it gives you exercises on what you just learned.

 

Where in that progression would you watch the video?  I see that not every section has a corresponding video.  I'm just curious at what point you watch it.

 

Thanks!

[SilverMoon]

DS/6th is using prealg. Right now we go through whole the lesson together, watch the videos, and then do the final exercises. The videos "give away" some of the discovery, so we save them for after we've worked out the new concept.

[Grantmom]

Thanks!

[Penelope]

Some people have said they don't watch them at all.

 

We watched a lot of them for pre-algebra, after the problems (the discovery part) and before the exercises, or sometimes after the exercises or even later, for review. There were also times when they were more for entertainment value than for any need for explanations beyond the book.

 

For algebra, we did not watch as many. Much fewer than half.

[Roadrunner]

We don't watch them.

[karenmsta]

Would any of you say the videos and alcumus are so great that you'd use them to supplement even if you didn't use the AOPS textbook?

 

 

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[karenmsta]

Would any of you say the videos and alcumus are so great that you'd use them to supplement even if you didn't use the AOPS textbook?

 

 

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[EndOfOrdinary]

Would any of you say the videos and alcumus are so great that you'd use them to supplement even if you didn't use the AOPS textbook?

 

 

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The videos illustrate what the book discusses. It would essentially be like using the workbook for a foriegn language class, but not attending the class. There is no harm, and you would gain a bit, but it would not necessarily be presented in a way that your learning materials talked about a concept. It would not contain the depth. It would be just a tiny bit. They are definitely not bad, and I am bummed that after three quarters of Algebra they stop, but we would not use them without the curriculum.

 

ETA: many people do use Alcumus without the book. My kid is completely not interested in Alcumus or Khan style learning, so I don't push it.

[EndOfOrdinary]

We use the videos after practice problems and before exercises as many people have commented. I also have Ds watch them if I can tell that the practice problems are still fuzzy. The lights are on, but they are not at full power. He gets to sit with the information for a couple days, but if it is still not really going strong then comes the video. Often times watching the video kicks all the pieces into place. He is a very visual learner, so something about the video really does it.

 

He will start the video, then pause it to do the problem himself, then watch the rest where it is solved. Sometimes he solves it the same way, sometimes not. That is part of the fun for him. It also gives me a very quick check in to see if he gets a section really strongly. Sometimes he can just zip right through the practice problems and the next day not be able to do the video problems. Then he has to regroup. Other times he just flies through the video problems too and I know he is really solid. Most of the time it is somewhere on the spectrum in between the two.

 

Often times when there is not a video for a section, it is because that section is one where multiple bits are linked together. You are basically building off of the other videos or combining a couple into a larger concept.

[Loesje22000]

Gray part, video, white part,

Gray part, video, white part,

Etc.

Until the review section.

We don't do the challenging problems, unless dd wonders how to solve one.

[Chrysalis Academy]

Would any of you say the videos and alcumus are so great that you'd use them to supplement even if you didn't use the AOPS textbook?

 

 

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Yes, that's exactly our situation.  Dd is using Jacobs for Algebra, but she does use Alcumus for challenge problems. When she gets stuck on a problem, the first place I send her is to the videos.  

[texasmama]

And we are the different ones.  :D  We have always watched the videos first, before attempting the gray box exercises and the practice problems.  We also use the gray box stuff as a teaching tool rather than a discovery tool.  This method has worked well for ds12.   If ds12 gets stuck on something in the chapter, he rewatches the videos.

[Grantmom]

Thanks all! Rose, what made you decide against using AoPS for algebra?

[Chrysalis Academy]

Just realizing that it probably wasn't a great fit for my dd's leaning style.  The hard-core discovery method was just frustrating for her in a first pass through Algebra.  She really likes the style of the Arbor School books (Jousting Armadillos and its follow-ups) and Jacobs, in which you are led to discovering the deeper concept and its applications through the problems.  But the leading is very gentle and logical, there are no leaps.  This just seems to work much better for her. She's the kind of learner who does better with understanding the big picture and then drilling down to the details, rather than building from the bottom up.  

 

Equally importantly, AoPS wasn't a great match for my style, so I wouldn't have been able to help her much - talk about blind leading the blind! So it was the needs of the learner, and the teacher, that made the decision.  Eventually!

 

We both really like Jacobs, my only concern is that it's a little too easy - she doesn't struggle with it at all.  And I think there's a value in grappling to understand something more deeply.  So that's why we still do Alcumus - the challenging problems really make her grapple, and help her see connections, and uncover holes in her understanding - but this works best for her after she's been introduced to the concept.

[Arcadia]

My boys watch some of the videos more than a year before they started on the prealgebra book. They watch only what interest them but after a while found the rest boring. So basically we didn't use the videos.

 

Would any of you say the videos and alcumus are so great that you'd use them to supplement even if you didn't use the AOPS textbook?

 

I would use Alcumus since it is free to use and nice practice. I won't use the videos unless your child is a strong audio visual learner rather than a read the book learner.

[VANURSEPRAC]

Hello all,  I bout AOPS preA around Christmas with the intention that this would be the text for my public school 6th grader to study after school and prepare for the credit by exam to accelerate one year in math. She balked at it right off the bat. So we used the 7th and 8th grade Prentice Hall Texas middle school text. She worked the text independently and passed the credit by exam without any problem.

Now DD is starting Foerster Alg I (she is on 2.6) . I was wanting to go back to the AOPS preA text and give it another try for critical thinking skills and learning to persevere with

difficult problem/concepts.

 

I have never dipped into another program. Do I do one day a week from AOPS? Where do I start? We have never watched the videos either or did Alcumus. 

 

We are doing this now while middle school has a teeny tiny if that much homework. I realize we probably won't be able to keep this up in high school.

 

 

[Roadrunner]

I think if you already completed preAlgebra successfully, you don't need to do the AoPS preA book. That's just too much. I would move on with Algebra and if you really want AoPS, just add their problem solving books instead. Start with volume 1. 

 

 

 

 

[Targhee]

DD began with the problems (those at the beginning of a section), and read through solutions. That was usually one day of work. Then she watched videos, then she did the exercises (at the end of a section). This was also usually one day of work. She might take 2 days to get through the review and challenge problems. The videos are basically the same thing as in the book, but she loves watching Rick present them. She is currently in their online Alg 1 class, and spends a lot more time on alcumus than she did in pre-A. I think she only watches the videos for fun, because she usually does this last thing before class starts for the next week.

[Grantmom]

 

 

Equally importantly, AoPS wasn't a great match for my style, so I wouldn't have been able to help her much - talk about blind leading the blind! So it was the needs of the learner, and the teacher, that made the decision.  Eventually!

 

 

 

 

Thank you for sharing your experience!  I am a little worried about that for myself too.  I am very good at math, and feel like my higher level math classes finally gave me good understanding of math and the concepts, not just the ability to apply a formula.  So, I am pretty confident.  However, reading the pre-algebra book, right in the beginning, they were explaining why a negative times a negative is a positive.  And it was really just going over my head.  I mean, I understand why, but the way they were explaining it just sounded overly complicated and left me feeling baffled.

[Arcadia]

However, reading the pre-algebra book, right in the beginning, they were explaining why a negative times a negative is a positive. And it was really just going over my head. I mean, I understand why, but the way they were explaining it just sounded overly complicated and left me feeling baffled.

The prealgebra book is the "wordy" one. Take a look at the Intro to algebra book by borrowing from the library if possible. It is possible to skip the prealgebra book and go slower on the Intro to algebra book.

[Roadrunner]

However, reading the pre-algebra book, right in the beginning, they were explaining why a negative times a negative is a positive. And it was really just going over my head. I mean, I understand why, but the way they were explaining it just sounded overly complicated and left me feeling baffled.

Here is the best part of the program. You don't have to understand it. :) As long as your child gets it, it's all good. The textbook is written to the student. I find it very liberating that all I have to do is hand him over the book.

I think (and I am sure many will disagree), if a child needs constant help with aops, it might not be the right fit.

[Grantmom]

That's good to know, because if he understands it and I don't have to, then that would be great. I was just thinking I might not know if he's really getting it or not if we don't do it together.

[texasmama]

That's good to know, because if he understands it and I don't have to, then that would be great. I was just thinking I might not know if he's really getting it or not if we don't do it together.

My ds12 is using AoPS A and is completely independent.  I use the end of chapter reviews to test his mastery of the material.  He does the problems, and I check them.  I keep copious notes on how he does with each problem so I can evaluate whether or not he has "passed" that chapter and needs to move on or needs review.  He chose to review one chapter on his own, as he knew he needed more time on it.  He has done well with the rest of the chapters.  Maybe some really mathy moms would not need this and could intuit whether or not their kids understood the material, but this non-mathy mom does.  It is a concrete, simple way to evaluate mastery.

[Roadrunner]

That's good to know, because if he understands it and I don't have to, then that would be great. I was just thinking I might not know if he's really getting it or not if we don't do it together.

There is no way he can solve problems without understanding. As long as his answers match the solutions manual, all is well. :)

[madteaparty]

Would any of you say the videos and alcumus are so great that you'd use them to supplement even if you didn't use the AOPS textbook?

 

 

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We did this for the first part of prealgebra, but the topics were somewhat covered in another textbook. I don't like the prealgebra book myself and cannot wait to move to Forrester for Algebra 1. We are in the preA class now so we have to slog through. Take what I say fwiw: We are outliers in that my DS absolutely does not master a topic even if he does every single thing aops has out there, alcumus, text and what have you. We've had to improvise a mini spiral program for that reason and it has been frustrating as I drank the aops koolaid like I tend to do. Come to think of it, most kids in ds's class are in school and are using aops in addition to whatever math curriculum, so not sure why I made this mistake. I also disagree with the "if you have to help it's not for you...". I started a thread on parental involvement here and answers varied widely. That said, parental involvement gets smaller by the day here. Good thing, since neither DH (math guy) or I(not a math guy) are devoted fans.

[Roadrunner]

That said, parental involvement gets smaller by the day here..

This. I think this is the key. Any new program in the beginning with young kids will require help, but involvement needs to decline in time. There are some really challenging problems in every chapter that will require a parent to read the solutions manual and help via Socratic reasoning, but I think in time the help should be required for starred problems and an occasional problem. That's different than working on most problems together.

 

If I end up having to be involved with more than 10% of the problems in Algebra, I am switching back to SM.

[Grantmom]

People have said though that they should not be getting everything right on the first pass.  That some of the problems are incredibly difficult on purpose, and that if they are getting everything right, then they are not working at the correct level.  Am I wrong in that way of thinking?  That's why I feel like I need to remain involved, so we can talk about it, and even if he does get something wrong, we can go back over it together, see where the mistake was, and do it again.

 

It is an interesting point that a lot of the kids doing AoPS are also doing a concurrent math curriculum in their school.  However, I think that the majority of them are doing AoPS so that they can work beyond what they are doing in school.  So, they probably aren't covering the same material in their school class that they are in the AoPS class.  It's still a good point though, that because they are in school, it is not the first pass through for them on some of the material.

 

That's interesting to consider, though.

[Grantmom]

If we were taking the online class, then there is someone working through it with them, but we aren't.

[Roadrunner]

I would love people with experience to answer those questions. I only have experience with preA, which isn't really much.

I don't know who is in our class, but there are many young kids (we have a second grader there and ton of fourth and fifth graders), so I am not sure they really covered the material before. I am sure there are others who have.

I would say that 50% (on average) of problems in preA are easy. The rest range from mildly hard to very hard. We have plenty of problems we get wrong on the first try, but right on the second one. I don't usually need to interfere but only with the star problems.

I never can make up my mind of I need to supplement.

[Roadrunner]

If we were taking the online class, then there is someone working through it with them, but we aren't.

This is another good point. We did the first half of the book without the class, but signed up for the second half. The teacher kind of expects you to know the material before the class, since you are suppose to do reading beforehand. So my kid loves the class because of the interaction, but I am not sure it is really adding much of the "explaining" part as in regular classroom where you don't study beforehand. Class experience is great though.

[Targhee]

People have said though that they should not be getting everything right on the first pass. That some of the problems are incredibly difficult on purpose, and that if they are getting everything right, then they are not working at the correct level. Am I wrong in that way of thinking? That's why I feel like I need to remain involved, so we can talk about it, and even if he does get something wrong, we can go back over it together, see where the mistake was, and do it again.

 

It is an interesting point that a lot of the kids doing AoPS are also doing a concurrent math curriculum in their school. However, I think that the majority of them are doing AoPS so that they can work beyond what they are doing in school. So, they probably aren't covering the same material in their school class that they are in the AoPS class. It's still a good point though, that because they are in school, it is not the first pass through for them on some of the material.

 

That's interesting to consider, though.

I think the idea is that if you aren't making mistakes/having difficulty then you have no opportunity to learn something new. I don't think that this book is intended to be a single pass through the material. I think it is meant to be multiple passes - first when you are doing the problems at the beginning, followed immediately by solutions and explanations. This is the main teaching component. (You might intuit the processes, but if you do completely then you don't need to be taught them and should move on to something more advanced. If you still do not understand after reading the solutions and explanations then you probably aren't prepared enough for th ematerial and should step back for a while) Then you might get it again with the video, and then again with the exercises, and once more with the review. Several passess.

 

I also think for many kids who are doing it in public school the first pass at school may have not made conceptual sense. They may know the procedure from school, but necessarily the WHY.

[VANURSEPRAC]

Well after DD finished the 2nd chptr of Foerster Alg 1 today I thought she could try again AOPS preA, nope it did not work, so I will give up now. I will try to  order the intro to A book from interlibrary loan and see if that works any better for her. So far, (and she is still in the hand holding phase of Foerster), she has loved it. She really likes how straight forward it is and how well it explains things. On to chapter 3 tomorrow.

[karenmsta]

 

I think (and I am sure many will disagree), if a child needs constant help with aops, it might not be the right fit.

Even moral support, cheerleading?

 

 

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[karenmsta]

 

I think (and I am sure many will disagree), if a child needs constant help with aops, it might not be the right fit.

Even moral support, cheerleading?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[karenmsta]

My ds is Coming from acing TT Pre Alg and will start aops alg when it comes in the mail, so what would be a good bridge between the two? Doing the pre alg alcumus? Khan academy? I guess this is a bit of a tangent from the OPs question.

 

 

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[karenmsta]

My ds is Coming from acing TT Pre Alg and will start aops alg when it comes in the mail, so what would be a good bridge between the two? Doing the pre alg alcumus? Khan academy? I guess this is a bit of a tangent from the OPs question.

 

 

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[Targhee]

My ds is Coming from acing TT Pre Alg and will start aops alg when it comes in the mail, so what would be a good bridge between the two? Doing the pre alg alcumus? Khan academy? I guess this is a bit of a tangent from the OPs question.

 

 

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Alcumus would be a good look at how AoPS structures its problems, and it may help him become accustomed to not acing everything. I think if you reiterate this idae, that you will miss problems because that is where you will have a chance to improve and learn, it will also help the transition.

[karenmsta]

Thanks, Targhee

 

 

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[karenmsta]

Thanks, Targhee

 

 

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[Ariston]

My almost 11 year old is able to do all the problems on the AOPS preA pre-test except for multiplying and dividing negatives (he gets the signs wrong.) Would you all say that test is an accurate indication of readiness? We haven't done 5th grade math yet but I was hoping to skip to pre-a, even if its a slow pace. Also how long us the preA book meant to take?

[Ariston]

Oops I meant to post this on another thread. Sorry :) will re-post