3rd Grader issues with completing writing and math tests

[Love2learn!]

Hello 

 

My DS is in 3rd grade in PS.  It is a STEM school and he is in the gifted program, where he has done really well until this year.  His teacher keeps saying that he is not completing assignments in class and does not use time constructively.  In the first marking period, his grade in writing said that he is not meeting the standard.

 

Apparently, he is having a hard time with writing.  Not the physical act of writing, since his handwriting has always been very neat and he loves drawing.  His problem seems to be getting his thoughts organized and on the paper in a reasonable timeframe.  He will write an essay, but he will enthusiastically write everything in the first paragraph and then have nothing left to say.  He is a voracious reader and will read Harry Potter, Percy Jackson, etc...he is very verbal and uses a high vocabulary.  So I can't figure it out.  

 

He is also having a hard time completing math tests in school.  It really came to a head last week, when he had a difficult time completing a diagnostic test.  He has no problem getting homework done quickly and he does not seem to be having trouble with math skills per se.  It appears that he is distracted though and is struggling with getting things done.  He says the noises from others bother him.   

 

Based on what happened with the math diagnostic, the teacher called a meeting with herself, the ESE coordinator and Asst Principal.  She mentioned something about considering an accomodation.  However, when I went to the meeting, they said that he is a bright boy that is just distracted and needs to learn better time management and organizational skills.  They did not feel an evaluation was worth pursuing.  The teacher will try and help him with more cues on time for math test. However, I don't understand how she can help the writing.  He appears to be stuck.

 

We are considering getting a psy-eval by a clinical psychologist in the area.  He works extensively with children and is very informed about the schools in the area. From what I understand they will test IQ/Personality/CPT look for learning disabilities, etc...  My question is......am I making more of this then need be?  Is it just a matter of maturity, discipline?  Although, I don't think that additional time only will help with the writing piece.  The evaluation is expensive, so I'm trying to discern if this is the right time to pursue something like this.  We just want to help our son.  I would love any feedback or suggestions you can share.  Also, does dysgraphia only apply to those who have trouble with the act of writing or does organizing thoughts on it's own apply as well?

 

Thanks in advance!

[OneStepAtATime]

Actually, your child may very well be gifted AND have certain learning issues.  If that is a possibility I would definitely embrace getting a private eval through a neuropsychologist but I would make sure that they had a great or at least really good reputation and that they know how to assess 2e kids (twice exceptional, meaning gifted with learning differences/challenges).  2e kids are notoriously challenging to diagnose because their gifts mask their weaknesses and vice-a -versa.  Most schools are not good at assessing these kids or really understanding what to do with them.  A professional may be able to help, though.

 

As for dysgraphia, there are many different forms within that umbrella diagnosis and it isn't all completely understood, yet.  For instance, my son has dysgraphia, but his handwriting in 4k. kinder. 1st, was actually much better than many of his classmates, especially some of the boys.  However, his handwriting was painfully slow.  He hit 2nd grade and the handwriting demands were increased 10 fold.  Then he also had to stop using the large lined paper with guided center line.  He also had to copy his spelling words off of the board.  He couldn't do it.  He didn't know how to judge size and formation and spacing by copying handwritten words off a chalkboard.  Nor could he judge spacing, size, etc. when writing on blank paper or writing on college rule paper.  

 

I have a nephew with dysgraphia that quite literally, even in college and with some remediation, still cannot form letters legibly enough to read them.  He has to type everything.  I have another nephew that has great handwriting but he cannot put his words on paper.  He is verbal.  He can express his thoughts fairly well verbally.  But even now that he is in High School he struggles terribly with taking those thoughts and writing them down on paper.

 

If your son is struggling with the act of getting thoughts onto paper he may need a writing program that is very systematic and breaks the process down into something that makes sense in his brain.  An eval could help with determining what is going on.  He may need a writing program like Institute for Excellence in Writing (IEW) or something along those lines.  Instruction in school may just not be explicit enough.

 

Hugs and good luck!  Skim through other posts on this board.  You might find some useful info while you wait for other responses.  

[Lecka]

I would not blow it off.  It sounds like the teacher is concerned, but then at the meeting, maybe people other than the teacher blew off the teacher. 

 

I think you may be able to talk to his teacher about ideas. 

 

But -- just b/c some other people at school are blowing it off, that does not mean it is nothing.  The teacher has let you know and the teacher has done her part.  Now I think the ball is in your court.  If you as a parent think things are fine, then things are fine.  If you as a parent want to respond to what happened at the meeting by looking for more, then that is how you can respond. 

 

I think if your son seems frustrated, it is important.  If your son seems like he is not frustrated, I think you can have some space to see what happens.

 

If your son is getting frustrated, though, you do not have that space, b/c your son will be taking a hit to his self-esteem and wondering why he is "a bad kid who can't do what he is supposed to" and thoughts like that. 

 

The way it is working out for your son is the top priority imo, more important that exactly how he scores or what he does or doesn't write.  Keeping him in a place where he feels good about himself as a student and learner and member of his class is what is most important. 

 

So -- I do not know what your best next step it. 

 

But ------ do not read too much into the meeting going the way it did.  That is one piece of information.  You have other information making up a picture -- what you see, and what his teacher sees. 

 

My older son has had "informal accommodations" (he has also had services) and something I have been told is to find out what the teacher is doing, and make sure the next teacher knows, or even ask the teacher to write a short note at the end of the year to give to his new teacher.  This has worked out for us, so far.  But while they are informal, we just hope that next year's teacher will do the same things that have worked in the previous years.  They are the kinds of things where I think we could get them in a 504 plan.  But -- not just the same issues, just to say. 

 

But you are within your rights to not just take no for an answer from that one meeting.  A lot of people are told no, and then they do not take no for an answer, get their private evaluation, come back to the school, and get what is recommended.  It can be a thing.  Or maybe you can just work things out with the teacher. 

 

But for me -- the answer to "am I doing the right things" is just -- is my son happy at school, does he feel good about himself at school, does he think if he works hard he can meet the expectation of his teacher, and things like that. 

 

It can be damaging for a child to think his/her best work cannot be good enough for the teacher.  If there is anything that seems like this -- then definitely take all steps. 

 

Another thought -- this is something that has come up for us.  Every year expectations rise in school. What is starting to be a problem now, may be bigger next year, if he is stuck and staying in the same place.  So if it seems like that -- it is more on the side of, take more action now.  If it does not seem like that, then maybe wait -- time does take care of a lot of things, too.  Too bad there is not an easy way to predict which will be the case, sometimes. 

 

I would also ask the teacher about the "noises from others" comments.  Is that what she sees, too?  Does that click with her?  And if so -- maybe he can have a way to do things in a quieter place.  THIS is the kind of thing that kids may tell their parents, but the teacher cannot read their minds, the teacher may not know that is what the child is saying at home.  That kind of thing, you need to follow up on, b/c it could be a simple fix.  I have had a LOT of things where I assume the teacher knew, but the teacher did not know, and now I am quick to mention these things.  Also, maybe my son's perception was not so accurate, and I need to explain things to my son -- but I do not know if I do not talk to the teacher, sometimes.

[FairProspects]

Nope, you are not making too much of it. 2E kids can be very good at compensating and late 3rd/4th grade level is often where the ability to compensate becomes much more difficult. My older ds used to be able to work 2+ grade levels ahead universally and now at 5th-8th grade level materials, his LDs are becoming more obvious (and incidentally make me very happy I didn't accept all the grade skips we were offered when he was younger). I would do the eval and look at accommodation suggestions. It is hard to know what changes to make until you have all the information in front of you.

[Lecka]

Btw -- I do think you were blown off at the meeting.  How do they know he "just needs to work harder?"  They do not know. 

 

I would not read too much into it, as meaning much of anything.  It is not a sign you are over-reacting or looking for a problem when there is no problem.  In case you are feeling like "well, at the meeting they said there is no big deal, so now we are over-reacting."  I would not draw that conclusion, I would draw the conclusion -- that what they said at the meeting is not something I would pay much attention to, b/c it doesn't sound like they were pre-disposed to want to really look into it.  So -- I would just not draw a conclusion from that, one way or another.  It would have been nice to have more come from the meeting, but since it didn't, oh well.  Keep looking at options. 

[Love2learn!]

Thank you so much everyone for all your insight. I don't feel like what they suggested we try will be enough. At the same time, I know that since he is not being disruptive and his grades are pretty good with the exception of writing, they don't seem to be alarmed. Even if they would assess him at school, I don't believe it would be thorough enough. I am definitely interested in keeping his self esteem and confidence intact. And most of all we want to know what is really Holding him back. The sooner we can give him tools the better prepared he will be for higher expectations. He spent an hour drawing comics before bedtime tonight. I just want what's best for my sweet, quirky, creative little boy.

 

Thanks for helping me hear my own voice and not feel so crazy. I believe the best course is to pursue an evaluation, so we can have real information.