Jump to content

Menu

Consider This - by Karen Glass


Recommended Posts

Finally read this and, wow, very interesting. I feel like maybe I understand Charlotte Mason for the first time. I have only read secondary sources on her (namely When Children Love to Learn, For the Children’s Sake, Real Learning, and Pocketful of Pinecones) and always sensed I was probably missing something by not going straight to the horse’s mouth. My general impression of CM was vintage books, frequent narrations, making nature notebooks, and doing picture studies (all with Victorian warm fuzzies!). I didn't do much of these outside of the LA so I was reluctant to call our school CM. I had done a “CM-inspired†curriculum once and our days were packed with just too many subjects and books and projects. I then came across Circe and Christopher Perrin, who were a breath of fresh air, and I decided I must be “classical†after all. But then I discovered that the Circe Institute highly valued CM and that was puzzling to me.

 

After reading Consider This however, I had a different picture of Charlotte Mason. I would be interested if those of you who have read her works consider this book a good summary. I was always turned off by CM’s Victorian prose and long, rambly sentences and so never read her books. Karen Glass used frequent snips and gave context and explanations to the excerpts as she wrote CT.

 

What I loved:

The focus on the end goal-- a person of character who is well-read, loves learning and is able to make connections with his knowledge.

Her insight on the meaning of “grammar.â€

Her perspective on Latin

Her explanation of the trivium

Her explanation of what “education is a life†means. (I never could figure that one out.)

Her explanation of “spreading a feast.†It is much more about creating holistic, relational core knowledge and love of learning than a crazy schoolday packed with subjects. In fact, it isn’t about subjects at all. Spreading a feast is really about creating self-learners with a solid foundation before the tough years start.

 

What I wasn’t sure about:

How strong the link was between Classical and CM. And I say this as one who considered them one and the same even before I read the book! :) Karen’s view of true Classical education is pre-Enlightenment. She feels that what existed afterwards, including in CM’s time, was a distortion of the original tradition. She suggested that CM reached into the past and sought to restore the original goals and practices of Classical ed.

 

Even though there were quotes of CM citing ancient writers, it seemed to me that she read widely, and took nuggets of wisdom wherever she could, including among her contemporaries. Then she meshed it all with her experience in the classroom. She was broad-minded and pragmatic, and was not afraid to point out when the emperor had no clothes on.

 

 

After reading this, I would consider CM perfect prep for a classical education (or any other one for that matter). There is a huge emphasis on “synthetic†thinking, which I took to mean as relational, whole-to-part learning. CM herself states that this prepares for the second stage of education, the analytical, classical one. Sometimes I have felt that people want to take the adult disciplines of higher learning and impose them on young children, and then they wonder why their school is not flying. CM ed is carefully designed according to what she observed about children’s development and with the end (adult disciplines) in mind.

.

I heard echoes of Hirsch’s Core Knowledge concept, the Waldorf and Montessori concept of young children, lots of Ruth Beechick, and of course Circe all over the place. :)  A lot of her ideas are not as distinctive as you might think. I found that reassuring.

 

So if you want to learn more about Charlotte Mason this is def a good read. And if any of you are laboring under a heavy load, trying to give younger children a classical education with Latin and lots of sentence diagramming, you will probably enjoy this as well. It may lift your burdens and give you reassurance.

 
  • Like 23
Link to comment
Share on other sites

For a long time I discounted Charlotte Mason. Sure, I agreed it could be a descent early education. A classical prep, as you said. But it surely wouldn't serve past 8 or 9 years old. Like you I read a half dozen contemporary CM books, but I didn't read the original series because oh my goodness that long winding prose. Not to mention all the asides to discuss the health benifits of rich foods or fires in the bedroom, or comments about the war, ect.

 

BUT so many people I admired admired CM...so I bit the bullet and started the series. I'm still only halfway through. I read volume 1, then 4, then 6, and now I'm finishing up 3. Lo and behold !!!! I love it. It turns out that Consider This, which came out after I'd finished 6 but before I started 3, is the ONLY contemporary book I've read that reflects Charlotte Masons works past Volume 1 (Home Education, her book on ages < 8). So you see all the stuff she recommended for very small children like copywork, 10-20 minute lessons, finishing before lunch, with no idea at all that those things END and in 7th grade those kids are doing 45 minutes of math and writing essays and studying Latin. It's like no one bothered to keep reading or something.

 

These days I think the link between CM and classical educators is very strong. And I find myself imitating her style more and more (although still not completely, but I can't imagine ever following anything completely).

 

If you DO decide to read CM I suggest starting at the end, with volume 6. It was her last work, and the most complete view of the methodology.

  • Like 12
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thank you for this review.  I've been trying to meld an eclectic mix of approaches in my head as we enter into this homeschooling journey (second year in).  I love strands of Classical, Waldorf, Charlotte Mason, Hirsch, Beechick, and so many others.  The great freedom and opportunity in this adventure called homeschooling is getting to weave a tapestry with all of these influences.  It can also feel like a burden at times.  Sometimes I feel frustrated that I can't just "pick one" (approach), though I know I'd never be satisfied to adhere to just one way of doing things.  Nice to know CM was influenced by many others as well; usually she is written about as such an original/distinctive educator.  Not discounting her originality, I do think we (humans) all are influenced by others, no matter how "original" our thoughts might seem.  

  • Like 5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The book is definitely a wonderful introduction to CM, that's not in the least watered down nor is it someone's personal interpretation of her works. Miss Glass lays out the why behind Charlotte Mason's methods and is true to the spirit of her works. I highly highly recommend. So glad others have liked it too! 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Finally read this and, wow, very interesting. I feel like maybe I understand Charlotte Mason for the first time. I have only read secondary sources on her (namely When Children Love to Learn, For the Children’s Sake, Real Learning, and Pocketful of Pinecones) and always sensed I was probably missing something by not going straight to the horse’s mouth. My general impression of CM was vintage books, frequent narrations, making nature notebooks, and doing picture studies (all with Victorian warm fuzzies!). I didn't do much of these outside of the LA so I was reluctant to call our school CM. I had done a “CM-inspired†curriculum once and our days were packed with just too many subjects and books and projects. I then came across Circe and Christopher Perrin, who were a breath of fresh air, and I decided I must be “classical†after all. But then I discovered that the Circe Institute highly valued CM and that was puzzling to me.

 

After reading Consider This however, I had a different picture of Charlotte Mason. I would be interested if those of you who have read her works consider this book a good summary. I was always turned off by CM’s Victorian prose and long, rambly sentences and so never read her books. Karen Glass uses frequent snips and gives context and explanations to the excerpts as she wrote CT.

 

What I loved:

The focus on the end goal-- a person of character who is well-read, loves learning and is able to make connections with his knowledge.

Her insight on the meaning of “grammar.â€

Her perspective on Latin

Her explanation of the trivium

Her explanation of what “education is a life†means. (I never could figure that one out.)

Her explanation of “spreading a feast.†It is much more about creating holistic, relational core knowledge and love of learning than a crazy schoolday packed with subjects. In fact, it isn’t about subjects at all. Spreading a feast is really about creating self-learners with a solid foundation before the tough years start.

 

<snip>

:iagree:   I agree with the portion quoted above - great high lights from the book.  I feel like Consider This explained CM to me better than any book I had previously read.  I highly recommend it.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I am half-way through Consider This. I have read CM's original works, and I would definitely say that Consider This is the intro-to-CM book that should be passed around to homeschool moms everywhere. I will advise reading Glass before reading CM herself.

 

YES!  CM *is* Classical...and this is what I was trying to say...No! Lots of "Classical" currics are not classical at all...and this is what I was trying to explain.

 

 

 

 

  • Like 8
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, I *loved* Consider This! Here's my review: http://www.simplyconvivial.com/2014/consider-this-education-book

 

I have always considered myself a meld of classical and CM, and after reading CM's volume 6, felt this was a very natural pairing.

 

I think classical would be "pre-Enlightenment" - that's why we call it classical. Post-Enlightenment is modernity, which is as opposed to classical. 

 

In CM's day "classical" meant dry-as-dust Latin grammar rote work only, hence she quoted classical sources but never used the term. She was trying to pull England back to the fullness of classical education. Also, most educators in the classical stream did write and plan for high school or college level work. Plato wrote about children on up, but few after him did. So, yes, CM was addressing what a child's education should be like, which was not as well-addressed as the higher grades within the classical tradition. Also, classical had always been for the elite, the aristocrats, and CM wanted a liberating, freedom-giving education for all. That also required adaption - but a necessary and positive adaption, I believe.

  • Like 6
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I finished the book, and I stand even more firmly with "Read this book first." for people interested in knowing CM. Then read book 6. For young moms, I will send them to Joyful Shepherdess's blog post where she lays out teaching reading/writing from the start.

 

 

 

Also, classical had always been for the elite, the aristocrats, and CM wanted a liberating, freedom-giving education for all. That also required adaption - but a necessary and positive adaption, I believe.

 

 

It's my thinking that children with dyslexia and other LD's would have been brushed aside as not destined for academics. It seems CM wanted to still set all children at the great Feast...but I do wonder, and I haven't seen it in her writings (maybe I've missed it) where she addresses teaching the struggling student beyond comments about some students will digest less than others but they will get what they need. What about perfectly bright children who have an LD?  

 

I do think that CM's methods of teaching reading/writing will teach probably 85% of all kids to read and write well. (Throwing out a %. I've not researched this. It's my guess.) But, what about the other 15%?  I am guessing that CM did not concern herself with that 15%, and they would be destined to benefit from the educations of those around them...like a herd immunity concept. 

 

If anyone knows where CM address this, I'd love to hear it.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

It's my thinking that children with dyslexia and other LD's would have been brushed aside as not destined for academics. It seems CM wanted to still set all children at the great Feast...but I do wonder, and I haven't seen it in her writings (maybe I've missed it) where she addresses teaching the struggling student beyond comments about some students will digest less than others but they will get what they need. What about perfectly bright children who have an LD?  

 

I do think that CM's methods of teaching reading/writing will teach probably 85% of all kids to read and write well. (Throwing out a %. I've not researched this. It's my guess.) But, what about the other 15%?  I am guessing that CM did not concern herself with that 15%, and they would be destined to benefit from the educations of those around them...like a herd immunity concept. 

 

If anyone knows where CM address this, I'd love to hear it.

 

It would have been difficult for CM to address our concept of LD, because in her time you either just got on with everyone else and were slow or "stupid" or you were beyond functioning in society and were kept at home or institutionalized. They didn't have shades and they didn't have special education.  In her time, the belief was that poor children weren't worth educating and that children with criminal parents were destined to criminality themselves. She wrote quite a bit addressing the ideas of her time, and couldn't really address an idea that had not yet come. 

 

However, I was just listening to a talk from the CIRCE conference a couple weeks ago by Paula Flint, who has been running a school in Texas for 9 years that is classical with CM methods & philosophy and inclusive - she has a masters or doctorate in LD and basically started a school so she could teach LD children the way she knew would work (with CM + latest research) and it does work. http://flintacademy.com/

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

It would have been difficult for CM to address our concept of LD, because in her time you either just got on with everyone else and were slow or "stupid" or you were beyond functioning in society and were kept at home or institutionalized. They didn't have shades and they didn't have special education.  In her time, the belief was that poor children weren't worth educating and that children with criminal parents were destined to criminality themselves. She wrote quite a bit addressing the ideas of her time, and couldn't really address an idea that had not yet come. 

 

However, I was just listening to a talk from the CIRCE conference a couple weeks ago by Paula Flint, who has been running a school in Texas for 9 years that is classical with CM methods & philosophy and inclusive - she has a masters or doctorate in LD and basically started a school so she could teach LD children the way she knew would work (with CM + latest research) and it does work. http://flintacademy.com/

 

 

That is my understanding too. 

 

 

I will look up that link.  Thanks for sharing!  CM + latest research is right where I'm at.

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Still following; thanks.  Interested in the Classical-CM connection, especially in regards to how/when would one generally shift from play-based, hands-on learning to more rigorous memory work and "serious" study?  (Not that hands-on learning ever goes away, but it seems like there will be a shift at some point.)  We're probably not there yet, as my DD is 6/1st grade, but I'm looking ahead and trying to get some vision.  I'm planning to read this book!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think CM's list of "Attainments by Age 6" she tried for should dispel any ideas that CM is not rigorous. It is age-appropriate, but it is not "gentle" as in "easy" or "Nice." It is gentle in that she always treats children as persons, as humans, and never as projects, checkboxes, or test-takers. 

 

https://www.amblesideonline.org/CMAttainments.shtml

 

1. To recite, beautifully, 6 easy poems and hymns
2. to recite, perfectly and beautifully, a parable and a psalm
3. to add and subtract numbers up to 10, with dominoes or counters
4. to read--what and how much, will depend on what we are told of the child
5. to copy in print-hand from a book
6. to know the points of the compass with relation to their own home, where the sun rises and sets, and the way the wind blows
7. to describe the boundaries of their own home
8. to describe any lake, river, pond, island etc. within easy reach
9. to tell quite accurately (however shortly) 3 stories from Bible history, 3 from early English, and 3 from early Roman history (my note here, we may want to substitute early American for early English!)
10. to be able to describe 3 walks and 3 views
11. to mount in a scrap book a dozen common wildflowers, with leaves (one every week); to name these, describe them in their own words, and say where they found them.
12. to do the same with leaves and flowers of 6 forest trees
13. to know 6 birds by song, colour and shape
14. to send in  handiwork, as directed
15. to tell three stories about their own "pets"--rabbit, dog or cat.
16. to name 20 common objects in French, and say a dozen little sentences
17. to sing one hymn, one French song, and one English song
18. to keep a caterpillar and tell the life-story of a butterfly from his own observations.

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The cool thing about reading this book is that I understand the WHY behind CM's methods. I am now free to pick what I like of her methods, skip what I like, and evaluate other ideas and curriculum with the big picture in mind. For instance, I always felt a little guilty about not doing outdoor nature walks with journals and stuff. But the fact is, where I live it is pretty cold most of the school year and the opportunities for outdoor nature study are fewer and uncomfortable. But now I understand why CM did science that way, and I can adapt our studies to work for us. (If I chose to live by her wisdom.  ;) .)

 

Another example is I was recently looking at the lovely language arts from Cottage Press. I have long planned to use their primers with my 2nd student when he was old enough. They now have upper grades too, and while those are wonderfully done, I could recognize that these levels are quite analytical for the ages they are intended for. I don't mean to say they aren't age-appropriate, but they would not reflect a CM approach for those particular grades. I guess CM suggested that students are ready for analytical learning when they are about 15. Some readers felt that was a bit late; there was a recent thread on that.

 

 

Still following; thanks.  Interested in the Classical-CM connection, especially in regards to how/when would one generally shift from play-based, hands-on learning to more rigorous memory work and "serious" study?  (Not that hands-on learning ever goes away, but it seems like there will be a shift at some point.)  We're probably not there yet, as my DD is 6/1st grade, but I'm looking ahead and trying to get some vision.  I'm planning to read this book!

 

From my understanding of the book, CM's emphasis was more on whole-to-part, big-picture learning than play-based. Rigorous memory work occurred right away, but it was beautiful and contextual, such as you see in the list Mystie posted. CM's course of study recommended for children was serious, but different than it would be later. As I mentioned above, she suggested the ripe old age of 15 for a change in approach. Definitely read the book. You may also be interested in Bluedorn's article on ten things to do before the age of ten. I find it dovetails nicely with this perspective.

 

 

 

  • Like 5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Still following; thanks.  Interested in the Classical-CM connection, especially in regards to how/when would one generally shift from play-based, hands-on learning to more rigorous memory work and "serious" study?  (Not that hands-on learning ever goes away, but it seems like there will be a shift at some point.)  We're probably not there yet, as my DD is 6/1st grade, but I'm looking ahead and trying to get some vision.  I'm planning to read this book!

 

 

The List of Attainments for Age 6 is a great place to start.  Another poster mentioned that there is a distinct change at age 15. Age 15 is when the child shifts from synthetic thinking to analytical thinking.  There are other, more gradual, shifts between age 6 and age 15.  At age 6, the child is learning how to read, being read to, giving oral narrations, chasing butterflies. At 10, the child is reading for herself books (that are on most high school reading lists nowadays), writing narrations, and relating to those butterflies in terms of its habitat/ecosystem as well as to literature & poetry & art that illustrates (with) the butterfly. 

 

That's just one example, but it's never an abrupt shift.  It's always a gradual process of maturity. 

 

Charlotte Mason took the work of the infant "serious."  She disliked the word "rigorous" as that implies hardness, rigor mortis came to mind. Rather, she viewed a child's education as a feeding of her mind with ideas. This is at the heart of synthetic thinking; those ideas cross all areas of life and inform how things relate. (Science of Relations)

 

When we think of rigorous study today, we are often talking about analytical thinking...and CM would argue that it's a waste of time until the child knows how that information relates within the big picture of the world. (Ex. It would be a waste of time to teach a child how a car works before teaching them what a car does, WHY it works. It might be a neat trick to show off to have a child who can explain how an engine works...but what good does that do if the child has no idea that the purpose of the car is to drive him from one place to another.  OTOH, a child who falls in love with the way cars move, how they sound, and appreciates the help of transportation they provide will probably gain a natural interest in how the engine works. That natural interest will be the driving force for learning the analytical side.)  

 

Memory work is in the context of poetry and meaningful things. The habit of attention is developed, and narration is employed to retain what is important.

 

As far as manipulative work, keep it up until the child outgrows it. Even then, pull out the manipulatives, real life examples, etc...whenever facing something new.  In fact, it's best to start with something real. Even in math, and even with big kids...said by the momma who passed calculus in high school but never understood what it WAS exactly that I was calculating.  Learning the analytical processes is a waste of time without first having the synthetic understanding.  (Which...is why my dyslexic child can whip out word problems grade levels above where he can plug and chug naked drill. It doesn't seem to make any sense according to modern education theory, but it makes perfect sense in light of CM's philosophy of education.)

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think CM's list of "Attainments by Age 6" she tried for should dispel any ideas that CM is not rigorous. It is age-appropriate, but it is not "gentle" as in "easy" or "Nice." It is gentle in that she always treats children as persons, as humans, and never as projects, checkboxes, or test-takers. 

 

https://www.amblesideonline.org/CMAttainments.shtml

 

1. To recite, beautifully, 6 easy poems and hymns

2. to recite, perfectly and beautifully, a parable and a psalm

3. to add and subtract numbers up to 10, with dominoes or counters

4. to read--what and how much, will depend on what we are told of the child

5. to copy in print-hand from a book

6. to know the points of the compass with relation to their own home, where the sun rises and sets, and the way the wind blows

7. to describe the boundaries of their own home

8. to describe any lake, river, pond, island etc. within easy reach

9. to tell quite accurately (however shortly) 3 stories from Bible history, 3 from early English, and 3 from early Roman history (my note here, we may want to substitute early American for early English!)

10. to be able to describe 3 walks and 3 views

11. to mount in a scrap book a dozen common wildflowers, with leaves (one every week); to name these, describe them in their own words, and say where they found them.

12. to do the same with leaves and flowers of 6 forest trees

13. to know 6 birds by song, colour and shape

14. to send in  handiwork, as directed

15. to tell three stories about their own "pets"--rabbit, dog or cat.

16. to name 20 common objects in French, and say a dozen little sentences

17. to sing one hymn, one French song, and one English song

18. to keep a caterpillar and tell the life-story of a butterfly from his own observations.

 

Yes!  OK, I printed this out a couple of years ago and review it 2-3x/year when I am trying to get "oriented" in our plans. A lot of these "goals" have been met easily / naturally because of the way we live (living in the country, garden, hiking, etc.), though some have been more directed and "bookish" (copywork).  

 

I love the way you put this:

 

 It is age-appropriate, but it is not "gentle" as in "easy" or "Nice." It is gentle in that she always treats children as persons, as humans, and never as projects, checkboxes, or test-takers.   

 

Sometimes I err in applying pressure to my DD by doing things like the latter (projects, checkboxes, etc.)  I hate the way school goes and the way we all feel when I lead things that way.  Thanks for pointing out the distinction.  
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The cool thing about reading this book is that I understand the WHY behind CM's methods. I am now free to pick what I like of her methods, skip what I like, and evaluate other ideas and curriculum with the big picture in mind. For instance, I always felt a little guilty about not doing outdoor nature walks with journals and stuff. But the fact is, where I live it is pretty cold most of the school year and the opportunities for outdoor nature study are fewer and uncomfortable. But now I understand why CM did science that way, and I can adapt our studies to work for us. (If I chose to live by her wisdom.  ;) .)

 

Another example is I was recently looking at the lovely language arts from Cottage Press. I have long planned to use their primers with my 2nd student when he was old enough. They now have upper grades too, and while those are wonderfully done, I could recognize that these levels are quite analytical for the ages they are intended for. I don't mean to say they aren't age-appropriate, but they would not reflect a CM approach for those particular grades. I guess CM suggested that students are ready for analytical learning when they are about 15. Some readers felt that was a bit late; there was a recent thread on that.

 

 

 

From my understanding of the book, CM's emphasis was more on whole-to-part, big-picture learning than play-based. Rigorous memory work occurred right away, but it was beautiful and contextual, such as you see in the list Mystie posted. CM's course of study recommended for children was serious, but different than it would be later. As I mentioned above, she suggested the ripe old age of 15 for a change in approach. Definitely read the book. You may also be interested in Bluedorn's article on ten things to do before the age of ten. I find it dovetails nicely with this perspective.

 

I guess by "play" I was thinking afternoons free spent in discovery out around the tree house, planting seeds in the garden with Dad, finding interesting rocks and then looking them up in a field book...This after a morning of the 3 R's...I don't know how to label it?

 

Rigorous memory work occurred right away    I have been avoiding this because "aaack!"  I'm horrible at memorization.  I'm afraid to start b/c I don't know how to do it with my DC without making it cardboard-y and cheesy.  I will read and set myself to work at changing that--maybe finding a "beautiful and contextual" way to do that.  I do see the value in memorization.  

 

Thank you for the rec's for Bluedorn, Cottage Press.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I guess by "play" I was thinking afternoons free spent in discovery out around the tree house, planting seeds in the garden with Dad, finding interesting rocks and then looking them up in a field book...This after a morning of the 3 R's...I don't know how to label it?

 

Rigorous memory work occurred right away    I have been avoiding this because "aaack!"  I'm horrible at memorization.  I'm afraid to start b/c I don't know how to do it with my DC without making it cardboard-y and cheesy.  I will read and set myself to work at changing that--maybe finding a "beautiful and contextual" way to do that.  I do see the value in memorization.  

 

 

 

 

Masterly Inactivity is the term to look up for the free afternoons.

 

 

 

Simple read poems over and over again...for pleasure.  "For pleasure" being the key component.  

 

I start as babes reciting "How do you like to up in the swing...." as soon as they can sit up in a little swing. My 2yo has begun filling in the ends of the lines for me.  By 4yo, my big kids chanted the poems during play all the time.  RL Stevenson has a great selection for littles.

 

I used to print off large print, illustrated (when possible) poems to post up on the wall at child's eye level.  My dd had a sweet relationship with "Caterpillar" by Rossetti.  

 

My oldest son loved "The Land of Storybooks" b/c he liked to pretend play just like the boy in the poem.

 

 

 

Read a bunch of poems for fun.  Find the ones that catch your child's interest, and make those part of her world.  She will do the work of memorizing b/c she found something she loves and wants to keep it...much like the desire to carry around a little purse and collect lovely rocks and bits.

  • Like 6
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Our homeschool was revolutionized when I learned about the whole method of memorization. Instead of working on a passage line by line, you read the whole thing at once. We read the same Psalm every morning for a few months and it is memorized effortlessly. Then we read poems for fun, and the kiddos learn those even faster because of the rhythm. Poems on audio are also wonderful to use. We have Andrew Pudewa's Linguistic Development Through Poetry Memorization, which is awesome. The FLL audio has some poems, and there are some free ones on Librivox.

 

Just some ideas. . .

  • Like 7
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Our homeschool was revolutionized when I learned about the whole method of memorization. Instead of working on a passage line by line, you read the whole thing at once. We read the same Psalm every morning for a few months and it is memorized effortlessly. Then we read poems for fun, and the kiddos learn those even faster because of the rhythm. Poems on audio are also wonderful to use. We have Andrew Pudewa's Linguistic Development Through Poetry Memorization, which is awesome.

 

We have not done well with poetry memorization in the past.  I have read more on how CM approached this, so I have changed how we do it.  It has worked well.

 

We choose a poet each term.  

They have to read a poem of their choice from that poet each day.  (sometimes outloud if we are having a good day :)

They copy a poem once a week. 

Practice reciting a poem twice a week (on their own)

Recite the poem in front of the family on Fridays.

 

I made a simple book from the poems listed on AO.  Our last term we did Emily Dickinson.  I have attached the file, if anyone is interested.

 

 

I am really enjoying this thread.  I am still reading Consider This and will probable start it over when I finish :)

Emily Dickinson.pdf

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Lots of good ideas for memorization here.  I think I'm seeing some "light" on that subject and see a way forward.  

 

Today we read Animals, Animals by Eric Carle (collection of good poetry illustrated in Carle's typical fashion)--just for fun.  Some of the poems were so enjoyable to read--rolling off the tongue or tickling our funny bones--that I could see reading them again and again until memorized. 

 

I realized about a year ago that we had memorized the whole The Real Mother Goose board book, simply from so much repetition between our two children.  That seemed so easy that I thought it didn't really "count" as memory work!   I guess I thought memorization had to be some horrible, dry teeth-pulling exercise.  Anyone else seem to regularly over-complicate things?! 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks for this book recommendation!  I have read everything else you mentioned about CM (including her own original series), but it sounds like this one might be the one to "make it click" for me.  I appreciate a lot of CM ideas, but am often turned off by the way I see them represented today.  I'm especially intrigued by the strong connection to classical education.  This will be my next read.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...

The cool thing about reading this book is that I understand the WHY behind CM's methods. I am now free to pick what I like of her methods, skip what I like, and evaluate other ideas and curriculum with the big picture in mind. For instance, I always felt a little guilty about not doing outdoor nature walks with journals and stuff. But the fact is, where I live it is pretty cold most of the school year and the opportunities for outdoor nature study are fewer and uncomfortable. But now I understand why CM did science that way, and I can adapt our studies to work for us. (If I chose to live by her wisdom.  ;) .)

 

Another example is I was recently looking at the lovely language arts from Cottage Press. I have long planned to use their primers with my 2nd student when he was old enough. They now have upper grades too, and while those are wonderfully done, I could recognize that these levels are quite analytical for the ages they are intended for. I don't mean to say they aren't age-appropriate, but they would not reflect a CM approach for those particular grades. I guess CM suggested that students are ready for analytical learning when they are about 15. Some readers felt that was a bit late; there was a recent thread on that.

 

 

 

From my understanding of the book, CM's emphasis was more on whole-to-part, big-picture learning than play-based. Rigorous memory work occurred right away, but it was beautiful and contextual, such as you see in the list Mystie posted. CM's course of study recommended for children was serious, but different than it would be later. As I mentioned above, she suggested the ripe old age of 15 for a change in approach. Definitely read the book. You may also be interested in Bluedorn's article on ten things to do before the age of ten. I find it dovetails nicely with this perspective.

 

What thread was this?  I wonder about this, too...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This just makes me smile!! I have not read the book and am unlikely to in the near-future (time! of the essence!) but it sounds like it perfectly captures the CM philosophy, which is not at all, in my mind, antithetical to classical education.  And not especially mysterious, prim, or difficult to put into practice, either. Thanks for posting it...if I catch time this summer I will read the book, and maybe introduce it to my little Charlotte Mason group here!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I haven't yet read Consider Tjis, I am hoping I'll be able to borrow it from someone.

 

I did read a review of it by a classicist which took some issue with its historical understanding of "classical education" and if he was really representing the book accuratly, I tend to agree with him,  So, in his view, the presentation of Mason's ideas in relation to that was questionable.

 

Increasingly I am finding that the idea of a "classical" education is an almost meaningless concept - it can mean so many things, some of them contradictory.  I tend to think that it might be more accurate to think of a tradition of education - much the same way that we use the idea of tradition in Christianity - a body of work and ideas that exists over time, as a kind of conversation. 

 

I don't think there is much question that Mason existed still within that tradition, and to a way unself-conciously, unlike many modern situations where people have been cut off from the tradition and need to do some work even to begin to engage in the conversation.

 

So I don't think we should really understand what she was doing in terms of thinking about being classical, or even about trying to ressurect something.  I think in part she was motivated by a new situation - the beginnings of public education for all and new scientific ideas about education - but mostly she wanted to think about education from a deeply Christian perspective and develop first principles based upon that.

 

So her first questions are things like "what is a child", "what does it mean to be educated", "what is the goal of a Christian life?"  Her answers are things like "a child is a person,"  arising from that  the mind of the child educates itsel because that is its nature, that the goal of education is to develop many different relationships with God and the things that come from him, nature, reason, ideas, mathematical concepts, people. 

 

Always, her practical advice derived from her first principles, combined with a lot of time spent teaching actual children.  A good example is the idea that teachers should not spend to much time explaining books, or that science education needs to begin with natural history.  Because for her the goal is for the student herself to develop a direct relationship with the ideas and author of the book, and a direct relationship with the objects of science.  When the teacher interjects too much, the student ends up with the teachers understanding of the book or an abstract understanding of nature - substitutes for that direct relationship.  In her mind this can potentially subvert the real relationship, and the desire to do it from the teacher is a product of lack of trust in the child's personhood and ultimatly in God.

 

With regard to learning difficulties - I don't know that CM gave specific advice about such things, though there might well be something in the PNEU articles.  But my sense is really that will skills she advocated always meeting students where they were, being creative with practical solutions for each individual, and making sure that where there were skill deficits, the student still was able to access lots of nourishing and exciting ideas.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I just read this as well thanks to this review! I'm a bit unsure now though about the trivium. Everything I thought I knew about it is apparently false. It seems that even though she doesnt think it right to apply the three terms to developmental stages, it seems that there's still clearly stages whether they be termed grammar, logic, or rhetoric. What harm is there for neoclassical followers to do this when indeed, there's a clear stage where you are pouring knowledge in, then waiting for them to reach a point where they can analyze and then finally produce their own thoughts?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I just read this as well thanks to this review! I'm a bit unsure now though about the trivium. Everything I thought I knew about it is apparently false. It seems that even though she doesnt think it right to apply the three terms to developmental stages, it seems that there's still clearly stages whether they be termed grammar, logic, or rhetoric. What harm is there for neoclassical followers to do this when indeed, there's a clear stage where you are pouring knowledge in, then waiting for them to reach a point where they can analyze and then finally produce their own thoughts?

 

My view is that the neoclassical understanding of the trivum as related to developmental stages is a bit limited.  I think it has some value, especially if you look at why Sayers was talking about it, what she was trying to warn against - but I don't think it is robust enough to hang a whole philosophy of education on, and it paddles around the surface of the deeper questions about what it means to be educated. 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 4 weeks later...

Well, I finally got this book and finished it.

For the most part, because I was very influenced by the Charlotte Mason movement, I love it.  One of my first books on homeschooling was For the Children's Sake, and I was greatly inspired by it.  Yes--education is a life. To me that sums up the power of CM.

 

But I must say that I do not like the word 'synthetic' for the idea of whole learning.  I guess its because of some of its connotations--one of its meanings is: "not real or genuine; artificial."  

Glad that she explained why she used it: Mason used that term (back when it didn't have an association with pantsuits)! 

I like the term 'integrated studies' because of the meaning of the Latin word it comes from. Did you know integer in Latin means "one/whole," yes. But it also means "undamaged/unbroken/ not missing any essential pieces!" Isn't that neat? (Yes, I realize the word 'integrated' has its own connotations!)

 

Two out of three of our sons have now graduated from college (and next month, one from law school).  This is so awesome when I think back to those days when we were homeschooling, and I thought to myself, "Well at least they will be well-rounded and can talk about classics as they make a living as carpenters!" Haha.   Truly, Vitae non scholae discimus! But, it turns out, this kind of learning works pretty well for school, too. ;")

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...