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Deflated balls...(Update post #111) U#2 Brady suspended 4 games...


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I keep waiting for a thread or jokes or something!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

MAY 7,2105 UPDATE: http://deadspin.com/tom-brady-threw-those-poor-ball-deflating-jamokes-under-1702608069

 

Brady kinda sorta knew...

 

Update #2

 

http://espn.go.com/boston/nfl/story/_/id/12867594/punishments-handed-tom-brady-new-england-patriots-deflategate

 

Brady suspended 4 games. Patriots loses a couple draft picks and fined a million dollars...

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This is a big problem at our house! The weather was nice, ball-bouncing fun to be had by all. Big balls, little balls, all shapes and sizes, and all nice and firm.

Along came this cold spell and BAM! Useless, deflated balls littering the place. What's an active girl to do?

 

But there is hope: Groundhog Day is fast approaching, and hopefully Ol' Puxatawney Phil will have good news for deflated balls around the nation. Spring is in the air, and just maybe, shopping for new balls.

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Darn it. You guys are joking. This stupid thing has been bothering me. I hate it when people cheat. The most plausible explanation is someone used knowledge of basic chemistry to achieve the lower inflation -- as opposed to actually deflating them physically. Then, I heard someone did an analysis of games and found a pattern that suggested this started in 2007.

 

But return to your jokes. Jokes are better than wasting emotional energy on being angry that people cheat. Maybe I need to watch late night tv.

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Darn it. You guys are joking. This stupid thing has been bothering me. I hate it when people cheat. The most plausible explanation is someone used knowledge of basic chemistry to achieve the lower inflation -- as opposed to actually deflating them physically. Then, I heard someone did an analysis of games and found a pattern that suggested this started in 2007.

 

But return to your jokes. Jokes are better than wasting emotional energy on being angry that people cheat. Maybe I need to watch late night tv.

 

I'm with you, but I just don't care for football at all, so if the powers that be in football are ok with cheating - well, ok then.  At least the rest of the teams know this now.  If it were up to me, they'd be out of the Super Bowl and have their other wins rescinded, but no one really asked me nor would want me to take over in a sport I don't give a hoot about.  I just think cheating should have impressive consequences.

 

The jokes, however, do give me a smile - usually.

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Darn it. You guys are joking. This stupid thing has been bothering me. I hate it when people cheat. The most plausible explanation is someone used knowledge of basic chemistry to achieve the lower inflation -- as opposed to actually deflating them physically. Then, I heard someone did an analysis of games and found a pattern that suggested this started in 2007.

 

But return to your jokes. Jokes are better than wasting emotional energy on being angry that people cheat. Maybe I need to watch late night tv.

I was/am open to anything concerning the topic.

 

I'd actually like to analyze the coach's and QB's statements...

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I was/am open to anything concerning the topic.

 

I'd actually like to analyze the coach's and QB's statements...

I can't believe that Tom Brady didn't have ANY idea they were deflated. I have probably held a football for an hour total in my life, and I can tell when the kids' footballs need air. No freaking way would someone who handles footballs professionally have any plausible deniability in this situation.

 

Belichick just seems sketchy to me. Maybe it's his rumpled sweatshirts? (Kidding.)

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I can't believe that Tom Brady didn't have ANY idea they were deflated. I have probably held a football for an hour total in my life, and I can tell when the kids' footballs need air. No freaking way would someone who handles footballs professionally have any plausible deniability in this situation.

 

Belichick just seems sketchy to me. Maybe it's his rumpled sweatshirts? (Kidding.)

He not exactly the brightest bulb.   

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He not exactly the brightest bulb.

Lol. True. Pretty though, when he washes his hair!

 

Still! There's just no way. He knows football. I would bet you could toss him one and he fairly accurately would be able to guess the PSI (even if he couldn't tell you what PSI means!).

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I can't believe that Tom Brady didn't have ANY idea they were deflated. I have probably held a football for an hour total in my life, and I can tell when the kids' footballs need air. No freaking way would someone who handles footballs professionally have any plausible deniability in this situation.

 

Belichick just seems sketchy to me. Maybe it's his rumpled sweatshirts? (Kidding.)

The part of the coach's statement that made me go "hmmm..." Is that he had a very specific interest in practice balls and said so in his statement but then said he had NO interest in game balls.

 

Could be, but I'm leaning towards not likely.

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I was/am open to anything concerning the topic.

 

I'd actually like to analyze the coach's and QB's statements...

 

Amazing parts to me were that the NFL had not contacted Tom Brady about this controversy even though it began on Monday. By Thursday, no contact from the NFL? I guess they are more worried about P.R. than what happened.

 

Second, both Belichick and Brady issued similar non-denial denials. "I have no knowledge," and "i just heard about this." The system was probably set up years ago, and whomever is doing it SURELY is doing it with full knowledge of Brady & Belichick. Brady acknowledged that he personally selected the game balls before each game and is very familiar with them. He didn't address the issue of whether they were already deflated at that point, just that he didn't want them "altered" after that.

 

Also quite a bit of equivocation from Brady as to what constitutes "cheating."

 

Both statistically and by their wishy washy denials you can bank on the fact that it was done, has been going on a while, and that both men consider the deflation part of what is expected by teams in order to gain an advantage over an opponent. Likely they think "everyone is trying to gain an advantage" so therefore there's nothing wrong with their method of doing so. So technically not "cheating." 

 

As announcer/former coach John Madden said, there's no way ANYONE would alter a ball like that without the knowledge of the QB. 

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Amazing parts to me were that the NFL had not contacted Tom Brady about this controversy even though it began on Monday. By Thursday, no contact from the NFL? I guess they are more worried about P.R. than what happened.

 

Second, both Belichick and Brady issued similar non-denial denials. "I have no knowledge," and "i just heard about this." The system was probably set up years ago, and whomever is doing it SURELY is doing it with full knowledge of Brady & Belichick. Brady acknowledged that he personally selected the game balls before each game and is very familiar with them. He didn't address the issue of whether they were already deflated at that point, just that he didn't want them "altered" after that.

 

Also quite a bit of equivocation from Brady as to what constitutes "cheating."

 

Both statistically and by their wishy washy denials you can bank on the fact that it was done, has been going on a while, and that both men consider the deflation part of what is expected by teams in order to gain an advantage over an opponent. Likely they think "everyone is trying to gain an advantage" so therefore there's nothing wrong with their method of doing so. So technically not "cheating."

 

As announcer/former coach John Madden said, there's no way ANYONE would alter a ball like that without the knowledge of the QB.

Great points!

 

Re: cheating and non-denials, here is the transcript of that part. Notice the answer.- Is Brady a cheater? -

-I don't think so. -

 

But then the question, -did Belichik throw you under the bus.-

Answer: -No.-

 

The contrast is amazing.

 

"Q: This has raised a lot of uncomfortable conversations for people around this country who view you as their idol. The question theyĂ¢â‚¬â„¢re asking themselves is, Ă¢â‚¬ËœWhatĂ¢â‚¬â„¢s up with our hero?Ă¢â‚¬â„¢ Can you answer right now, is Tom Brady a cheater?

 

TB: I donĂ¢â‚¬â„¢t believe so. I feel like IĂ¢â‚¬â„¢ve always played within the rules. I would never do anything to break the rules. I believe in fair play and I respect the league and everything theyĂ¢â‚¬â„¢re doing to try to create a very competitive playing field for all the NFL teams. ItĂ¢â‚¬â„¢s a very competitive league. Every team is trying to do the best they can to win every week. I believe in fair play and IĂ¢â‚¬â„¢ll always believe in that for as long as IĂ¢â‚¬â„¢m playing.

 

Q: Some people think Coach Belichick threw you under the bus this morning, do you feel that way?

 

TB: No, I think everyone is obviously trying to figure out what happened. I think thatĂ¢â‚¬â„¢s the main thing over the last couple days. ItĂ¢â‚¬â„¢s trying to figure out what happened. Like I said, I was as surprised as anybody when I heard Monday morning what was happening. I think over the last few days people have been trying to figure out Ă¢â‚¬â€œ as the NFL is trying to figure out Ă¢â‚¬â€œ what part of the process and from when I saw the ball which was five hours before halftime, what exactly happened."

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And can I vent a bit? I'm sick of the "hate the game, not the player" defense that is going around right now. You now, everyone cheats so who cares. Did yall see this article? I thought it was a good analysis of the current state of sports. (And I think puts some blame where it belongs- on the consumers who reward it. Ftr - were I the commissioner, the Patriots would forfeit the win and be fined a ridiculous amount. If I were the owner of the Cheatriots as my family as called them since spygate, I would sack Bellicheat. But, that will never happen.

 

Ps loving the jokes. Wish I had some to add.

 

http://www.wsj.com/articles/joseph-epstein-the-deflated-state-of-sportsmanship-1421970701#livefyre-comment

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And can I vent a bit? I'm sick of the "hate the game, not the player" defense that is going around right now. You now, everyone cheats so who cares. Did yall see this article? I thought it was a good analysis of the current state of sports. (And I think puts some blame where it belongs- on the consumers who reward it. Ftr - were I the commissioner, the Patriots would forfeit the win and be fined a ridiculous amount. If I were the owner of the Cheatriots as my family as called them since spygate, I would sack Bellicheat. But, that will never happen.

 

Ps loving the jokes. Wish I had some to add.

 

http://www.wsj.com/articles/joseph-epstein-the-deflated-state-of-sportsmanship-1421970701#livefyre-comment

 

I am with you. My sport of choice is baseball, so it's PED's and voting for cheaters for the HOF.

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MSNative...I could only read the first paragraph. I'm not a member.

 

But I loved the title!

So strange. I read this in the paper today and just searched for it. When I searched, I got the whole article. When I followed the link I only got the first paragraph as well. So if anyone is interested enough, try just searching "Epstein sportsmanship" and you may be able to read the whole thing.
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So strange. I read this in the paper today and just searched for it. When I searched, I got the whole article. When I followed the link I only got the first paragraph as well. So if anyone is interested enough, try just searching "Epstein sportsmanship" and you may be able to read the whole thing.

Cool! That worked!

 

Great article.

 

There were parts that reminded me of one of my son's teams and "honor calls." The athlete has a duty to be honest and say whether he tipped a ball before it went out of bounds bc sometimes it was tipped but so lightly the ref couldn't tell.

 

My son's team is known to be truthful about their honor calls whereas other teams aren't. His team always says it isn't really a win if you lied about an honor call.

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Great points!

 

 

 

 

Thanks for the transcript quotes, I'm going to comment on them below in bold:

 

Re: cheating and non-denials, here is the transcript of that part. Notice the answer.- Is Brady a cheater? -

-I don't think so. -

 

But then the question, -did Belichik throw you under the bus.-

Answer: -No.-

 

The contrast is amazing.

 

"Q: This has raised a lot of uncomfortable conversations for people around this country who view you as their idol. The question theyĂ¢â‚¬â„¢re asking themselves is, Ă¢â‚¬ËœWhatĂ¢â‚¬â„¢s up with our hero?Ă¢â‚¬â„¢ Can you answer right now, is Tom Brady a cheater?

 

TB: I donĂ¢â‚¬â„¢t believe so. 

 

 [A simple NO is needed here. Instead, we get an answer about how he "feels." Likely, he feels everyone does it, therefore HE is not a cheater.] 

 

 I feel like IĂ¢â‚¬â„¢ve always played within the rules.

 

[Another statement of how he FEELS. Also addresses "playing" within the rules, not "others" altering the game ball on his behalf.]

 

 I would never do anything to break the rules. 

 

[Notice how this is constructed, I "would never," not I DIDN'T. And likely he had someone else break the rules on his behalf]

 

 I believe in fair play and I respect the league and everything theyĂ¢â‚¬â„¢re doing to try to create a very competitive playing field for all the NFL teams.

 

[This says nothing about the issue at hand, it is a deflection from his own responsibility for the current situation.] 

 

ItĂ¢â‚¬â„¢s a very competitive league. 

 

[i think he is telling us here that everyone cheats in one way or another, in his opinion]  

 

Every team is trying to do the best they can to win every week. 

 

[same] 

 

 I believe in fair play and IĂ¢â‚¬â„¢ll always believe in that for as long as IĂ¢â‚¬â„¢m playing. 

 

[so what? This apparently is what "fair play" looks like to Tom Brady]

 

 

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SWB, I wonder if she would have any thoughts on this...it seems that some of the points she makes in her doctoral dissertation, "The Art of the Public Grovel" probably apply. This guy is really being cagey. He may not be "apologizing", but he seems to be as slippery as some of the figures in her book.

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Cool! That worked!

 

Great article.

 

There were parts that reminded me of one of my son's teams and "honor calls." The athlete has a duty to be honest and say whether he tipped a ball before it went out of bounds bc sometimes it was tipped but so lightly the ref couldn't tell.

 

My son's team is known to be truthful about their honor calls whereas other teams aren't. His team always says it isn't really a win if you lied about an honor call.

I love that!! Your son's team is absolutely right. My son's coaches are the same. It's encouraging to know there are still some teams and coaches that believe in honor.

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Serious question: Don't both teams play with the same ball? They don't switch it out when the new offense takes the field, do they? Also, don't the officials pick up the ball after every down? Wouldn't they notice if the ball felt weird? So, what's the point of intentionally deflating the ball if you're giving the other guys the same benefits you get?

 

I'm not a regular football viewer, but I do have a passing familiarity with the game, and I don't understand what the big deal is.

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Serious question: Don't both teams play with the same ball? They don't switch it out when the new offense takes the field, do they? Also, don't the officials pick up the ball after every down? Wouldn't they notice if the ball felt weird? So, what's the point of intentionally deflating the ball if you're giving the other guys the same benefits you get?

 

I'm not a regular football viewer, but I do have a passing familiarity with the game, and I don't understand what the big deal is.

 

No, each team uses its own balls.

 

Yes, the officials should have noticed.

 

There was some other writer/analyst who had time on his hands, who analyzed the Patriots' fumble rate compared to other teams over the past 10 years. Since 2007 it is MARKEDLY lower than other teams' fumble rates. Something that would be statistically highly unlikely by chance. (Unless you want to believe that Belichick "coaches" his players not to fumble) That's another hallmark of a ball that has likely been deflated, that it's easier for running backs (and wide receivers) to hang onto.

 

So it's likely that the Cheating Game dates back that far.

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I never follow football and don't care who wins or loses and go shopping in empty malls during Super Bowl. But, from what I am reading, the Patriots were winning against the Colts (I hope I got that right?) anyway, so why would they cheat? I am confused  :confused1:

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I never follow football and don't care who wins or loses and go shopping in empty malls during Super Bowl. But, from what I am reading, the Patriots were winning against the Colts (I hope I got that right?) anyway, so why would they cheat? I am confused  :confused1:

 

 

My theory is this is something they have been doing for a LONG time, maybe dating back as far as 2007, so they didn't do anything to alter their routine.

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I never follow football and don't care who wins or loses and go shopping in empty malls during Super Bowl. But, from what I am reading, the Patriots were winning against the Colts (I hope I got that right?) anyway, so why would they cheat? I am confused :confused1:

They (allegedly) have been cheating since 2007. They (allegedly) were cheating from the start of the game. Maybe they would have won anyway, but we will never know. Is Tom Brady good despite his cheating or is he good because he cheats?

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Astute point, Trish.

 

I'd like to see some major advertisers decide to pull their superbowl ads, the stands unfilled, and people tune the game out because it's the money that makes the difference. Until the people that feed the machine stop feeding it, the cheating will continue because there won't be the retribution of a more empty wallet.

 

I think that cheating in the NFL is just an extension of cheating in college football. CNN is running an article on a lawsuit brought by two UNC grads who claim they are shockingly undereducated. This goes back to the scandal of "paper classes" that broke when a UNC instructor blew the whistle in special courses only for athletes that require no real academic work, but result in a "degree" at the end of four years. Of course, I find it hard to believe that these athletes sitting in their "Arithmetic for beginners" or "European History Told Through Nursery Rhymes" or whatever classes on campus in which the non-athletes are hunkered down over thick texts with their noses buried in them, frantically highlighting the main points, taking notes, attending study groups, and studying for exams did not notice a disparity in their workload vs. their peers. Equally as noticeable should have been that the athletes on the non-high earning sports teams such as the swim or tennis team were working as hard as their non-athletic peers in order to keep their grades up. Well, and that bizarrely low ACT/SAT score that would be an automatic rejection from UNC, or U of MI, or MSU or whatever...another clue, yet they are innocent! But, anyway, they are suing the NCAA over this. Well, if Big name schools like UNC (my home state schools of U of Michigan and Michigan State are named in the scandal, and frankly, we've known for a long time here that if Ghengis Khan applied to U of MI or MSU not knowing his alphabet or how to count past ten, but would assure a win over OSU, Ghengis is going to college on a sport's scholarship), and their rivals are paving the college path with nonsense classes in order to keep eligibility high for star players, then it is only natural that the cheating system that feeds pro ball, breeds cheating.

 

Lower Division Schools who are not allowed by the NCAA to offer the big sports' scholarships are probably a lot more honest because the students who go there have to be able to pull their weight while on the team. There isn't any big money to be gained by gaming the system. These kids pay to play either by true merit aid, need based aid, or jobs and loans. Maybe what we need is for the NCAA to pull the plug on big name college sports for a couple of years and allow Divison III schools like University of Minnesota at Duluth and MTU to play their matches televised. Vacate the Patriots win, and have some advertisers pull sponsorship, and maybe the players and coaches will get the message that cheating is WRONG.

 

 

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If the NFL really wanted the Pats to win then why did the refs help the Seahawks "beat" the Packers?   I think this whole "ball deflated" thing is just another way for the NFL to distract the Pats in hopes that the Seahawks will win the Super Bowl. 

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Latest is that supposedly some Patriots locker room attendant was caught on camera taking the bag of inspected balls, disappearing with them into some room, and then re-emerging with them several minutes later. 

 

Is this person a Lone Deflator?

 

Was there a Conspiracy to Deflate?

 

It will be interesting to see what Lee Harvey Locker Room Attendant has to say if he's interviewed.

 

 

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