Pressing through the middle years of homeschooling: how do you do it?

[Chrysalis Academy]

I just read my weekly email from Simple Homeschool, and this quote really jumped out at me:

 

But all three kids are in middle school now and, like the middle pages of a story I love, I’ve found that this season presents new challenges.

I have to discipline myself not to become bored, irritated, or anxious to skip ahead in this chapter of homeschooling.

I remind myself that there is much to learn in the middle of things.

 

(here is the URL for the full post: http://simplehomeschool.net/middle-years-homeschooling/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+SimpleHomeschool+%28Simple+Homeschool%29

 

 

Does anybody else have a hard time with this?  Being here now, I mean.  I find it so easy to think & plan (obsess?) over what comes next, whether it's the next book or high school, that I have a hard time staying in the present.  And because there are so many cool things to learn, it can be hard to stay focused on the basic/foundational knowledge that a kid needs to be able to learn all that cool stuff.  I'm thinking particularly of science, where I realize that we need to stop and focus on dd learning basic chemistry & biology in order to understand the cool stuff that we both find so interesting.  But it's a chronic problem, I tend to look ahead and find all kinds of great resources for the future, but have a hard time choosing age and stage appropriate stuff that is still engaging.  It seems like my essay assignment ideas are always a little to hard, the books I want her to read are a little out of reach, I'm constantly having to revise plans to fit the reality.  Which is fine, I'm pretty good at seeing when I've overreached and being flexible.  But it has been on my mind a lot lately.

 

Do you have a hard time staying engaged in what your kid is learning in the here and now? Do you find yourself assuming they are ready for more? How do you maintain high expectations and the sweet spot of offering them things that make them stretch and grow, without pushing?  Anybody feel like talking about this?

[Nemom]

Wow! Thank you for putting into words exactly what I feel like. It is comforting to hear that a "seasoned" hs'er is having the same struggles as this new homeschooler.

 

It is only November of her 7th grade year, yet I have been literally stressing out and researching curriculum for high school. I have felt consumed by this desire to skip 8th grade and jump right into 9th. I am so distracted by it that I have not been able to focus on what we are doing right now.

 

I do have this expectation that she should know some of these things already. It has been hard for me to take my 40 yr old brain back to 12 and remember that there was a point where I did not know what I know. I have found that our day goes best when I am able to completely drop the expectations and just be where she is at. Unfortunately, it is hard to do sometimes.

[Amithy]

I think some of this comes with realizing the high school is really right there on the horizon...in a way that it wasn't when our kids were in elementary school. It seemed so far away back in Kindergarten. But, in the same way that is seems like it was just yesterday that they were born, we realize that it won't be so long, and they'll be all grown. We adults know just how quickly time passes.

 

Having said that, I find that it slows me down a lot if I remind myself that we have SIX years before graduation (7th-12th grades). We're only in our 8th year of homeschooling (K-7). So, we're just barely over halfway. That shifts my perspective.

 

Also, I think it can be hard in Western society to relax and take our time. We are very much trained to hurry and focus on productivity. Sometimes I have to remind myself of what my real goals are. Is it really my goal just to get somewhere as fast as I can? Or is it my goal to build a relationship? To build a strong foundation for learning? To teach meaning and character?

[Penguin]

Gracious golly, I do indeed have this problem. But DS made me conscious of it early this (8th grade) year. I was talking about high school to him too much, and he wanted to enjoy being an 8th grader. I have learned to keep my forward thinking mostly to myself.

 

I am going to miss the ability to pursue art, music, penmanship, multiple foreign languages and computer science without wondering if it is enough for a credit.

 

I have a couple of novels that I reallly want to get to before next year because they don't seem "high school reading list worthy." Never mind that I just read them last year and found them quite worthy. Anne of Green Gables is one in case you are curious :)

[Clear Creek]

Yes. It is a little like 1st grade all over again, when I felt that there was SO MUCH that she needed to know RIGHT NOW that I would forget to work on the 6yo basics like scissor skills, lol. Back then I had to remind myself that she had twelve years to learn everything, and now I am having to remind myself that she has four years in high school to learn high school level content; she doesn't have to start learning and producing output at that level yet. Especially not if it involves skipping over foundational material. I almost did that with science this year; I had planned for her to continue with the PHSE middle school series since it had worked so well in 6th grade (she reads the sections for overviews on a topic, then checks out library books on the topic for a more in-depth view of the parts she found most interesting). I kept looking at the Conceptual Physics book and and another book (maybe Science Matters?), though, because I wanted her to begin learning science at a deeper level before she reaches high school. But I had to step back and realize that she needed the foundational material before she jumped in the deep end with the heavier stuff, and it really would be ok for her to start with high school science in high school. It turned out to be the right decision because she is learning tons, and she is still excited about the subject. On that note, if I post in the 8th grade thread next spring that I am using one of the aforementioned texts and not the third book in the PHSE series, somebody please whack me over the head with it. :D

 

I am also kind of struggling with it in math, as well...she has been in the AOPS prealgebra book for almost a year, and while I have looked ahead at her algebra textbook and can see that she is probably at a point where she could handle starting it, she would really benefit from finishing the prealgebra textbook first. Just because I look at the unfinished chapters and know the topics doesn't mean that she does, ya know?

[Wildiris]

I deeply resist looking too far into the future. It is so easy to bound on ahead with plans, curriculum selection, etc. Yet in the moment, I find that we need to go over that chapter in science again because the notes DD took on her reading were too superficial, and if she were to continue taking notes this way, she would undoubtedly meet with failure in the future. I am always reminded of piano practice: Go slow in order to go fast. Laying a good foundation of learning how to learn rather than obsessing about the next step is what I remind myself when I get the urge to plan or get bored with the daily pace of school. 

[Chrysalis Academy]

You all are so wise  :001_wub:

[Lori D.]

Well, no. I did NOT have this issue at all. The middle school years were so free and such a JOY here. (FINALLY! lol)

BUT, I think that is because we had a unique situation. We had a VERY rough start of things homeschooling DSs, starting when they were 1st and 2nd grades. One had LDs that were still full-blown at that time, plus attitude/strong-willed. So, the first 4 years of homeschooling were a fight every single day, when I was trying to roll out the delight and discovery and love of learning, with loads of educational games, documentaries, field trips, hands-on, etc. Plus a boatload of stress and research trying to figure out what the deal was with DS#2, and then how to best address his LDs. Oy vey.

Starting about 5th/6th grade, DS#2 started to turn a corner on the LDs (and the attitude), and we were able to really ENJOY learning. We were starting to have some great in-depth discussions. Everyone had more patience and perseverance, so we could finally DO stuff, rather than deal with LDs or attitude. Whew!

Just to comment on a few of the previous posters' thoughts:
 

On 11/11/2014 at 8:17 AM, Amithy said:

I think it can be hard in Western society to relax and take our time. We are very much trained to hurry and focus on productivity. Sometimes I have to remind myself of what my real goals are. Is it really my goal just to get somewhere as fast as I can? Or is it my goal to build a relationship? To build a strong foundation for learning? To teach meaning and character?

Amen! Preach it, sister! The middle years were the time we were able to branch out and explore all together as a family, and really develop relationship, working side-by-side doing real-life things. DSs were able to volunteer at church and work alongside me teaching Sunday School. We all did some home improvement projects together. 
 

On 11/11/2014 at 10:08 AM, Clear Creek said:

I am having to remind myself that she has four years in high school to learn high school level content; she doesn't have to start learning and producing output at that level yet.

...Especially not if it involves skipping over foundational material.

I think this board and hearing about all the amazing advanced things that the gifted students are doing tends to add to the stress that we should be "doing high school in middle school". You are so wise to fight that urge and do what is best for your individual student in the long run!

One of the best things I heard about planning for high school was from Mary Schofield, who spoke at a homeschool conference I attended years back, about how middle school is crucial for making sure you have all the foundations solid, and only IF there is an area your student is advanced in and ready for it, do you move forward and do just that area at high school level in middle school.
 

On 11/11/2014 at 8:38 AM, Penguin said:

I am going to miss the ability to pursue art, music, penmanship, multiple foreign languages and computer science without wondering if it is enough for a credit.

I have a couple of novels that I reallly want to get to before next year because they don't seem "high school reading list worthy." Never mind that I just read them last year and found them quite worthy.

Just to add on: the "fun" and exploration does NOT have to stop at high school, or worse, at middle school. We worked hard to "tame" the schedule and the expectations of credits to be sure we DID include time for exploration of interests all the way through middle school AND high school -- through field trips, regular time for personal interests/hobbies, extracurriculars of interest, or counting those interesting pursuits as a partial credit (you can easily have 0.25 credits on the transcript!).
 

On 11/11/2014 at 6:57 AM, Chrysalis Academy said:

 I find it so easy to think & plan (obsess?) over what comes next, whether it's the next book or high school, that I have a hard time staying in the present...

Do you have a hard time staying engaged in what your kid is learning in the here and now? Do you find yourself assuming they are ready for more? How do you maintain high expectations and the sweet spot of offering them things that make them stretch and grow, without pushing?  

"Grass is greener" syndrome?

I found it helpful to allow myself a season of planning and preparing for the following year (for some reason, March/April is when that usually happened for me), and then a short season to purchase, schedule, etc. (in the summer). And then mentally close the door on that season. Be mindfully engaged in what we were doing this year, and choose daily to be in the moment without "itchy feet" to jump ahead to the next thing. It helped knowing that the season for looking ahead was coming -- but it wasn't NOW.

That meant, for me, to stop reading certain kinds of threads when I was not in that season. Or just bookmarking them, but knowing I would NOT read them until it was "my season". That helped me mentally be in the moment, both to enjoy it, and to be able to see if any minor adjustments were needed.

At this stage of your homeschooling, Rose, you really know your DDs; trust your very thorough advance research and schedule/plan, and only tweak as needed. At this point in the school year, continuing to research and scan for the best, the latest, the most perfect fit, is very likely just going to feed that "grass is greener" syndrome and prevent you from really being in the moment and enjoying the "now".

Wishing you JOY in the journey, and mindful, meaningfulness in the midst Hugs, Lori D.

Past threads -- perhaps with ideas to help?
- Once your child hits middle school, does this mean all the "fun" stuff stops?
- If you knew then what you know now (see posts by LoriM (#6) and JennW in SoCal (#20) esp. -- lovely!)
- Looking back

Edited March 10, 2019 by Lori D.

[EndOfOrdinary]

I found all five MCT student books on eBay for a super steal and snatched them up for next year. They came last week. Today I was thinking, "It's only November. We could start now!" Sheesh. I crushed that little demon thought. We are focusing solely on writing this year. It is going well. The kid has to really wrap up this whole essay thing strongly before we go leaping into an entire English curriculum again. Dumping something new on top and adding more is the opposite of helpful regardless of how pretty and shiny it is. I have to be stern with myself, "Self! We covered this at the end of last year! No more pushing! This year is going to be different, remember!"

 

Honestly, I am rushing forward to middle school (we are fifth grade this year). They are my favorite years to teach and I very much so miss teaching then to my pile of awkward, smelly, gangly kids each year. The growth in these years is so enchanting to behold. It is when kids really start to turn into people. Sometimes rather snotty, stubborn people, but their own people none the less :)

[Another Lynn]

I think this feeling (of anxiety? rushing ahead?) is strongest with the oldest one.  After that, it's easier to relax and say, "Ok, this is the path from here to there.  I've been here before."  (Not that I'm there yet, lol.)

[prairiewindmomma]

Yes! I have to remind myself that the curricula shouldn't drive what we do.... We should look at where the student needs to go and find curricula that matches that.

[Chrysalis Academy]

 

 

"Grass is greener" syndrome. ;)

 

I found it helpful to allow myself a season of planning and preparing for the following year (for some reason, March/April is when that usually happened for me), and then a short season to purchase, schedule, etc. (in the summer). And then mentally close the door on that season. Be mindfully engaged in what we were doing this year, and choose daily to be in the moment without "itchy feet" to jump ahead to the next thing. It helped knowing that the season for looking ahead was coming -- but it wasn't NOW.

 

That meant, for me, to stop reading certain kinds of threads when I was not in that season. Or just bookmarking them, but knowing I would NOT read them until it was "my season". That helped me mentally be in the moment, both to enjoy it, and to be able to see if any minor adjustments were needed.

 

At this stage of your homeschooling, Rose, you really know your DDs; trust your very thorough advance research and schedule/plan, and only tweak as needed. At this point in the school year, continuing to research and scan for the best, the latest, the most perfect fit, is very likely just going to feed that "grass is greener" syndrome and prevent you from really being in the moment and enjoying the "now".

 

Wishing you JOY in the journey, and mindful, meaningfulness in the midst! :) Hugs, Lori D.

 

 

Past threads -- perhaps with ideas to help?

- Once your child hits middle school, does this mean all the "fun" stuff stops?

- If you knew then what you know now (see posts by LoriM (#6) and JennW in SoCal (#20) esp. -- lovely!)

- Looking back

 

 

 

See, it's not really Grass is Greener - it's not that I look at other shiny curricula and feel dissatisfied with what we are doing.  It's that things I've planned and chosen, or that I expect, seem to be out of line with reality.  You are giving me too much credit for having chosen well for my dd!  What I'm finding is that many of the books and video-based courses that I thought we'd do this year have turned out to be way over her head - without the needed background knowledge, they'd be a waste of time at this point.  Well, duh, they are college or adult level resources! Why should a 12 year old be ready for them?  So reining myself back is necessary.

 

Similar with writing - she just can't cope with the interesting write a thesis-driven essay about what we've discussed kind of assignments that I want her to be writing.  She's just learning to write an essay, and can write a perfectly coherent essay on why dogs are better pets than cats, but when I ask her to come up with a thesis about the book we've been discussing and write an essay, she just goes completely blank.  Well, ok, that's actually the level of writing you would expect in high school - it's ok for 7th grade to be about learning the basics of the form, rather than producing beautiful, well thought out pieces of work.  Right?

 

These are the kinds of conversations I have to keep having with myself.  I guess one solution is to stay away from the Accelerated board.  Discussion over there are interesting, but I do not have that kid, and I think it skews my already kind of skewed expectations.

 

I've never taught kids before.  I don't have a great grasp of what is reasonable at this age.  So when I read about the very high achievers, I tend to set that as my normal.  First of all, I want to have high expectations for my kids, and second, I was a very high achiever/early bloomer myself, so that just seems normal to me.  I guess maybe I tend to filter out what seems "normal"?  And my kid is really, really normal.   Which is a good thing!

 

Upthread someone posted about the difficulty of letting middle school be middle school, of not having high school expectations of our 6th and 7th graders.  I guess that it was it boils down to for me, too.

[chiguirre]

Similar with writing - she just can't cope with the interesting write a thesis-driven essay about what we've discussed kind of assignments that I want her to be writing.  She's just learning to write an essay, and can write a perfectly coherent essay on why dogs are better pets than cats, but when I ask her to come up with a thesis about the book we've been discussing and write an essay, she just goes completely blank.  Well, ok, that's actually the level of writing you would expect in high school - it's ok for 7th grade to be about learning the basics of the form, rather than producing beautiful, well thought out pieces of work.  Right?

IME, the online writing and English classes I've seen give specific topics for their writing assignments. WTMA uses WWS1 and gives the student the fact sheet to use to generate their composition. Landry Academy's English 4 (8th/9th grade level) also gives a fairly narrow topic for their compositions and provides scaffolding to help students start writing their longer essays. Athena's middle school writing class gave specific assignments so that kids didn't feel adrift. They don't just say, "Write a 1000 words about the book we just read".

 

If you need essay question ideas, Pink Monkey, Schmoop and Cliff Notes often give topic suggestions. Glencoe's literature guides also have good thought-provoking questions.

[Chrysalis Academy]

I thought Nan in Mass wrote a delightful post about not expecting Middle Schoolers being Highschoolers.

She noticed in her years of homeschooling that every year middle school parents think their child should be an 9 th grader, while it is obviuous middle school is a transition stage....

 

I thought somebody bumped that thread every year on the highschool board.

 

I also thought SWB expresses in her audio that middle school is the time for skills and for repairing unfixed problems in a child's education.

 

I'm not sure I understood everything right. But these things I try to remember my self.

Even with required exams and inspection at home.

 

I love to see the progress by dd this year.

Last year dd didn't much academics because we moved, but for some subjects it became a solution, she just neede to be a little bit older,I think sometimes.

 

Here is a link to Nan's lovely post.  Off to re-read.

 

http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/3487-for-those-of-you-with-8th-graders-considering-homeschooling-high-school/?hl=%2Bparents+%2B8th+%2Bgraders&do=findComment&comment=39627

 

ETA: is this the one you meant, or is there another gem?  All Nan's posts are gems, I know, but I wanted to make sure I had the right post. It seems there was another one about expectations for middle schoolers but I'm not finding it right now.

[Chrysalis Academy]

IME, the online writing and English classes I've seen give specific topics for their writing assignments. WTMA uses WWS1 and gives the student the fact sheet to use to generate their composition. Landry Academy's English 4 (8th/9th grade level) also gives a fairly narrow topic for their compositions and provides scaffolding to help students start writing their longer essays. Athena's middle school writing class gave specific assignments so that kids didn't feel adrift. They don't just say, "Write a 1000 words about the book we just read".

 

If you need essay question ideas, Pink Monkey, Schmoop and Cliff Notes often give topic suggestions. Glencoe's literature guides also have good thought-provoking questions.

 

Right, these are all great suggestions.  I don't actually just say "go off and write an essay."  We have extensive discussions and if she doesn't come up with a thesis during the discussion (which she often does) then I am happy to assign or suggest one.  But she still gets this hopeless, blank look and doesn't seem to know where to begin.  She can write easily and fluently about a fluff topic, but not about a more thought-provoking one.  And I'm not sure whether to push through that and lead her step by step through writing a more analytical essay, or whether my expectations are not appropriate and I should just back off on the writing assignments for now.  This is part of the difficulty in gauging what is appropriate.  

 

So what do you guys think is more appropriate for a 7th grader?

Option 1:  Read and discuss good literature, and interesting topics in science and history.  Don't assign writing on those topics, though - work on the essay form with less challenging topics.  Writing essays about literature will come with maturity and is a more appropriate assignment for high school.

Option 2: Teach - actively and with scaffolding - how to do this kind of writing now.

[Chrysalis Academy]

And this one:

http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/68058-to-all-you-people-with-8th-graders-or-there-abouts/?hl=+nan%20+mass

 

That's the one I was thinking of! Thanks for finding it.

[JoJosMom]

Right, these are all great suggestions.  I don't actually just say "go off and write an essay."  We have extensive discussions and if she doesn't come up with a thesis during the discussion (which she often does) then I am happy to assign or suggest one.  But she still gets this hopeless, blank look and doesn't seem to know where to begin.  She can write easily and fluently about a fluff topic, but not about a more thought-provoking one.  And I'm not sure whether to push through that and lead her step by step through writing a more analytical essay, or whether my expectations are not appropriate and I should just back off on the writing assignments for now.  This is part of the difficulty in gauging what is appropriate.  

 

So what do you guys think is more appropriate for a 7th grader?

Option 1:  Read and discuss good literature, and interesting topics in science and history.  Don't assign writing on those topics, though - work on the essay form with less challenging topics.  Writing essays about literature will come with maturity and is a more appropriate assignment for high school.

Option 2: Teach - actively and with scaffolding - how to do this kind of writing now.

 

First, I totally understand what you are going through-I think I'm worse. I have one child and I'm not a teacher. I am compulsive and anal retentive. My inclination is prepare her for college by DOING IT NOW. Which I've had to accept is really, really stupid and really, really wrong. FWIW, I've gone with what's behind "Door #3."

 

WRT literature, DD just reads. She reads broadly and extensively on her own, so I'm trying to just let her go. She *hates* forced discussion, claiming it steals the fun (That was an OUCH and a learning moment: "What does that tell you, Mama, about how you are doing as a teacher?"). So, I occasionally assign something and sometimes sneak in a few questions-that's it.

 

For writing, we're doing Cover Story. All pirates, all the time. And that's it. Which is really hard for me. No history essays. Just projects chosen by DD(so they are all humorous, fun, creative-definately not structured. Well, we do some structured writing in Art of Argument and science, but it's mostly paragraphs. The high school essay is going to have to wait for high school.

 

Sometime over the summer, I finally realized, "Hey, I have a really bright, rock solid, almost-seventh grader. Which is great. Yay, DD. Yay, me. She doesn't need to be a great ninth grader yet. And it's really rotten of me to expect it."

 

Wow. Just re-read what I wrote and I don't know if any of this is of use to you, but BOY was it cathartic. Maybe I should have just stuck with :grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug: .

 

(Great thread, BTW. I shall now stick to reading the responses and the links. And thinking. :o )

 

[Chrysalis Academy]

JoJo's Mom, JoJo is a lucky kid to have such an open-minded, perceptive, and humble mother & teacher!  Thank you so much for sharing.  :grouphug: right back at ya!

[Critterfixer]

I like both ideas Rose. I think that scaffolding is important. I've just got fifth graders, and average to below average at that. I'm fine with it. (Average and below average as determined by standardized testing--they have their moments!) It's been a joyful thing to start giving them some things to get them to think and then letting them handle them a little at a time. We are not doing essay writing, not by a long shot. We'll get there.

Part of the whole reason I am really working hard this year (and probably through 6th, 7th and 8th) on creative fiction plots is to help with essay writing later on. I hope it will help, anyway. I like being able to read a story, figure out what the plot structure is and then go from there. I also love character analysis, and I think it helps if you know how a character gets built, so that you can pull out some aspect of that character and take it apart later.

 

I'm coming to this as a kid who ended up in college lit classes in what would have been tenth grade. I knew nothing of how plot and character worked, I had to just go on what I knew from extensive reading and my own poor attempts at fiction. My essays were a thing to cry over, and not in a good way. 

I could simply not understand why I was not able to please the prof. Spelling, grammar, style were okay, but honestly, that old curmudgeon of a composition prof cut me a LOT of slack. He got what my problem was and didn't ding me when he could have. My problem was two-fold: first, I couldn't grapple with a theme if I didn't know how to find it (plot structures, character analysis) and secondly, I was sixteen. I had not lived. I couldn't grapple with Life in literature. I was busy figuring out day to day living, thank you very much! The extent of my problems I needed to solve were not the problems that the college age kids were supposed to be grappling with.

 

In retrospect, I really wish that in all that reading through middle school, that I'd had someone who would have shown me how a plot was constructed, who would have told me how much goes into making a character, how character interaction happens, how you build conflict. It might have helped me not to be overwhelmed with theme. Of course, that person would have had my nasty tempered, bad-attitude self to deal with...

 

Sorry, a bit disjointed. Not thinking very clearly today for some reason.

[8filltheheart]

I only have a sec and am not sure this will be coherent and it is going to be rather blunt (take it in the spirit in which it is offered!! :) ), but here goes:

 

I do not struggle with rushing through anything with my kids b/c I really don't ever think about subsequent yrs.  I do not even have my 10th graders's next two yrs' courses identified!   We really build courses based on interests and skills.   I don't know where we are going to go until we get closer to getting there.  Not one of my kids has EVER completed a course in a similar manner to a sibling, not even when I have combined them b/c they each bring their own level of competence into the course.  Their unique twists take them in a slightly varied direction.

 

I do not attempt to replicate traditional courses at home.   Homeschooling once you get beyond learning basic skills is so much fun precisely b/c you can study what you want to!!  What does she like?   Until you are counting high school credits, everything is free game.   Why rush anywhere?   Thrive in the joy of learning what is a strong interest.   What does it matter what other people are reading?  My dd would never have read 99% of what she has read up to this point if I were thinking in terms of what she "should be reading."   We took books that she was reading and went on jaunty trails all over the place  based on allusions which interested her and we followed the trail.  Same with history and science!  There is so much beyond the typical high school sequence.  Embrace the freedom to enjoy it!

 

Right, these are all great suggestions.  I don't actually just say "go off and write an essay."  We have extensive discussions and if she doesn't come up with a thesis during the discussion (which she often does) then I am happy to assign or suggest one.  But she still gets this hopeless, blank look and doesn't seem to know where to begin.  She can write easily and fluently about a fluff topic, but not about a more thought-provoking one.  And I'm not sure whether to push through that and lead her step by step through writing a more analytical essay, or whether my expectations are not appropriate and I should just back off on the writing assignments for now.  This is part of the difficulty in gauging what is appropriate.  

 

So what do you guys think is more appropriate for a 7th grader?

Option 1:  Read and discuss good literature, and interesting topics in science and history.  Don't assign writing on those topics, though - work on the essay form with less challenging topics.  Writing essays about literature will come with maturity and is a more appropriate assignment for high school.

Option 2: Teach - actively and with scaffolding - how to do this kind of writing now.

 

I would offer my kids optional thesis statements.  We would discuss how they could go about developing their argument.   I would have them bring their work for each stage of the writing process.  For example, they would bring me their collected notes.  We would discuss what they planned on doing with the notes.  Next they would bring me their outline.   We would discuss how effective their plan was for proving their thesis, how to incorporate supporting evidence, etc.   And then they would bring me their rough draft and we would evaluate, etc. 

 

I'm not sure if that is helpful or not.   

[freesia]

I think you should do a combinations with your dd. I think you should work on paragraph and essays structure and style with your "fluff" topics. Then, once or twice over the year,do a thesis type essay with lots of scaffolding.

 

But, honestly, I think the thesis writing can wait, with no harm done. Ds was a reluctant writer. We are only really getting to thesis writing now in ninth grade. (Well, unless you count a run through most of LTOW in eighth grade, but that has plenty of scaffolding.) We did plenty of discussion and giving evidence for thoughts. You know what? He is getting it easily. We do WttW which teaches thesis writing--no problem. He is writing history essays with thesis statements (but not his own original ones)--no problem. It is okay to wait on written thesis writing. Really. Get the paragraphs rock solid.

 

But, no, I enjoy the middle years. They are able to discuss interesting ideas and do so much more. I like seeing their adult selves begin to emerge. I like running to the grocery store or a quick errand alone. LOL I don't actually struggle with pushing high school. DS was on an advanced math track--but I kind of regret it. I chose to do a middle school physical science instead of a high school one, so he wouldn't dred science. High school work is really interesting--but it all feels "serious" and a lot of work.

[Farrar]

Oh, thank you, Rose, for this thread. So much wisdom.

 

We're only just heading into the logic stage, but I really loved all the things saying how we should let middle schoolers be middle schoolers and not expect them to be high schoolers.

 

I find myself reflecting more and more on my experiences teaching middle school lately. When I first started homeschooling my kids, it was really fresh in my mind having just left that period of my life. I actually drew a lot of wisdom from it... especially how to help kids with all the various tricks of the trade for ADHD and sensory seeking older kids. Turns out that stuff is super useful for run of the mill 5 year olds. :rolleyes:  But then at some point, I stopped thinking so much about those experiences and this morning as Mushroom fell out of his chair, I was like, oh, no, they're nearly MIDDLE SCHOOLERS now - larger and unaware of their bodies to the extent that they bump into things and fall out of chairs. But I have been looking forward in a way to this stage for a long time, so I am hoping I can enjoy it...

 

We have changed up our homeschool a lot this year. I'm focusing more on letting us go down rabbit trails and doing weird projects. We're in the middle of learning about houses. We're building a small frame playhouse (that they're too old to play in, but not too old to build), studying history through how people live, reading biographies of architects... They went to the archival collection at the central library and learned how to use the microfilm machines and printed out the original permits for our home and then did newspaper research to learn about the original inhabitants (our home was originally owned by a man of recent German heritage who became a middle school principal and died in the mid 30's). We've also been doing more with math projects and more documentaries (we have had a great time discussing How We Got to Now on PBS). In a way this was how I always envisioned our homeschool, but when the kids were little, it never worked very well to follow rabbit trails, so we became much more classically influenced. Now, this is some magic age where it's working and I hope it will keep working throughout middle school.

 

And yet it's not high school, so I feel less pressure to get in all the classic literature (they're not ready for it all anyway) or higher level math (I'm hoping we do finish algebra and part of geometry in middle school, but no rush and we're on track), or serious lab science, or whatever. There's room to just mess around. Actually, this will sound very odd, but there's a thing in the first series of Slings and Arrows where the main character is tasked with some weird corporate Shakespeare seminar that has all these very confusing goals that he reads aloud that are very specific and high minded. And he goes, "I don't know what any of that means. How about we just f*** around with some texts?" And, of course, by the end, all the characters are reading Shakespeare and trying really passionately to act. And I guess I think that's what education should be... maybe always, but especially at this weird transitional age... let's just mess around and see where we get and try to find that spark.

[Clear Creek]

This is my favorite thread on the HS board in regards to middle school. So much good advice, and not all of it the same...some on shoring up skills, some on taking the available time to explore interests, some on just enjoying these years.

[Clear Creek]

 

So what do you guys think is more appropriate for a 7th grader?

Option 1:  Read and discuss good literature, and interesting topics in science and history.  Don't assign writing on those topics, though - work on the essay form with less challenging topics.  Writing essays about literature will come with maturity and is a more appropriate assignment for high school.

Option 2: Teach - actively and with scaffolding - how to do this kind of writing now.

 

Option 3: Discuss in-depth (defend thesis statements orally with references from the book in lit) until her essay writing skills catch up. Use picture books (simple reading that clearly illustrates literary elements and themes) to teach how to write about literature. Wait to assign essays on more difficult books and topics until the two skills are at the same level.

 

I am not asking for essays yet in history and science. For now, those are fun subjects that we read and discuss. Maybe next year, maybe in high school...I want her to be competent in essay writing before she tackles those two subjects; she could discuss lit all. day. long. so that is where I am going to have her practice her essay writing at first (once she finishes the writing curriculum that is teaching her essay writing).

 

 

[Clear Creek]

First, I totally understand what you are going through-I think I'm worse. I have one child and I'm not a teacher. I am compulsive and anal retentive. My inclination is prepare her for college by DOING IT NOW. Which I've had to accept is really, really stupid and really, really wrong. FWIW, I've gone with what's behind "Door #3."

 

WRT literature, DD just reads. She reads broadly and extensively on her own, so I'm trying to just let her go. She *hates* forced discussion, claiming it steals the fun (That was an OUCH and a learning moment: "What does that tell you, Mama, about how you are doing as a teacher?"). So, I occasionally assign something and sometimes sneak in a few questions-that's it.

 

For writing, we're doing Cover Story. All pirates, all the time. And that's it. Which is really hard for me. No history essays. Just projects chosen by DD(so they are all humorous, fun, creative-definately not structured. Well, we do some structured writing in Art of Argument and science, but it's mostly paragraphs. The high school essay is going to have to wait for high school.

 

Sometime over the summer, I finally realized, "Hey, I have a really bright, rock solid, almost-seventh grader. Which is great. Yay, DD. Yay, me. She doesn't need to be a great ninth grader yet. And it's really rotten of me to expect it."

 

Wow. Just re-read what I wrote and I don't know if any of this is of use to you, but BOY was it cathartic. Maybe I should have just stuck with :grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug: .

 

(Great thread, BTW. I shall now stick to reading the responses and the links. And thinking. :o )

 

 

I loved this post. I am seriously considering letting my daughter spend her 8th grade year focusing on creative writing, since she would absolutely love it - she has an amazing "voice" that really shines through when she writes a story, and she would easily write for an hour or two a day. I think she would learn so much about writing - paragraphs, transitions, showing not telling, putting her grammar knowledge to use - that she might profit more from practicing writing in story writing than in essay writing. Maybe I can put off having her write essays in various subjects until 9th grade.

 

But I am having serious trouble committing to this. I was reading a thread about curriculum choices on the HS board a couple days ago, and someone asked why writing programs were being suggested...weren't students supposed to learn how to write essays in middle school and be writing essays accross the curriculum in high school? And someone else agreed with them, so naturally I freaked out because unless a miracle happens, my daughter won't be proficient in essay writing until sometime in high school.

 

 

[hollyhock]

I just want to throw in my two cents about the essay writing (which I actually stole from SWB)... according to her audio lectures, kids in 7th grade are still writing outlines and re-writing from them. She saves essay writing for high school. Now, that's not to say that some kids aren't capable of writing an essay earlier, because of course many can. But as far as what's ok or what's normal for 7th grade, they really don't have to be writing essays at all.

 

My 7th grader, who is turning 13 in January, doesn't write essays. But his rewrites from his outlines are really nice and occasionally for our history research project, he comes up with a good multi-paragraph paper that could almost be an essay (we haven't yet studied the particulars of intros, endings and persuasive arguments yet). But I think after another year of this, he will be really ready to write essays and hopefully they won't be a big deal.

 

In some ways, it might be better to wait a bit longer, and make sure all the middle school writing skills are firmly in place rather than rush into something a kid isn't ready for that may leave him with a dread of essays.

 

I'm not saying that's what you're doing at all, but it can happen. Of course, you know your daughter the best, so you are the best judge of where her skills are and what she's ready for. I just wanted to point out that, in my book, she is ahead already, so I wouldn't feel bad at all about slowing things down if you need to.

[Lori D.]

On 11/12/2014 at 7:43 AM, Chrysalis Academy said:

See, it's not really Grass is Greener...

...What I'm finding is that many of the books and video-based courses that I thought we'd do this year have turned out to be way over her head… So reining myself back is necessary.

... Similar with writing…  it's ok for 7th grade to be about learning the basics of the form, rather than producing beautiful, well thought out pieces of work.  Right?

...I've never taught kids before.  I don't have a great grasp of what is reasonable at this age.  So when I read about the very high achievers, I tend to  have high expectations for my kids, and second

...I was a very high achiever/early bloomer myself, so that just seems normal to me.

... Upthread someone posted about the difficulty of letting middle school be middle school, of not having high school expectations of our 6th and 7th graders.  I guess that it was it boils down to for me, too.

Ahhh, gotcha. ?

I also had not taught before, and have average students. That, coupled with worrying about the mild LDs and if I was addressing them well enough and comparing with what was typically done at the grade level always made me uneasy, so  I tended to look at the scope and sequence of a lot of programs at DSs' grade levels each year, to get a feel for how much was reasonable to expect -- volume of assignments and material, as well as level of material.

For example: googling for the table of contents of Bob Jones subjects, or searching for typical middle school syllabi for English, History, or Science (the more "mushy" subjects that can be fun to DIY, but which also makes them easy to get off track with material that is too much/little or too lite/advanced.

For Lit., I looked in those table of contents, syllabi, scope & sequences, etc., to see what grades *typically* assigned the work. (Side note: you have to watch this, though, as a LOT of heavy classic works are getting assigned at increasingly younger grades in an effort for the curriculum / class / school to appear "rigorous", without providing the context and background needed to fully understand the depth and subtly of the work, and/or when the student has not really developed the logical, emotional, and experiential tools to handle the work. JMO!).

I also would check out the lexile reading level and other reading level measures, plus read a few sample pages from the Amazon "look inside" feature to try and gauge how /when the work might fit for our family.

For some things we were able to shoot a little higher. For some it was best to stay right about on target. In the elementary/middle school years, for the LD areas, we spent a lot of focused time doing individualized work and didn't look at what others were doing because we could not compete there.

And we did a LOT of bunny trailing. (Even managed some of that in high school.) Knowing that middle school was in many ways our "last window of opportunity" to explore, made it much easier set aside traditional schedules and follow sudden interests or follow bunny trails for a week or a month.

Over the years, I also found it helpful when putting together our own Lit. or History, to put little stars by some books and items that I thought might turn out to be too lite/advanced, or that we might just not have time for. Those little stars made great guides during the school year for "course corrections" if I found we did indeed try to do work above us, or, we suddenly got off on a fascinating bunny trail -- I could see where we could skip and pick back much further along on our original trail.

One other thing that helped me stay a bit more focused and more realistic of student abilities: each year in the summer, I would sit down and spend a day per student, prayerfully considering the big list of potential school subjects and what specifically I saw as the need (or no need) of the student for that topic, and list the 1-2 most important goals to accomplish with that subject area in the coming year. From that longer list, usually 2-3 overall major goals would arise, and I would keep both of these goal lists (the "big 3" and the individual subject goals) handy through the year and refer to it every 6-8 weeks and ask myself: "Are we accomplishing these goals? Can I check off any of these goals as completed? Are we getting off track? If so, why? What would need to change? "

Don't know if anything there helps!

Edited November 11, 2018 by Lori D.

[lewelma]

See, it's not really Grass is Greener...

 

...What I'm finding is that many of the books and video-based courses that I thought we'd do this year have turned out to be way over her head… So reining myself back is necessary.

 

… Similar with writing…  it's ok for 7th grade to be about learning the basics of the form, rather than producing beautiful, well thought out pieces of work.  Right?

 

...I've never taught kids before.  I don't have a great grasp of what is reasonable at this age.  So when I read about the very high achievers, I tend to … have high expectations for my kids, and second

 

… I was a very high achiever/early bloomer myself, so that just seems normal to me.

 

… Upthread someone posted about the difficulty of letting middle school be middle school, of not having high school expectations of our 6th and 7th graders.  I guess that it was it boils down to for me, too.

 

Rose, I have not read all of this thread although I really want to.  Just been way way too busy recently.  But I wanted to put in my 2 cents worth before the thread got away from me.

 

I know I'm quoting a paraphrase here, but it saved me some time (thanks Lori). I struggle with expectations too, and what I have found is that I need to have some classes at a high level, some medium, and some low.  Then, in my mind's eye I can cater to each of these expectations with the resources I find. So for us it goes something like this:

 

Math - Super high.  no need to talk about it!

 

Physics - High level, but done over TWO years, so done at half speed -  3 days a week.

Music - High level, but only because he started very young.  He loves it, so not really work. 6 hours per week including practice, lessons, and trio.

 

Mandarin - Medium level.  There are no content expectations here, only a time expectation.  45 minutes each day.  He gets done what he gets done.

Writing - Medium level. He works 5 hours per week on either writing or discussions.  So output is about 12 short papers a year.  Reading lit is separate.

 

History - low level. both in content and output.  There are no expectations here.  He listens to his dad read and discuss books that are at a middle school level.  He has written 2 papers this entire year on topics he was interested in - ebola and Islamic State (we are doing modern history, so they kind of fit in, but more interest led).

 

My point is to let her *choose* what she wants to do at a high level, and don't encourage *everything* to be done at that level.  Maybe she can rise to the occasion in your big-history/science class if you drop to some support materials first, but then allow her to write at a middle school level for English.

 

HTH,

 

Ruth in NZ

 

 

[Penguin]

(snip)

 

But I am having serious trouble committing to this. I was reading a thread about curriculum choices on the HS board a couple days ago, and someone asked why writing programs were being suggested...weren't students supposed to learn how to write essays in middle school and be writing essays accross the curriculum in high school? And someone else agreed with them, so naturally I freaked out because unless a miracle happens, my daughter won't be proficient in essay writing until sometime in high school.

 

 

I saw that thread and freaked out, too. And then I remembered that good writers are always learning how to become better writers. There is no being "done" learning how to write.

[Lori D.]

On 11/12/2014 at 4:58 PM, Penguin said:

I saw that thread and freaked out, too. And then I remembered that good writers are always learning how to become better writers. There is no being "done" learning how to write.

Yes! And just because a lot of students are advanced on these boards and writing at a high level in middle school, does NOT mean that's where the average student is.

Interest and ability definitely play a role in when/how a student it going to mature into writing. We were definitely BEHIND that curve here with 2 DSs (NEITHER very interested in writing), esp. with DS#2. It wasn't until about grade 10 (age 16) that DS#1 really got a handle on writing. And DS#2 with mild LDs in writing was just finally "clicking" a bit with writing in 12th grade (age 18). Both made another really good leap forward in their Writing 101 and 102 classes in college.

The Lit. & Comp. co-op classes for grades 7-12 I've been teaching for the past several years really confirms this: I've had 7th graders writing at high school level, and high schoolers writing at about a 4th grade level. I've also had 7th graders writing right at 7th grade level, and high schoolers writing at college level. SO much maturing goes on during the 6 years of middle school / high school, esp. in the area of writing! And every single student is on their own unique timetable.

Edited November 11, 2018 by Lori D.

[8filltheheart]

I agree that not all students are ready for essay writing in middle school.   My current 10th grader was writing essays in 6th.  Were they fabulous?  No.  They were very rudimentary b/c essay writing is a new ball game and there is a learning curve.  But, she is also a phenomenal writer.   My current 7th grader is a very creative writer.  Her fiction writing is fabulous.  Her non-fiction writing is not on par with her creative writing.   We are getting there.  

 

My personal objective for my kids is to master writing in middle school so that in high school we focus on the art of argumentation vs. the fundamentals of writing.   Even with my great writers, I still teach writing.  There is always something to learn.  ;)   My 10th grader and I are going through Horner's book this yr.  (I don't remember what we used last yr.....brain fog.)

 

 

 

 

[Chrysalis Academy]

 

 

I'm coming to this as a kid who ended up in college lit classes in what would have been tenth grade. I knew nothing of how plot and character worked, I had to just go on what I knew from extensive reading and my own poor attempts at fiction. My essays were a thing to cry over, and not in a good way. 

I could simply not understand why I was not able to please the prof. Spelling, grammar, style were okay, but honestly, that old curmudgeon of a composition prof cut me a LOT of slack. He got what my problem was and didn't ding me when he could have. My problem was two-fold: first, I couldn't grapple with a theme if I didn't know how to find it (plot structures, character analysis) and secondly, I was sixteen. I had not lived. I couldn't grapple with Life in literature. I was busy figuring out day to day living, thank you very much! The extent of my problems I needed to solve were not the problems that the college age kids were supposed to be grappling with.

 

 

 

I'm reading all the posts in this thread again this morning, and the bolded made me chuckle.  My dd is so not a grappler!!  She's a happy, mellow, every morning is a good one, compliant, sweet, homebody, contented child.  She is totally happy with whatever I put in front of her (well, except the complex essay assigments).  I am constantly asking her if there is something she would like to study, and her answers are 1) Horses and 2) I like everything you have me study, mama!   

 

I, on the other hand, grapple with everything - overthink it, rethink it, struggle with it, etc.  So it's natural to me to constantly question and second guess myself.  I am actually kind of envious of my dd's ability to just take life as it comes!  A big reason I love homeschooling is that it gives her this space, to just be herself, to not have to grow up too quickly, socially.  I need to honor that and not ask her to grow up too quickly intellectually/academically, also.  There will be plenty of time to grapple with dark thoughts in the next few years, no doubt!

[Chrysalis Academy]

I only have a sec and am not sure this will be coherent and it is going to be rather blunt (take it in the spirit in which it is offered!! :) ), but here goes:

 

I do not struggle with rushing through anything with my kids b/c I really don't ever think about subsequent yrs.  I do not even have my 10th graders's next two yrs' courses identified!   We really build courses based on interests and skills.   I don't know where we are going to go until we get closer to getting there.  Not one of my kids has EVER completed a course in a similar manner to a sibling, not even when I have combined them b/c they each bring their own level of competence into the course.  Their unique twists take them in a slightly varied direction.

 

This totally boggles my mind!!  When (what grade) do you start creating the interest-based courses? Have all your kids had interests to drive that? Do any of them say "I want to study whatever you think I should, mama"?  Would you create a whole study around an interest like horses, or does it have to be something more "academic"

 

I do not attempt to replicate traditional courses at home.   Homeschooling once you get beyond learning basic skills is so much fun precisely b/c you can study what you want to!!  What does she like?   Until you are counting high school credits, everything is free game.   Why rush anywhere?   Thrive in the joy of learning what is a strong interest.   What does it matter what other people are reading?  My dd would never have read 99% of what she has read up to this point if I were thinking in terms of what she "should be reading."   We took books that she was reading and went on jaunty trails all over the place  based on allusions which interested her and we followed the trail.  Same with history and science!  There is so much beyond the typical high school sequence.  Embrace the freedom to enjoy it!

 

I love this.  I don't try to replicate traditional courses either.  We both love what we are studying this year - big history, big science, and fantasy lit.  When I ask her about what she'd like to study next, she has no clue, though.  Besides horses  ;) 

 

I would offer my kids optional thesis statements.  We would discuss how they could go about developing their argument.   I would have them bring their work for each stage of the writing process.  For example, they would bring me their collected notes.  We would discuss what they planned on doing with the notes.  Next they would bring me their outline.   We would discuss how effective their plan was for proving their thesis, how to incorporate supporting evidence, etc.   And then they would bring me their rough draft and we would evaluate, etc. 

 

I love this too.  This is how we will handle writing about Macbeth - I will offer her a statement, which she can agree with or disagree with and we'll work together to develop a thesis and an argument based on that.

 

I'm not sure if that is helpful or not.   

 

Yes, always!!

 

[8filltheheart]

I have really worked with my kids to identify interests. I am serious about not knowing next yr's plans for dd. We altered her history plans for this yr and she is now doing an indepth study on communism (this goes to her attempting to discern if she wants to major in Russian or linguistics. A more serious linguistic study is being planned. I couldn't have known these things last yr at the start of 9th bc she had just started studying Russian at the beginning of 9th and became enamored with it. She spent 2nd semester last yr and the first half of this semester studying Russian history and culture.). Ditto to ds. I had no idea how much he was going o fall in love with physics and philosophy. I knew he loved math, but the rest evolved during high school.

 

Our oldest dd wasn't sure what her interests were, so we planned courses and camps (like a forensic chemistry camp whenshe thought she wanted to work for the FBI as a biochemist. Camp changed her mind when she realized it wouldn't be like Abby on NCIS.).

 

You could actually create a really interesting course around horses. I did for T, but then she changed her mind before we actually did it. I researched the historical influence of horses on various cultures (I am not the slightest bit interested in horses and was fascinated by the topic. ;) ) you can do a study of the biology of a horse (did you know it is a relative of the rhino and that they have use horse hormones to help prevent rhino miscarriages? Learned that from rhino Scientists in the Field :) ) so, yes, it is possible.

 

Lit courses are another area where I refuse to be boxed in. My kids reading lists are atypical, but meet their needs. J did a huge CS Lewis yr during high school and it was fabulous.

[Critterfixer]

 

I, on the other hand, grapple with everything - overthink it, rethink it, struggle with it, etc.  So it's natural to me to constantly question and second guess myself.  I am actually kind of envious of my dd's ability to just take life as it comes!  A big reason I love homeschooling is that it gives her this space, to just be herself, to not have to grow up too quickly, socially.  I need to honor that and not ask her to grow up too quickly intellectually/academically, also.  There will be plenty of time to grapple with dark thoughts in the next few years, no doubt!

 

 

So how about grappling with some happy thoughts? What is that quote from LM Montgomery about pigsties and pine woods? Pine woods are just as real as pigsties and a darn sight pleasanter to be in. At her age, what is she ready to consider? Friendship? Sacrifice for others? The lighter side of irony? The importance of family? (There is this great short story--I must try to find it about a girl who comes back to see her mother to buy a quilt so she can display it on the wall, and the mother gives it to the other sister, because she knows that the first girl doesn't value the use, only the monetary worth.) 

I don't know if that would be helpful, but I wonder if starting with the lighter themes would help in getting ready to tackle the darker themes. Friendship as a springboard for the poison of revenge, as an example.

[Arcadia]

And because there are so many cool things to learn, it can be hard to stay focused on the basic/foundational knowledge that a kid needs to be able to learn all that cool stuff. I'm thinking particularly of science, where I realize that we need to stop and focus on dd learning basic chemistry & biology in order to understand the cool stuff that we both find so interesting.

Your daughter can always pursue her cool stuff and then realise she needs to shore up her fundamentals. Like Dmmetler's daughter learning statistics to understand some research papers.

Sometimes its more relaxing for the parent to put the ball in the child's court to gain the skills needed to advance in their pursuits.

 

My jokers are fencing with sticks at a park while I get to surf the web :lol: I'm just going with the flow for my 5th grader. Its still exploration stage for him.

[8filltheheart]

There is also so much time to learn! Ds didn't take his first physics course until 8th grade. He never even read anything about physics in elementary school. Yet, during the following 4 yrs, he managed to complete 3 astronomy courses and 5 university physics classes. Where there is a will, there is a way. Seriously.

[MamaSprout]

Guilty. Sort of.

 

I went through a fit of massive planning going into 5th grade where I mapped out an overview spreadsheet of what we needed before high school. This actually helped me obsess less. Do I know exactly what I'll be teaching in three years? Not exactly.

 

If I see something I like, I plop a link into my spreadsheet and can see immediately if it is better than what's already there, or if it's just more. The "Low Cost" one in my sig is similar, but I have more info to myself and a mix of free and purchased materials in my private plan.

 

I work part time and by the time dd hits high school, I will likely be full time again.

 

My planning helped me focus on our homeschool big picture, eliminate curriculum envy and buying things "just in case". I'm homeschooling my youngest, so this is a once-and-done endeavor.

 

It actually slowed us down in a couple of subjects because I could clearly see that we had lots of time and could delve deeper and follow bunny trails.

 

If dd takes a notion to learn something new, we do. I now know we have lots of time to explore. And Rainbow Resource does a fine job of storing everything I need until I'm ready to buy it. :hat:

[Chrysalis Academy]

There is also so much time to learn! Ds didn't take his first physics course until 8th grade. He never even read anything about physics in elementary school. Yet, during the following 4 yrs, he managed to complete 3 astronomy courses and 5 university physics classes. Where there is a will, there is a way. Seriously.

 

 

Guilty. Sort of.

 

I went through a fit of massive planning going into 5th grade where I mapped out an overview spreadsheet of what we needed before high school. This actually helped me obsess less. Do I know exactly what I'll be teaching in three years? Not exactly.

 

If I see something I like, I plop a link into my spreadsheet and can see immediately if it is better than what's already there, or if it's just more. The "Low Cost" one in my sig is similar, but I have more info to myself and a mix of free and purchased materials in my private plan.

 

I work part time and by the time dd hits high school, I will likely be full time again.

 

My planning helped me focus on our homeschool big picture, eliminate curriculum envy and buying things "just in case". I'm homeschooling my youngest, so this is a once-and-done endeavor.

 

It actually slowed us down in a couple of subjects because I could clearly see that we had lots of time and could delve deeper and follow bunny trails.

 

If dd takes a notion to learn something new, we do. I now know we have lots of time to explore. And Rainbow Resource does a fine job of storing everything I need until I'm ready to buy it. :hat:

 

 

I do the exact same thing you do, elladarcy, but for whatever reason it just makes me feel like we *don't* have time to do everything I'd like to fit in!  I look at high school and it seems so full and busy with required courses. I am really committed to planning creative and specailized courses in high school the way 8 does, but it seems like there is never enough time in my fantasy plans for everything.  Which there isn't, obviously!

 

Confession:  I'm planning *my* fantasy studies.  I need to be careful to keep my ears open and plan the studies that fit my girls' fantasies, not just mine.  I actually think it would be easier if Shannon were a bit more opinionated about what she'd like to study! But maybe that will come.  She is certainly getting exposed to a little bit of everything this year with big history/big science.  I did that intentionally, and I watch to see where she lights up.    My second dd is actually easier in some ways, because she is more opinionated, thus creates rabbit trails more naturally.

[MamaSprout]

I guess I should mention my scheduled stuff is very much of a "less is more" philosophy.

 

Dd is very good about exploring her interests on her in the afternoons, although sometimes she needs me. She is very good about letting me know when she needs books or materials.

[Chrysalis Academy]

I realize that I'm making it sound like my dd isn't interested in anything but horses, which is totally unfair.    She's also passionate about theater and performs with a local youth theater company and loves Shakespeare.  In the past, she fell in love with entomology and we spent her whole 4th grade year studying insects.  That has passed.  Last year she fell in love with astronomy, but I don't really see the fire in her belly to pursue the math & physics she'd need to actually do that as a career.  That could change.  In the meanwhile, I feel like the best thing I can do is to make sure her math is solid, so that if it remains an interest she will have the background to pursue it.   So she has a ton of interests and we have definitely incorporated them into our plans!  And I've created individualized plans for pretty much everything.  Anyway, I don't want to malign my dd here and looking back it feels like I did!  It's just hard when I ask her what she wants to study and she says that she trusts me to know what she needs to learn.  It's a lot of pressure!!  :svengo:  :D

[FairProspects]

I realize that I'm making it sound like my dd isn't interested in anything but horses, which is totally unfair.    She's also passionate about theater and performs with a local youth theater company and loves Shakespeare.  In the past, she fell in love with entomology and we spent her whole 4th grade year studying insects.  That has passed.  Last year she fell in love with astronomy, but I don't really see the fire in her belly to pursue the math & physics she'd need to actually do that as a career.  That could change.  In the meanwhile, I feel like the best thing I can do is to make sure her math is solid, so that if it remains an interest she will have the background to pursue it.   So she has a ton of interests and we have definitely incorporated them into our plans!  And I've created individualized plans for pretty much everything.  Anyway, I don't want to malign my dd here and looking back it feels like I did!  It's just hard when I ask her what she wants to study and she says that she trusts me to know what she needs to learn.  It's a lot of pressure!!  :svengo:  :D

 

Can you guide her interests a bit toward things she hasn't experienced but you suspect she will love? I was pretty sure my ds would love to ponder ideas about alternate universes, time travel, what that means for us philosophically, but he didn't really have the maturity or experience to know that he would enjoy reading and discussing these ideas because he didn't have the exposure. I assigned some books like A Wrinkle in Time, The Phantom Tollbooth, and Tuck Everlasting and he is having a great literature year because of it. Sometimes I forget that they are still exploring the universe and don't have to know everything they like yet. They just have to think about something new and see where that will take them. :)

[Chrysalis Academy]

Can you guide her interests a bit toward things she hasn't experienced but you suspect she will love? I was pretty sure my ds would love to ponder ideas about alternate universes, time travel, what that means for us philosophically, but he didn't really have the maturity or experience to know that he would enjoy reading and discussing these ideas because he didn't have the exposure. I assigned some books like A Wrinkle in Time, The Phantom Tollbooth, and Tuck Everlasting and he is having a great literature year because of it. Sometimes I forget that they are still exploring the universe and don't have to know everything they like yet. They just have to think about something new and see where that will take them. :)

 

Yes!  That was/is my plan for this year.  She loves astronomy, and she really likes biology too, so I was thinking she'd love astrobiology.  I mean, I think she will love it - but she really needs some basic chemistry and bio to be able to get much out of it.  Thats what I'm realizing about most of the things in science that interest her or that I suspect will interest her - she needs some basic chemistry and biology to be able to progress further.  So that's what I've realized I need to focus on, rather than college-level texts and online courses that she can't really fully appreciate without the appropriate background material.  

 

This year is all about exposure.  But I think the next thing needs to be a focus on foundational science so that as her interests do develop, she will have the tools and background to pursue them.  Where I went wrong in my planning for this year was thinking that the texts and lecture courses that I can follow would be intelligible for her, too.  She can follow them somewhat, and she finds them interesting, but I can see she's not really groking it at a deep level because she's missing foundational building blocks.

[Arcadia]

As an aside, the last few chapters of AoPS prealgebra is fun and fast to finish. Also the Miller Levine biology text is friendly enough as a spine.

 

Just wondering what you mean by fundamental building blocks? Won't she ask you to explain or ask for your opinion?

 

ETA:

My problem with my boys is literature. Drama/theatre class is in the horizon. They don't like mommy taught.

[Chrysalis Academy]

She's working on Algebra, so her math is totally on track.  By fundamental building blocks I'm really talking about the basic principles of biology & chemistry that would allow you to understand most higher-level biological sciences.  For more than middle school astronomy, she needs to complete algebra and physics, so that's a ways off too.  That's all I really mean.  I just mean we need to work on some fundamentals - Miller Levine would totally fit that bill - rather than leapfrogging that and expecting her to be able to really grasp higher level stuff.

 

I'll give you some examples:  I have A New History of Life and Modern Perspectives on Our Solar System from TC.  There is a class on Coursera currently on Origins - Formation of the Universe, Solar System, Earth and Life and another coming up on Astrobiology.  These are all things she's expressed interest in studying.  I've previewed all of these, and I think they would be over her head.  Sure, she would sit and watch them, and we might even discuss them, but the reading they draw on, and the real content that they contain are over her head at this point.

 

OTOH, she did great with McHenry's The Elements (on the easy side), Dr. Art's Guide to Planet Earth, and The Magic of Reality.  She's learned a ton from them this year.  So I think that things on this level - Dr. Art's Guide to Science, Exploring the Way Life Works, The Third Chimpanzee for Young People, Science 101: Ecology, and things like that are more appropriate than a college-level Astrobiology textbook.  KWIM?

 

(Cue the chorus of, "Well, duh!"  Go easy on me! This is my first 7th grader!  ;)  :o )

 

It's actually been an interesting process to try and reverse-engineer that: to look at the things she's expressed interest in studying, and to figure out what background she will need to be able to really learn from those texts or materials, and to figure out the order in which to cover that stuff.

[Arcadia]

If you are looking at Hewitt's conceptual physics, you might be interested in the cousera course and textbook by Lou Bloomfield. (ETA: How Things Work. Link+ has the book I think.)

 

I also sign up for the just started Origins coursera course. It would be over the head for my astrophysics kid :)

 

I can never ask my younger what he want to study. He will honestly say nothing. My older is very opinionated.

[Chrysalis Academy]

I have Hewiitt's Conceptual Physics.  That would also be doable for her this year or next year, but I think we're ready for some biology and chemistry at this point, we did physical science & astronomy (w/o math) last year.  She did Bloomfield's Cousera class last spring in 6th and learned a lot.  She really struggled with the textbook, but she did read and take notes on the two chapters that went with the course.  She did all the quizzes and passed the course with I think around an 80% average, which I was happy with.

 

So she's not a slouch, she really has done a lot of great background stuff!  It's good for me to type it all out.  She just isn't ready for college courses yet.  Go figure.  ;)

[FloridaLisa]

MIddle school is such a mix. Sixth graders are still very much just mature 5th graders,7th a bit more and then 8th grade has always been the transition year for us.  We just kept progressively working in 6th and 7th. I really saw a jump toward high school work in 8th.  By 8th grade, most of my dc were doing text-based science, taking notes in class and from the book, and had the bi-weekly tests.  Even if we used a text for science in 6th or 7th, I didn't give tests.  I just didn't need that kind of feedback as I was still interested in the hands-on learning, discussions and written narrations. 

The only formal essay writing my kids have done in middle school has been IEW.  And that's just the kids who happened to have IEW somewhere in those 6th-8th grade years b/c of a co-op class.  I was much more pleased with the classical model approach used in  Classical Writing and used that in 6th - 7th grades.  

 

I don't think we really started formal essay and research writing until high school. 

 

I will say this: the one thing that across the board really helped my kids make the leap into upper-level discussion was participating in debate.  Most kids are overwhelmed with debate as a 12-year-old but with a year under their belt, they can discuss trade with China and the medical malpractice issues with pretty amazing understanding.   

 

Lisa

[Chrysalis Academy]

Lisa, that is a great point about debate.  We don't have access to that, but my kids both do theater, and it has done wonders for their ability to speak clearly and confidently and articulately in front of groups of people.  Not exactly the same thing, but I've seen it have huge benefits for them.

 

Plus, I don't worry so much about memory work when they are memorizing huge pieces of Shakespeare.  ;)

[Lori D.]

On 11/13/2014 at 8:13 PM, FloridaLisa said:

I will say this: the one thing that across the board really helped my kids make leap into upper-level discussion was participating in debate. 

 

Agree! AND it was a huge help in *writing*, too.

Even though the debating our DSs did was with Youth & Gov't (which is specifically in legislative format), it was still a HUGE help in organizing their thoughts, coming up with specific support, hooks/introductions, and conclusions -- all of which was used in writing papers! ?

PS
I know this is off-topic, and specifically just about writing, BUT… there are several past threads that have been SO helpful with LOADS of fabulous wisdom about teaching writing in the middle/high school years. Just wanted to link them yet again:

Bringing Karen's mention of essay writing to a new thread
Resources for teaching writing for high school
Can we discuss apathetic writers and college prep?

Edited November 11, 2018 by Lori D.