emzhengjiu Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 Before I read the article, I assumed the second case was a member of Mr. Duncan's family, but instead it's a health care worker at Presbyterian Hospital. We live outside of Dallas. I'm not afraid, but it's still a concern. For some reason, it seems worse that the second case was a health care worker. We're praying for everybody involved, especially Mr. Duncan's family. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMamaBird Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 I too am surprised it was a health worker rather than a family member seeing that they were with him for those four days. A lady from my church is leaving this morning for her second trip to LIberia to work as a health worker with Samaritians Purse. These health workers who knowingly wade into this astound and humble me! I know I'm going to be spending massive amounts of time in prayer for her over the next few weeks and I guess I'll be adding this worker in Texas to the list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farrar Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 I'm curious to whether it's someone who dealt with him when he first went in or when he went again when they knew he had ebola, but they're not revealing that information yet. My heart really goes out to their family. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joyofsixreboot Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 I read The Hot Zone about 15 years ago and it scared me. This is not comforting. Especially since the I assume the healthcare worker followed universal precautions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farrar Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 I also wondered... if they're testing the family to the extent that they are the health care workers. The family have complained about some of the treatment they've received. No matter what you think of them or Duncan himself, the more vigilant their care and treatment, the better off we all are in terms of stopping this now. It feels like we know so little about ebola, but surely some people are just naturally more susceptible? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emzhengjiu Posted October 12, 2014 Author Share Posted October 12, 2014 According to a live newscast I just watched, the health care worker was on duty during Mr. Duncan's second visit to the hospital. The worker also was following CDC guidelines to wear a mask, gloves and a gown, according to the hospital's spokesman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twolittleboys Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 According to a live newscast I just watched, the health care worker was on duty during Mr. Duncan's second visit to the hospital. The worker also was following CDC guidelines to wear a mask, gloves and a gown, according to the hospital's spokesman. Well, that would definitely be more worrisome. If it was during the first visit I wouldn't be surprised as likely not that many precautions were taken. But once they knew he had ebola (and given all the media attention etc.) I would have thought that they would follow protocol VERY stringently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emzhengjiu Posted October 12, 2014 Author Share Posted October 12, 2014 Well, that would definitely be more worrisome. If it was during the first visit I wouldn't be surprised as likely not that many precautions were taken. But once they knew he had ebola (and given all the media attention etc.) I would have thought that they would follow protocol VERY stringently. I'm getting ready to leave for work, but I would like to listen to the broadcast again later to be sure I heard that information correctly! Maybe the worker has underlying health issues that made her or him more susceptible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paige Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 I also wondered... if they're testing the family to the extent that they are the health care workers. The family have complained about some of the treatment they've received. No matter what you think of them or Duncan himself, the more vigilant their care and treatment, the better off we all are in terms of stopping this now. It feels like we know so little about ebola, but surely some people are just naturally more susceptible? I was thinking the same thing. I also wonder if there is any sort of preventative treatment they could give people. If the side effects aren't too scary, I wonder if starting the exposed people on some anti-viral or immune boosting drugs might be a good idea. I feel for all the families involved but especially for the 13yr old child in quarantine who is a relative of Mr Duncan. My 13yr old would be terrified. Hopefully the family suspected what they were dealing with and aren't getting sick because they were very cautious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twolittleboys Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 I'm getting ready to leave for work, but I would like to listen to the broadcast again later to be sure I heard that information correctly! Maybe the worker has underlying health issues that made her or him more susceptible. Hm, I have now also read something to that effect. And no matter how susceptible someone is to a disease - I don't see how they could catch it in full protective gear? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pawz4me Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 I believe the Spanish nurse has said that she thinks she touched her face with a glove after treating the infected patient. Even well trained health care workers can make mistakes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldberry Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 http://www.cnn.com/2014/10/09/health/ebola-spain/ This article about the process that occured in Spain was concerning to me. I'm saying this as someone who has not been in a panic over this situation AT ALL. This woman (the nurse) was a healthcare worker with known contact (not exposure, but yes, contact) and yet she was all over the place! At her personal doctor and at a hospital that was not equipped to handle her. Did they not have any kind of procedure in place here? Why was she not instructed to report directly to the hospital she had been working at? This situation, *if it is true* plus some of the questionable handling in Dallas is deeply concerning and does not engender confidence at all. I am really disappointed in the level of *apparent* incompetance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChocolateReignRemix Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 Fortunately it looks like they caught this fairly early, which increases her chances of survival and reduces the likelihood she passed it on to someone else. The response with the haz mat teams is also much better than before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farrar Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 Well, I'm glad they seem to have learned from their mistakes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 Obviously, I am even more concerned as this was from the second hospital visit, and the nurse was wearing protective gear. How is it that his contacts that were not wearing protective gear okay? I've heard the conspiracy theories. How likely is it that these people actually did not get it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butter Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 Not everyone who is exposed gets Ebola. Who knows why. Not everyone who is exposed to any illness gets it. There are many children in Africa who are now orphans who didn't get Ebola even though they were in their home with parents with Ebola. It happens. People are more likely to contract Ebola from someone further along in the course of the disease making the healthcare workers the ones at greatest risk. The nurse in Spain was in protective gear, too. Even with universal precautions slight mistakes can happen, sometimes with devastating consequences. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChocolateReignRemix Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 Obviously, I am even more concerned as this was from the second hospital visit, and the nurse was wearing protective gear. How is it that his contacts that were not wearing protective gear okay? I've heard the conspiracy theories. How likely is it that these people actually did not get it? First, stop listening to conspiracy theories. Second, to contact Ebola must have contact with the fluids and the virus has to enter their body (break in the skin, etc), so simply having "contact" doesn't mean someone will actually catch Ebola. It is a good sign that we have made it this far without anyone from Mr. Duncan's first contacts coming down with the disease. We are still within the 21 day window but the longer we go the better it looks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 Not everyone who is exposed gets Ebola. Who knows why. Not everyone who is exposed to any illness gets it. There are many children in Africa who are now orphans who didn't get Ebola even though they were in their home with parents with Ebola. It happens. People are more likely to contract Ebola from someone further along in the course of the disease making the healthcare workers the ones at greatest risk. The nurse in Spain was in protective gear, too. Even with universal precautions slight mistakes can happen, sometimes with devastating consequences. I agree with most of this. I just don't quite know if we should say she made a mistake... she had to have know about the other nurse (in Spain?) and been even more careful. What kind of slight mistake could she have made? Doesn't that mean it is easier to get than many people think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 First, stop listening to conspiracy theories. Second, to contact Ebola must have contact with the fluids and the virus has to enter their body (break in the skin, etc), so simply having "contact" doesn't mean someone will actually catch Ebola. It is a good sign that we have made it this far without anyone from Mr. Duncan's first contacts coming down with the disease. We are still within the 21 day window but the longer we go the better it looks. How did the nurse get it, though? I was actually relaxing thinking this was going to turn out to be nothing (just another news hype), but a nurse wearing protective gear getting this is really concerning to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catz Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 I agree with most of this. I just don't quite know if we should say she made a mistake... she had to have know about the other nurse (in Spain?) and been even more careful. What kind of slight mistake could she have made? Doesn't that mean it is easier to get than many people think? She could have brushed the outside of her protective gear taking it off and touched her face or gone to the bathroom. It's completely possible. There are many very small mistakes she (or someone else) could have made that would have led to this result. I have no doubt they were attempting to follow standards to the best of their ability. Things sometimes do not go according to plan during medical emergencies. I don't understand the jump to conspiracy theories at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 I'm not jumping to conspiracy theories, I just said I've heard them. I have considered what people have said, but I didn't say I believe them. It does raise other questions, though. Is this more contagious then most people think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChocolateReignRemix Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 How did the nurse get it, though? I was actually relaxing thinking this was going to turn out to be nothing (just another news hype), but a nurse wearing protective gear getting this is really concerning to me. Let's puzzle through it a bit. We know the virus can't pass through the protective gear (and that isn't debatable - it can't.) So where could transmission occur? Likely when someone is removing the suit/decontaminating after having contact with the fluids. Although there are strict protocols to follow, some go against basic instinct (touching your eyes for example.) Remember that while the healthcare workers are trained, it isn't like they deal with this all of the time. Mistakes can and will happen, which is also why they are being monitored for fevers/symptoms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChocolateReignRemix Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 I'm not jumping to conspiracy theories, I just said I've heard them. I have considered what people have said, but I didn't say I believe them. It does raise other questions, though. Is this more contagious then most people think? My recommendation to completely ignore them stands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 Let's puzzle through it a bit. We know the virus can't pass through the protective gear (and that isn't debatable - it can't.) So where could transmission occur? Likely when someone is removing the suit/decontaminating after having contact with the fluids. Although there are strict protocols to follow, some go against basic instinct (touching your eyes for example.) Remember that while the healthcare workers are trained, it isn't like they deal with this all of the time. Mistakes can and will happen, which is also why they are being monitored for fevers/symptoms. That's true. Was it not full protective gear (like a hazmat suit)? It seems that should be what is worn and then they should pray the suit off (with something that would kill the virus) before removing... I've seen that done under other circumstances (you've probably seen it,also). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 Hm, I have now also read something to that effect. And no matter how susceptible someone is to a disease - I don't see how they could catch it in full protective gear? they have to take off the gear . . . . . they are supposed to be decontaminated before taking off the gear - even then, spots can be missed. I'd like to know why the cdc is saying gown and mask when EVERY picture you see of care worker are in bunny suits (which are a more impervious fabric, and cover more), double gloves, and a respirator. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pawz4me Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 How did the nurse get it, though? I was actually relaxing thinking this was going to turn out to be nothing (just another news hype), but a nurse wearing protective gear getting this is really concerning to me. We won't know for awhile. Just as it took several days for the information about the nurse in Spain having touched her face to be made public. In the meantime, there is no point in speculating or ascribing wild conspiracy theories to the situation. I'm reminded of the old saying often used in medical circles of "When you hear hoof beats think horses, not zebras." Or in other words -- the most common explanation is usually the correct one. And in this case that would mean that the nurse made a mistake. Or it's possible that her protective suit was defective (pinprick hole, etc.). It's also possible it was damaged while she was wearing it (by a sharp instrument, etc.). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emzhengjiu Posted October 12, 2014 Author Share Posted October 12, 2014 I don't think the worker was wearing a hazmat suit, but was gowned, gloved and masked. I enjoy conspiracy theories as much as anyone,but I don't think this is the time to dwell on them. I would rather concentrate on what I can do that's positive, especially praying for everyone involved. It has to be scary for Mr. Duncan's family and for this worker and their family. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 We won't know for awhile. Just as it took several days for the information about the nurse in Spain having touched her face to be made public. In the meantime, there is no point in speculating or ascribing wild conspiracy theories to the situation. I'm reminded of the old saying often used in medical circles of "When you hear hoof beats think horses, not zebras." Or in other words -- the most common explanation is usually the correct one. And in this case that would mean that the nurse made a mistake. Or it's possible that her protective suit was defective (pinprick hole, etc.). It's also possible it was damaged while she was wearing it (by a sharp instrument, etc.). If that is true, that is very concerning. A pinprick hole? So a minute amount of virus got through the hole? How? Through air? Liquid? Then, once it was inside the suit, how did it infect her? I am not asking these questions to be argumentative, and you don't have to answer if you think I am. These are genuine questions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 I don't think the worker was wearing a hazmat suit, but was gowned, gloved and masked. I enjoy conspiracy theories as much as anyone,but I don't think this is the time to dwell on them. I would rather concentrate on what I can do that's positive, especially praying for everyone involved. It has to be scary for Mr. Duncan's family and for this worker and their family. That makes much more sense than a hazmat suit. I don't understand why they didn't have anyone near him wearing a hazmat suit. I think people believe it's very difficult to contract, which might explain that. I can definitely agree that we should pray for everyone involved, and I have been. Anyway, I've got cleaning to do... off to get started. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butter Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 I agree with most of this. I just don't quite know if we should say she made a mistake... she had to have know about the other nurse (in Spain?) and been even more careful. What kind of slight mistake could she have made? Doesn't that mean it is easier to get than many people think? Probably the same thing the nurse in Spain did. Accidentally touched her face or some other body part with a cut on it with a gloved hand that was contaminated. Think of how often we touch our faces without even realizing it. Not all mistakes are intentional. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pawz4me Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 If that is true, that is very concerning. A pinprick hole? So a minute amount of virus got through the hole? How? Through air? Liquid? Then, once it was inside the suit, how did it infect her? I am not asking these questions to be argumentative, and you don't have to answer if you think I am. These are genuine questions. I think the logical guess to answer your questions would be liquid (bodily fluids) and that she had a small cut or very chapped skin or some other kind of break in the skin barrier. There was an incident in The Hot Zone and I hope I'm remembering the important parts correctly. A veterinarian who was performing a necropsy (an autopsy on an animal) on a monkey who had died of ebola had cut her hand making dinner the night before. A minor cut that didn't require anything but a bandaid (maybe not even that). While performing the necropsy her outer glove started leaking and blood seeped in. There was a very small hole or tear in it. Thankfully her inner glove held. The point is that it really would only take a few minor things coming together for an infection to occur in a medical person who is coming in contact with bodily fluids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 I do not mean this to be disrespectful for those who have this virus - or those in countries where it is a real risk - but a headline I read just made me laugh. now it's time to panic, ebola is threatening the chocolate supply. (Ivory coast is the largest producer of the world's supply of cacao. they have shut their borders with Liberia and guinea. that reduces the workforce for harvest - and it is harvest season.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laurie Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 We know the virus can't pass through the protective gear (and that isn't debatable - it can't.) So where could transmission occur? Likely when someone is removing the suit/decontaminating after having contact with the fluids. Although there are strict protocols to follow, some go against basic instinct (touching your eyes for example.) Remember that while the healthcare workers are trained, it isn't like they deal with this all of the time. Mistakes can and will happen, which is also why they are being monitored for fevers/symptoms. This is what concerns me. I have seen enough poor hygiene practices from some health care professionals to worry about the spread of this deadly virus. We've already had the virus brought here by someone who lied about exposure to it. Now that it has spread to a non-traveler, it's going to be harder to just assume that sick people with a fever are "safe" as long as they haven't recently traveled to/from W. Africa. Are all the doctors and nurses going to be wearing the protective gear routinely in the ER, doctors' offices, etc.? Hardly. At some point, it probably won't be possible to assume that my family and I are "safe" as long as we haven't been in close contact with a sick person who has just arrived from W. Africa. I already have a problem with seeing the people in medical scrubs at the grocery store...when they're in the produce section it especially makes me wonder if they've just left work and what could be lurking on their sleeves! But then I'm a squeamish sort of person anyway...I also don't appreciate seeing the people who have to put their nostrils all over the fruit, health care workers or not! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butter Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 That's true. Was it not full protective gear (like a hazmat suit)? It seems that should be what is worn and then they should pray the suit off (with something that would kill the virus) before removing... I've seen that done under other circumstances (you've probably seen it,also). By the descriptions it sounds like they are doing isolation plus universal precautions. That is not a hazmat suit. That is gown, gloves, mask, possibly booties over the shoes. Hazmat suits are not very easy to get in and out of even when a nurse is only checking on the patient the minimum necessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twolittleboys Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 I am not at all worried about some conspiracy etc. but do think it is a bit worrisome that now two healthcare workers (Spain and Dallas) have been affected. It does seem that there is an urgent need to improve the procedures/training for people involved in such cases (not just ebola but anything really contagious). As the priest in Spain was flown in from overseas I would assume he was treated in a hospital (supposedly) well equipped for such serious illnesses (as compared to someone walking into a local ER in some small town). Of course there will always be human error and/or equipment malfunction but two cases seems a lot considering that there haven't been that many ebola cases treated in Europe in total. I do hope they figure out soon which factors need additional care/changing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perry Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 Keep in mind that these people are coughing, sneezing, vomiting, bleeding, having diarrhea... It's a very messy business and someone has to clean all that up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matryoshka Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 I think the logical guess to answer your questions would be liquid (bodily fluids) and that she had a small cut or very chapped skin or some other kind of break in the skin barrier. There does not need to be any break in the skin barrier. Ebola can easily enter the body through the eye or nose. I think I read in some article about that first US doctor that contracted it in Africa (and who also followed all protocols as far as he knew), that transmission through touching the eye is one of the most common ways for Ebola to be transmitted. We touch our eyes all the time without even thinking about it. The eye is a much larger opening than any small cut or chapped skin would offer, and the eyes are full of liquid, not scabbed like a cut or protected with mucus like the nose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PinkyandtheBrains. Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 I don't find it surprising there is a second case, nor that it is a healthcare worker. It's expected there will be a few. I'm glad they have access to good healthcare. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twolittleboys Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 The positive thing though is that it seems none of the people who Mr. Duncan was staying with seems to be getting sick so far. That definitely indicates what has been said: that ebola is not THAT contagious in earlier stages. Which again makes it less likely to turn into a huge problem in the US and Europe. So the danger posed by people "sneaking" onto airplanes though sick (after taking Tylenol etc.) or people riding the bus etc. without even knowing that they are sick should be very, very small. Not many of us would have contact with anyone so sick who is not part of our family/friends in our privat lives (this is of course not true for hospital workers etc.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pawz4me Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 There does not need to be any break in the skin barrier. Ebola can easily enter the body through the eye or nose. I think I read in some article about that first US doctor that contracted it in Africa (and who also followed all protocols as far as he knew), that transmission through touching the eye is one of the most common ways for Ebola to be transmitted. We touch our eyes all the time without even thinking about it. The eye is a much larger opening than any small cut or chapped skin would offer, and the eyes are full of liquid, not scabbed like a cut or protected with mucus like the nose. Yes, I'm well aware of that. But I was answering to fit Jinnah's scenario. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laurie Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 Keep in mind that these people are coughing, sneezing, vomiting, bleeding, having diarrhea... It's a very messy business and someone has to clean all that up. Not only messy. Expensive, too. People keep talking about how banning flights from the 3 African nations would be so damaging to their economies. I also wonder what will happen here and not just in the hospitals. It's going to be very time consuming and expensive to try to decontaminate the homes and cars of anyone who becomes ill. Even when done properly, I have to wonder how many people are going to want to rent the "ebola apartment" or buy the "ebola quarantine house". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
albeto. Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 If that is true, that is very concerning. A pinprick hole? So a minute amount of virus got through the hole? How? Through air? Liquid? Then, once it was inside the suit, how did it infect her? I am not asking these questions to be argumentative, and you don't have to answer if you think I am. These are genuine questions. It's okay to not know for a bit, Jinnah. It's okay to be ignorant while looking at all possible variables. Jumping to conclusions isn't effective, and is in fact counter-productive. You might try these tips to help keep any concerns under your control: Do things to care for and develop your intellectual well being. Put time and energy into continuous learning about the diversity of opinions and findings in the social sciences, especially, social psychology, general philosophy, adult learning, and marketing. Stop taking things at face value . Always try and assess the value of evidence presented, regardless of their personal appeal and the appeal of their ideas. Know how information has been gained, don't assume based on feelings of trust or peace of mind. Familiarize yourself with the mechanics of influence and persuasion. Recognize the difference between fact and opinion, and how emotions are manipulated to blur this line. Research epistemology - it explains how we conclude our knowledge is credible. Resist the temptation to believe the easiest explanation is accurate. Familiarize yourself with cognitive biases. Learn to identify when you might be employing one (or more). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matryoshka Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 Yes, I'm well aware of that. But I was answering to fit Jinnah's scenario. Just wanted to make it explicit because I keep seeing "how could this happen?" and "there must have been a cut/abrasion and/or breakdown in their gear". Much more likely they somehow got something on themselves taking the stuff off and then touched their eye. You can cut the risk of something like that happening down to be very, very small, but not to zero. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perry Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 There are many children in Africa who are now orphans who didn't get Ebola even though they were in their home with parents with Ebola. This is an important point. In any Ebola outbreak, children are much less likely to get Ebola, because they aren't typically the caregivers. It's the people exposed to the bodily fluids that get sick- family caregivers and healthcare workers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 I am not at all worried about some conspiracy etc. but do think it is a bit worrisome that now two healthcare workers (Spain and Dallas) have been affected. there have been dozens of health care workers who contracted this virus and have died, despite wearing protective gear. (including some of the top medical professionals in the hot zone) we have only recently heard about that because westerners have contracted it. westerners going in made it inevitable westerners would eventually also contract this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carrie12345 Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 I'm just left wondering how this case will impact volunteers to Africa. I've seen some projections for over there if it's not contained. If it's left to increase there, can anyone really pretend it won't increase here? We can argue about to what level until the cows come home, but we've already seen what 2 cases can do to us, sociologically speaking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twolittleboys Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 there have been dozens of health care workers who contracted this virus and have died, despite wearing protective gear. (including some of the top medical professionals in the hot zone) we have only recently heard about that because westerners have contracted it. westerners going in made it inevitable westerners would eventually also contract this. Oh, I realize that. But the assumption often was (or at least I have to admit that that was my assumption) that this was due to more difficult conditions (e.g. lack of protective gear, inferior gear, smaller numbers of medical professionals which means they might be more rushed etc.). Before these cases I just would have assumed that the better facilities in the West would make it much safer for health care workers. It isn't that I would have thought it impossible that someone contracts the disease here in such a scenario but two cases when there have only been few cases in Western hospitals seems a lot. I guess my expectations were just higher... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VeteranMom Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 they have to take off the gear . . . . . they are supposed to be decontaminated before taking off the gear - even then, spots can be missed. I'd like to know why the cdc is saying gown and mask when EVERY picture you see of care worker are in bunny suits (which are a more impervious fabric, and cover more), double gloves, and a respirator. The "gown and mask" reference really concerned me, too. I'm a nurse and have taken care of patients on full isolation in the past. That typically involved shoe covers, mask, gown, and gloves. I'd be curious to know what kind of precautions were being taken in Dallas. I've never worn or seen the bunny suits in a hospital. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perry Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 Before these cases I just would have assumed that the better facilities in the West would make it much safer for health care workers. I'm sure it is. These patients are critically ill. Health care workers will have many, many encounters with them throughout the day. Each patient will be in direct contact with many different workers each day-nurses, orderlies, physicians, lab techs, xray techs, doctors, housekeepers. So even though it is just a handful of patients, we are talking about many thousands of contacts with the potential for transmission. And so far we have one case of trasmission in this country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mathnerd Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 Oh, I realize that. But the assumption often was (or at least I have to admit that that was my assumption) that this was due to more difficult conditions (e.g. lack of protective gear, inferior gear, smaller numbers of medical professionals which means they might be more rushed etc.). Before these cases I just would have assumed that the better facilities in the West would make it much safer for health care workers. It isn't that I would have thought it impossible that someone contracts the disease here in such a scenario but two cases when there have only been few cases in Western hospitals seems a lot. I guess my expectations were just higher... I have seen a RN in a top University research hospital touch another kid without changing gloves after checking one child and I had the unpleasant experience of insisting that she change gloves even though the kids involved were not my children. What the laymen do not understand is that Ebola is an unknown disease with no known medication available as of today. If a droplet of body fluid remained in an "aerosol" state in the air for a few minutes, anyone who breathes the same air can be exposed according to medical information I googled a couple of weeks ago. Unless the medical professional knows that the person already has Ebola, it is impossible to take the levels of precautions that Ebola requires. And medical professionals in the West have not encountered this largely unknown disease so far and hence may not approach this with the same awareness as in Africa. That said, exposure to Ebola does not mean a full blown disease in the victim. Whether the virus develops severe symptom depends on the person's immunity, base health level etc. So, no 2 persons will react the same to the same virus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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