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Physics First approach


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I am a very strong proponent of this approach.  Knowing the physics without the math is very helpful, even for physicists (one of my degrees, btw).  When math drowns the science, then it becomes just another math class, not that I have a problem with math classes.  ;)

 

We use this in our family, and the BASIS schools follow this approach, as well.  They start in 6th grade, though, and use Holt Science and Technology, followed by Conceptual Physics or Physics First in 7th and 8th.

 

I never did get the idea of starting with biology, since modern chemistry is built on foundations laid by physicists, and biology is much easier when you have a grasp of chemistry.

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My oldest is beginning high school, and we have decided to do Physics first. After talking with a scientist and a couple of doctor friends, this makes sense. My doctor friend said that chemistry and biology will both be much richer with a better understanding of physics. In fact, they also did the physics first tract with their own children.

 

Like Mike mentioned, too much emphasis on math just drowns out the science.

 

:) Beachy

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Hello,

 

I am curious what your thoughts are on the 'Physics First' approach toward science during high school?  Has anyone tried this approach?

 

http://www.aapt.org/Resources/policy/physicsfirst.cfm

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Physics_First

 

My ds just finished Grade 10, and he studied physics during that year.  Grade 11 will be for chemistry, and Grade 12 will be for biology.

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We are doing physics first - it's just logical.

Physics is the most fundamental of sciences. All systems, including organisms and cells, are governed by the laws of physics. Chemistry really just is an application of physics. Modern biology contains a lot of chemistry. So, the logical progression would be physics- chemistry- biology.

 

The only reason, IMO, that physics is postponed in the educational system in this country is the sad state of math education that has most students unprepared to do physics earlier. Even that could be circumvented through a well designed conceptual physics course that would be accessible even for middle schoolers.

 

Both my kids are taking algebra based physics (College Physics by Knight) in 9th grade.

 

ETA: Physics first does not have to be conceptual. It is also quite possible to teach algebra based physics AND develop strong conceptual  understanding without physics "drowning out" the math as Mike puts it. It just requires that the student's math skills are developed well enough that the math part is automatic and the head  is free for the concepts.

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My son did Physics first. He had Algebra 1 in the 8th grade, and he wanted to take physics first, so he did Derek Owen's Algebra based Physics course in the 9th grade. He did Chemistry last year, and he'll do Biology this year. He'll probably do another more advanced course of Physics his senior year.

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By the way this is not a new concept.  I did this back in high school in the 70s!  I took the regular HS NYS Regents Physics class in 10th grade.  It was for top performing Algebra 1 students (we took it in 9th grade back in the day).  I really enjoyed it.  We didn't have AP classes at my school then so wasn't able to take an advanced class.

 

I recommend a regular high school Physics class early (9th or 10th) followed by an AP Physics or DE in 11th or 12th grade.  Most Middle schools now teach survey science classes that cover Bio, Chem and Physics as prep.

 

 

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Thanks guys,

 

This is great input and food for thought as I map out high school science.  I am really liking the rationale for taking this approach over the more traditional Biology First.  It helps to hear from others who have gone this route.

 

Fortunately ds13 has completed AoPS algebra and will be taking geometry his 8th grade year.  So I don't think he would have any problem taking an Algebra based Physics in 9th grade.  I actually had him go through a physical science text last year along with parts of of an online conceptual physics college course -  Louis Bloomfield's How Things Work - The Physics of Everyday Life.  ds13 loved listening to these college physics lectures and going through Bloomfield's text in part. I can see him developing a natural love of physics which is great.  Unfortunately we didn't have the time to finish the lectures or the associated text in 7th grade.  So I'm torn between finishing Bloomfield or simply moving on to a Life Science text which was the original plan for 8th grade science.  I may end up trying to do both though I'm not sure how valuable Life Science will be with a Physics First plan for High School.  I guess I could do half and half in 8th.  Maybe one more semester of Bloomfield followed by a semester of life science.

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Well, for variety I'll mention that we're doing chemistry first. My daughter seems to bump up against barriers in chemistry more often than physics. It's quite possible that this just applies to our situation, though. I had tossed around the idea of physics first, but then chemistry became the obvious practical choice for us. I should probably add that we actually deal with many areas of science every year. When we have a chemistry year, physics is in no way left out of the equation.  We have already cycled through biology, earth science, and physics a couple times, so it's not as though she hasn't had any physics. :)

 

ETA: If nothing changes, she will probably do algebra based physics next year in 9th.

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I'm currently lesson planning for a kid who ended up doing physics last.  We kind of covered Newton's laws in an unschooly fashion in middle school (rube goldberg machines, mythbusters, science fair, etc.) -- does that count as conceptual physics?

 

Older DD did chem 9th, then bio 10th, and will do physics in 11th.  The overlap between the physics and chem books includes the gas laws, state change diagrams, and the Bohr model of the atom.  Since we did all those in chem, we'll skip them in the physics text and have more time for other things.  The typical physics book covers a LOT of topics, so we definitely won't run out.  I can definitely see the advantage to doing two years of physics to cover it all.

My younger DD, going into 9th, is a budding physical scientist (planetary geologist/geophysics/astrophysics). I'm making her do bio first because I'm afraid it's going to be hard to get her to go back and get that life science graduation requirement in if I let her run wild with her natural interests. For her, I'm thinking physics 10th, chem 11th at the CC, and then her choice for 12th.  It's hard to say whether she should spend 12th on calc-based physics or spend time on her own interests (advanced geology, astronomy, etc.)

 

We'll see.

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We chose not to for DS/10th. Science is his least favorite subject, and it doesn't come easy. If he ends up in a science field his dad and I would need resuscitated. He's on a biology, chemistry, physics track.

 

DD/9th, DC #2, handles science better. It used to be a favorite, but isn't now. She is on the physics, chemistry, biology path. I can, I am, I ought, I will? She is able, and it's a better preparation should she end up in a STEM field.

 

DS/6th lives science and already plans to be an engineer or physicist someday. We're stuck between having him get biology out of the way first, or making him carve a hole in all the physics and chem he can do to fit it in later. I expect we'll know better hen he's closer.

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