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S/o on menopause - keeping your marriage together as hormones mess with everything


Ginevra
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I hope I don't regret opening this subject. *blush*

 

In the meno thread, I was happy to have the assurance that many things I don't love about myself at the moment do in fact go hand-in-hand with hormonal changes of peri menopause. What I find difficult, though, is figuring out how to not move to Tijuana in the middle of the night, leaving dh to figure out how the washing machine works and what to do with the chickens.

 

DH has hormonal effects all by his marvelous self; he is 51. He is more irritable, more retreating, more sleepy and less interested in brewing a cup of TeA. But I am not much help, because oftentimes I couldn't care less about some peppy brew, just want to go to my bedroom and shut out the world, don't feel chatty, don't want to be "on." I can see the potential marriage neglect.

 

We are on vacation now. Last night, dh and the kids wanted to walk to DQ and get ice cream. I can't eat ice cream anymore (Lactose Intolerance), and I had that whole comfortable-here-now-and-don't-want-to-go-walking-now thing happening, so I told them to go without me. Dh was quite miffed. "This is family time, don't you want to go with your family?" To watch you all eat ice cream? Not so much.

 

Anyway, that's just one little vignette, but I can see how his andropause changes combined with my peri meno changes could really put a hurtin on the marriage. Anyone have any insight as to how to get through it intact? (And please don't say counseling, because there is pretty much not a snowman's chance of that.)

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Can't help but do want to follow.  Things that never used to bother me are really bothering me right now.  And things that bothered me some but I was willing to put up with, are now making me want to fly to a deserted island and choose who can visit and when, and some days I am not sure DH will even make the list.   

 

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Can't help but do want to follow.  Things that never used to bother me are really bothering me right now.  And things that bothered me some but I was willing to put up with, are now making me want to fly to a deserted island and choose who can visit and when, and some days I am not sure DH will even make the list.   

 

this is SO me too.

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I think one of the first things is to talk with him about it during a lull in the hormone follies. One thing dh and I do is that we have agreed that when either one of us needs to go off by ourselves (or be by ourselves, as in your example), the other deals with it, without comment or criticism. However, if it starts to happen very frequently, then the other person has the option of gently bringing up the topic of how much "alone time" the other is taking.

 

Another thing we try to do is to both keep up with our healthy eating, any helpful supplements, and gets plenty of rest. I have found that a good, long nap can "cure" a lot of my temporary moodiness. We discussed how it would not help to have the other person nag about any of these things - the choice has to be a personal one.

 

So, in a nutshell, I would suggest talking and setting some ground rules. Perhaps you could cover the need for either partner to indicate that one needs to remove themselves from the group for a while, to remember that sometimes things are said that aren't really meant the way they come out, and at what point should the other partner actually intervene if they feel the first one is really sinking into a bad place and might need professional help.

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I have been through some of that.  It's an adjustment. 

 

My husband is 8 years younger than me, and I went through early menopause, so we have been in and out of sync at times.  I was also over 40 when both my kids were born, so my timing has just never been "normal" iykwim.

 

I wonder, do you and your husband talk about it?  Do you acknowledge the changes you are both going through and talk about how you are feeling?    I've always been an introvert and need my space more and more.   But my kids (one in particular) still need me.  I still have a relationship with my husband - that is not going away.    I try to find ways to claim my own space and time.  I try to schedule morning coffee or evening wine dates with a friend.  I go out by myself sometimes.  But I also go out with the family when I don't want to.  That's just a part of family life, I think.  My kids aren't always keen to go to family events, but they go. 

 

Using your DQ example.  If I really didn't want to go, I'd say something like "hey, I could use some down time, and it's good for you and the kids to do some things without me.  Go on and have a good time."  Since my husband would already know about my growing need for people to just leave.me.alone, it wouldn't seem weird. But if everyone really wanted me along, I would go and get something else to eat, or just not eat.  There is a particular restaurant everyone in my family likes but me.  When they get a hankering to go, sometimes I go and find something I can tolerate, and sometimes I beg off.   (ETA: I know not liking something is not the same as not being able to eat it, so it is not quite comparable.)  Sometimes it's a struggle to be gracious about it. 

 

I don't think you necessarily need counseling for this unless there is a lack of honest communication.  So far, it works for us to acknowledge the changes and figure out how to manage them.  

 

Three or four people have posted since I started this, so I'm anxious to hit post and see what they have to say!

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No idea about the menopause, but perhaps you should invest in some of Lactaid and just keep some in your purse or glove box. Often times there is a hotdog or fries or something you can order from places like DQ that isn't a milk product at all.

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I wonder, do you and your husband talk about it? Do you acknowledge the changes you are both going through and talk about how you are feeling? I've always been an introvert and need my space more and more. But my kids (one in particular) still need me. I still have a relationship with my husband - that is not going away. I try to find ways to claim my own space and time. I try to schedule morning coffee or evening wine dates with a friend. I go out by myself sometimes. But I also go out with the family when I don't want to. That's just a part of family life, I think. My kids aren't always keen to go to family events, but they go.

 

Using your DQ example. If I realty didn't want to go, I'd say something like "hey, I could use some down time, and it's good for you and the kids to do some things without me. Go on and have a good time." Since my husband would already know about my growing need for people to just leave.me.alone, it wouldn't seem weird. But if everyone really wanted me along, I would go and get something else to eat, or just not eat. There is a particular restaurant everyone in my family likes but me. When they get a hankering to go, sometimes I go and find something I can tolerate, and sometimes I beg off. Sometimes it's a struggle to be gracious about it.

 

We don't really talk about the changes. I may talk about mine, but I don't think he makes a connection like that for himself. If women fail to talk about the changes of this phase of life, how much less is it common for men to talk, kwim?

 

We are both introverts, so there has not historically been misunderstandings about either of us needing alone time. When he comes home from work, he retreats with the dog to his shop/Garage-mahal for a few hours, for instance. We have both taken trips without the other and we both often have activities we do alone, with friends, or with one or two of the kids. Never been a big deal. I guess with the ice cream example, he felt that we're on a family vacation, so going without me felt odd. He said he imagined people will think he is a "weekend dad" out with his kids before they go back to their mother. I don't know...I probably should have sucked it up and gone in this instance. That is probably a whole separate issue of its own - I am a "pleaser" to begin with and I find I am less willing now than earlier to do something just to keep the ship sailing.

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My poor dh hears everything from me.  I decided a year ago to just tell him how I was feeling and what I was feeling.    He actually gets it now...and respects my need for some quiet time, not tolerating the heat and the day to day challenges going on in my world.     I think we need to keep our men in the loop and be upfront with how we feel and what's happening to us.     

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I am 51 and dh is 49 and I think it is just a matter of trying harder (not just talking about tea btw), for us anyway. I haven't always wanted to because it is an effort and, frankly, I am tired. But we have watched over the past two or three years a lot of friends and acquaintances end their marriages. It has been a good reminder that just because you have been married for a long time doesn't mean you can count on it. Some of these couples we sort of started out with, have kids the same ages, and would never have predicted them divorcing. It is really sad for everyone and I really, really don't want to go there.

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We don't really talk about the changes. I may talk about mine, but I don't think he makes a connection like that for himself. If women fail to talk about the changes of this phase of life, how much less is it common for men to talk, kwim?

 

We are both introverts, so there has not historically been misunderstandings about either of us needing alone time. When he comes home from work, he retreats with the dog to his shop/Garage-mahal for a few hours, for instance. We have both taken trips without the other and we both often have activities we do alone, with friends, or with one or two of the kids. Never been a big deal. I guess with the ice cream example, he felt that we're on a family vacation, so going without me felt odd. He said he imagined people will think he is a "weekend dad" out with his kids before they go back to their mother. I don't know...I probably should have sucked it up and gone in this instance. That is probably a whole separate issue of its own - I am a "pleaser" to begin with and I find I am less willing now than earlier to do something just to keep the ship sailing.

 

I guess I can see that on a family vacation, it makes sense to do things as a family.  I would probably be annoyed with my husband if he begged off doing something while we were on vacation.  But on the other hand I spend much more time with the kids so it's more important for him to spend vacation time with them.  

 

But the thing about people thinking he's a weekend dad... that just sort of stuck out at me.  Does he ever do things with just the kids (sorry, I can't see sigs if your kids ages and such are there, and I can't remember), without you?  Does he generally worry what people think of him like that?  You are on vacation, away from home, so they aren't even people he knows or is going to encounter again, right? 

 

Sorry if I am derailing too much or going somewhere I shouldn't.  As always, you are free to ignore me.  :001_smile:    I just saw that and went "whoa."  That puts a lot of pressure on you to always be available and ready to do things.

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I have said before I think hormones are partly responsible for marriages going off in the ditch mid life.

 

Women especially tend to give give give and one day they just throw their hands up and walk away.

 

I know that is an over simplification but I do believe there is a connection to our hormones.

 

I think the trick is finding balance. How to be nurturing, while taking care of oneself. How to keep being kind when you feel like ripping someone's head off. ;)

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I guess I can see that on a family vacation, it makes sense to do things as a family. I would probably be annoyed with my husband if he begged off doing something while we were on vacation. But on the other hand I spend much more time with the kids so it's more important for him to spend vacation time with them.

 

But the thing about people thinking he's a weekend dad... that just sort of stuck out at me. Does he ever do things with just the kids (sorry, I can't see sigs if your kids ages and such are there, and I can't remember), without you? Does he generally worry what people think of him like that? You are on vacation, away from home, so they aren't even people he knows or is going to encounter again, right?

 

Sorry if I am derailing too much or going somewhere I shouldn't. As always, you are free to ignore me. :001_smile: I just saw that and went "whoa." That puts a lot of pressure on you to always be available and ready to do things.

He does do things with the kids without me pretty often. I actually think that it does not bother him when he's with folks who know us, but is bothered when it's folks who don't. It is not at all rare for him to do things with just the boys (they are 9 and 14), just based on the things they want to do that I and dd don't, such as watch a motocross race.

 

I do think there is some anxiety for him as we see long-term, big-surprise marriages breaking up around us, just as a PP mentioned up thread. It seems like, when we were young, there were a lot of early-marriage divorces among friends of ours, but then that settled down. For the past fifteen or so years, there have been few, possibly no, divorces among friends and family. But that is changing now. We know several 15-20-year marriages ending now. I think it feels threatening to us both.

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Women especially tend to give give give and one day they just throw their hands up and walk away

I can see that. I am a very peaceful person. I do a lot of things just to be agreeable. I do feel many times now, though, like just telling people to stuff it and be mad at me, if that's how it has to be, kwim?

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He said he imagined people will think he is a "weekend dad" out with his kids before they go back to their mother.

 

Side note-seriously, why does he even care what a bunch of strangers think?  He is never going to see them again.

 

I can totally relate to what you are going through with the hormones.  My dh has been ill for a number of years now and being caretaker and my own hormonal shifts have left me wishing I can hole up on an island by myself. Dh just spent a week at his mothers to give me a break and I am kind of sad he is back now.  I feel horrible about that.  It was just so peaceful for me when he was gone.

 

You need to find a time when you are both having moment of lucidity (as we like to call them in our house) to discuss what is going on with you.

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Side note-seriously, why does he even care what a bunch of strangers think? He is never going to see them again.

 

I can totally relate to what you are going through with the hormones. My dh has been ill for a number of years now and being caretaker and my own hormonal shifts have left me wishing I can hole up on an island by myself. Dh just spent a week at his mothers to give me a break and I am kind of sad he is back now. I feel horrible about that. It was just so peaceful for me when he was gone.

 

You need to find a time when you are both having moment of lucidity (as we like to call them in our house) to discuss what is going on with you.

I think the weekend dad comment was a clue that he is concerned about winding up as one.

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Not that I think his concerns about ending up as a weekend dad are not important but I think he is missing the big picture here in terms of your needs.  If my dh made a comment like that in my current state of mind he would find that concern coming 100% true.

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Not that I think his concerns about ending up as a weekend dad are not important but I think he is missing the big picture here in terms of your needs. If my dh made a comment like that in my current state of mind he would find that concern coming 100% true.

Hee, heee. You made me chuckle at that one!

 

Not to pile sh!tt on top of sh!itt, but he is currently going through a "divorce" in his work life (which is also my work life, because i am his secretary). His brother, who has been his partner in their two companies for their entire careers, wants to separate the partnerships on a two-year time frame. We were talking about some logistics before the ice-cream incident. He is so distressed about the business separation. I think he needed to feel that, "well, at least my wife is still beside me," but then, i wasn't. I think, for me, the stress of talking about the businesses just made me want to retreat even more, but it made him more needy of a feeling of solidarity.

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I understand. I'm 46 and peri-menopause has been kicking my butt this year. Starting with a complete inability to lose weight, then gaining 15 lbs in 6 months, then having a yeast infection I couldn't get over, interpersed with having AF 5 times in 2 months. And that's just the physical symptoms. I was having an emotional roller coaster that was really starting to scare me. Not just being a little more irritable, but like, "whoah, this really isn't me, and if it gets a little worse I could end up on the evening news" type of emotional swings. I did talk to my GYN and she put me on the Pill. I'm sure that could be controversial in this group, and I'm not saying it's for anyone else, but for me.... it saved me. I still can't lose weight, but my cycles are regular and my emotions are stable. I don't know what the long term plan is, but it gave me a lot of relief.

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It's not much, but DH and I make a point of spending time with each other. I used to eat in front of the tv but I learned that we needed to sit at the dinner table together. We talk about how our day went. I also use him like google to start conversations. I get a lot of topics from this board. I've suffered from insomnia for years. I had to make a point to go to bed at the same time as DH even though I often got out of bed after he fell asleep.

 

I'm 46 and he's 57. I have noticed some changes in him. The biggest one is that he is more impatient, usually when he's driving. So I told him that it bothered me and now I do more of the driving. I think I have tried retreating into my own world a lot more within the past year or so. I used to want to spend time around my family all the time. Now I'm happy to go into my bedroom and either read or watch tv by myself. I still do that, but only during the day while DH is at work. Oh, my kids are older teens so they don't need me like they used to. That makes spending time alone easier.

 

I wish I could say we talk about all the little things that bother us. I don't know how to bring them up without having hurt feelings on both sides. I like to say we can talk about anything, but I've learned to live with little things. An example is that he reads over my shoulder. We read in bed and he'll put down his book and read my book/Kindle. It's such a small thing but it really does irk me. :tongue_smilie:

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Or when you feel completely trapped.

 

I could say a lot more, but I know the board rules.  I will say that DH and I are on completely different pages about me staying at home and even about homeschooling.  He begged me to be a SAHM.  It isn't my personality.  I can't stand it.  After 9 years, I still don't like it.  I don't even like HSing.  

 

 

 

 

I have said before I think hormones are partly responsible for marriages going off in the ditch mid life.

Women especially tend to give give give and one day they just throw their hands up and walk away.

I know that is an over simplification but I do believe there is a connection to our hormones.

I think the trick is finding balance. How to be nurturing, while taking care of oneself. How to keep being kind when you feel like ripping someone's head off. ;)

 

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I understand. I'm 46 and peri-menopause has been kicking my butt this year. Starting with a complete inability to lose weight, then gaining 15 lbs in 6 months, then having a yeast infection I couldn't get over, interpersed with having AF 5 times in 2 months. And that's just the physical symptoms. I was having an emotional roller coaster that was really starting to scare me. Not just being a little more irritable, but like, "whoah, this really isn't me, and if it gets a little worse I could end up on the evening news" type of emotional swings. I did talk to my GYN and she put me on the Pill. I'm sure that could be controversial in this group, and I'm not saying it's for anyone else, but for me.... it saved me. I still can't lose weight, but my cycles are regular and my emotions are stable. I don't know what the long term plan is, but it gave me a lot of relief.

When I get back home, I plan to talk to my gyn and going back on the pill might be the route I take. i have been on it in recent years for emotional stability, acne and heavy periods and it absolutely helped enormously. Then, my mother got breast cancer and it scared my pants off. I abruptly quit the pill. But now, this month, the period irregularity and the mood swings are getting freakish. I really don't want to live like this.

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Or when you feel completely trapped.

 

I could say a lot more, but I know the board rules. I will say that DH and I are on completely different pages about me staying at home and even about homeschooling. He begged me to be a SAHM. It isn't my personality. I can't stand it. After 9 years, I still don't like it. I don't even like HSing.

I'm sorry. (((Hug))). I hear you. I "liked" your post, not because I like it, but so you feel heard. You're welcome to PM me if you want to talk.

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Or when you feel completely trapped.

 

I could say a lot more, but I know the board rules. I will say that DH and I are on completely different pages about me staying at home and even about homeschooling. He begged me to be a SAHM. It isn't my personality. I can't stand it. After 9 years, I still don't like it. I don't even like HSing.

Wow. That must be really tough. Seems like 9 years would be long enough. Can you renegotiate your contract?

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When I get back home, I plan to talk to my gyn and going back on the pill might be the route I take. i have been on it in recent years for emotional stability, acne and heavy periods and it absolutely helped enormously. Then, my mother got breast cancer and it scared my pants off. I abruptly quit the pill. But now, this month, the period irregularity and the mood swings are getting freakish. I really don't want to live like this.

Quill before you go on the pill you might get a full blood panel done so you know where you are in the stream of time. Once you start taking the pill IHOP won't be able to get an accurate reading.

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My observations about things that cause (usually) women to flip out and divorce seemingly suddenly...

 

1. Years of unresolved resentment and conflict

2. Inability to see that your partner has made an effort to change things you have been unhappy with

3. Voicing said resentments to people who are not 'friends of your marriage' which leads to encouragement to abandon your vows

4. Voicing unhappiness to an opposite sex person which very often leads to affairs which often turn into exit affairs.

5. Failure to feed your marriage...

6. Failure to care for yourself.

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All I know is, this is spot-on with how I've been feeling. Some days I'm okay when he walks in the door after work; others I just cringe when he drives up the driveway.

 

My husband is extremely patient with me, my moodiness and occasional outbursts, so that's nice. Otoh, he is extremely OCD and has Been diagnosed in the past with Borderline Personality Disorder, which makes it all the harder for me to deal with him when I'm already on the verge of throwing things.

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For me, I'm okay with dh most of the time, but in the last year or so a couple of things really bother me.

 

1. He chews too loudly and slumps at the table. Seriously, his teeth clack. I never noticed it before and my kids are like, "Daddy's teeth have always done that."

 

2. At night, his breathing irritates me. If I'm awake, just the sound of the air going in and out will make me get up and got to the couch. I won't mention what it is like on nights when his allergies kick in.

 

 The bad thing about this is I've always been one to insist that the family eats together every night, and that dh and I must share a bed to be "properly" married. I'm laughing at myself now.

 

Also, it never occurred to me that dh would start to look old....and what does he see when he looks at me?

 

My mother left my dad at this season in her life for   all the reasons Scarlett mentioned above: 

 

1. Years of unresolved resentment and conflict
2. Inability to see that your partner has made an effort to change things you have been unhappy with
3. Voicing said resentments to people who are not 'friends of your marriage' which leads to encouragement to abandon your vows
4. Voicing unhappiness to an opposite sex person which very often leads to affairs which often turn into exit affairs.
5. Failure to feed your marriage...
6. Failure to care for yourself.

 

I've been careful to avoid most of these particular issues because of that. Plus, dh does make an effort to be considerate and supportive. But, there are other things, like realizing that you just don't see some things the same way any more, and wondering if it would be worth the potential trouble to even try to discuss it. Then feeling resentment because you would like to be free to hold your own opinions openly.

 

 

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I've been careful to avoid most of these particular issues because of that. Plus, dh does make an effort to be considerate and supportive. But, there are other things, like realizing that you just don't see some things the same way any more, and wondering if it would be worth the potential trouble to even try to discuss it. Then feeling resentment because you would like to be free to hold your own opinions openly.

 

Yes, I agree. This comes up with us, too. Dh and I are both politically conservative, but over time, he has adopted more and more of a very Amero-centric uber-conservative view, while I'm more Libertarian, less-oversight, very tolerant type of view. In the past, one of our connective habits was always having coffee together in the morning, while watching news and weather. We still do this, but I am often asking him to go to local news, ostensibly so I can hear about local happenings, but more because I DO NOT WANT to discuss some political issues on the national news.

 

During our last election, there were two questions on the ballot that he felt surely I would choose X, like him, but I told him I disagreed and intended to choose Y. These are political hot topics to begin with. I do think now I have said how I feel about these issues and don't wish to discuss it any more. So now, when new hot topics come up in the news, I say little. I know our views are different and I stand nothing to gain by saying what I think of it. So, it is too bad in a way, because that becomes another disconnection point, if you will, instead of adding another connection to the marriage.

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I am starting to see your house as The Tell Tale Heart......oh dear.

 

 

 

2. At night, his breathing irritates me. If I'm awake, just the sound of the air going in and out will make me get up and got to the couch. I won't mention what it is like on nights when his allergies kick in.

 

 

 

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I hope I don't regret opening this subject. *blush*

 

In the meno thread, I was happy to have the assurance that many things I don't love about myself at the moment do in fact go hand-in-hand with hormonal changes of peri menopause. What I find difficult, though, is figuring out how to not move to Tijuana in the middle of the night, leaving dh to figure out how the washing machine works and what to do with the chickens.

 

DH has hormonal effects all by his marvelous self; he is 51. He is more irritable, more retreating, more sleepy and less interested in brewing a cup of TeA. But I am not much help, because oftentimes I couldn't care less about some peppy brew, just want to go to my bedroom and shut out the world, don't feel chatty, don't want to be "on." I can see the potential marriage neglect.

 

We are on vacation now. Last night, dh and the kids wanted to walk to DQ and get ice cream. I can't eat ice cream anymore (Lactose Intolerance), and I had that whole comfortable-here-now-and-don't-want-to-go-walking-now thing happening, so I told them to go without me. Dh was quite miffed. "This is family time, don't you want to go with your family?" To watch you all eat ice cream? Not so much.

 

Anyway, that's just one little vignette, but I can see how his andropause changes combined with my peri meno changes could really put a hurtin on the marriage. Anyone have any insight as to how to get through it intact? (And please don't say counseling, because there is pretty much not a snowman's chance of that.)

I can certainly tell you what not to do. My DH and I have made every mistake possible during that time of life. The only thing that was not compromised on was our devotion to the institution of marriage.

 

Hindsight being what it is, I can only wish that I had done the following:

 

1. No matter what, leave the door open. No going to my room alone, no matter how good it feels.

2. Always go on every little adventure hubby suggests. Yes, I hate biking down that busy road in 90 degree heat.

3. Learn to look at hubby when he talks. Pretend he is Tom Selleck when looking at him.

4. Start all projects in the family room, even folding the clothes. Always be within eyesight.

5. Write post it notes to DH even if he is in the same room. It feels like a secret then.

6. Bathe daily, wear makeup, and comb hair before entering the kitchen in the a.m.

7. Make his favorite meal every Thursday. I do not cook so I did pick up his favorite takeout frequently. I got this one thing right sometimes.

8. When DH speaks, do not comment, only ask a question.

 

HTH

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Dh was already 48 when we got married so I haven't had to deal with his hormonal changes too much.   And so far he's been fairly understanding about my cranky mood swings.  I think he'd be in heaven if the hot flashes get worse since I'm always colder than he is (he hates the heat).

 

I was at my doctor for a biopsy and ultrasound a few months ago because of some of the issues mentioned in these threads.  Everything came out fine and I'm supposed to make an appointment to talk about what to do about the bleeding, and moods, etc. but I still owe for that visit since my insurance is a high deductible plan and money is a serious problem right now.  She did say that insurance companies are reluctant to approve an ablation until medication has been tried.  So, I'll probably end up back on the pill despite my tied off tubes.  

 

I'm turning 45 next week.  My youngest turned 7 today.  I think I feel bad for my little guys more than for my husband.  I feel like I'm not the fun, energetic, patient mom but the cranky, snapping, impatient mom.  I hope it doesn't last long.

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I can certainly tell you what not to do. My DH and I have made every mistake possible during that time of life. The only thing that was not compromised on was our devotion to the institution of marriage.

 

Hindsight being what it is, I can only wish that I had done the following:

 

1. No matter what, leave the door open. No going to my room alone, no matter how good it feels.

2. Always go on every little adventure hubby suggests. Yes, I hate biking down that busy road in 90 degree heat.

3. Learn to look at hubby when he talks. Pretend he is Tom Selleck when looking at him.

4. Start all projects in the family room, even folding the clothes. Always be within eyesight.

5. Write post it notes to DH even if he is in the same room. It feels like a secret then.

6. Bathe daily, wear makeup, and comb hair before entering the kitchen in the a.m.

7. Make his favorite meal every Thursday. I do not cook so I did pick up his favorite takeout frequently. I got this one thing right sometimes.

8. When DH speaks, do not comment, only ask a question.

 

HTH

But are these really what one must do to keep the peace? And I say that in spit of generally being a peace keeper already. So, taking them individually, here's how the list looks to me:

1. I am not allowed to carve out my own solitude when I want.

2. Defer to his idea of fun at all times.

3. Look at him - i have no problem with this suggestion.

4. Not the worst piece of advice, although specifically folding clothes would make no sense, because our laundry room is upstairs.

5. Post its - cute idea.

6. Bathing, etc. no. I fix myself up every day, but I'm not going to get up at 5 so I can beat him to the shower, just so he never has to look at me with bed-head.

7. Favorite meal - yeah, ok. I cook almost every day as it is.

8. This last one I really don't get. Are you saying treat him as though he has all the answers? How can we have a relationship of equals in such a way?

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Dh and I are friends.  We understand that we have different needs and wants at different times in our life.  Sometimes those needs and wants match our spouse's.  Sometimes they don't.  When they don't, someone has to compromise.  Sometimes the compromise is no big deal.  Sometimes it feels like a bigger deal.  We never make one person do all the compromising.  Both dh and I are adults.  I trust both of us to not have temper tantrums if we don't get our way or have someone agree with us.  Our marriage is based on our souls meshing, not on where we sleep etc.  (this has been important because of my chronic illness issues).  We understand that surface things are just that.  Someone's inability to handle spicy food anymore doesn't mean anything has changed in our marriage even if where we might go for a date night might change.  What we value is important but sometimes we have competing values - like family and alone time.  We're upfront even with our kids on how we choose or compromise to reflect those values.  

 

So your example of ice cream -   "Of course I love being with you guys.  But I've been loving being with you guys all weekend.  And I can't have ice cream.  Go have fun and I'll join in a family game when you guys get back."  and if he pushes it  "Oh, all right.  But you'll owe me!"  (said with a smile and a fake threatening voice.)  

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I can certainly tell you what not to do. My DH and I have made every mistake possible during that time of life. The only thing that was not compromised on was our devotion to the institution of marriage.

 

Hindsight being what it is, I can only wish that I had done the following:

 

1. No matter what, leave the door open. No going to my room alone, no matter how good it feels.

2. Always go on every little adventure hubby suggests. Yes, I hate biking down that busy road in 90 degree heat.

3. Learn to look at hubby when he talks. Pretend he is Tom Selleck when looking at him.

4. Start all projects in the family room, even folding the clothes. Always be within eyesight.

5. Write post it notes to DH even if he is in the same room. It feels like a secret then.

6. Bathe daily, wear makeup, and comb hair before entering the kitchen in the a.m.

7. Make his favorite meal every Thursday. I do not cook so I did pick up his favorite takeout frequently. I got this one thing right sometimes.

8. When DH speaks, do not comment, only ask a question.

 

HTH

 

I don't think I could adopt this list.  I would wonder what happened to *me*....

 

I think that this is a challenging stage of life.  My dh is beginning to think about retirement and that is pretty stressful for both of us for many different issues.   We are very different people with few intersecting interests - staying connected in this next phase is going to be challenging.    If I want him to be open to my new ideas (no matter how weird!), I have to be open to his new ideas (no matter how dumb!).   Communication between us always works better if I can approach him when we're not disagreeing and so that he has time to think about what I've said before I expect him to take action.

 

Anne

 

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Things that are helping me and my Dh as we are in similar season of life:

 

Communication - this is mostly me talking to him as he is not much of a talker. I try to be concise. ;)

Acupuncture, chiropractor, exercise, naps and whatever else helps me to feel better physically. No HRT here because of family history of cancer.

Purposefully verbalizing what I appreciate about his character and actions. Try to be an encourager. Cliche, but helpful, cultivate an attitude of gratitude - often and sometimes out loud.

Finding fun stuff that we both like to do or talk about. Not kids or homeschooling or politics or theology. Watching favorite movies together, an occasional date night. Work on the friendship, however that looks for you.

Compromise, as Jean said above. Sometimes he takes the kids so I can be alone. Sometimes I go cheerfully when I don't want to. Sometimes we have TeA, sometimes not. Balance. Check your unspoken expectations and make sure they are reasonable and that he actually knows them.

 

This is not an easy road, to be sure...

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I find it interesting that a few people seem to feel threatened or very shaken because they are seeing other couples getting divorced. I'm not sure why you would feel that way.

 

We have seen many friends and clients get divorced, but we have never looked at it in terms of, "Wow, that could be us some day." I have to admit that we always get kind of gossipy about it and wonder what was going on behind closed doors that we'd never suspected, but we never think, "We could be next."

 

Everyone's marriage could end in divorce some day, but I don't think it's helpful to compare your own marriage to someone else's, because no matter how well you know someone, you don't know them well enough to really be able to tell what they are like with their spouse in private.

 

I do think it's a good idea to try not to get stuck in a rut and to try to learn from the mistakes of others so we've don't repeat them in our own marriages, so I'm not saying we should ignore it when we see friends or family members getting divorced, but I don't think we should personalize their situations so much that we become fearful for our own marriages.

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Anyone have any insight as to how to get through it intact? (And please don't say counseling, because there is pretty much not a snowman's chance of that.)

Have you read The Hormone Cure by Dr Sara Gottfried? My neighbor gave it to me because my post baby hair loss was that noticeable. Anyhow, it's for all hormone issues that women experience. She has a detailed questionnaire to help you figure out what hormones are going wacky. She includes scientific explanations about hormones, what they do, etc. and research on the effects of lifestyle changes, herbs, and prescription drugs on hormones. She also gives plans for correcting the hormone imbalance (from least risky lifestyle changes to prescriptions). I found it helpful. While my hair has not grown back, the fatigue, "drying up", sex drive, ability to cope has all improved from the lifestyle changes and some herbs she recommended. Too bad there's not a book for men. ;)

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Just thank you for bringing up that men have their own issues. Dh is sort of becoming a grumpy old man (he is 54). I feel fine and he finds that irritating. How come no one talks about that?

 

I actually think someone mentioned this earlier in the thread. ETA: Actually, the OP brought it up in the first post! Has your husband discussed this with his doctor? Sometimes there really are physical reasons for men to experience problems with mood at this age.

 

I think we are talking about women's issues because most of us are women, and because we aren't really supposed to be talking about our husbands in negative ways according to board rules. So I think if we opened a thread about, "My husband is really being difficult and why might that be?" there is a good chance that some posters would start criticizing him and it would just turn into a problem thread. But hopefully if you are the one that wants to talk about it, we can do that in an acceptable way. Other than low testosterone, I am not sure what possible physiological reasons would be, but I know there are some!

 

If he is the one that wants to talk about it, I imagine that he could find some kind of health board to ask questions on, but I do think it is harder sometimes for men to talk about personal things like this with other men IRL.

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DH and I have been discussing similar topics, what we have determined is:

 

Making someone a "weekend parent" isn't an option.  As DH put it, "going through a rough spot" often means "going through a stupid spot".  We don't make life changing decision based on having a bad year, or a bad few years especially when we know the cause.  Why would I ruin my life because my hormones are giving me a hard time. KWIM? 

 

We talk it out and give each other honesty and grace.  Again, our commitment is to be together so we work together to help each other out.  In the described scenario, even if DH had given me grief initially for not going with him to DQ and I had given it right back for his attitude, we would have talked later and reminded one another of our current hormonal limitations.  For the most part though, we keep our mouths shut, take some time to cool off and then remember the big picture. 

 

We encourage each other.  He supports my hobbies, I tease him about his. ;)  But we allow the hobbies and don't belittle each other for having interests and ideas. (Some of our friends do NOT do this and the lack of support for each other surprised us.)

 

We are a team, "You and me against the world, baby."

 

 

Patience and lots of naps (and chocolate).  :)

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Oh dear God, if that's what it takes, I'm out. I simply cannot find it in me to do these things. It's quite possible that I've turned into a cold, hard *****, because that list makes me feel like I'd be going to marriage jail.

 

I'm not saying it won't work for other people.

 

I was trying to go along with it at first because I thought it meant I got to be married to Tom Selleck, but then I read that it was about only pretending it was Tom Selleck and then I couldn't get excited about any of it. :glare:

 

I love my dh, but those suggestions sounded like overkill to me. I don't even think my dh would like that much attention, and he'd think I'd found out he only had weeks to live if I suddenly started kissing up to him so much. ;)

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I can certainly tell you what not to do. My DH and I have made every mistake possible during that time of life. The only thing that was not compromised on was our devotion to the institution of marriage.

 

Hindsight being what it is, I can only wish that I had done the following:

 

1. No matter what, leave the door open. No going to my room alone, no matter how good it feels.

2. Always go on every little adventure hubby suggests. Yes, I hate biking down that busy road in 90 degree heat.

3. Learn to look at hubby when he talks. Pretend he is Tom Selleck when looking at him.

4. Start all projects in the family room, even folding the clothes. Always be within eyesight.

5. Write post it notes to DH even if he is in the same room. It feels like a secret then.

6. Bathe daily, wear makeup, and comb hair before entering the kitchen in the a.m.

7. Make his favorite meal every Thursday. I do not cook so I did pick up his favorite takeout frequently. I got this one thing right sometimes.

8. When DH speaks, do not comment, only ask a question.

 

HTH

 

1.  What about the bathroom?  What about if the room is right off the living room and you want to read without tv noise but he really wants to watch the game?

2.  Might work if you don't have young kids, no health issues, and his adventures aren't too off-the-wall.  I'm not dragging two kids out at 4 am to fish out in the bay in the middle of winter.  Or doing it myself for that matter.  And Dh would be shocked if I did.

3.  This one is good.  Make sure you're listening, not multi-tasking.

4.  This is silly and highly impractical.

5.  This is cute.

6.  Not happening.  Dh is an early riser.  He's up, dressed and has made breakfast before waking me up even now that I'm working.  He also wants a wife that will go camping without hauling along make-up, perfume and a ton of hair products.

7.  Dh does all the cooking in our house so this wouldn't work.  He's a much better cook than I am and we can't afford/don't want constant take-out.

8.  I'm not sure I understand this one??   How do you never comment, only ask questions?  Is it a non-stop "well, what would you prefer?"  Ugh, totally not happening.  And I think Dh would seriously hate that.  We have a slightly warped, sarcastic way of talking in casual conversation.

 

Nothing wrong with having separate interests and activities, but if a couple wants to share everything it shouldn't always be the wife doing his things.  I think it would need to go both ways.

I don't worry about or feel threatened when other people divorce, maybe because I've already BTDT?  Dh and I married late in life - 35 for me, 48 for him.  I was married 10 years the first time and it was bad and stressful almost from the beginning (actually at least partially because ex had some expectations along the lines of those in the above list).  Dh and I hit 10 years this October and it has been better from the very start.   

 

Communication, not letting resentment stew, being honest about needing some time alone or a break every once in a while, not trying to do it all, asking for help when its needed, having fun together - these are what seem to be working for us.

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Oh dear God, if that's what it takes, I'm out. I simply cannot find it in me to do these things. It's quite possible that I've turned into a cold, hard *****, because that list makes me feel like I'd be going to marriage jail.

 

I'm not saying it won't work for other people.

 

 

I'm with you Sadie...my heart just sank when I read that list.    Why can't i be my own person?  Why can't he be comfortable with that?    

 

I have friends who take separate vacations.  They're perfectly happy together.  Actually, she takes vacations..he doesn't.  He hates being away from home.  Would that mean she'd always have to stay home or that she'd always have to bring along a grumpy unhappy dh?? (she tried that one actually and it was a disaster).  Now, they're content, she gets the explore the world and he's happy to stay home and work or do a staycation.  He'll come with her sometimes if it's a short trip, but there's no pressure and it makes the marriage happier.  It works for them.

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