Another chapter in the Doug Phillips/Vision Forum saga

[Seasider]

The young woman has come forward. The linked article is long and includes some graphic details.

 

I find the statements by HSLDA's Michael Farris particularly.... interesting.

http://mobile.wnd.com/2014/04/pastor-accused-of-using-nanny-as-sex-object-2/

[umsami]

Oh that poor woman.  Prayers for her healing.

 

I too found Farris's comments to be interesting…and although I rarely agree w/him, I'm glad he said what he did.

[LucyStoner]

May he rot.

[Random]

It seems to me that this abuser fits the profile quite well.  It's important to teach our sons and daughter how to spot predators, no matter what their relationship to us.

 

It REALLY upsets me that he would use the Christian faith as his justification. 

 

Sad. Sad. Sad.

 

[bolt.]

I read the document.

 

If the allegations are true, what happened to the poor girl was absolutely dispicable. Brainwashing and being 'used' as a sex object.

 

If the allegations are false, they are quite detailed and specific for false allegations. If they are false, they are masterminded.

 

I was pleased (?) with the way the document drew out the way the indoctrination took away her ability to consent, while also being clear that she verbally and repeatedly asked him to stop. And his promises to marry her?!? Her confusion and distress must have been phenomenal. (If true.)

 

It's sad that there is no means of real redress for such actions -- just money. The wallet hurts, and cash can help with recovery needs, but it's not enough. (If true.)

[Moxie]

That poor girl.  I'm so glad she is coming forward to out this sleezeball.  I hope she kept all the emails from him and Beale.  I'm also pleasantly surprised by Farris.

[Seasider]

 

I was pleased (?) with the way the document drew out the way the indoctrination took away her ability to consent, while also being clear that she verbally and repeatedly asked him to stop. And his promises to marry her?!? Her confusion and distress must have been phenomenal. (If true.)

 

 

I agree with all you said, bolt, but the part I've marked is, I think, a key piece of the woman's case.

 

I found it interesting that DP apparently told Lourdes that his wife would die. Horrid.

[Joanne]

So creepy. So, so, so creepy.

 

I'm concerned about her marriage and the publicity and the timing of everything.

[bolt.]

Yes, it has to be established that he had a "position of power" -- which makes consent impossible. If he was a just a family friend happens to be a preacher that she was on friendly terms with, that's not as tight a case. Especially with the absence of "she objected every time" (which would have been stated if it was the case) her confusion could be played against her if her 'consent' becomes debatable (without the position of power argument).

[Moxie]

The promises to marry her--was Beale sick??  Beale isn't old enough to just kick off at any time.  I'd sleep with one eye open if I were her.

[JumpyTheFrog]

Isn't it amazing how Phillips admitted to an affair in the fall and is now denying the whole thing, saying nothing happened? What a slimeball!

[LucyStoner]

The promises to marry her--was Beale sick?? Beale isn't old enough to just kick off at any time. I'd sleep with one eye open if I were her.

But instead she sent threatening emails to Lourdes Torres as recently as summer/fall of 2013. It sounds as though this woman has plenty of texts, emails and such to back up her claims.

[JumpyTheFrog]

The article definitely makes it sound like abuse, since she asked him to stop and he didn't.

[Jane in NC]

Her bravery may help other abused teens step forward.  And that is a good thing. 

[speedmom4]

Thankfully Michael Farris is speaking out against the patriarchy movement in general. His comments also confirm the suspicions of many about Doug Phillips.

 

Elise in Nac

[MFG]

I find it revolting that DP thinks that he did not 'know her in a Biblical sense' somehow mitigates his actions. What he is accused of actually doing is much more pervy than if he had just sweet talked her into doing the deed. Not that either scenario is justifiable. This just seems that much more dehumanizing.

[Lisa R.]

 

The irony in this story is staggering. Did you see his series on "Advanced Family Strategies" in the article? Phillips was traipsing around the country, publishing and selling sermons, and touting patriarchy in the name of family values. Patriarchy is an awesome system if you are a male and a leader in your church. If you are not a church leader and particularly if you are a female, too bad. Patriarchy worked really well for Phillips until his victim spoke out.

 

To fully see the level of deception, one must understand patriarchy and its teachings. The level to which these children of patriarchy are sheltered would boggle the mind. Adult women are expected to be fully obedient to their fathers or husbands and their pastor. Doug was a father-figure in her life as well as an elder in her church. The imbalance of power between this woman and Phillips is huge.

 

I admire this woman's courage, hope she finds peace, and hope her example encourages other victim's to find their voice.

[Princess Ariel]

Is his wife still with him? I can only imagine the help she needs but she's probably in pretty deep as well.

It's all just so awful!

[MFG]

Is his wife still with him? I can only imagine the help she needs but she's probably in pretty deep as well.

It's all just so awful!

According to the complaint filed today, Beall Phillips sent a threatening email to the victim:

 

54. On October 3, 2013, Ms. Torres received an e-mail from Beall Phillips threatening her if she did not keep silent about what happened to her, i.e., her abuse:

During the last ten weeks, and ultimately for the last nine months, you have been lighting bombs all across the country. Right now, you may have a perception of peace, but what you don't know is that these bombs are about to explode in a manner that will change all of our lives forever. It will affect your life, your marriage prospects . . . your parents . . . and thousands of other people. It is far worse than you imagine.

The VFM board has encouraged me to let you know about these and to work with you to give you an opportunity to stop impending destruction.

 

This links to the formal complaint in all its gory detail: http://www.wnd.com/files/2014/04/TorresComplaintFinalwithCoverSheet.pdf

[Juniper]

I really hope she wins her case. More precedent in this area would be very helpful. I know I often came up against incredulity from certain mindsets when I explained that there are certain situations (Pastors, Counselors, Doctors, Military especially when combined with damnation, community rejection, and possible fiscal consequences) when an adult cannot consent.  

 

Those were often the hardest conversations. She is doing a brave thing and I genuinely hope and pray she has a very strong support system. It sounds like she does. 

[Anne in CA]

I am glad to see her bringing this into the light. It must have been very hard for her all the way around.

[Lang Syne Boardie]

For everyone following sex trafficking and slavery in the world and in our nation -- Doug Phillips. If this is all true, how he is not one of the many faces of slavers and users in this abomination of our time?

He indoctrinated and groomed her, forced himself on her, threatened her, separated her from friends and family, changed her living situation and location, created a culture and paradigm in which his actions were either somewhat normalized or he was idolized to a point that ensured cover-ups to protect him and his world...

he saw her as an object. He saw her as less than a person.

Don't you see, Doug Phillips is one more person who was on the side of the devil, contributing to sex slavery in the United States in current times. And all the while he was a minister and a family man and someone trying to convert America to dominionism starting with homeschoolers!

Ariel Castro going to join the neighborhood search for Amanda Berry while he had her locked up in the attic with other sex slaves.

Doug Phillips preaching to believers, taking homeschoolers' money and telling them how to be godly like him, while ensnaring this young girl in his own home as his own personal toy.

The only difference I see between these two is that Castro had literal locks on the door and Phillips did not. Which is of no significance when the chains he did bind her with were enough to keep her enslaved.

[bolt.]

The "threatening" message from Beall seems a bit less than complicit, and not very threatening (though certainly upsetting). I'm very willing to believe it was sent by a wife who believed (at the time) that these were false allegations, or mere innuendo.

 

Who among us would instantly believe innuendo like that against our own spouse? I, as a first reaction, would be more likely to consider the rumours false, and I would hope the "girl" would help deny them and/or stop contributing to trouble of a scale she might not understand. If the email was sent from that perspective, it not only makes more sense, but is a significantly less nefarious thing for Beall to have done.

[Guest]

Oh that poor woman.  Prayers for her healing.

 

I too found Farris's comments to be interesting…and although I rarely agree w/him, I'm glad he said what he did.

 

I never could have imagined a situation where I would be saying "ITA with Michael Farris", but....

[Juniper]

The "threatening" message from Beall seems a bit less than complicit, and not very threatening (though certainly upsetting). I'm very willing to believe it was sent by a wife who believed (at the time) that these were false allegations, or mere innuendo.

 

Who among us would instantly believe innuendo like that against our own spouse? I, as a first reaction, would be more likely to consider the rumours false, and I would hope the "girl" would help deny them and/or stop contributing to trouble of a scale she might not understand. If the email was sent from that perspective, it not only makes more sense, but is a significantly less nefarious thing for Beall to have done.

You might be surprised. I know in my case the threatening phone calls and ravings were very scary. 

 

I do not know Beall personally, but I know quite a few escapees from the movement and they are very serious when they say she is, "Mean as a snake." I will give her that it is a bad coping mechanism, but I am sure Lourdes was under extreme duress. 

[Seasider]

This links to the formal complaint in all its gory detail: http://www.wnd.com/files/2014/04/TorresComplaintFinalwithCoverSheet.pdf

Thanks for the link. THIS is the real bomb.

[Random]

According to the complaint filed today, Beall Phillips sent a threatening email to the victim:

 

54. On October 3, 2013, Ms. Torres received an e-mail from Beall Phillips threatening her if she did not keep silent about what happened to her, i.e., her abuse:

During the last ten weeks, and ultimately for the last nine months, you have been lighting bombs all across the country. Right now, you may have a perception of peace, but what you don't know is that these bombs are about to explode in a manner that will change all of our lives forever. It will affect your life, your marriage prospects . . . your parents . . . and thousands of other people. It is far worse than you imagine.

The VFM board has encouraged me to let you know about these and to work with you to give you an opportunity to stop impending destruction.

 

This links to the formal complaint in all its gory detail: http://www.wnd.com/files/2014/04/TorresComplaintFinalwithCoverSheet.pdf

 

Wow.

 

Sounds like the Phillips are toast!

 

I am so impressed with the victim's (for lack of a better word) courage.

[MFG]

According to the complaint, Mrs. Phillips was aware of the situation well before the sending of the email. Months if not years.

[HS Mom in NC]

I'm glad Farris saw the false teachings long ago and did what he could to distance himself and his organizations from that kind of nonsense. I wonder how many other well known names out there in the homeschooling community might have distanced themselves in some way or gone to lengths to avoid or to confront Philips and his type over the years that we haven't heard about.

 

I hope she's just the first in a very long line of women (and men) who leave that kind of cult.

 

I hope they're meticulous about the legal proceedings so Philips can be revealed for what he really is in a way that stands up in court.

[G5052]

I just read it came here to see if anyone else had seen it.  No words to describe how horrible it is.

[SadieMarie]

I don't get how people, especially women, buy into patriarchy. When, in the history of the world, has hierarchy based upon ascribed status ever gone well for those at the bottom? They are always subject to abuse and exploitation. And yet people buy into it and in the process sacrifice their own children. Sorry, but while he is clearly a pig, he only got to be an influential one with the help of followers. Even if he is finished by this someone else will take his place and people will follow the new guy spouting the same line of bull.

[Joanne]

I don't get how people, especially women, buy into patriarchy. When, in the history of the world, has hierarchy based upon ascribed status ever gone well for those at the bottom? They are always subject to abuse and exploitation. And yet people buy into it and in the process sacrifice their own children. Sorry, but while he is clearly a pig, he only got to be an influential one with the help of followers. Even if he is finished by this someone else will take his place and people will follow the new guy spouting the same line of bull.

 

 

You may not mean it this way, but this is very insulting to victims. It also belies a lack of knowledge about the abuse, power, and control dynamic and how it develops. Furthermore, entrenched patriarchy lives today, making the context of the abuse, power, and control dynamic able to grow on fertile, unquestioned, ground.

 

It's not that they "buy into it and in the process sacrifice their own children." It's that the process itself is the abuse and people get trapped in the process not by their own fault or decreased capacity but because of the way abuses of power play out.

 

[Joanne]

According to the complaint filed today, Beall Phillips sent a threatening email to the victim:

 

54. On October 3, 2013, Ms. Torres received an e-mail from Beall Phillips threatening her if she did not keep silent about what happened to her, i.e., her abuse:

During the last ten weeks, and ultimately for the last nine months, you have been lighting bombs all across the country. Right now, you may have a perception of peace, but what you don't know is that these bombs are about to explode in a manner that will change all of our lives forever. It will affect your life, your marriage prospects . . . your parents . . . and thousands of other people. It is far worse than you imagine.

The VFM board has encouraged me to let you know about these and to work with you to give you an opportunity to stop impending destruction.

 

This links to the formal complaint in all its gory detail: http://www.wnd.com/files/2014/04/TorresComplaintFinalwithCoverSheet.pdf

 

I read the entire document. Sick, twisted stuff.

[JonesinIndiana]

I wonder if Lourdes' attorney, David Gibbs, is the same attorney that represented Terri Schiavo's family? The phone number on the petition is a 727 exchange which is Pinellas county, where the Schiavo case took place.

[Joanne]

Returning to add that I suspect other women will come forward with similar stories.

[LucyStoner]

It's just another very good reminder that power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely.

 

Returning to add that I suspect other women will come forward with similar stories.

A-yup. It's never just one. If you will abuse and assault someone, you usually have more than one victim.

[SadieMarie]

You may not mean it this way, but this is very insulting to victims. It also belies a lack of knowledge about the abuse, power, and control dynamic and how it develops. Furthermore, entrenched patriarchy lives today, making the context of the abuse, power, and control dynamic able to grow on fertile, unquestioned, ground.

 

It's not that they "buy into it and in the process sacrifice their own children." It's that the process itself is the abuse and people get trapped in the process not by their own fault or decreased capacity but because of the way abuses of power play out.

Please explain to me why people follow guys like this, adult people. Because you are right. I do not get it. Do you define every follower of men like him as victims? Because I am not talking about these two young women who were teenagers when he began targeting them. I am talking about all the people who supported this man and gave him power. Without his followers he was nothing.

[laughing lioness]

You may not mean it this way, but this is very insulting to victims. It also belies a lack of knowledge about the abuse, power, and control dynamic and how it develops. Furthermore, entrenched patriarchy lives today, making the context of the abuse, power, and control dynamic able to grow on fertile, unquestioned, ground.

 

It's not that they "buy into it and in the process sacrifice their own children." It's that the process itself is the abuse and people get trapped in the process not by their own fault or decreased capacity but because of the way abuses of power play out.

 

I don't agree.

 

Like Sadie Marie said, Phillips only got to power because consenting adults bought his stuff, spouted his stuff, listened to his stuff, implemented his stuff and promoted his stuff.  

Adults have the option to think for themselves, or to give up that right.   

 

I have a good friend who bought everything Phillips sold. They are bright, thinking people who have decided that Phillips knows more than others. Phillips fall, like Gothards has "rocked their world,. That's because they whole-heartedly trusted these people, and willingly gave up their ability to think critically about them or what they said. Why could I think critically about them, and they could not? Because they put them on a pedestal and forget that they were fallible.

'

Narcissists, being what they are, are often initially compelling. But "abuses of power" aren't like a tractor beam that we are helpless against, that renders those listening unable to think for themselves and form their own opinions. To ascertain that they are, and that people can't get away from them because of how the abuses of power play out, is insulting to thinking people everywhere. 

 

Obviously, those raised in cults, a, and children groomed for victimization, are a whole different story. 

[FaithManor]

Two things. First, the neighbors of the Torres family witnessed DP after both Lourdes and her father ssued a cease and desist contact request to DP climbing through her bedroom window. She yelled at him to leave and shouted to her father for help. They chased him down the street WiTH GUNS and only stopped when neighbors came outside either out of curiosity or to assist and recognized him under the streetlights. They did not file a police report, however they did report it to attorney Gibbs who took statements. This lends a lot of credibility in court to her claims that it was unwanted attention.

 

Second, David Gibbs is an attorney for Christian Law Association and while not patriarchial in the typical sense, he is himself very conservative and chose to take the case. Though I don't agree with several things he stands for, he is known for his personal integrity and not taking clients simply for profit motive. I do believe that he would not take on a shark like DP if the evidence was weak.

 

I hope DP's dangling parts rot!

[FaithManor]

The "threatening" message from Beall seems a bit less than complicit, and not very threatening (though certainly upsetting). I'm very willing to believe it was sent by a wife who believed (at the time) that these were false allegations, or mere innuendo.

 

Who among us would instantly believe innuendo like that against our own spouse? I, as a first reaction, would be more likely to consider the rumours false, and I would hope the "girl" would help deny them and/or stop contributiSto trouble of a scale she might not understand. If the email was sent from that perspective, it not only makes more sense, but is a significantly less nefarious thing for Beall to have done.

This email came AFTER DP was issued a cease and desist by the victim and her father and he tried to cimb through her bedroom window and was chsed down the street by Lourdes' father and brother who were armed and loaded for bear due to his refusal to stop contacting her after she broke it off once and for all.

 

Beall also went NUTS in front of Peter Bradrick, Dr. Joe Morecraft, and three other men who confronted Dippydo about his behavior. This was the evening before his first resignation letter. They were shocked at her vitriol towards them and Ms. Torres. Peter Bradrick and a couple of the others wrote about it in Nov. And Dec. 2013 both in blog, and through other channels.

 

I can easily see that the worst examples would not be published at this time.

[Zuzu822]

I'm pretty sure that Lourdes is featured in the Return of the Daughters film by the Botkins. I remember that she didn't come from the same background as the other girls...far less privileged. Just horrifying.  :crying:

[FaithManor]

Two things. First, the neighbors of the Torres family witnessed DP after both Lourdes and her father ssued a cease and desist contact request to DP climbing through her bedroom window. She yelled at him to leave and shouted to her father for help. They chased him down the street WiTH GUNS and only stopped when neighbors came outside either out of curiosity or to assist and recognized him under the streetlights. They did not file a police report, however they did report it to attorney Gibbs who took statements. This lends a lot of credibility in court to her claims that it was unwanted attention.

 

Second, David Gibbs is an attorney for Christian Law Association and while not patriarchial in the typical sense, he is himself very conservative and chose to take the case. Though I don't agree with several things he stands for, he is known for his personal integrity and not taking clients simply for profit motive. I do believe that he would not take on a shark like DP if the evidence was weak.

 

I hope DP's dangling parts rot!

Okay, my first sentence wasn't clear. First came the cease and desist request filed by the family attorney. Then DP tied to climb into her bedroom window.

[mamajudy]

Absolutely sickening.

[awisha.]

Ugh, what a disgusting and sickening slimeball.

[unsinkable]

There is a box checked that damages are over 1,000,000.

 

Has the statute of limitations passed for a criminal complaint of sexual assault?

 

What about that bedroom break-in? Couldn't he still be arrested for that?

[awisha.]

Two things. First, the neighbors of the Torres family witnessed DP after both Lourdes and her father ssued a cease and desist contact request to DP climbing through her bedroom window. She yelled at him to leave and shouted to her father for help. They chased him down the street WiTH GUNS and only stopped when neighbors came outside either out of curiosity or to assist and recognized him under the streetlights. They did not file a police report, however they did report it to attorney Gibbs who took statements. This lends a lot of credibility in court to her claims that it was unwanted attention.

Second, David Gibbs is an attorney for Christian Law Association and while not patriarchial in the typical sense, he is himself very conservative and chose to take the case. Though I don't agree with several things he stands for, he is known for his personal integrity and not taking clients simply for profit motive. I do believe that he would not take on a shark like DP if the evidence was weak.

I hope DP's dangling parts rot!

He CLIMBED through her bedroom window?!?!?!

Is he a 15 year old boy who's watched too many eps of Dawsons Creek??

What sort of sane GROWN man thinks climbing into ANY window is a good idea??

 

Even better than his dangling parts rotting, would be him going to jail and forgetting the "Don't bend over to pick up the dropped soap" rule.

[Word Nerd]

I'm pretty sure that Lourdes is featured in the Return of the Daughters film by the Botkins. I remember that she didn't come from the same background as the other girls...far less privileged. Just horrifying. :crying:

She's also in the clip posted recently that shows Michelle Duggar winning the Mother of the Year award and getting pawed on by Doug. If I'm not mistaken, she's the last one in the "thank you" montage.

[SadieMarie]

She's also in the clip posted recently that shows Michelle Duggar winning the Mother of the Year award and getting pawed on by Doug. If I'm not mistaken, she's the last one in the "thank you" montage.

Well, that is just perfect.

[FaithManor]

There is a box checked that damages are over 1,000,000.

 

Has the statute of limitations passed for a criminal complaint of sexual assault?

 

What about that bedroom break-in? Couldn't he still be arrested for that?

The statute of limitations has not expired by Texas law, and because he was clergy and fullfilled the Texas definition of unlicensed counselor, the clergy abuse statute could apply. I'm not certain about arresting him for the window incident because they issued a legal request for him to cease contact but did not oursue a personal order of protection nor a restraining order so tresspassing law or breaking and entering laws might apply, but I don't know for sure.

 

Neighbors saw it so this is pretty damaging to old Dougie boy.

[Zuzu822]

She's also in the clip posted recently that shows Michelle Duggar winning the Mother of the Year award and getting pawed on by Doug. If I'm not mistaken, she's the last one in the "thank you" montage.

Oh my gosh, that's right! I knew I'd seen her recently in one of the patriarchy discussions. Just disgusting.