I need a good, independent writing and grammar program for my kids next year.

[Michelle My Bell]

I am in college and I am looking for recommendations for a writing/grammar program for my kids. Their grades are 5th, 8th, and 11th. Video instruction would be a plus, but not necessary. I just want something solid, they can do on their own in this subject. I would be checking in, especially with the youngest. What have you used that you could really recommend?

[scrapbabe]

Essentials in Writing is video based and could be used without a lot of parental involvement.

[EKS]

Analytical Grammar has videos. 

[Michelle My Bell]

What do you all think of Christian Light Language Arts? 

[Hunter]

Cozy Grammar is excellent for punctuation. The basic grammar is good. I'd skip cozy grammar essay.

 

Have you looked at Hake Grammar and Writing? I have the 7th grade book. I'm still undecided about the series. 

[WishboneDawn]

What do you all think of Christian Light Language Arts?

I haven't heard great things about it.

 

I second the Cozy Grammar recommendation.

[Hunter]

I was looking through my Hake 7 again last night. Often combining programs can be confusing. So far Cozy Grammar seems entirely compatible with Hake, but I haven't yet looked at the nitty gritty of all the punctuation, yet.

 

My plan right now is to use even the cozy grammar essay with Hake. I take back my recommendation to skip the essay videos. They complement the Hake 7 Essay Lessons well enough.

 

Hake 7 includes a lot of Literary Analysis as vocabulary and filler. I'm looking at LLATL Gold to supplement and to fill in what is assumed to have already been covered. I do NOT consider Hake 7 for 7th grade!!!!

 

Right now for "high school" I'm looking at Hake 7 and 8, Cozy Grammar basic, punctuation, essay, EIL 1, EIL 3-American, EIL 4-British, LLATL Gold American, LLATL Gold British. And for spelling, the SWR audio files and the Wise guide as an answer key, and HTTS 4 workbook.

 

I know that sounds complicated and expensive and...yeah, just a lot. That is my current 4 year self-education plan, though.

 

I won't be trying to complete EIL, 1, 3, 4, but just use pieces of it to fill in the holes and supplement LLATL Gold and Hake. Some of the MLA and general writing ideas are good.

[stm4him]

What is EIL?

[Hunter]

Excellence in Literature

http://www.everyday-education.com/literature/index.shtml

[stm4him]

Hunter,

 

That looks good and if we weren't doing CC I might consider that for our literature, but I thought you were going to read the Dirda list and the children's literature list......

[Carolinagirl1]

What do you all think of Christian Light Language Arts? 

 

We use and love CLE LA! So far we have used 1st and 3rd grades. The 3rd grade level is totally independent. It includes grammer, spelling, and penmanship all in one. There is some writing but not much. Starting in 4th, I am going to supplement the CLE LA with Meaningful Composition. I understand that this is a great combination.

[Jasperstone]

What do you all think of Christian Light Language Arts? 

 

 

Wonderful until middle of grade 5. I'm looking for something else now.

 

My short list is EIW, Hakes and BJU.

 

I hope and I can come to a conclusion soon. ^_^

[Michelle My Bell]

Really? Why don't you like it after 5th grade?

[Hunter]

Hunter,

 

That looks good and if we weren't doing CC I might consider that for our literature, but I thought you were going to read the Dirda list and the children's literature list......

 

Sorry, I just saw this today. These are just reading lists, not composition and analysis and history of lit curricula.

 

And what I'm doing for my OWN self-education right NOW is taking a bit of different path than my long term tutoring plans.

[Tiramisu]

Personally, with CLE, the lessons are long. We did not last long with it, though we used the math for many years. They could be done independently for the most part, but to do it right, you would have to check their work and that would be a lot of pages to check for you. A LOT.

 

I think EIW was a good suggestion.

[PeterPan]

Radical suggestion.  Get WWS1-3 (3 is coming out this fall), and have all your kids do them at age-appropriate paces.  The 11th grader could do 1 book a semester, leaving her time to do maybe even the Weston Rulebook of Arguments her senior year.  The 8th grader could do regular pace if you want.  The 5th grader could do it but more slowly or alternating units with the Creative Writer books.

 

Btw, I've been having my dd do the WWS books at that accelerated pace, and I'm VERY impressed with what we're covering.  That's my plan, to do Weston along with WWS3 this coming year.  SWB herself has said if a student works through the WWS books and really nails the skills they'd be a better writer than many of the kids she sees in freshman english.  Carry it over to tasks in her other subjects obviously.

 

PS.  I highlight the instructions to make sure my dd gets the important points.  If you do that, it definitely fits your parameter of writing done relatively independently.

[Hunter]

The more I see samples and reviews of writing strands, the more I think there is less/no need of a formal literature program to supplement Hake. I think Hake, Writing Strands, and a little spelling might be enough for formal LA curricula.

[Jasperstone]

Really? Why don't you like it after 5th grade?

 

Oh, the grammar is getting sooooo tedious. :willy_nilly: It's doing my head in, lol! :banghead: 

 

Also, it's very weak on writing. There's no explanation, they just expect a child to write what's asked etc...

 

I just wish I could come to a decision between- Hakes, EIW, Easy Grammar and BJU!!! :confused1:

[Jasperstone]

Personally, with CLE, the lessons are long. We did not last long with it, though we used the math for many years. They could be done independently for the most part, but to do it right, you would have to check their work and that would be a lot of pages to check for you. A LOT.

 

I think EIW was a good suggestion.

 

 

I do LOVE their Maths though! And their LA is excellent until Mid Grade 5, IMHO.

[Tiramisu]

Oh, the grammar is getting sooooo tedious. :willy_nilly: It's doing my head in, lol! :banghead:

 

Also, it's very weak on writing. There's no explanation, they just expect a child to write what's asked etc...

 

I just wish I could come to a decision between- Hakes, EIW, Easy Grammar and BJU!!! :confused1:

 

I posted on your other thread but I saw this and thought I would give you some more input. If you are concerned about the writing in CLE, I'm very convinced that EG is not the program for you. It will not provide writing instruction.

 

I'm still inclined to think Hake may be tedious and if you're feeling that way, there's really no harm in trying something completely different, like EIW. You will have your writing and grammar bases covered. I have not used EIW but I've looked at samples and read reviews...and SWB recommended it, too, on the document about possible writing progressions that she has up on the php website.

 

For a complete change, you could do EG and WWE or WWS. :)

[Jasperstone]

I posted on your other thread but I saw this and thought I would give you some more input. If you are concerned about the writing in CLE, I'm very convinced that EG is not the program for you. It will not provide writing instruction.

 

I'm still inclined to think Hake may be tedious and if you're feeling that way, there's really no harm in trying something completely different, like EIW. You will have your writing and grammar bases covered. I have not used EIW but I've looked at samples and read reviews...and SWB recommended it, too, on the document about possible writing progressions that she has up on the php website.

 

For a complete change, you could do EG and WWE or WWS. :)

 

 

Yeah, I knew I would have to choose a writing program if we went with EG.

 

The samples of Hake look good and way easier than CLE from going on the site. But it's hard to judge the *whole* program on a few samples.

 

Thanks again for your time. I really appreciate it!

[Guest Cynthia828]

Really? Why don't you like it after 5th grade?

In regards to Christian Light Education, I hope you don't mind me jumping in on this conversation.

 

I can only tell you our experience with it and where we are now.  I decided to give CLE a chance and I am thrilled I did.  My son used it from 4-8 grade, and he is in 9th now.  We are not using it this year, but the tools he learned in those years with that curriculum are rock solid.  Yes, it is a lot of work, but I believe that is part of what makes it so good.  It is not mastery, but spiral, so there is lots of review...again...that is what makes it very good for a spiral learner.

 

This year I am teaching an Omnibus coop in my home to a group of 9th and 10th graders.  I have had them every week since the beginning of the year.  My son is the only one who did CLE, and the difference between his LA skills and theirs is STAGGERING.  The students keep asking him how he knows "all that" and his response continually is CLE.  Even the parents can tell the difference and two of them are kicking themselves for not having done CLE, as they have now rushed to purchase a curriculum for their 9th graders through CLE.  Both students fell in CLE's 7th grade range, and I am sure the rest of the class would as well.

 

I believe CLE is rock solid, and while I agree that they really don't have much in the way of writing in the curriculum, I supplimented that into the curriculum.

Let me end with this.  My son was in a private Christian School here in South Florida.  When I pulled him out, he scored 33 percentile on the SAT.  The first year I homeschooled him with CLE, it jumped to 66 percentile, and the following year, he got a perfect score on his SAT Language arts section. I am thrilled with the results from CLE.

 

BTW...we also used them for math, and received the same results!

 

Blessings,

Cynthia

 

[Carolinagirl1]

In regards to Christian Light Education, I hope you don't mind me jumping in on this conversation.

 

I can only tell you our experience with it and where we are now.  I decided to give CLE a chance and I am thrilled I did.  My son used it from 4-8 grade, and he is in 9th now.  We are not using it this year, but the tools he learned in those years with that curriculum are rock solid.  Yes, it is a lot of work, but I believe that is part of what makes it so good.  It is not mastery, but spiral, so there is lots of review...again...that is what makes it very good for a spiral learner.

 

This year I am teaching an Omnibus coop in my home to a group of 9th and 10th graders.  I have had them every week since the beginning of the year.  My son is the only one who did CLE, and the difference between his LA skills and theirs is STAGGERING.  The students keep asking him how he knows "all that" and his response continually is CLE.  Even the parents can tell the difference and two of them are kicking themselves for not having done CLE, as they have now rushed to purchase a curriculum for their 9th graders through CLE.  Both students fell in CLE's 7th grade range, and I am sure the rest of the class would as well.

 

I believe CLE is rock solid, and while I agree that they really don't have much in the way of writing in the curriculum, I supplimented that into the curriculum.

Let me end with this.  My son was in a private Christian School here in South Florida.  When I pulled him out, he scored 33 percentile on the SAT.  The first year I homeschooled him with CLE, it jumped to 66 percentile, and the following year, he got a perfect score on his SAT Language arts section. I am thrilled with the results from CLE.

 

BTW...we also used them for math, and received the same results!

 

Blessings,

Cynthia

 

While I'm not the OP - Thank you so much for this!! This makes me excited that I chose this curriculum! What did you supplement the writing with?

 

[bnbacademy]

What do you all think of Christian Light Language Arts? 

 

I briefly looked thru one book several years ago, and noted several spelling errors, so was not impressed.

 

No videos, no foofah, but Rod & Staff English has been very successful for us. It is written also by a conservative Mennonite publishing co.; so there are black and white pics throughout of women in cape dress/covering and lessons and exercises reflect Biblical principles. Although promoting a more outwardly conservative style than I, I like to incorporate faith throughout the school subjects. The results for us has been unqualified success in Grammar knowledge, hands down. 

 

It is not independent. Ds reads instructional info, we orally work thru the application exercises, he does worksheets + tests; which are then reviewed and corrected together.

[MeAndTheBoys]

We have used CLE Math and Reading since the beginning, and I switched from R&S English to CLE LA this year--into Grades 4 and 5.

 

I have been very happy with it, as far as grammar and spelling go.  DS2 had HORRIBLE spelling issues last year, and I was just commenting today that he has improved SO much--which is odd because I don't think the CLE LA over-emphasizes spelling--they just use the words for 4 lessons, then take a quiz.  But something is clicking--

 

And the grammar is a bit tedious, but I think they are *getting it*, for real.  The diagramming helps them to really take apart a sentence and figure out what it means.

 

Regarding the comment that it gets too tedious in the middle of 5th grade--I didn't find that, but I am wondering what I will think about 6th grade, lol--  I will say that there are many things in the 5th grade book that I have had to learn-- my oldest son retains it and so I don't have to remember as much to help him, but when DS2 does LA 500 next year, I am planning on having him keep a notebook of new terms/concepts that we can use as a reference tool!!!

 

It is weak on writing, but we supplement--we are still working on WWE3 with DS2 this year, we took an IEW class, we do narrations with MFW.  I plan to either slowly start WWS next year with both boys or do Apologia Jump In! Writing.

 

I think CLE LA is a very solid program--but it's not new or innovative or exciting.  It can be tedious to grade--  It is very independent, but the grading takes a little time (not too much time if they don't miss too many, lol).

 

ETA--My youngest is starting CLE Reading and MAth 100 this year.  I have never used CLE LA levels 100-300, and I don't think I will--I plan to use FLL with him in 1st and 2nd, then either R&S Grade 2 or 3 for 3rd grade (since I already have those texts) then probably jump into CLE 400 in 4th grade.  Just too many workbooks for so young, IMO.

 

Betsy

[FriedClams]

I haven't heard great things about it.

 

I second the Cozy Grammar recommendation.

I have used CLE LA for years. The grammar portion is exceptional, but for writing it is weak. I have used IEW FEMA few years and we'll be switching this fall to EIW. I love IEW, we're just tired of it and need something fresh..

[FriedClams]

Personally, with CLE, the lessons are long. We did not last long with it, though we used the math for many years. They could be done independently for the most part, but to do it right, you would have to check their work and that would be a lot of pages to check for you. A LOT.

 

I think EIW was a good suggestion.

If you follow their suggestions from second grade on the students should grade their daily work.

[Jasperstone]

I have used CLE LA for years. The grammar portion is exceptional, but for writing it is weak. I have used IEW FEMA few years and we'll be switching this fall to EIW. I love IEW, we're just tired of it and need something fresh..

Will you still be using CLE LA, or drop it completely when you start EIW?

 

Has EIW got enough grammar?

 

By the way, mine just came in the mail yesterday! Im very excited for my dd to get started on it.

 

I just felt CLE LA was getting too dry, and while there is lots of grammar, my dd couldn't transfer it to real writing.

[Jasperstone]

Oh, the grammar is getting sooooo tedious. :willy_nilly: It's doing my head in, lol! :banghead:

 

Also, it's very weak on writing. There's no explanation, they just expect a child to write what's asked etc...

 

I just wish I could come to a decision between- Hakes, EIW, Easy Grammar and BJU!!! :confused1:

I just saw this earlier post, and wanted to update-

The decision is made, and we went for EIW!

 

I'll wait and see whether we need to add more grammar. The lady at EIW said we didn't need to though.

[Michelle My Bell]

Elizabeth, 

     I know this thread is old, but in regards to my oldest daughter, I wanted to ask you if you could give me more details how you managed to do one whole book in one semester? How much time is devoted to this subject? Also, do you add in any additional Language Arts? Thanks for any feedback you can give me. 

 

 

 

Radical suggestion.  Get WWS1-3 (3 is coming out this fall), and have all your kids do them at age-appropriate paces.  The 11th grader could do 1 book a semester, leaving her time to do maybe even the Weston Rulebook of Arguments her senior year.  The 8th grader could do regular pace if you want.  The 5th grader could do it but more slowly or alternating units with the Creative Writer books.

 

Btw, I've been having my dd do the WWS books at that accelerated pace, and I'm VERY impressed with what we're covering.  That's my plan, to do Weston along with WWS3 this coming year.  SWB herself has said if a student works through the WWS books and really nails the skills they'd be a better writer than many of the kids she sees in freshman english.  Carry it over to tasks in her other subjects obviously.

 

PS.  I highlight the instructions to make sure my dd gets the important points.  If you do that, it definitely fits your parameter of writing done relatively independently.

 

[AimeeM]

What do you all think of Christian Light Language Arts? 

 

The grammar is excellent. We plan to use the grammar portion this upcoming year for grade 7 and eventually with my kindergartner (in grade 1). Very rigorous and independent (in the later grades).

Unless your kid is a natural spelling, you'll need different spelling, though.

And I'm not at all impressed with the writing. It's cheap enough that I feel okay crossing out the writing and spelling portions, though, and just using it as grammar (using other things for spelling and writing).