Mental Math is Awful!!!!

[Chelli]

Or at least my dd10 feels it is.  :sad:

 

I find all of the mental math techniques so cool and very helpful especially since I never learned them in school.

 

However, she falls apart when we come to the mental math sections in Math in Focus. She wants to just work the problems the way she knows how (traditional algorithms) instead of trying to mentally manipulate the numbers. Seriously, it's tear inducing. She understands what they are trying to get her to do it is just very difficult for her to hold all of those parts in her head while doing it.

I know that dd10 will never have a career in a math field. It is not her thing which I totally understand because I chose my major in college based on which one would need the least math requirements.  :tongue_smilie:

 

I hate to give up Math in Focus because I am greatly enjoying teaching it. And for the most part dd10 likes it as well.....until we get to mental math.

 

So my question is this: Is a Singapore approach to math worth it if the mental math training is not there? Would I be better served just using something more traditional with her and focusing on using Singapore methods with my dd6 who really gets it?

 

Thanks for your input!

[lexi]

My dd has a terrible time with it too. She cannot hold numbers in her head. I can write out a large problem and have her work it out in her head without the benefit of writing anything down. She does great with that. But she can't remember numbers to save her life. It's frustrating to both of us! She knows all the helpful strategies. She just can't remember numbers long enough to apply them. And I have no idea how to help her!
So, no help but we have the same problem!

[Dmmetler]

It pays off in time, but I think that for a child who already knows algorithms, it might be hard to go back and learn them the other way. I know my DD does mental math much easier than I do-and I believe a big part of it is that she learned it almost from the start, while I learned "Show your work!".  I think there's a lot of benefit in Singapore as far as the level of problems and the problem solving strategies even if she never picks up using the mental strategies. I've learned a lot by teaching it.

 

 

 

 

[Chelli]

It pays off in time, but I think that for a child who already knows algorithms, it might be hard to go back and learn them the other way. I know my DD does mental math much easier than I do-and I believe a big part of it is that she learned it almost from the start, while I learned "Show your work!".  I think there's a lot of benefit in Singapore as far as the level of problems and the problem solving strategies even if she never picks up using the mental strategies. I've learned a lot by teaching it.

 

But that's just it. She's been using Math in Focus since 1B so it's not like she hasn't been taught this way. She has always struggled with mental math from the time it was introduced. She just finds it so much easier and faster to grab some paper and pencil and work it out. She can do the mental math if I walk her through it step by step, but she does not intuitively get it or see it as useful, thus it frustrates her when I make her do it.

[kajm]

We were using Singapore math, but my ds10 just did not get along well with it.  It was just drudgery to him.  I personally think it is a very good program, but he wasn't thriving with it, so say the least.  So, reluctantly, I made a switch.  After looking at many different options, I chose Mathematical Reasoning from CTP for the main spine and then throw in a page or two from Singapore's Challenging Word Problems about two days a week.  He has some other issues than your dd, so it may not work for you, but this has made math go much smoother and still gives me some of the Singapore that I like. 

 

I know some people say the MR is not a complete program, more a supplement, but I have not found that to be the case working it like we have.

 

HTH!

[EKS]

If she has trouble holding things in mind, just write down the intermediates for her.  Once the techniques are second nature to her, it will be easier for her to remember the intermediates.

 

So, for example, if she's doing 37 x 3 mentally, do this:

 

Have her say "30 x 3" is 90."  Then you write down 90.

Have her say "and 7 x 3 is 21."  Then you write down 21.

Have her say "and 90 + 21 is 111."  Then you write down 111.

Have her say "so 37 x 3 is 111."

 

It is absolutely ok for you to provide this sort of scaffolding as long as you eventually remove the scaffold.

[Indian summer]

I remember being taught mental math in school before I was ready for it. I have since developed my own observations and systems of mental math. And I think most people that I know have figured their own ways of doing mental math. It makes me wonder if it might be the better way. You know how as adults we absorb what we are learning because it interests us or serves a purpose in our lives...

[Chelli]

I remember being taught mental math in school before I was ready for it. I have since developed my own observations and systems of mental math. And I think most people that I know have figured their own ways of doing mental math. It makes me wonder if it might be the better way. You know how as adults we absorb what we are learning because it interests us or serves a purpose in our lives...

 

I can see this. I find the mental math stuff so cool and interesting now as an adult, but I know that I would have been just like my dd at her age. "Why do I have to do this? I know how to do it the other way."

 

Hopefully time will help sort it out.

[WishboneDawn]

Or at least my dd10 feels it is. :sad:

I find all of the mental math techniques so cool and very helpful especially since I never learned them in school.

However, she falls apart when we come to the mental math sections in Math in Focus. She wants to just work the problems the way she knows how (traditional algorithms) instead of trying to mentally manipulate the numbers. Seriously, it's tear inducing. She understands what they are trying to get her to do it is just very difficult for her to hold all of those parts in her head while doing it.

I know that dd10 will never have a career in a math field. It is not her thing which I totally understand because I chose my major in college based on which one would need the least math requirements. :tongue_smilie:

I hate to give up Math in Focus because I am greatly enjoying teaching it. And for the most part dd10 likes it as well.....until we get to mental math.

So my question is this: Is a Singapore approach to math worth it if the mental math training is not there? Would I be better served just using something more traditional with her and focusing on using Singapore methods with my dd6 who really gets it?

Thanks for your input!

Just you wait a minute...

Not bring good at mental math doesn't mean she can't go into math. There are many different fields that require many different skills.

It may not be her passion in the end but don't start thinking that because this one part of math isn't her strength that math as a whole isn't her thing.:)

[jennynd]

Mental math is so much easier not doing it with a book. With my DD, she had hard time look at the book and work on mental math. It just doesn't belong together. But when she is in bath tub, that is another story. I will just random ask her mental question from the easiest 100+100, then 98+5, then198+5... You get the idea. Let her do it when her mind is the only tool. That worked a lot better for my DD then work on the book... I know, it is kinda weird, but that is when you supposed to use mental math, right?.. When you don't have a pen and paper.

[Kerileanne99]

Mental math is so much easier not doing it with a book. With my DD, she had hard time look at the book and work on mental math. It just doesn't belong together. But when she is in bath tub, that is another story. I will just random ask her mental question from the easiest 100+100, then 98+5, then198+5... You get the idea. Let her do it when her mind is the only tool. That worked a lot better for my DD then work on the book... I know, it is kinda weird, but that is when you supposed to use mental math, right?.. When you don't have a pen and paper.

This makes perfect sense to me. We do something similar, as we have 'math baths' twice per week. This entails about a million different waterproof math manipulatives, measuring devices, etc... But another thread altogether:)

We do a lot of mental math in the bath, in the car, and waiting in various places. My kiddo actually started it: her self-proclaimed nickname is 'Charlie Chicken' and she made up a game called No Trickin' my Chicken. Mental math is all the rage, but to expand upon her initial forays I did use a whiteboard to demonstrate intermediate steps. She also used her fingers to make say, sign language numbers on her right hand for tens and then on her left hand for ones, or similar when she was learning to keep the numbers in her head.

Another thing that really, really helped her was Soraban. Soroban is Japanese Abacus training. Since it is Asian-style math it goes really, really well with RS, Singapore math, and MIF, all of which we have done or do. If you haven't seen it, there are a million YouTube videos. Eventually, you work towards Anzan, a mental, virtual abacus in your head. That being said, even beginners start to picture that abacus in your head and it makes mental math sooo much easier:)

[Tanikit]

For my DD6 (who is still doing pretty easy mental math - she is in SIngapore 2a at the moment) the thing that motivates her is money - give her some pocket money, send her into a shop and she will know exactly what she can afford and also exactly what the change will be (to the surprise of the tellers) - ask her the same sum at home without something to buy and she complains and "cannot do it." 

 

I also think that an inability to hold the numerals in one's head is fairly normal since 98 is a quantity - if you have played with enough manipulatives and she can see then actual things in her head (9 groups of 10 - either the actual manipulative that represents this or 9 groups of 10 actual things like sweets or puzzle pieces or something) she may have a much better time of it as then she would be able to see her hand moving the pieces around - this is much easier to see in your head than just a number that is confusing and very abstract. It is also easier to see why making a one hundred would be easier if she gets it with the manipulatives.

[Korrale]

We do mental math on our walks. I give my son math problems and he skips along figuring them out. Sadly due to winter weather walks had been in hiatus for such a long time. Now that we are walking again I feel that he has regressed so much. So we have been making sure to have short mental math spurts during the day. My son will not do it when we are doing math work. He is a huge fan of working through all the steps.

Like someone else mentioned. I was never taught mental math. Or not explicitly that I remember. I mostly taught myself many tricks. I am reading a few mental math books now, and I find that the tricks are not too unconventional as I figured out a lot of the patterns years ago. When did I figure them out? When I used to take long walks with the dogs all over our farm.

[redsquirrel]

As someone who has been through SM once already I say that some things are more difficult than others, and you muddle through the difficult parts the best you can. I think my older boy had a difficult time with it for a bit and then it just clicked. I doubt my younger boy will ever find it clicking but that will be ok as well.

 

I also write down the intermediate parts. I do things like that as much as they need and am always surprised how, once the pressure is off, they learn that it more trouble to have my help.  Pretty soon they are off on their own.

 

But, if the rest of SM is working for her then just help her as best you can through it and then move on to the next section. Its really not that big a deal. I think it is more important if she can tell you the steps rather than do it all in her head, if that makes sense.

[Susie in MS]

For my dd and I, I came to the conclusion that all roads lead to Rome. Mental math (the SM way) was not cutting it here. If a child can figure out math one way and not the way in the book then what is the problem with that? I have told her that whatever method(s) works for her then that is the one(s) she should use. I was never taught mental math either, yet when my brain was ready for it I figured it out for myself. I feel my dd will do the same. Life is short and my time is extremely limited. If she can learn math easier a different way then that is what we are going with. Some maths programs (I have not seen the one you refer to) just make math harder than it really needs to be. Anyway, that is the conclusion I came to for my hs. I know others feel differently. Hope your situation is remedied soon. 

[Crimson Wife]

I discovered that oldest DD's problem with mental math was not the mental calculation part but rather keeping the digits straight in her head that she heard orally (one of the reasons why I took her to the audiologist for a central auditory processing disorder eval). As soon as I started writing down the original problem for her on the whiteboard, she was able to solve it via mental calculation.

[Guest RJC]

To help your child, you should consider activities found at  www.mathtricks.ca

They will help stimulate math learning in a fun, exciting way.