Jump to content

Menu

Getting evaluations--please point me in the right direction!


Jeeves
 Share

Recommended Posts

Ok.  So this is kind of long.  And I kind of lurk on this board.  And last summer I asked about maybe getting an evaluation for my then-11 yo.  The short story is that he took a long time to read (he was 9), but when he finally got it, he took off.  Well, in the intervening years, he has read (and reads) voraciously, but I have found that he struggles to read and understand instructions during school.  He also has trouble spelling.  Also, he overreacts to situations.

 

When I posted last summer, so many of you were helpful about encouraging me to get an evaluation, but I didn't because I really couldn't figure out what to get an eval for or where to go.  So I continued with not doing anything and (subconsciously) hoping it would just "fix itself."  Anyway, fast forward to a few weeks ago.  My now-12 yo is still struggling with instructions, particularly in math, and my almost 8 yo is struggling to read--looking a lot like my 12 yo did at that age (although he reads better than the 12 yo did at that age and doesn't have the overreaction issues that the 12 yo has).  I just realized I couldn't do this with two kids and it isn't fair to them, either.

 

I have a good friend who is an instructor with the PACE program, so she did an evaluation for for both children.  It's a short eval, but it gave a nice snapshot of what is going on with them.  They look almost identical on paper.  They are moderately low with processing speed and "word attack" (knowing and applying sound codes to pronounce unknown words) and very low with "auditory analysis" (analyzing speech sound within a spoken pattern) and "logic and reasoning" (ability to reason and solve spatially defined problems).  But both were graded high for "working memory" and "visual processing."

 

I think the PACE program would probably help them, but THE COST!  So I'm trying to figure out what I could/should do instead. 

 

I have been trying to find threads that talk about evals and it seems like the prevailing thought is to get their vision tested first by a DO.  With the above description, do you all still think that would be helpful?  Or should I just move right on to a NP eval instead?

 

If you made it all the way through this, congratulations! Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If your insurance will cover a screening through a DO, I say do it.  If something comes up on the screening then you can see about the additional cost (sometimes high) of an in depth developmental vision screening and VT.  If not, maybe someone more knowledgeable than I can chime in here as to how critical this is.  

 

Honestly, I am seriously considering going ahead and getting a more eye exam through a DO for myself, and both my kids sometime this summer.  My DS will start VT next week for heterophoria (diagnosed last week) but I do not know for certain that the DO we are going to is that knowledgeable.  We will see how VT goes, but will possibly be staying in a larger city for a bit this summer and I am considering getting better eye exams then (if we can afford it).

 

Good luck and best wishes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I must have missed something.  Their lowest parameter is auditory processing, so you want to check their eyes??

 

My understanding (could be incorrect) was that the PACE people can use either a PACE-developed test or a standard IQ test (WISC?).  Do you know which she used?  Will she give you the scores or only those word descriptors?  I know with our psych, they'll call something average when it's in the 30th percentile.  You could have someone being called moderately low and that percentile could be surprisingly low.  Then very low could be single digits.  It would be nice to have the percentiles or the actual scores and breakdowns if it was IQ testing.  I know some of the PACE places use IQ testing, so it's worth asking.

 

Although I think everyone does well to get their eyes checked, I think in your case you need a psych eval.  With those results, he can help you sort out if you've got dyslexia going on or need a referral to an audiologist as well.  Around here the good audiologists won't even see you without a full psych eval, so again you're back to getting the psych eval.  And if you're going to do remediation with PACE, it would be good to get a full eval to establish a paper trail, get the diagnosis while it's very clear, etc.  PACE is going to muddy the waters on that, so I would do the psych eval first, just me.

 

If you want to get their eyes checked, sure do it.  That doesn't change needing a psych eval.  At this point your issue is that you don't have the right words for what's going on and that they're not getting in the stream of accommodations to bring out the best in them.  The psych eval is the only thing that will get you those accommodations, so you have to do it.  Have to is strong.  The psych eval will help you immensely.  It's not the end of the world that you waited.  Goodness knows I waited till my dd was 12, sort of also in the same logic.  It made a huge difference for us, so hopefully it will for you to.

 

So what you want is a psychologist or neuropsychologist who is well-regarded for dyslexia.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

With auditory analysis being quite low and word attack being moderately low, with visual processing being in the higher range, I would opt to look first for a full evaluation with an educational psychologist or neuropsychologist. Those lower scores, plus the lower processing speed, are red flags for dyslexia. Like Elizabeth says, you want to get a paper trail established using a psychologist so when you need accommodations for high school programs and/or SAT/ACT testing that it can be shown that your child has a history of a disability.

 

One source for potential evaluators is the database at the International Dyslexia Association website. At the top of the homepage, there is a "Find a Provider" link which lists evaluators as well as tutors and therapists.

 

You could also do an evaluation with a developmental optometrist if you wish to rule out any issues with eye tracking, etc, but with a higher visual processing score, it wouldn't be my first priority.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

I have been trying to find threads that talk about evals and it seems like the prevailing thought is to get their vision tested first by a DO.  With the above description, do you all still think that would be helpful?  Or should I just move right on to a NP eval instead?

 

 

 

Just a quick note about abbreviations: DO is the abbreviation for doctor of osteopathy, an osteopath. OD is the abbreviation to use for an optometrist.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just a quick note about abbreviations: DO is the abbreviation for doctor of osteopathy, an osteopath. OD is the abbreviation to use for an optometrist.

 

Thank you!  Can you tell yet that I'm struggling with all the "stuff" with this?!? :laugh:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I must have missed something.  Their lowest parameter is auditory processing, so you want to check their eyes??

 

My understanding (could be incorrect) was that the PACE people can use either a PACE-developed test or a standard IQ test (WISC?).  Do you know which she used?  Will she give you the scores or only those word descriptors?  I know with our psych, they'll call something average when it's in the 30th percentile.  You could have someone being called moderately low and that percentile could be surprisingly low.  Then very low could be single digits.  It would be nice to have the percentiles or the actual scores and breakdowns if it was IQ testing.  I know some of the PACE places use IQ testing, so it's worth asking.

 

Although I think everyone does well to get their eyes checked, I think in your case you need a psych eval.  With those results, he can help you sort out if you've got dyslexia going on or need a referral to an audiologist as well.  Around here the good audiologists won't even see you without a full psych eval, so again you're back to getting the psych eval.  And if you're going to do remediation with PACE, it would be good to get a full eval to establish a paper trail, get the diagnosis while it's very clear, etc.  PACE is going to muddy the waters on that, so I would do the psych eval first, just me.

 

If you want to get their eyes checked, sure do it.  That doesn't change needing a psych eval.  At this point your issue is that you don't have the right words for what's going on and that they're not getting in the stream of accommodations to bring out the best in them.  The psych eval is the only thing that will get you those accommodations, so you have to do it.  Have to is strong.  The psych eval will help you immensely.  It's not the end of the world that you waited.  Goodness knows I waited till my dd was 12, sort of also in the same logic.  It made a huge difference for us, so hopefully it will for you to.

 

So what you want is a psychologist or neuropsychologist who is well-regarded for dyslexia.

 

Hi OhE--actually, your posts on other threads was the reason I was considering getting his vision checked.  It seemed like what you were saying was that if anyone is having reading issues, then always start with the least expensive, easiest option, which I thought you had said was vision testing.  Anyway, I probably just misunderstood.

 

But, you're right when you say that I don't have the right words for what's going on.  That  is putting it mildly.  I don't even know where to go for an evaluation.  I think I'm going to call the school today and see what they have and what we can do there.  Any other suggestions?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

With auditory analysis being quite low and word attack being moderately low, with visual processing being in the higher range, I would opt to look first for a full evaluation with an educational psychologist or neuropsychologist. Those lower scores, plus the lower processing speed, are red flags for dyslexia. Like Elizabeth says, you want to get a paper trail established using a psychologist so when you need accommodations for high school programs and/or SAT/ACT testing that it can be shown that your child has a history of a disability.

 

One source for potential evaluators is the database at the International Dyslexia Association website. At the top of the homepage, there is a "Find a Provider" link which lists evaluators as well as tutors and therapists.

 

You could also do an evaluation with a developmental optometrist if you wish to rule out any issues with eye tracking, etc, but with a higher visual processing score, it wouldn't be my first priority.

 

I looked on the website for my area and it's mostly tutors and reading helpers.  But thank you for putting the visual processing and the psych eval in perspective!

 

I really appreciate all the info!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I looked on the website for my area and it's mostly tutors and reading helpers.  But thank you for putting the visual processing and the psych eval in perspective!

 

I really appreciate all the info!

I love where we live for the lack of traffic, the close location of many family members, the lower key lifestyle.

 

I hate where we live for the poor or only fair medical care (nearly, literally, killed me when I was fighting breast cancer) and the extreme ignorance in the local medical community...oh and the pretty poor offerings for homeschoolers.  Heavy sigh...no place is perfect.  

 

I hope with all my heart you find a really helpful path.  Best wishes.  You are not alone.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi OhE--actually, your posts on other threads was the reason I was considering getting his vision checked.  It seemed like what you were saying was that if anyone is having reading issues, then always start with the least expensive, easiest option, which I thought you had said was vision testing.  Anyway, I probably just misunderstood.

 

But, you're right when you say that I don't have the right words for what's going on.  That  is putting it mildly.  I don't even know where to go for an evaluation.  I think I'm going to call the school today and see what they have and what we can do there.  Any other suggestions?

I'm sorry, I don't precisely remember your other thread.  I will say I was just responding to your new information.  The psych eval at this point is unavoidable, and doing any form of interventions first would muddy the water.  Our VT place does PACE as well, and I think  you probably would have been seeing more with vision in the testing if it were a dramatic, bleeding, gotta fix it first kind of problem.  Before, I'm guessing you explained it in a way that asked for help on a limited budget where you weren't yet differentiating what the actual problem was.  Now you have a LOT more clear sense of what the problem is, and even if they have some vision problems as well the vision problems AREN'T going to explain those test results.  So you need the psych at this point to dig in.  

 

Sure, get their eyes checked.  I take my ds and dd every year.  But at this point you really need a psych eval, sooner rather than later, and before any expensive interventions.  

 

Btw, sometimes the local ps will give terrific, full evals and great help and followup, and sometimes they do the bare minimum or worse.  See what you can get.  :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm sorry, I don't precisely remember your other thread.  I will say I was just responding to your new information.  The psych eval at this point is unavoidable, and doing any form of interventions first would muddy the water.  Our VT place does PACE as well, and I think  you probably would have been seeing more with vision in the testing if it were a dramatic, bleeding, gotta fix it first kind of problem.  Before, I'm guessing you explained it in a way that asked for help on a limited budget where you weren't yet differentiating what the actual problem was.  Now you have a LOT more clear sense of what the problem is, and even if they have some vision problems as well the vision problems AREN'T going to explain those test results.  So you need the psych at this point to dig in.  

 

Sure, get their eyes checked.  I take my ds and dd every year.  But at this point you really need a psych eval, sooner rather than later, and before any expensive interventions.  

 

Btw, sometimes the local ps will give terrific, full evals and great help and followup, and sometimes they do the bare minimum or worse.  See what you can get.   :)

 

OhElizabeth-- thank you for the information!  I actually meant that I was looking at posts of yours  on other threads, but I seem to be making a mess of communicating today!  Anyway, I just called and left a message at our district school office.  We'll see how far that gets us.  It's a small, rural district, so maybe not very far, but maybe they'll be able to give me more resources to check in the area! 

 

I really do thank you all for just even getting me to realize that it's probably a psych issue and may not be vision at all.  And that maybe we can get it "adjusted" in other ways than PACE--or at least figure out what it is and then go into PACE with full knowledge of what we're dealing with.

 

I love this forum. :hurray:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Here, maybe this will help you?  Someone gave the link in another thread, and I found it a really helpful explanation about the relationship between VT and dyslexia and auditory stuff...  http://eideneurolearningblog.blogspot.com/2009/08/more-vision-wars-visual-training-for.html

 

VT will help if they have vision problems, and PACE, at least with a good therapist, can be very good at getting kids more functional.  Maybe at some point you'll decide to make some interventions like that, but I think you're wise to do like you're doing and pursue the evals first.  Hopefully it goes well and they give you helpful info in a timely fashion.  You might also start making some calls about your private options, just so you aren't left in the lurch if the school falls through.  Keep us posted on how it goes.  :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Alright.  Well, they're checking things at the schools.  It's almost like they've never had a homeschooler ask the questions before (about getting evals at the school).  Anyway, we'll see.

 

I also made a well-child check appointment for my 7 yo and a sports physical appointment (which he needed for this spring) for the 12 yo and I'll quiz the doctor about evals.

 

And thanks for the link, OhElizabeth--I saw that on the other thread, too, and thought it looked great!  I have to read it more thoroughly, though. 

 

I'll let you all know how it goes!  I can't thank you all enough for getting me started in the right direction!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Update:

 

Well, I have been thoroughly pleased with the school responses so far.  They have been very accommodating, even if they can't do much until I get a diagnosis.  I met with a committee for my 7 year old and they were able to give me some ideas on how to help him with his reading.  And I'm going to a meeting for my 12 yo next Wednesday.  I think this will just be a preliminary meeting to find out about him, but they have been really nice about it and just seem to want to help.

 

The other good news is that the pediatrician referred both children to a pediatric psychologist, who will test them for LDs.  And it's covered by insurance!!  I'm still waiting for the appointment scheduler to call, but I'm just thrilled that we'll be able to get them tested! 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just so you know, you can also call up a psychologist yourself.  You don't have to use the one your doc refers you to.  You want to take some time and make sure the psych is at least homeschool-neutral.  Getting someone who's anti-homeschooling might be frustrating to you.  You can talk with people in your community to see who they've sent their kids to.  The places I called were small enough that if you left a message the doc himself would usually call back.  That was nice, because it gave you 5-10 minutes to ask a couple questions (how do they feel about homeschooling, how many hours of testing would they run, how long are their reports, etc.).  

 

Glad things are coming together for you!  That's exciting!  :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I wanted to mention some things other than testing.

 

Reading nonfiction is a skill that needs to be taught and practiced. You may want to consider picking up a booklet that teaches the skill. A link follows:

http://www.amazon.com/Teaching-Students-Read-Nonfiction-Transparencies/dp/0439376521/ref=wl_mb_wl_huc_mrai_1_dp

 

My DS is done with reading remediation; however, he still has to practice reading directions fully. His processing speed is slow and he hates math. He has to practice highlighting the question being answered. He doesn't always folllow directions well either. I believe it is part hormonal boy, part processing speed, and part interest. His verb comp skills are extremely high. Good luck with testing!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Heather, not sure this is useful to the op at all, but I'll just mention (because you reminded me) that the BJU reading and science both do an excellent job of working on reading comprehension in a detailed way.  My dd didn't need the reading and always seemed to blow through the questions, but I could envision them actually giving my ds a run for his money and being worthwhile for him.  The science reading comprehension for BJU was definitely challenging for dd.  I remember when we started in the 3rd grade book (at which point she was reading at a MUCH higher level for fiction, hehe) and she read a section and couldn't answer ANYTHING.  So much for the value of narration for comprehension, hehe.  Narration lets them determine what they thought was important, but some kids benefit, like you're saying, from really explicit work on how to attend to a passage and synthesize it and make inferences and predict and so on.  I've just been really surprised that what I took for granted over the years with the BJU was all right there and something that people were having to look for separate workbooks for hither and yon.  I'm not saying it would go into the most detailed struggling student's needs, but just at that medium level, it's already built in.  

 

That's your trivia for the day, lol.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Heather, not sure this is useful to the op at all, but I'll just mention (because you reminded me) that the BJU reading and science both do an excellent job of working on reading comprehension in a detailed way.  My dd didn't need the reading and always seemed to blow through the questions, but I could envision them actually giving my ds a run for his money and being worthwhile for him.  The science reading comprehension for BJU was definitely challenging for dd.  I remember when we started in the 3rd grade book (at which point she was reading at a MUCH higher level for fiction, hehe) and she read a section and couldn't answer ANYTHING.  So much for the value of narration for comprehension, hehe.  Narration lets them determine what they thought was important, but some kids benefit, like you're saying, from really explicit work on how to attend to a passage and synthesize it and make inferences and predict and so on.  I've just been really surprised that what I took for granted over the years with the BJU was all right there and something that people were having to look for separate workbooks for hither and yon.  I'm not saying it would go into the most detailed struggling student's needs, but just at that medium level, it's already built in.  

 

That's your trivia for the day, lol.  

 

I have an older BJU PS text so will check that out. Thank-you. :D 

 

OP, I mentioned the above because I had a belief that once my son could decode and read text well, that everything else would simply fall in place.  Unfortunately, his dyslexia doesn't work that way.

 

It's the same with dysgraphia too.  I was told that if I took away the pencil and taught the boy to type that all would great in our world.  That assumption is bunk.  Processing speed and EF issues start revealing themselves in more prominent ways.  OhE refers to the way these issues reveal themselves as peeling an onion.  You start digging in and discover you've only scratched the surface.  

 

My son's issues are not rooted in visual BTW.  His issues trend towards OT type things such as vestibular and retained reflexes. We discovered that when he was almost 13 yo and had wrapped up reading instruction.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have an older BJU PS text so will check that out. Thank-you. :D 

 

OP, I mentioned the above because I had a belief that once my son could decode and read text well, that everything else would simply fall in place.  Unfortunately, his dyslexia doesn't work that way.

 

It's the same with dysgraphia too.  I was told that if I took away the pencil and taught the boy to type that all would great in our world.  That assumption is bunk.  Processing speed and EF issues start revealing themselves in more prominent ways.  OhE refers to the way these issues reveal themselves as peeling an onion.  You start digging in and discover you've only scratched the surface.  

 

My son's issues are not rooted in visual BTW.  His issues trend towards OT type things such as vestibular and retained reflexes. We discovered that when he was almost 13 yo and had wrapped up reading instruction.

You won't see it in the student text.  BJU always puts the meat of their curriculum in the tm, and even in high school you need the tm to get the full course.  BJU's philosophy is that the teacher should bring something to the lesson, so they make sure she does.  Most other curricula are kind of stand-alone, toss the book at the kid and it gets done.  So to see what is in BJU, you have to look at the tm.  They have full chapter samples on the press website, so that's the easiest way.  Look at all the stuff in the side bars.  In the reading, which again we can quibble over for it being press-written stuff, etc., they have not only the comprehension stuff but outlining and ...  and ...  It just seemed to me like every time someone would come up with something on the boards, I'd realize it was already in there.  And it came obviously to dd for the most part but might not to ds.

 

Somehow I missed that your ds had issues with retained primitive reflexes, etc.  So how did that affect his reading?  Enlighten me.  :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You won't see it in the student text.  BJU always puts the meat of their curriculum in the tm, and even in high school you need the tm to get the full course.  BJU's philosophy is that the teacher should bring something to the lesson, so they make sure she does.  Most other curricula are kind of stand-alone, toss the book at the kid and it gets done.  So to see what is in BJU, you have to look at the tm.  They have full chapter samples on the press website, so that's the easiest way.  Look at all the stuff in the side bars.  In the reading, which again we can quibble over for it being press-written stuff, etc., they have not only the comprehension stuff but outlining and ...  and ...  It just seemed to me like every time someone would come up with something on the boards, I'd realize it was already in there.  And it came obviously to dd for the most part but might not to ds.

 

Somehow I missed that your ds had issues with retained primitive reflexes, etc.  So how did that affect his reading?  Enlighten me.   :)

Vestibular affects ability to focus near and far.  An example of difficulty would be copying info from a board.  It affects posture and the way he holds his head erect.  VT called the focusing part accommodation, and that is developmental.

 

Retained STNR and ATNR affect ability to sit still.  I'm sure there is more to it.  He is physically uncomfortable sitting.  He reclines whenever, wherever possible.  It gets him in trouble because he extends his impossibly long legs out in front of him while sitting at a desk.  He wants to lie down as he reads too, and I don't allow that.  

 

We used to work a lot at the kitchen counter, sitting on stools but he prefers the office. He needs to practice the inhibition exercises.  OT pushed the IM and balance exercises but didn't really touch the specific reflex exersices.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yeah, that's the bummer about finding things late.  It's so much harder to get compliance.  Then when we encourage evals for 7, 8, 9 yo's people saying we're jumping the gun and overzealous.  Or may be we just know how fun it is to find out what could be done, only find it out so late it probably won't get done.  :(

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just so you know, you can also call up a psychologist yourself.  You don't have to use the one your doc refers you to.  You want to take some time and make sure the psych is at least homeschool-neutral.  Getting someone who's anti-homeschooling might be frustrating to you.  You can talk with people in your community to see who they've sent their kids to.  The places I called were small enough that if you left a message the doc himself would usually call back.  That was nice, because it gave you 5-10 minutes to ask a couple questions (how do they feel about homeschooling, how many hours of testing would they run, how long are their reports, etc.).  

 

Glad things are coming together for you!  That's exciting!   :)

 

Thank you for mentioning this.  I  know I should probably call and talk to her, but since we're in a rural-ish area (only an hour from a major metropolitan area), I sure would just like to go the place that's 30 minutes from my house.  I figure the eval and testing (which is what the first appointment will be) will be fine, even if I don't care for her.  Then I can always go somewhere else for the treatment/therapy/whatever we call it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I wanted to mention some things other than testing.

 

Reading nonfiction is a skill that needs to be taught and practiced. You may want to consider picking up a booklet that teaches the skill. A link follows:

http://www.amazon.com/Teaching-Students-Read-Nonfiction-Transparencies/dp/0439376521/ref=wl_mb_wl_huc_mrai_1_dp

 

My DS is done with reading remediation; however, he still has to practice reading directions fully. His processing speed is slow and he hates math. He has to practice highlighting the question being answered. He doesn't always folllow directions well either. I believe it is part hormonal boy, part processing speed, and part interest. His verb comp skills are extremely high. Good luck with testing!

 

I'm going to check out that pamphlet--thanks!

 

And that is really interesting about your son and slow processing of directions and hating math.  It sounds like my son--including the high verb comp skills.  Good to know that not everything will turn around immediately!

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have an older BJU PS text so will check that out. Thank-you. :D 

 

OP, I mentioned the above because I had a belief that once my son could decode and read text well, that everything else would simply fall in place.  Unfortunately, his dyslexia doesn't work that way.

 

It's the same with dysgraphia too.  I was told that if I took away the pencil and taught the boy to type that all would great in our world.  That assumption is bunk.  Processing speed and EF issues start revealing themselves in more prominent ways.  OhE refers to the way these issues reveal themselves as peeling an onion.  You start digging in and discover you've only scratched the surface.  

 

My son's issues are not rooted in visual BTW.  His issues trend towards OT type things such as vestibular and retained reflexes. We discovered that when he was almost 13 yo and had wrapped up reading instruction.

 

OhE--good to know about the BJU texts.  I think I have some tucked away that I found at a book sale once.  I'm going to go dig them out!

 

And Heather--your two posts about your son just sound so familiar!  But I don't like the sound of the peeling onion (have I mentioned that I have a "just fix it!" mentality?).

 

So what are vestibular and retained reflexes and STNR and ATNR?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

DS suffered chronic ear infections for the first 6 years of his life. Vestibular issues affect coordination, vision, and balance.

 

Here's a link about reflexes. DS never crawled and went straight to walking. When he was little, he struggled to climb. He can ride a bike but is very clumsy and cannot coordinate the two halves of his body to swim. He's taken swimming lessons in the past, but we are never near a pool for him to practice.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

That's very interesting.  Some of the symptoms sound like him (a lot, actually), but he's very athletic and he's always been MORE coordinated the faster he goes.  Which I've always thought was a vestibular issue, too, but can never find anything like it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 months later...

*UPDATE*

 

So I got the results back from the psychologist today for both my 12 yo and my 8 yo.  The results were actually better than expected!  (I hope they're accurate!). 

 

My 12 yo was diagnosed with ADHD and a Written Expression Disorder (basically, this means that he can't spell).  The psych said that the spelling may actually improve once the ADHD is treated since she noticed the great frustration he had with the spelling portion in the test.  She thought that maybe treating the attention issue would help, since all his other scores are actually normal to high normal.  I'm going to make an appointment with his primary care doc to talk about ADHD meds--pros and cons.  This psych said that our primary doc is probably the best in our clinic for knowledge about ADHD meds.  Yay! 

 

Anyone have any insight into this diagnosis or using meds to treat?

 

As for the 8 yo, she diagnosed him with just a plain old "Reading Disorder," which sounds to me like he just needs to work at it.  She didn't see any signs of dyslexia or other LDs, which I'm thankful for and hopeful that the school can help us out with now that I have a "diagnosis."  She said he MIGHT be borderline ADHD, but she wanted to wait for later and re-evaluate once the reading issue has been resolved because some of the ADHD issues might resolve once he's focused enough on reading.  We'll see.  It just sounds like a long summer of very tedious reading to me! But better than what it could have been, I guess.

 

Anyone else every had just a "Reading Disorder" result?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

*UPDATE*

 

So I got the results back from the psychologist today for both my 12 yo and my 8 yo.  The results were actually better than expected!  (I hope they're accurate!). 

 

My 12 yo was diagnosed with ADHD and a Written Expression Disorder (basically, this means that he can't spell).  The psych said that the spelling may actually improve once the ADHD is treated since she noticed the great frustration he had with the spelling portion in the test.  She thought that maybe treating the attention issue would help, since all his other scores are actually normal to high normal.  I'm going to make an appointment with his primary care doc to talk about ADHD meds--pros and cons.  This psych said that our primary doc is probably the best in our clinic for knowledge about ADHD meds.  Yay! 

 

Anyone have any insight into this diagnosis or using meds to treat?

 

As for the 8 yo, she diagnosed him with just a plain old "Reading Disorder," which sounds to me like he just needs to work at it.  She didn't see any signs of dyslexia or other LDs, which I'm thankful for and hopeful that the school can help us out with now that I have a "diagnosis."  She said he MIGHT be borderline ADHD, but she wanted to wait for later and re-evaluate once the reading issue has been resolved because some of the ADHD issues might resolve once he's focused enough on reading.  We'll see.  It just sounds like a long summer of very tedious reading to me! But better than what it could have been, I guess.

 

Anyone else every had just a "Reading Disorder" result?

What the heck is "just a READING DISORDER"?  :)

 

Honestly, isn't that what Dyslexia is?  Did she indicate WHY he has a "reading disorder"?  Difficulties with phonemic awareness?  Difficulties with fluency?  Difficulties with reversals?  Difficulty with tracking?  Difficulty with comprehension?  

 

I am truly puzzled.  Hopefully someone with more knowledge can chime in here and give some clarity.  

 

As for a long summer of very tedious reading, that just sounds awful.  Surely she had suggestions for specific areas to target to help improve his "reading disorder"?  And perhaps some ways to make that process more exciting and fun?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm very glad you are beginning to get answers.

 

My understanding also is the "reading disorder" is the new name for "dyslexia," but it could be broader as in simply not reading as well as expected. ??

 

In any case, for your second ds particularly, it seems as though it could very well be a visual issue. And as there is a suspicion of ADHD as well, I would really consider in an evaluation with a developmental optometrist (covd) at this point. Developmental vision issues are closely correlated with both reading problems ADHD symptoms. Our evals run $200. You could do one ds first, and since they seem rather similar to you, the results for one may help you in deciding to go forward with the other ds. Personally, I think I would rule this out before deciding to go forward with meds.

 

Okay, I'm thinking more now, and definitely out of my area of expertise (as though I had any expertise. LOL)...Dyslexia and stealth dyslexia. Traditionally, dyslexia means problems with reading. But stealth dyslexia refers to more difficulty with spelling than reading. I wish someone more knowledgeable will chime in, but these labels sound like the two issues you are dealing with.

 

The important thing to keep in mind is that your second ds may very well follow the path your first ds did and just bloom later on as a reader. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What the heck is "just a READING DISORDER"?   :)

 

Honestly, isn't that what Dyslexia is?  Did she indicate WHY he has a "reading disorder"?  Difficulties with phonemic awareness?  Difficulties with fluency?  Difficulties with reversals?  Difficulty with tracking?  Difficulty with comprehension?  

 

I am truly puzzled.  Hopefully someone with more knowledge can chime in here and give some clarity.  

 

As for a long summer of very tedious reading, that just sounds awful.  Surely she had suggestions for specific areas to target to help improve his "reading disorder"?  And perhaps some ways to make that process more exciting and fun?

 

Well, we had a relative come out of a ps evaluation with a "diagnosis" of "listening disorder" and "thinking disorder." How's that for helpful?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

For my 8 yo (the one with the "reading disorder"), his cognitive skills (Verbal IQ, Nonverbal IQ, Working Memory, Processing Speed, and Full Scale IQ), he was in the average (on the high end of the bell curve) for all but the Verbal IQ. So that kind of rules out visual issues, I think?  For the Verbal IQ portion, he was on the low side of Low Average.  In fact, she suggested using visual cues and supports to help him with his reading.

 

His academic skills were lower, especially the reading, comprehension and spelling (obviously).  The strange part is that the Decoding part was scored as solidly average. His math wasn't great, but average.

 

Does that help at all?  Anybody see this before?  

 

And what is "stealth dyslexia?"

 

And what's "DSM?"

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There may be much more info contained in the subtest scores (in particular, are there differences among the subtest scores?  Highs and lows?).  And no, high scores do not rule out vision issues.  What test was this?

 

If decoding is good, it's also possible for there to be some other language processing issue.  A speech and language pathologist can usually ferret that out.  For example, my dd had an issue with language processing that led her verbal score to drop between K and a subsequent testing in 3rd grade - it had to do with reading comprehension via making inferences.

 

The DSM is the diagnostic manual that lists official criteria for certain LDs, among other things.  Disorder of written expression is commonly referred to as dysgraphia.  A reading disorder is often referred to as dyslexia, though that's not always the case.

 

AFAIK, stealth dyslexia is an unofficial term often used by the Eides.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Stealth Dyslexia really just means that a child/adult either has certain gifts that are masking the typical signs and struggles with what is considered dyslexia or the weaknesses are not strong enough to easily be noticeable.   And it may have originally been coined by the Eides, but is more commonly used by some now.

 

My son I would consider a stealth dyslexic.  He made straight A's in school until mid-2nd grade.  He got 103 on his spelling tests.  He SEEMED to be reading.  Comprehension was higher than any of his classmates.  But he had some powerful underlying strengths that were masking the real issues.  Those strengths carried him through until mid-2nd grade where he crashed and burned badly.  We had no idea he was dyslexic and dysgraphic and also had other issues.  It was really quite a shock.

 

DD was considered a stealth dyslexic by the evaluator since she made it to 5th grade with mostly A's, some B's her entire school career even though testing in 5th grade showed severe issues with phonemic awareness, fluency, comprehension, etc.  Honestly all the signs were there, though.  She struggled from 4k onward.  I was just too ignorant (and listened to bad advice) to understand what was really happening.  I killed myself reteaching everything at home every single year.  The evaluator admitted that if I hadn't been reteaching everything she would not have functioned well at all in school past kinder (and she was struggling in kinder).

 

I consider DS to be a stealth dyslexic in the truest sense.  If he hadn't had a really awful teacher in 2nd, he might have muscled his way through 2nd, too, without us really knowing he had any learning issues at all.  I'm certain by 3rd it would have become obvious, but not before.  

 

DD, not really.  She was outwardly struggling with standard learning practices the moment her 4k program introduced them.  Classic signs of dyslexia across the board.  We just didn't understand what we were seeing.

 

DSM:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diagnostic_and_Statistical_Manual_of_Mental_Disorders

Link to comment
Share on other sites

For my 8 yo (the one with the "reading disorder"), his cognitive skills (Verbal IQ, Nonverbal IQ, Working Memory, Processing Speed, and Full Scale IQ), he was in the average (on the high end of the bell curve) for all but the Verbal IQ. So that kind of rules out visual issues, I think?  For the Verbal IQ portion, he was on the low side of Low Average.  In fact, she suggested using visual cues and supports to help him with his reading.

 

His academic skills were lower, especially the reading, comprehension and spelling (obviously).  The strange part is that the Decoding part was scored as solidly average. His math wasn't great, but average.

 

Does that help at all?  Anybody see this before?  

 

And what is "stealth dyslexia?"

 

And what's "DSM?"

 

I'm going to suggest something and I'm really not doing it to make your head spin. I would like you to be very sensitive to your ds's reaction as you use visual clues to help, especially when you use them as you simultaneously explain things. This was often suggested with my dd and it caused more frustration because she had visual processing difficulties that we didn't know about. Her system became overwhelmed at times trying to process auditory and visual information simultaneously. Because she has a specific auditory weakness, specialist always assumed visual clues would help but they sometimes made it worse, depending on the complexity of the visual information and how low her frustration tolerance was on a given day. Despite this, she studies music so motivation has a lot to do with it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thank you for all the suggestions and I appreciate your questioning of the Reading Disorder diagnosis.  It made me look a little deeper and I have now made an appointment with a COVD for my 8 yo.  Hopefully, that will yield some answers. 

 

Anyone else with similar diagnoses, please feel free to let me know what you've found out or done!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

And Tiramisu, that last one did make my head spin, so I'm just going to put it in my back pocket and think about it if he doesn't progress! ;)

 

And I just re-read your earlier post--I didn't think about getting a vision eval for my 12 yo, but maybe I will--I found out that our insurance covers the eval, but not the therapy.

 

Thanks for your help!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

And Tiramisu, that last one did make my head spin, so I'm just going to put it in my back pocket and think about it if he doesn't progress! ;)

 

And I just re-read your earlier post--I didn't think about getting a vision eval for my 12 yo, but maybe I will--I found out that our insurance covers the eval, but not the therapy.

 

Thanks for your help!

 

Sorry!

 

The eval is a good idea, and especially nice if insurance covers it.

 

My oldest was home this weekend from college for an Easter visit. At one point she was sitting at the table with her sister who was telling her something but who happened to be waving something in her hand at the same time. Oldest dd said to younger dd, "I can't understand what you are saying while you are waving that thing around!" :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We are getting tested through Scottish Rite ( next month!) and a part of the pre-evaluation form was a behavior assessment form. With her acceptance letter for evaluation, my youngest also received the "blue letter" which encouraged us to have her evaluated for ADHD by our primary physician.

 

While preparing for this appointment, I found Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) algorithm for diagnosing, evaluating. treatment, etc. of ADHD. This was the exact same process that our Pedi had us work through. We had another behavior assessment form to complete prior to the first appointment, and the first appointment lasted quite a while. At the end of this appointment, I felt "good" about the diagnosis, treatment plan, and medication options.

 

Medication is an important part of her overall plan of success. She still has reading issues,  which should be formally identified next month, but medication has improved her success with our reading program that we already have in place.

 

HTH

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We are getting tested through Scottish Rite ( next month!) and a part of the pre-evaluation form was a behavior assessment form. With her acceptance letter for evaluation, my youngest also received the "blue letter" which encouraged us to have her evaluated for ADHD by our primary physician.

 

While preparing for this appointment, I found Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) algorithm for diagnosing, evaluating. treatment, etc. of ADHD. This was the exact same process that our Pedi had us work through. We had another behavior assessment form to complete prior to the first appointment, and the first appointment lasted quite a while. At the end of this appointment, I felt "good" about the diagnosis, treatment plan, and medication options.

 

Medication is an important part of her overall plan of success. She still has reading issues,  which should be formally identified next month, but medication has improved her success with our reading program that we already have in place.

 

HTH

If you get a ped diagnosis without getting the full psych eval, you might miss APD, that would look like adhd but not be.  Is Scottish Rite going to run all the psych tests and do a full eval (IQ, motor control, dysgraphia, word retrieval, etc.) ?  I don't know what testing they run.  You should ask, because the information a full psych eval will give you will make a HUGE difference in how you teach. (assuming the psych takes the time to explain things and show you how they apply)  That adhd label is only the starting point.  Glad the meds are working for you though, that's awesome!   :hurray:  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks for the feedback, OhElizabeth.

 

ADHD-hyperactive is her formal dx, and she fits it to a "T". She does not have any S/S to suspect APD.

 

Specifically, off meds she is extremely talkative, overly active, unable to sit or be quiet when appropriate, seems to be on a "motor" all the time, etc. She could understand a request, but may or may not be able to follow through with the request due to her activity level. Her only learning issue was reading related. Math is not a problem. She is a grade level ahead in math and it didn't matter if the content is verbal or visual unless she was especially hyperactive that day ( which was usually related to diet specifically food dyes).

 

As far as the test at Scottish Rite, my understanding from previous users is to expect the gamut of testing to be done. I will know more on May 8 when I get their results. I'll let you know!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ok.  So my parents have said that they would pay for the PACE program (the tutor certified spin off of the Learning RX program) for both of my children.  The tutor is a friend of mine and she said that it does help with ADHD concentration and I do think it will help with my 8 yo, since he seems to just not be able to read.  Does anyone here have any experience with this program and how it helped their children with ADHD or a reading disorder?  (I'm also keeping the vision appointment, though).

 

Thanks!

Jacey

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

Ă—
Ă—
  • Create New...