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What are the major differences between Singapore Math and Math in Focus?


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#1 KellyMama

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 09:20 AM

Pros and cons for either program?

I've been trying to wrap my head around the SM sample I purchased (4a + HIG) and I've decided my DS would do really well with this approach, but we're both used to programs like Abeka and Saxon where the lesson is all on one or two pages and is taught directly to the student. All the HIG teacher involvement and scripting ideas and multiple manipulatives - it's just not his thing. He likes to read it, decipher it, ask if he needs help and then we go over his work. I'm not sure how to make that style work with Singapore?

Also does anyone use the tests? I see SM offers them but few people tend to mention them in the various 'what to buy' threads.

#2 wapiti

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 09:36 AM

I've been trying to wrap my head around the SM sample I purchased (4a + HIG) and I've decided my DS would do really well with this approach, but we're both used to programs like Abeka and Saxon where the lesson is all on one or two pages and is taught directly to the student.


Maybe what you're looking for is MM - Asian-style, mastery math like Singapore, but written directly to the student, no TM, no extra books. In MM 4, each lesson is usually about a couple of pages.

#3 PandaMom

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 09:51 AM

I have decided to switch to MIF because SM just isn't working for my DD at this time. Check out my thread from the other day to see if you can find any answers. http://forums.welltr...-math-in-focus/ Also, I did go to the MIF website and sign up for the virtual sampling. Definitely a big help in deciding to switch. http://www.hmheducat.../singaporemath/

Susie
DD(7) Turning 8 on Sunday
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#4 Wabi Sabi

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 10:35 AM

Maybe what you're looking for is MM - Asian-style, mastery math like Singapore, but written directly to the student, no TM, no extra books. In MM 4, each lesson is usually about a couple of pages.


Yes, I really wanted to fall in love with Singapore but we just couldn't manage juggling multiple books, guides, etc. MM has been the perfect solution for us. Having everything altogether on the page just simplifies it but without sacrificing quality.

#5 KellyMama

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 11:42 AM

Yes, I really wanted to fall in love with Singapore but we just couldn't manage juggling multiple books, guides, etc. MM has been the perfect solution for us. Having everything altogether on the page just simplifies it but without sacrificing quality.


Ok is MM math mammoth or Miquon Math? ;)

#6 KellyMama

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 11:42 AM

I have decided to switch to MIF because SM just isn't working for my DD at this time. Check out my thread from the other day to see if you can find any answers. http://forums.welltr...-math-in-focus/ Also, I did go to the MIF website and sign up for the virtual sampling. Definitely a big help in deciding to switch. http://www.hmheducat.../singaporemath/

Susie
DD(7) Turning 8 on Sunday


I just did that too. Hopefully it will help me to decide.

#7 Chelli

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 12:02 PM

I just did that too. Hopefully it will help me to decide.


I wrote a review of MIF on my blog. You might want to take a look at it. Singapore Standards didn't work for ME, as the teacher. I'm sure my dd would have done fine with it, but if I can't teach it, it won't work. Math Mammoth didn't work for dd. The amount of problems on the page would have her upset before we ever started the lesson. MIF works for both of us.
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#8 KellyMama

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 12:35 PM

Is the scope and sequence of MIF 4 similar to Singapore 4a/4b? Somehow when I look at the samples at CBD it doesn't seem to cover the same concepts - or it seems "easier" somehow? I do like the look of the workbook. I guess if I felt it was too easy, I could supplement with the CWP from Singapore and I was contemplating using BA alongside it for "fun" anyway, so perhaps it's ok if MIF is more typical 4th grade work. I just know we used Abeka 4th for my DDs and my middle child really did NOT need that much long division practice. We skipped the green problems and while she got it done, she was bored. to. tears. I see much benefit to repetition, but my little guy is wired like my middle - he doesn't need that much. He needs meaty concepts. Something to sink his teeth into, enough practice to solidify it (which I realize varies for each kid and each concept) and then he wants to move on (with some spiral but not much, daily). Am I asking the impossible lol or does that sound like a math program out there? ;)

#9 KellyMama

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 12:35 PM

I wrote a review of MIF on my blog. You might want to take a look at it. Singapore Standards didn't work for ME, as the teacher. I'm sure my dd would have done fine with it, but if I can't teach it, it won't work. Math Mammoth didn't work for dd. The amount of problems on the page would have her upset before we ever started the lesson. MIF works for both of us.



Yes, that's what I'm thinking too! I'm not sure I can teach it! ;) Thanks for posting the link to your blog - checking it out . . .

Edited to add: OK, I could have written this myself!!!

I don’t consider myself a math dummy. I don’t like math that much, but I went all the way through Advanced Placement Calculus in high school, so I knew how to work math problems. I did not understand how to do math or teach math using this method. Obviously I was taught to “plug and chug!”


I hope it's ok to quote from your blog. This just perfectly summed up my math background! I also don't love math and I also made it through AP Cal. I shouldn't have any issues teaching this, I'm just not sure I WANT to teach math with this many "pieces" - or that he wants to learn it like that either! LOL Thank you for verbalizing that for me!

#10 Spy Car

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 12:40 PM

Ok is MM math mammoth or Miquon Math? ;)


Math Mammoth.

Bill

#11 Spy Car

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 01:22 PM

To prove that it takes all kinds (:D), I like having multiple books to juggle.

Why? Because the different books in Primary Mathematics fill different needs in our math program.

For me, I don't want one book that is written to the student that they do independently (except, perhaps, when they have problems). Rather, I want to have a parent/teacher intensive portion of the math program with plenty of Socratic dialogue, some Direct Instruction, some student lead discovery, some activity based learning, and a lot of interaction to make a rich teaching/learning experience. The PM Textbooks and HIGs fill that portion of the program.

Then there are Workbooks for students to practice and showing competence that they have absorbed the lessons.

Then the Intensive Practice and Challenging Word Problem books raise the bar, taking Primary Mathematic from a "strong" to a "world-class" math program.

My 2 cents.

Bill

#12 SweetandSimple

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 02:29 PM

We're using Math in Focus 1A right now. I really like it, and I feel good that I can teach the Singapore approach this way. I do use the Instructor's Manual, the textbook, and the workbook, though, so there is still quite a bit of book-juggling going on. I wish that it was easier to compare the scope/sequence of MIF with Singapore, but I really do think that the programs are quite similar.

#13 KellyMama

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 04:08 PM

To prove that it takes all kinds ( :D), I like having multiple books to juggle.

Why? Because the different books in Primary Mathematics fill different needs in our math program.

For me, I don't want one book that is written to the student that they do independently (except, perhaps, when they have problems). Rather, I want to have a parent/teacher intensive portion of the math program with plenty of Socratic dialogue, some Direct Instruction, some student lead discovery, some activity based learning, and a lot of interaction to make a rich teaching/learning experience. The PM Textbooks and HIGs fill that portion of the program.

Then there are Workbooks for students to practice and showing competence that they have absorbed the lessons.

Then the Intensive Practice and Challenging Word Problem books raise the bar, taking Primary Mathematic from a "strong" to a "world-class" math program.

My 2 cents.

Bill


I'm actually not surprised by this - I know lots of people must feel this way because Singapore is so well-loved! Even taking away my own reticence, I'm not sure my son would enjoy this format. I'm going to have to mull it over a little more and perhaps show him the differences between a few programs. Going into 4th grade, I'm pretty sure he'd like having an opinion stake in our decision! ;)

#14 jer2911mom

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 02:11 AM

I posted this in the thread that was linked above, but I contacted MIF to find out when you would hit algebra I because it is not clear in their sequence. They said it would not be until after Course 3 (the 3rd middle school course), so you wouldn't get to algebra I until 9th grade unless you accelerated the other levels. They said the middle school levels of MIF do a good job of introducing the algebra concepts, but students would still need to take algebra I afterwards. So the pace seems to be slower than Singapore PM.

Chapter reviews/tests are in the MIF workbooks or student books, depending on the level. These can be used as either review exercises or formal assessment. The workbooks have cumulative and mid-year assessments. The MIF assessments book is a test-prep book that contains multiple choice answers.

HTH,
Kathy
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