Terminal illness in laws shutting us out...

[elizabeth]

Phew what a month. My BIL had a quad bypass wherein they found cancer in the chest wall and in the kidneys as well a clear cell carcinoma. We have always had a tenuous relationship and he has however, come over here on weekends to watch TV sports with my husband. It is my practice to cook and serve food and treat him like an honored guest in my home despite his refusal to attend our wedding and telling anyone who would listen that I was a gold digging whore. For the record this is untrue. I actually come from a very well educated and well respected family and it was ludicrous to say such things. I forgave him and let this go many years ago. Presently I am alone in my study wondering what to do. I found out today that my husband was told by the third sibling who does not live here that I was not welcome to bring food or any have any involvement with helping out while BIL is ill. Further my husband was told that our daughter was welcome but I was not as I made BIL uncomfortable. I think this is coming from his spouse who does not know how often he came over here and ate gladly from my table. Who knows? This is something that to me crosses the line of decency. I am angry, hurt and feel quite betrayed after having waited on him hand and foot for years only to be told by a third party that I was not welcome nor was my assistance welcome at all. To be unflinchingly honest I have never felt so dirty and shameful in my life. Who on God's green earth would treat someone this way who has been kind and forgiving of cruel treatment? To be told that our daughter was welcome and I was not was worse than being slapped and fiercely so. Sadly, the man who told me this was not outraged, not in the least. You are a quick group and can figure this one out fairly quickly. I will respect the wishes that I have been informed of but feel that this is an attempt to marginalize me and demean my marriage. You could have knocked me over with a feather as this news was given to me as if it were no big deal...I am just horrified. What is going on here??

[Unicorn.]

I'm curious as to what your dh said/did. Honestly, if he didn't tell them they could all go straight to He!!, then I think you have bigger problems to worry about. :grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug:

[Melissa in Australia]

:grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug:

 

Sometimes people who are faced with imminent death do and say things that are not how a 'normal' person behaves. Sometimes their partner does this as well.

 

Not excusing your DH at all though. Maybe he is having a blockhead moment and didn't think about how hurtful repeating other's words was.

[Anne in CA]

This behavior is so far off the charts of "decent" that I for one would be grateful that they don't feel close to you. You think you feel dirty now, imagine if you had been close with these people for years and found out that they would do this to someone like you, then you would BE dirty. Right now you are lucky and can just feel like you have been a gracious hostess to an ungrateful person with an ugly soul. I have been betrayed by someone who is not who he pretends to be in public and I do feel grateful that I am not one of this person's "circle". Those people are like him and they are nasty by association to me now. I would not expose my dd to such people, even if your dh wanted to, even as a death bed request. Such people are pure poison and I would not allow my child near them at all. I would explain why to the child, in the most gracious way possible, but NO way NO how, would these people influence my children.

 

I doubt very much that this is his wife, I think he feels bad about his allegations about you in the past and is lying to himself to justify them. No one but him and his wife are fooled, but some people are happy to remain fooled. They think they can "explain away" the truth. I have learned to run from such people.

[elizabeth]

I am not crying any more. I will respond to each of these helpful and loving posts. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. And yes I do have more to worry about than this situation. I am very mindful that the statement was not offered to me in a generous or protective fashion. Cruelty and poison are par for the course Anne. You nailed it. Which breaks my heart in some ways as I hate to think others have been trodden upon with slander and malice. How can people behave in such a way? I could not do it. No way.

[Reya]

Someone's SO needs a little crash course on what marriage means. Can't do anything about the BIL, but the DH would be in the BASEMENT until he figured out that he was expected to stand up for me.

[ladyinthegarden]

If you have been in that family long enough to serve them, and have a daughter of the marriage. Then the family should take a united stance to defend you, and tell these knuckleheads that if you are not welcome, they won't be coming either, especially your child! That would be like sending her to wolves, to be around people who don't respect her mother. I've been through this twice, first marriage failed because of a MIL, and her nasty antics. They will tell anyone who will give an ear I was a horrible person .Truth be told, I was glad to get rid of them ALL when I signed the divorce, it was like divorcing his entire family. My current marriage came with in-laws that are just as bad, and worse. I could write a book. Long story short, the MIL tried the same antics. We forged a united front. The funny thing is, my new BIL was inquiring about how much better she acted when I showed up. I said to him it's because I won't tolerate the non-sense, and she knows she must act dignified to be around my family. It's one for all, or nothing at all.

[PrincessMommy]

Sigh... I am so very sorry this has happened to you. :grouphug: It seems like there are several issues going on at once. First the in-laws and their blocking you out, 2nd your husband's reaction, the rest of the family's reaction.

 

There really isn't much you can do about the in-laws and family. I just don't think now is the time to try to force them to change - especially your dying BIL. :grouphug:

 

But, I totally agree iwth others that you should have a sit-down with your husband and then with your husband and dd about how THEY will react. I would even consider bringing in a third-party. This is a pretty intense time for your dh and on one hand he doesn't have a lot of time to get his brother to understand his POV, but on the other hand if he doesn't have your back now, when will he?

 

Just my paltry 2cents.

[Danestress]

I guess I disagree with everyone else.

 

Even though I do have trouble with your dh accepting this, and especially with him allowing those comments in the past, his brother is dying. I would pray that g

 

ETA: Sorry - this is the second time I have done this - started to post something, changed my mind, and accidentally posted a unfinished post without knowing it until someone "likes" what I wrote, even though I didn't mean to post it and didn't finish it.

 

But anyway, what I was going to say, but thought the better of, but oh, what the heck, was the following: I think you should pray (or think about or whatever your faith tells you to do) how you can minister to your DH during what is no doubt a really hard time for him. If your BIL truly doesn't want you there (and I sort of doubt it because it seems this was second hand) then let it go. Be humble. I agree that perhaps your DH SHOULD stand up for you, but I wouldn't force the issue when he is going through a really hard time with his family.

 

Don't make this into something more painful for him. It's painful for you, and you are being treated unjustly, but sometimes rather that take a huge stand and demand our rights, it's better to shrug and see what happens.

[bzymom]

That is reprehensible behavior, and I would have great difficulty with any family that would allow any member to be treated in such a manner. (And d/h and I would definitely rumble!)

 

But I think that issue is separate right now. Your BIL is dying, and there is not going to be anything good to come out of reacting to this garbage that has been spewed at this moment. I would certainly let my husband know of my hurt and outrage, but I would wait to deal with the others until a more appropriate time.

 

:grouphug: :grouphug: You deserve better.

[Parrothead]

Your dh needs a swift kick in the pants for not defending you. He also needs to man up.

 

No way in h-e-double hockey sticks would I or dd have anything to do with them now until the funeral., and I might not show up at the funeral.

 

It wouldn't surprise me to hear later that they blame your cooking on BIL illness and death.

[twinmami01]

I'm so sorry you are dealing with this. I can't imagine how hurtful this is. No wise words, just prayers and hugs.

[elegantlion]

Read the Homer quote in your signature. His behavior speaks from his thoughts. The forgiven are not always remorseful about their words. If this is his request, he's speaking what's been in his heart. Unfortunate.

 

It sounds like dh was passing on information, I certainly would have been gobsmacked to hear that.

 

It sounds like he never did change his mind about how he felt about you in the beginning. He's been playing nice for years. That would not make me shameful, it would piss me off. But we cannot change another person. Some people just don't click, it's just true, even in family.

 

It should be no reflection on you because in his dying days he's being an a$$. It's hurtful and mean and really unnecessary, to smack the hand of one who would choose to help another, especially one who is dying. It's a reflection on him.

 

What to do? Cry again? probably. Send your dh and dd there to say their peace? I don't know. I probably would. I would probably cook that darn fine meal for myself and my family.

 

In the end, it is his loss. In the end, however, I think we die how we live. Dying doesn't change our character. This isn't about you, it's about him.

[Guest inoubliable]

Phew what a month. My BIL had a quad bypass wherein they found cancer in the chest wall and in the kidneys as well a clear cell carcinoma. We have always had a tenuous relationship and he has however, come over here on weekends to watch TV sports with my husband. It is my practice to cook and serve food and treat him like an honored guest in my home despite his refusal to attend our wedding and telling anyone who would listen that I was a gold digging whore. For the record this is untrue. I actually come from a very well educated and well respected family and it was ludicrous to say such things. I forgave him and let this go many years ago. Presently I am alone in my study wondering what to do. I found out today that my husband was told by the third sibling who does not live here that I was not welcome to bring food or any have any involvement with helping out while BIL is ill. Further my husband was told that our daughter was welcome but I was not as I made BIL uncomfortable. I think this is coming from his spouse who does not know how often he came over here and ate gladly from my table. Who knows? This is something that to me crosses the line of decency. I am angry, hurt and feel quite betrayed after having waited on him hand and foot for years only to be told by a third party that I was not welcome nor was my assistance welcome at all. To be unflinchingly honest I have never felt so dirty and shameful in my life. :grouphug: Who on God's green earth would treat someone this way who has been kind and forgiving of cruel treatment? A$$holes. And you can't change people like that, you can only work around them if you have to. To be told that our daughter was welcome and I was not was worse than being slapped and fiercely so. I've been there, and you're so very right. It's insulting and hurtful. Sadly, the man who told me this was not outraged, not in the least. You are a quick group and can figure this one out fairly quickly. I will respect the wishes that I have been informed of but feel that this is an attempt to marginalize me and demean my marriage. It likely is. You could have knocked me over with a feather as this news was given to me as if it were no big deal...I am just horrified. What is going on here?? They're circling the wagon, closing in on ranks. It happens in some families. It happened in my DH's family. If you and your DH (and this really does need to be a decision you make together, backing each other up) decide that it is important to you both to be involved with BIL's care, then your DH needs to have a frank response to whoever tries to shut you out. Something like, "DW and I have been involved in BIL's life for years, we have been aware of his health issues and have been active in supporting him. We will continue to be active in supporting him in whatever way BIL needs and we can provide. If BIL chooses not to accept that help, then we will respect his wishes when he tells us that."

[G5052]

Yes, not uncommon.

 

My parents and I were increasingly enstranged over the years (mental illness compounded by dementia), and neither wanted me around at all when they were in hospice.

 

I respected that, but I did go to the funerals, partly because I wanted to see other relatives and family friends at that time.

[Starr]

They don't sound like healthy role models for your dd.

[KnitWit]

(((Elizabeth))) I'm so sorry. That is just horrible.

 

I think that your dh should have a private conversation with his brother and find out if his brother truly feels that way. If it IS bil's wish, then your dh should ask him why he has been able to stomach your hospitality and food at your own table and now is shutting you out, what is his motive? If your dh is not willing to speak for you...that needs to be addressed also.

 

As for the funeral, they are for the living, not the dead. The dead do not know the attendance. It's your dh's brother. If your dh wants you there to comfort HIM, then go. If HE doesn't want you there and sides with whomever took it upon themselves to voice this *wish*, then I'd probably wash my hands of the whole lot.

[bolt.]

I don't think it's unreasonable for a dying man to have a visitor list that is restricted only to people with whom he is entirely comfortable and finds 100% uplifting.

 

I also don't find it surprising that "the woman my brother selected as a bride, who is part of my extended family" isn't among the category of people who are 100% totally comfortable and entirely uplifting.

 

I don't think you have an "earned right" to be present or helpful, just because you have been part of the hospitality when you and your DH hosted your BIL at your home. There is no such thing as an "earned right" that should make it wrong for someone to decide they and you are not close enough for deathbed hospital visits.

 

And the other people there matter too -- not just the dying man, but the people who are coping with loosing him... And not nessisarily coping in healthy ways yet (or ever).

 

I, personally, know already that I make my IL's feel that they have to keep up appearances around me. I didn't remotely expect to visit my FIL when he was 'indisposed' in a hospital situation. He likes me fine around a dinner table, but a hospital gown and breathing tube is something else. His son for companionship and his granddaughters for hope, and my service is to help make that happen -- because that's what actually helps/serves. (I don't believe that inserting myself where I am not making people more comfortable actually would be an act of service to them.)

 

All this to say that it can be hard when you find out that you aren't in the inner circle for a crisis, but the fact is you *aren't* in the inner circle all the time, and the least helpful thing to do in a crisis is to try to make the suffering people make space for you in there, whether they are comfortable about it or not. We love them from outside the circle, if we can. And if we can't, we respect that and carry on.

[Lady Florida.]

((((((Elizabeth))))))

 

I have no words of wisdom, but agree with what EL wrote, quoted below. It's sad that he is dying and cancer sucks. Neither excuses his behavior though. Some a$$holes are a$$holes to the end.

 

 

 

In the end, however, I think we die how we live. Dying doesn't change our character. This isn't about you, it's about him.

[Spryte]

:grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug:

 

How very painful. I'm so sorry.

[kalanamak]

As horrible as I know you feel, I have a fundamental belief that death belongs to the dying. I would take any advise to not show up as **the best that they can do now**, and let it be. Who knows, you may be the scapegoat that helps unite the others in this terrible time.

 

I have seen many families cope with death in good and bad ways, and that is how I came up with opinion that dying belongs to the dying.

I hope this helps even a little.

[elizabeth]

The many and varied responses here have given me several things to consider. I have not reposted until now as I have been up all morning and afternoon cooking. I told my husband that he was to call and let them know that beef stroganoff and a barley vegetarian dish were being delivered by my husband around 5 ish. I am deeply touched by the effort and honesty in each and every response. He is welcome to call me whatever he likes but I made a promise to cook for him and have kept my word. The phone rang about an hour ago and I could not hear it as I was cooking. There was no message but it was from BIL's home. If they are refusing the food it is no skin off my nose we will eat it and enjoy the fruits of my labor and love. It is tragic to me that they live this way. I choose not to follow their lead and to do what is right. I am respecting his wishes by not going over there nor will my sweet daughter be around where her mother is treated like dirt. However I promised to make his favorite dishes for him and my word is my bond. I might be a wh*re but I certainly am not petty and spiteful. I have to live with me. If my effort is refused so be it but the ugly is not on me.

[elizabeth]

I don't think it's unreasonable for a dying man to have a visitor list that is restricted only to people with whom he is entirely comfortable and finds 100% uplifting.

 

I also don't find it surprising that "the woman my brother selected as a bride, who is part of my extended family" isn't among the category of people who are 100% totally comfortable and entirely uplifting.

 

I don't think you have an "earned right" to be present or helpful, just because you have been part of the hospitality when you and your DH hosted your BIL at your home. There is no such thing as an "earned right" that should make it wrong for someone to decide they and you are not close enough for deathbed hospital visits.

 

And the other people there matter too -- not just the dying man, but the people who are coping with loosing him... And not nessisarily coping in healthy ways yet (or ever).

 

I, personally, know already that I make my IL's feel that they have to keep up appearances around me. I didn't remotely expect to visit my FIL when he was 'indisposed' in a hospital situation. He likes me fine around a dinner table, but a hospital gown and breathing tube is something else. His son for companionship and his granddaughters for hope, and my service is to help make that happen -- because that's what actually helps/serves. (I don't believe that inserting myself where I am not making people more comfortable actually would be an act of service to them.)

 

All this to say that it can be hard when you find out that you aren't in the inner circle for a crisis, but the fact is you *aren't* in the inner circle all the time, and the least helpful thing to do in a crisis is to try to make the suffering people make space for you in there, whether they are comfortable about it or not. We love them from outside the circle, if we can. And if we can't, we respect that and carry on.

He is at home and going into the hospital for dialysis a few days each week. It is one matter to refuse to see those with whom one is not comfortable that is understandable and certainly the right of any person. However, to say my daughter is welcome but I am not is grotesque and reminds me of the old days on the plantation where the mixed race children were allowed in the big house but their mothers were exiled to the fields for the offense of being of color. This situation is far uglier than I have described. As bad as it gets. But I thank you for your honest insights and opinion nonetheless.

[mommaduck]

I agree that they are circling the wagons. Be supportive of your husband. Cook (regardless who eats it). Speak to your husband about his showing unity in your marriage to his family (aka you, him, kids are a packaged deal) calmly and at an apprpriate time. Don't make it a "me or them" isue though...not right now while emotions are running high. Though, yes, I'd be wanting to pitch one hell of a fit.

[elfgivas]

:grouphug:

 

you have kept your word, and offered your gift. once the gift is given, it is up to the receiver to do with it as they choose. (that one is hard, but true).

 

now, maybe cook your dh's favourite foods for him tomorrow or the next day or .... encourage dh to talk about his brother, memories of when they were little, for example. maybe they loved to fly kites. maybe your dd can go fly a kite with her dad and you as a remembering.... (ie. do things that help your dh thru a hard time, and that show love and compassion).

 

:grouphug:

ann

[elizabeth]

When the food was ready at 5:30, dh called and texted. They were unapologetic and said today would not work as they had already eaten(despite dh call to them at noon) . They then said that I could cook the same thing tommorrow and that would be fine. I told them I did not have time as dd has a guitar performance from 10 to 2 at a local restaurant, then a couple hours of taking down decorations at the law office and dinner before belly dance classes. the gall of these people. To go out to eat and suggest I simply remake the meal tomorrow as if I have nothing to do but jump at their every whim? Sorry folks I am not the hired help. Their message was sent to me and understood. I am done. And relieved. I like clarity and their feelings for me were made abundantly clear. What is the deal is this crap on the nice people week or what?!

[MomatHWTK]

Honestly, you set yourself up for the rejection and the "gall." You knew the request and the opinions of the folks involved and chose to make a meal anyway then claimed the high road by saying you were keeping your word. It is fine to be offended that someone has rejected you, but if you had really forgiven your BIL's comment from years past it wouldn't keep coming up in your posts now. If you really had wanted to honor his wishes, you wouldn't have pushed by calling and saying you were making a dinner when you knew it would very likely cause conflict. Let the man die, let his wife be with him and stop fussing over whether you have been given sufficient honor for your hospitality.

[Lawana]

Honestly, you set yourself up for the rejection and the "gall." You knew the request and the opinions of the folks involved and chose to make a meal anyway then claimed the high road by saying you were keeping your word. It is fine to be offended that someone has rejected you, but if you had really forgiven your BIL's comment from years past it wouldn't keep coming up in your posts now. If you really had wanted to honor his wishes, you wouldn't have pushed by calling and saying you were making a dinner when you knew it would very likely cause conflict. Let the man die, let his wife be with him and stop fussing over whether you have been given sufficient honor for your hospitality.

 

I disagree. I think it's unfair and unkind to suggest that her dh's family's rejection of her and her efforts are in any way her fault.

[elegantlion]

Honestly, you set yourself up for the rejection and the "gall." You knew the request and the opinions of the folks involved and chose to make a meal anyway then claimed the high road by saying you were keeping your word. It is fine to be offended that someone has rejected you, but if you had really forgiven your BIL's comment from years past it wouldn't keep coming up in your posts now. If you really had wanted to honor his wishes, you wouldn't have pushed by calling and saying you were making a dinner when you knew it would very likely cause conflict. Let the man die, let his wife be with him and stop fussing over whether you have been given sufficient honor for your hospitality.

 

 

Wow, that's a little harsh. Elizabeth is not one to come here and air her grievances to toot her own horn.

 

She is known to make food and take food, she did what she does to aid people in need. She was summarily rejected and then advised to remake the meal at their convenience, yes that takes gall. Most people would take the meal and reheat the next day. Yes, a man is dying, but they are still trying to set the rules on how they accept help and assitance, from family none the less.

 

I presume there is more not written about the entire story, which is hers to keep. Rejection stings, even when you are used to it.

 

I see Elizabeth as offering a token of hospitality, a white flag of goodwill, which it sounds like she is known for. She's already stepped away from visiting. She's hurting, she doesn't come here and share those pains often, how about a little grace towards her.

 

How would you like to be told by a dying family to not come, we're not here for long, but we don't want to see you. I think you'd need to vent somewhere too.

 

Elizabeth, I'm sorry :grouphug:

[hillfarm]

I would ask your dh to calmly let bil know that the 3rd party told you to stay away. If that was not his wish, then he has the option to say something to the contrary. However, I would not be surprised if he doesn't. It may well be easier to him during this time when he has low energy and spirits, to not fight with the 3rd party and others about whether or not you should be welcomed.

 

I would stay away and keep your dd away also. If I am not welcome, then I will not subject my dd to having to decide whether she is betraying me by going. Discuss this with your dh. If the bil requested a deathbed meeting with your dd, then I would let your dh decide. And then, only a short time with the bil and then out of there. No visiting with the others who have been so ugly.

 

Also, no more food. If they ask, I'd calmly respond in a similar manner as they did. I cooked it yesterday for you. I am not able to cook for you today. No explanation, no arguing, no nothing. End of story. They were unwilling to inconvenience themselves or change their plans. Thus establishing the ground rules. Today it is inconvenient for you and you are not able to change your plans. He who lives an inflexible life may well die (or starve) by the same.

 

Suport your dh and dd as much as possible. Ignore the others. Don't go to the funeral. The deceased won't know, it will only upset the bereaved. If your dh needs your presence that much, wait in the car for him. Leave the others to their own devices. They are not worth you doing something that would cause you to lose the respect of your dh, dd, or self. To put it more succinctly, good riddance to bad rubbish. Let them go from your life.

[bolt.]

 

He is at home and going into the hospital for dialysis a few days each week. It is one matter to refuse to see those with whom one is not comfortable that is understandable and certainly the right of any person. However, to say my daughter is welcome but I am not is grotesque and reminds me of the old days on the plantation where the mixed race children were allowed in the big house but their mothers were exiled to the fields for the offense of being of color. This situation is far uglier than I have described. As bad as it gets. But I thank you for your honest insights and opinion nonetheless.

 

I don't understand your thoughts about your daughter. Half of the time you sound like you just want the opportunuty to help ease his passing, and are feeling sad and rejected because you are not in a position to offer something meaningful -- and the other half of the time you sound like you are just plain angry at these people and want to punish them for failing to perceive you as among their nearest and dearest.

 

Aparently it would be nice for him to see his niece. If that's the case, what reason would a person who only wants to help ease his passing have to keep her away? Spending time with the children of one's family is very uplifting. It's much more uplifting than a meal! In that situation, I'd practically tie a bow around her neck and send her over regularly. Anything to help!

 

Is this a racial issue or something? Is that what your comparison is implying? I just don't get it.

[elizabeth]

Honestly, you set yourself up for the rejection and the "gall." You knew the request and the opinions of the folks involved and chose to make a meal anyway then claimed the high road by saying you were keeping your word. It is fine to be offended that someone has rejected you, but if you had really forgiven your BIL's comment from years past it wouldn't keep coming up in your posts now. If you really had wanted to honor his wishes, you wouldn't have pushed by calling and saying you were making a dinner when you knew it would very likely cause conflict. Let the man die, let his wife be with him and stop fussing over whether you have been given sufficient honor for your hospitality.

 

Actually the reverse is true. BIL stated last week to his third sibling that he in fact had never considered me family and I was not welcome to visit but my daughter could.This after dining at my home for many occasions and asking me to cook an elegant dinner for he and his best friend which I did quite obligingly. Silver, fine china 6 courses and dessert. So no I never had a clue HE was hanging on to old conflict until the past week. I had no reason to. He has made himself a frequent guest at my home so why on earth would I think he saw me as an outsider? I did not set myself up for abuse. All I have done is try to avoid friction that would cause my husband pain. I offered a month ago to make food and his wife gave me a list of things he liked. Sorry but I was led to believe until last week that there was no issue whatsoever until my husband informed that the third sibling called with his ugly messaage that I was not welcome but my daughter was. And I did honor his wishes I never set foot anywhere near him or his home. The fact is they are all absolutey convinced that ANYONE who does any kindness is after their immense wealth. Maybe it is ok for you to be told you are a gold digging whore, never apologized to despite your continued hospitality, and then had someone give you a list of foods that were acceptable, then told no you as a person were not welcome and then watched your husband have his repeated calls and texts rejected as well. I have boundaries around what is civil and gracious behaviour. And the man will die alone except for his wife as their children avoid them like the plague due to the endless cruelty and dysfunction. I hope his wealth is a great comfort to them both as that is all they have, they have shoved everyone else aside including the housekeeper who has cleaned for them for 40 years. But yes I did bring rudeness and uncivil conduct my way by preparing a lovely meal that accorded with his spouse's instructions to me . Good grief you should meet them as you would likely get along quite well. No one deserves to be treated with dismissive rudeness and cruelty like an errant house servant. No one. Making a dinner to cause conflict does not fly either, my husband has been over there daily for weeks. This is about their neurotic obsession with never needing to say thank you. Money does not buy class nor does education. The behaviour exhibited by them is appalling. For the record, I took care of their father when he was dying and he would be so very very ashamed at this conduct. You have not had all the facts at your disposal so I will assume the best that I failed to explain the background adequately. But saying to a woman who was called a gold digging whore and has done nothing but be kind to the person who uttered such cruel words that she deserved the treatment dealt to her is an affront to basic common decency.

[mommaduck]

Question, how are the other spouses treated?

[bolt.]

When the food was ready at 5:30, dh called and texted. They were unapologetic and said today would not work as they had already eaten(despite dh call to them at noon) . They then said that I could cook the same thing tommorrow and that would be fine. I told them I did not have time as dd has a guitar performance from 10 to 2 at a local restaurant, then a couple hours of taking down decorations at the law office and dinner before belly dance classes. the gall of these people. To go out to eat and suggest I simply remake the meal tomorrow as if I have nothing to do but jump at their every whim? Sorry folks I am not the hired help. Their message was sent to me and understood. I am done. And relieved. I like clarity and their feelings for me were made abundantly clear. What is the deal is this crap on the nice people week or what?!

 

They don't owe you an apology for not eating a meal they didn't ask for.

 

They seem to have perceived that offering a meal is very important to you, and wanted you to have another option -- since you were insisting. They didn't ask you to cook again, they just said you could if you wanted to... And now you don't want to, because it's not a good day for you... And that really should be fine with everyone... Except you are really really offended by it.

 

I don't think you are being "nice people" in this situation. I think you are being "angry rejected offended people" -- and not cutting anyone any slack for failing to accommodate your desire to be "helpful" in a very specific way, at a specific time, on a specific day.

 

I sincerely hope that you are able to either change your perspective or put on a good face before your DH gets home. His. Brother. Is. Dying. The last thing he needs is to be smoothing over your ruffled feelings about not being welcome/allowed to be supportive in inner-circle ways.

[Lawana]

I don't understand your thoughts about your daughter. Half of the time you sound like you just want the opportunuty to help ease his passing, and are feeling sad and rejected because you are not in a position to offer something meaningful -- and the other half of the time you sound like you are just plain angry at these people and want to punish them for failing to perceive you as among their nearest and dearest.

 

Aparently it would be nice for him to see his niece. If that's the case, what reason would a person who only wants to help ease his passing have to keep her away? Spending time with the children of one's family is very uplifting. It's much more uplifting than a meal! In that situation, I'd practically tie a bow around her neck and send her over regularly. Anything to help!

 

Is this a racial issue or something? Is that what your comparison is implying? I just don't get it.

 

Does it really matter whether it a racial issue? Rejection is rejection. To say ones child is accepted but ones spouse is not (absent behavioral issues) is just wrong.

[Anne in CA]

I think spending time with family that at ANY time EVER called me a gold digging wh* re would not be good for a young mind being formed. I am all for exposing children to the greater world. Heck, I took my kids to a drug rehab outside Tiajana and we stayed there for three weeks and listened to someone detox from heroine without methadone.the faith that those people had in God was great for my kids to take part in. But exposing kids to someone who has a deliberately delusional view of one parent is exposing them to the idea that these ways of relating to people are understandable.

 

I think Elizabeth was kind to this man and his decision to exclude her from this part of his life, when normally people would pull together is extremely nasty. I am all for people having the right to die as they like, but saying things like she can't help at all but we want to see her daughter is yucky. It implies that they want to say bad things about her to her daughter, I know it is a slim implication, but these are not nice people and there does not seem to be any reason to believe that they are really good at heart, they just call people names for no reason, and exclude parts of their family for no reason but would never say ugly things about OP to her daughter.

 

The OP's husband grew up with this man and has been excusing his behavior since childhood. It is normal to him. If I were the OP I would do anything to make sure this behavior was not excused or normalized to my children.

[bolt.]

 

Does it really matter whether it a racial issue? Rejection is rejection. To say ones child is accepted but ones spouse is not (absent behavioral issues) is just wrong.

 

That's not sensible at all. Little kids have a far different effect on a situation than adults do -- and there are lots of places that kids go with one parent and not the other. Kids make dying people feel good. Some extended famy members don't make dying people feel good. Dying people should be made to feel as good as possible -- therefore kids offer the ministry of childish smiles and extended family members show thier kindness as they can, without being intrusive. That's perfectly normal in my world.

[elizabeth]

I don't understand your thoughts about your daughter. Half of the time you sound like you just want the opportunuty to help ease his passing, and are feeling sad and rejected because you are not in a position to offer something meaningful -- and the other half of the time you sound like you are just plain angry at these people and want to punish them for failing to perceive you as among their nearest and dearest.

 

Aparently it would be nice for him to see his niece. If that's the case, what reason would a person who only wants to help ease his passing have to keep her away? Spending time with the children of one's family is very uplifting. It's much more uplifting than a meal! In that situation, I'd practically tie a bow around her neck and send her over regularly. Anything to help!

 

Is this a racial issue or something? Is that what your comparison is implying? I just don't get it.

 

It is racial and religious bigotry writ large. My daughter is a precious, kind child. To disrespect me and to condone that is implying that such conduct is acceptable. It is not. You seriously would send your child to visit a person who told her that her mother was not welcome??! Dear God this is insanity! This is not about" perception", this is about public humiliation and rejection to please his very jealous wife who is insane. Everyone from insurance execs, cops, other lawyers, doctors, his MIL, the Mayor the whole damn community has been there but I am somehow suddenly once again unacceptable. The bottom line is he is a wretched, cruel person who will never, ever change and likely will spend eternity clutching his money. He cannot accept kindness because he thinks everything has a cost. He has seen his niece on the many, many , many occasions when he stopped by here. Now of all things I am the family scapegoat. Thank goodness my daughter has a mother who will protect her from such unstable, borderline personality game players. My reason to keep her away is simple. You hate me ,you hate half of my child. I am half of that child and to teach her that dying people can act like jackasses spouting cruel words and making obscene remarks about her parents is no lesson at all. There is honor and decency in forbearance. I will not sully her image of me by teaching her that it is ok if someone calls mommy a whore and tells her to cook something and then refuses the food when brought by a relative with whom he is comfortable. He will get exactly what he treasures, his money and his belief that he can own anyone. Not on my watch baby. No way.

[elizabeth]

I think spending time with family that at ANY time EVER called me a gold digging wh* re would not be good for a young mind being formed. I am all for exposing children to the greater world. Heck, I took my kids to a drug rehab outside Tiajana and we stayed there for three weeks and listened to someone detox from heroine without methadone.the faith that those people had in God was great for my kids to take part in. But exposing kids to someone who has a deliberately delusional view of one parent is exposing them to the idea that these ways of relating to people are understandable.

 

I think Elizabeth was kind to this man and his decision to exclude her from this part of his life, when normally people would pull together is extremely nasty. I am all for people having the right to die as they like, but saying things like she can't help at all but we want to see her daughter is yucky. It implies that they want to say bad things about her to her daughter, I know it is a slim implication, but these are not nice people and there does not seem to be any reason to believe that they are really good at heart, they just call people names for no reason, and exclude parts of their family for no reason but would never say ugly things about OP to her daughter.

 

The OP's husband grew up with this man and has been excusing his behavior since childhood. It is normal to him. If I were the OP I would do anything to make sure this behavior was not excused or normalized to my children.

 

Thank you. I appreciate what you are saying. Normalizing vile behaviour is a mar on a child's heart.

[mommaduck]

Agreed. In fact, if anything, you can let so and so know that you don't believe it's healthy for your daughter to be around people who think her mother is a golddigging wh.re.

 

How old is your dd and how does she feel about this?

[elizabeth]

They don't owe you an apology for not eating a meal they didn't ask for.

 

They seem to have perceived that offering a meal is very important to you, and wanted you to have another option -- since you were insisting. They didn't ask you to cook again, they just said you could if you wanted to... And now you don't want to, because it's not a good day for you... And that really should be fine with everyone... Except you are really really offended by it.

 

I don't think you are being "nice people" in this situation. I think you are being "angry rejected offended people" -- and not cutting anyone any slack for failing to accommodate your desire to be "helpful" in a very specific way, at a specific time, on a specific day.

 

I sincerely hope that you are able to either change your perspective or put on a good face before your DH gets home. His. Brother. Is. Dying. The last thing he needs is to be smoothing over your ruffled feelings about not being welcome/allowed to be supportive in inner-circle ways.

 

You do not have the facts correct at all. Please read my posts and all of them before judging me and speaking to me as if I were a spoiled child. It is fine to disagree but your tone is condescending as I am reading it. Please know that I have been helpful all along including the numerous occasions where he simply showed up and spent the day over here. I never once treated him with anything but respect despite his cruel past. Dh brother unceremoniously tossed him out of their law firm and I REBUILT that relationship by making him welcome in our home . You have no idea what you are speaking about.

[Lawana]

That's not sensible at all. Little kids have a far different effect on a situation than adults do -- and there are lots of places that kids go with one parent and not the other. Kids make dying people feel good. Some extended famy members don't make dying people feel good. Dying people should be made to feel as good as possible -- therefore kids offer the ministry of childish smiles and extended family members show thier kindness as they can, without being intrusive. That's perfectly normal in my world.

 

Sorry, in my world it is. To reject me, based on arbitrary factors, but to accept my child, who shares those same factors, is still wrong. Yes, children do have a different effect than adults. But rejection is still rejection. If you can accept my child because s/he is a product of your blood relation, then you can accept me.

[Miss Peregrine]

I have nothing to add but {{{{hugs}}}}, Elizabeth.

[bolt.]

 

It is racial and religious bigotry writ large. My daughter is a precious, kind child. To disrespect me and to condone that is implying that such conduct is acceptable. It is not. You seriously would send your child to visit a person who told her that her mother was not welcome??! Dear God this is insanity! This is not about" perception", this is about public humiliation and rejection to please his very jealous wife who is insane. Everyone from insurance execs, cops, other lawyers, doctors, his MIL, the Mayor the whole damn community has been there but I am somehow suddenly once again unacceptable. The bottom line is he is a wretched, cruel person who will never, ever change and likely will spend eternity clutching his money. He cannot accept kindness because he thinks everything has a cost. He has seen his niece on the many, many , many occasions when he stopped by here. Now of all things I am the family scapegoat. Thank goodness my daughter has a mother who will protect her from such unstable, borderline personality game players. My reason to keep her away is simple. You hate me ,you hate half of my child. I am half of that child and to teach her that dying people can act like jackasses spouting cruel words and making obscene remarks about her parents is no lesson at all. There is honor and decency in forbearance. I will not sully her image of me by teaching her that it is ok if someone calls mommy a whore and tells her to cook something and then refuses the food when brought by a relative with whom he is comfortable. He will get exactly what he treasures, his money and his belief that he can own anyone. Not on my watch baby. No way.

 

I'm sorry this is a bigotry issue. Racism is a sin, and when people are racist to you, they sin against you. It's not ok.

 

I did send my daughters with my DH to give his dad a pick-me-up after heart surgery. I knew that it wasn't my place to be there -- he wouldn't want to be seen like that by someone he wasn't close to, and I wasn't invited so I didn't go. I did help my daughters make get well cards before they went. It was all fine with me.

 

I didn't find it at all humiliating. It wasn't a surprise to me to suddenly realize that I am not in my FIL's inner circle of most comforting people, nor was it surprising that my daughters are. It all seemed really normal to me.

 

But my IL's don't hate me -- especially not for racial reasons. They just aren't ready to have me around when they feel vulnerable. So, it's really different, and I'm sorry. Many normal non-hateful families don't invite in-laws to walk too close through the rough times. That, in itself, is not wrong. However, your IL's don't sound like they have behaved normally towards you for such a long time that it's easy to see that "this" is an extension of "that". You should absolutely not expose your child (or yourself) to cruel, hateful people who let racism rule in their hearts... Not even when they are dying.

 

You know, if I got cancer, and if I had a married sister -- there is every reason that I'd love to spend time with her and her kids during my dying days. I don't think I'd feel like I was doing something wrong if I was not as welcoming to her husband. If I didn't find him comfortable, I would expect him to be supportive from a distance, not come over and watch me wasting away. I'd keep that for my inner circle -- and I'd decide who that would be. Doesn't that make sense? That the issues are different? That the cruel rejection is not exactly in being a not-close-enough-for-deathbed relative -- but in the long-term systematic abuse that you have been subjected to, the complete non-accelrance from the beginning onward -- while you tried to keep the peace and be the bigger person.

 

It's no wonder this is hitting you hard -- but I hope the perspective helps at least a little.

[elizabeth]

Question, how are the other spouses treated?

 

Like garbage. Thus my effort to reach out to her in any way possible. I have offered repeatedly to run errands, clean house, fend off office staff, walk her dog, cook, bring carry out. etc. The third sibling, a man, is married to a gentleman who is kind and funny with great talent. I adore him. He is also garbage worthy as he is "after the money." So sad. It must have been he** on earth in that household when they were growing up. Money is not evil but by bosh it can cause people to go absolutely nuts if they think someone is after it.Good question. All spouses, all genders are treated with derision and contempt when he feels like it. Not good at all.

[laundrycrisis]

I would forbid your DD to have any contact whatsoever with any of your DH's family until he will act like a man, a real husband, by your side, standing up for you and with you. Yes, even during this difficult time for his family. If your husband is unwilling to do this, to stand by his own wife, I would inform him that he gets one month to mourn his brother after he passes, and then there needs to be a serious effort shown in marriage counseling.

 

The BIL is who he is. But if a husband allows his family to treat his wife this way, his wife should hold him accountable.

[elegantlion]

Sorry, in my world it is. To reject me, based on arbitrary factors, but to accept my child, who shares those same factors, is still wrong. Yes, children do have a different effect than adults. But rejection is still rejection. If you can accept my child because s/he is a product of your blood relation, then you can accept me.

 

 

 

 

Even so, my dh and I approach situations differently. To visit a dying person is a totally different ball of wax than visiting someone who is just ill. I would not send my child in there to cheer someone without them being able to talk to me, be with me during the visit so I could assess THEIR comfort. Death is not an easy subject for adults. Before my neighbor died they wanted people, anyone, to come and sit with her. I had hesitations myself, in the end I was sick so I couldn't, but I would not have sent my child into that atmosphere without some guidance from me. Dh is great, caring, and compassionate, he just may not be attune to how my ds would need to approach a situation.

 

All that is said with a person who is accepting of me and my family. If only 2/3rd of my family was "acceptable" in their eyes, the whole dynamic changes.

[bolt.]

 

You do not have the facts correct at all. Please read my posts and all of them before judging me and speaking to me as if I were a spoiled child. It is fine to disagree but your tone is condescending as I am reading it. Please know that I have been helpful all along including the numerous occasions where he simply showed up and spent the day over here. I never once treated him with anything but respect despite his cruel past. Dh brother unceremoniously tossed him out of their law firm and I REBUILT that relationship by making him welcome in our home . You have no idea what you are speaking about.

I had been typing as you were posting, so I was going on the incomplete information I had, only up to the post I was specifically responding to. I had no reason to automatically assume that you IL's might be cruel on so many levels. I was only responding to the idea of whether normal families sometimes quite reasonably keep a distance from spouses-of-family during hard times. They sometimes do -- and it's often OK.

 

Your situation is not OK... I hope your DH can cope with the strain of truly mourning a beloved brother who was in ongoing unrepentant sin against his wife. That's got to be a giant burden.

[mommaduck]

I'm so sorry. That is an awful situation. Many hugs, prayers, and thoughts for you. I hope you didn't mind my questions....I want trying to grill you. You sound like you have tried to be a blessing in very difficult places. I have little advice that would be proactively helpful. Just know you did what you could and sit down with your husband and see what you two can agree on as far as how to deal...particularly irt your dd.

[mommaduck]

Wasn't trying to grill...auto correct due to phone swyping.