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REALLY shy kids at New Year's Eve Party


AndyJoy
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Apparently not all PS kids are perfectly socialized :)

 

We went to a New Year's Eve party tonight with DS (3). We were told there would be other kids there, so we brought a bucket of LEGO bricks (and his Mobigo in case no other kids showed). A 7-year-old girl and 5-year-old boy arrived and DS was so excited! He ran up to them and said, "My name is Keaton! What's you name? You want to play LEGOs?" They wouldn't even say hi! After they had an hour to "warm up" they still wouldn't respond to anything. Their mom let them hang out in a back room to watch TV and play Nintendo DS. The boy eventually said, "Yes," when I asked him if he was in kindergarten and, "Seven," when I asked the girl how old she was, but that was it. She nodded no when I asked if she was in 2nd grade and yes when I asked if she was in 1st grade. Keaton was so disappointed. He kept saying, "Her won't talk to me!" Their mom said they aren't usually that shy and I found it really odd that she didn't expect them to acknowledge DS with a "Hello," and "No thank you," to his requests to play with LEGOs at least! It was very strange to spend 3.5 hours with kids who literally wouldn't say a word! They wouldn't even respond to her questions about whether they wanted a drink with more than a nod.

 

My kid doesn't have a shy bone in his body, so social coaching with him is mostly explaining about personal space and not hugging/hand-holding an uncomfortable random 5-year-old you played with for 5 minutes on the playground. Is it unreasonable to expect a somewhat shy (but not typically very shy) kid to at least say hello to a new kid (who is much younger, and thus not really a "threat")?

 

 

 

OP,

 

I do think your motives have been questioned and unfairly criticized in this thread. I see nothing braggy about what you said here. You tried to describe a situation and made a joke about socialization--a long-running joke on home schooling boards.

 

Describing your friendly son as "socially aggressive" is another unfair dig. I'm not sure why someone would think it appropriate to insult a three year old--particularly when he wasn't even doing anything wrong.

 

I see you came here to describe situation where two kids and their mom were not very social. Perhaps this is due to shyness; perhaps this is due to rudeness. We don't know. (I find it curious that a parent that is too shy to socialize with two kids that are two shy to socialize would be interested in going to a party.)

 

Your ds is three years old. His natural personality is very outgoing. One of my dc is like this, too. What I found over the years is that some people really appreciate and respect this, and others don't care for it. In other words, a stronger personality can be polarizing. I think you're already seeing some of this on this thread. I do agree with you; this personality has great strengths along with great challenges for the parent. It is hard to have a child you feel that you often have to "rein in". Really outgoing kids are unusually comfortable in all sorts of situations. They learn to pick up on social cues as they mature and need special coaching. It's clear that you already see this.

 

People have been hard on you here. I think you're doing great. You sound like you have an adorable little boy. I'd love to play LEGOS with him.

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I am sorry you and your son had a disappointing night. I don't blame you for feeling a little sad and rejected.

 

It sounds to me like maybe the Mom was just being lazy - allowing her children who are old enough to just sit and watch tv unsupervised in the back room to do so. She probably wanted to be left alone to hang out with the adults. Even if she had forced the issue about making them speak, I think it was going to be a bad night for your son. I mean, after she makes them say "hello" and then respond to, "Do you want to play?" what happens when the kids say, "No, we don't want to play?" It's not going to feel good from your son's perspective either way.

 

I feel badly for your son, though. Somehow the tv/DS thing makes this seem ruder to me than it would if they had brought books and were absorbed in them. Maybe that's just my bias. Something about watching a tv at a party bugs me, even for children, especially if the tv functions to allow the viewer to just, "tune out" everyone else. And I say that as someone who really likes tuning others out, lol.

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First :grouphug: . This parenting gig can be tough. Not only do we have our own kid's idiosyncrasies to deal with, but throw in other kids' and it's hard to know what to do. I think what you did was fine, but I also think you're wasting a lot of energy worrying about this mom did, or didn't do. She knows her kids. You know your son. If we were at a house party, and my older kids were quietly entertained, it honestly wouldn't cross my mind to check and see if they were engaging a 3 year old as well.

 

Well, I'm not wasting energy on the original situation anymore. I think by posting here I really emphasized that situation more than I had intended. My more general thoughts on the issue were not formulated yet, but I wanted to "get it out there" because I have a tendency to start long, general topic ideas in a Word document then get fearful and back out on actually posting them. If I can just get something out there, I can respond bit by bit which works better with a preschooler in the house anyway. This thread as given me more to ponder and I find it to be useful and enlightening and something that I've needed to think through for a while.

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. Had she made a simple comment like, "They're pretty shy so they may not want to hang out tonight." I probably wouldn't have found it as odd. Instead she said things like, "They'll warm up later," and "T loves LEGO," so I didn't think it was rude to wait 1 hour before letting DS ask again.

 

 

But see, WHY does she have to explain her children to you??

 

I think there's nothing more off-putting to a "shy" child to always hear that they ARE shy.....they start to tell themselves that and build that up as a "reason" and then it makes it even more difficult to overcome. Speaking from experience here, and 1st time parenting, my first DS was/is shy and apparently we announced it quite often in situations, and about age 7, as we talked to him in our of our "coaching sessions' prior to going to an gathering (ie, just say Hi, it's a great way to make friends, if someone says hi to you, they are probably trying to be friends, give them a little smile etc).. he said "BUT I'M SHY! That's why I don't talk to people."....so in his mind, he was telling himself he was shy, because apparently we'd told people, and him since he was standing there, enough times that now he's built that up in his mind. NOW I know better,and I would NEVER announce that to people, with my child standing there.

 

I also, knowing my child, would NOT have pressed or forced him to respond. I would, as a parent who protects my child before the interests of other adults, would have offered him an excuse/reason/escape such as "Would you like to go in the other room and occupy yourself", if I saw that he was uncomfortable with being approached by a adult and a bit-too friendly (in my child's eyes) toddler.

Bottom line, because you don't know these people, have never met these children or their parents prior to this, you simply can not judge that 1. The parents are not doing a good job, 2. The children are rude. You have absolutely no background on what happened before this party, or what is going on in their lives. Same goes for anyone who posted on this message judging the parents or the children. Okay, so you thought it was odd, and that's fine if you want to think that, but then to bring it here, not sure what you were expecting? Everyone to agree that the parents were doing a bad job, that a children were ill mannered and rude? That's where it kinda gets weird. You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but it gets judgey to bring it here, only telling your side and making judgements on strangers and their young children. That's rarely going to go over well.

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I'm sorry if I came across as prideful or gloating. I did not mean to hurt the feelings of parents of shy kids or imply that they are inferior. This was not my intention.

 

I want to say that I really don't believe you were intentionally implying this. Truly. And my feelings aren't hurt so much as I felt the need to represent what my kids' feelings would be. Let me put it this way... I imagine the OP made me feel similar to how you would feel if someone posted the exact reverse of this thread. "REALLY exuberant kid at New Year's Party" and proceeded to describe the situation from the opposite perspective. (By the way, I guarantee that thread would have immediately had posters responding with questions about manners. They would be "rippin' that OP a new one" for not making her kids say hi.)

 

Also, I know parenting exuberant kids isn't a walk in the park. (Again, I have one.) But here's the thing. Parenting the vast majority of kids isn't a walk in the park. No, they don't necessarily have your kid's exact combination of quirks, but they have different quirks, different challenges. Maybe that mom was incredibly embarrassed by her kids' behavior. Maybe she was just making excuses because her kids told her they didn't feel like playing with a three year old but thought THAT was too rude to say. Maybe she really was confused; kids can be a riddle sometimes. Maybe she had just plain ol' given up for the day. Surely you have been there? I don't know any moms who haven't. This leads me to wonder where dad was. It seems to me that he bears some responsibility, either by being present but not "present" or by not being present at all.

 

Maybe I should start a thread on dealing with the emotional needs of outgoing kids

 

This is a great idea!

 

It's hard knowing when to have my son back off, you know? If he doesn't get a response to "Hello!" at the park, should we move on? Or can he try again to engage the child as long as he's not "in their face"? Usually he "wins over" kids by offering to play ball or monster trucks. It often takes several tries. How are we to know when someone is so shy this is too much if the parent doesn't say a word?

 

You know, the problem here is not necessarily always going to be how persistent he is or is not. The answer is in the other child. Because of the story of how you made your best friend, I am wondering if it is (or at least was) as hard for you to read social cues as it is for your DS. I would get him in the habit of approaching/asking only once, but gently. You can teach him to offer up one, "Are you sure you don't want to play _____?" if the child starts looking longingly in his direction. There are some really great social skills books available (even some specifically for toddlers and preschoolers) these days.

 

Honestly, people don't want to be rude and hurt your feelings. No one wants to say their kid doesn't want to play with your kid, regardless of the reason. And the parent with the shy child does not want to announce that their kid is shy or push their kid into uncomfortable interaction any more than you want to explain your kid's quirks and deal with his sadness over not finding a playmate again. Have you considered a play group? I might have missed if you posted about one.

 

If your child is one who would be really uncomfortable with, "Hi, I'm Keaton. What's you name? Do you want to play LEGO?" how is the outgoing child to know to give up? I didn't see strong enough body language to know that the kids were anxious/uncomfortable. Do you say something when another kid is failing at engaging your child?

 

Think about it from the other child's parents' perspective. What should he/she say exactly? What answer would you be happy with and deem not too rude? (I promise I am not being snarky here.) You can't pick, "He's shy," because it's not so great for that child to hear that day in and day out.

 

I tell my exuberant child a version of what I used to tell other kids and/or their parents about my shy/slow-to-warm kids, although I never use those terms. (I say used to because my kids are too old for me to speak for them anymore.) I encourage my exuberant child to tread softly and speak gently when wishing to engage a reluctant or quiet playmate. Now, this child is blessed with extraordinary empathy and reads people like a book, so that obviously helps. I encourage my shy/slow-to-warm kids to do as much or as little as they wish, according to their own comfort level, but to use their manners (which I will allow can be necessarily cryptic).

 

I guess my biggest frustration with this situation was that the mom didn't speak to either her kids or me about what was going on. But maybe she wasn't concerned and thought it would work itself out without her help. I'm sure I'm devoting much more time to thinking about it than she is.

 

This is absolutely true. Probably because it is part of a bigger picture for you. She has another big picture though. We all do. :grouphug:

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But see, WHY does she have to explain her children to you??

 

I think there's nothing more off-putting to a "shy" child to always hear that they ARE shy.....they start to tell themselves that and build that up as a "reason" and then it makes it even more difficult to overcome. Speaking from experience here, and 1st time parenting, my first DS was/is shy and apparently we announced it quite often in situations, and about age 7, as we talked to him in our of our "coaching sessions' prior to going to an gathering (ie, just say Hi, it's a great way to make friends, if someone says hi to you, they are probably trying to be friends, give them a little smile etc).. he said "BUT I'M SHY! That's why I don't talk to people."....so in his mind, he was telling himself he was shy, because apparently we'd told people, and him since he was standing there, enough times that now he's built that up in his mind. NOW I know better,and I would NEVER announce that to people, with my child standing there.

 

I also, knowing my child, would NOT have pressed or forced him to respond. I would, as a parent who protects my child before the interests of other adults, would have offered him an excuse/reason/escape such as "Would you like to go in the other room and occupy yourself", if I saw that he was uncomfortable with being approached by a adult and a bit-too friendly (in my child's eyes) toddler.

Bottom line, because you don't know these people, have never met these children or their parents prior to this, you simply can not judge that 1. The parents are not doing a good job, 2. The children are rude. You have absolutely no background on what happened before this party, or what is going on in their lives. Same goes for anyone who posted on this message judging the parents or the children. Okay, so you thought it was odd, and that's fine if you want to think that, but then to bring it here, not sure what you were expecting? Everyone to agree that the parents were doing a bad job, that a children were ill mannered and rude? That's where it kinda gets weird. You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but it gets judgey to bring it here, only telling your side and making judgements on strangers and their young children. That's rarely going to go over well.

 

Oh wow. I'm not going to even try to respond to all this. I think you're being unfair and over the top with your accusations against my motives. Seriously? I'm only supposed to post when I know what the responses will be? Where have I acted like I want everyone to JAWM? I can't genuinely be sorting through some thoughts and want input? EVERY thread on this board starts out one-sided and then others weigh in. Isn't that the point of a discussion board? Wow. I guess I'll be working on my thick skin tonight.

 

I don't think anyone HAS to explain their child, and I certainly wouldn't want them to label their child in such a way to impede their development. What I meant by wondering if parents of shy parents would say something was this:

 

If my child (or I) is making your very shy child uncomfortable and you don't see any hope of them "warming up" to us, would you say something (out of the hearing of your child)? If you can tell that my child is not your child's type, would it make sense to you to warn us for your child's comfort so we can leave him/her alone? Are we supposed to rely solely on your child's body language, even if it isn't clear? Are you ok with a few attempts to engage your reluctant child over the course of several hours, or is one dismissal enough? Are you going to be annoyed at the pushy child/mom later who were just trying to be friendly and not getting much feedback to help understand the situation?

 

I'm looking for actual answers to these questions but you're jumping down my throat instead.

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I find this conversation very interesting. I never really thought about the perspective of an extroverted child that needs lots of interaction but who doesn't get a lot. I wouldn't use the term socially aggressive because it makes it a negative term about his extroversion which like a pp mentioned just is. You didn't come off to me like you were bragging or only seeing the positive in your son.

 

I try to teach my kids to respond but I don't force it. I don't use the word shy in front of them if someone asks if they are shy or why they are not talking I say they need time to warm up. They are called shy and asked why they are not responding and that just makes things worse. I have had conversations with them about how nervous is a feeling that can be overcome and conversations about how we can respond to different situations. I encourage them to say hi to people or thank you if they receive a compliment but I don't force it. I respond for them if I tell them to say hi and they can't. I do all I can but they still have difficulty. They don't always respond so I guess I never taught them manners. (I know OP didn't imply that but some people did) I don't know if I always respond the perfect way every time. I'm sure there are times when it has been one of those days and I need adult interaction and a break from the kids and could come off as not even teaching my kids. I would give the mom the benefit of the doubt. It is not always an easy job.

 

I find it curious that a parent that is too shy to socialize with two kids that are two shy to socialize would be interested in going to a party.

 

I don't find it odd that a parent wants time to spend with adults and is taking that as an opportunity to get a little break. I don't get the comment shy to socialize with two kids that are shy? They are her kids so I am assuming she spends lots of time interacting with them and that they do not act shy around her and interact with her. I don't think she acts shy around her kids but she could be an introvert and her kids can be like most kids and be pretty noisy at home and maybe she just wanted a chance to talk to adults.

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Sorry if you felt as if I was jumping down your throat, as that was not my intention. It's a conversation, and I'm not angry or hyped-up, but I do tend to be matter of fact. So that often comes off wrong. Certainly we can have a two-sided conversation and along with that, we won't agree on everything here.

 

I didn't read any of those questions that you've stated now, in your original post. I did read about them being "unsocialized", which I get was tongue-in-cheek, sorta, I guess, but I also read others jumping in to say the children needed manners, they should be forced to say something, the mom must have been being lazy, just wanted to hang out with adults, etc. I read how friendly your child was, how much of an effort you put in with those children and your own child, but I read that basically that mom and her children did nothing right. You did specifically state you wished the mom had explained to you that her children were shy instead of what she did, which was offer polite non-commital responses that neither forced her children into something they did not want to do, nor flat out told your child to leave them alone. I can't see how her telling you that her children would not want to play with your son would have made you or your son feel any better.

 

I'm simply saying the assumptions made about those children and the mom's parenting skills were unfair. To post it here, a big deal out of nothing...as other's have said, we don't know other people's stories, other people's "pictures".

 

Now if in fact your original intent was the answers to these last questions you've asked, it could have been asked without bring up this exact family,and with just generic situations/terms. Then there would have been no bashing or judging of this family by any one on the forum.

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Oh wow. I'm not going to even try to respond to all this. I think you're being unfair and over the top with your accusations against my motives. Seriously? I'm only supposed to post when I know what the responses will be? Where have I acted like I want everyone to JAWM? I can't genuinely be sorting through some thoughts and want input? EVERY thread on this board starts out one-sided and then others weigh in. Isn't that the point of a discussion board? Wow. I guess I'll be working on my thick skin tonight.

 

I don't think anyone HAS to explain their child, and I certainly wouldn't want them to label their child in such a way to impede their development. What I meant by wondering if parents of shy parents would say something was this:

 

If my child (or I) is making your very shy child uncomfortable and you don't see any hope of them "warming up" to us, would you say something (out of the hearing of your child)? If you can tell that my child is not your child's type, would it make sense to you to warn us for your child's comfort so we can leave him/her alone? Are we supposed to rely solely on your child's body language, even if it isn't clear? Are you ok with a few attempts to engage your reluctant child over the course of several hours, or is one dismissal enough? Are you going to be annoyed at the pushy child/mom later who were just trying to be friendly and not getting much feedback to help understand the situation?

 

I'm looking for actual answers to these questions but you're jumping down my throat instead.

 

 

I think people who have reserved children often feel hurt for their children because comments of shyness are freely given in front of them. Parents are embarrassed when their reserved children don't respond accordingly, and are at a loss of what to say, and usually resort to the shyness excuse. I could not do this to DD. I refused to do this because it would have been so unfair to her in order to ease the other party. The odd part is that my DD does have a reserved nature at times, and then suddenly, she'll just walk up to kids and want to play with them and get rejected. Oh boy, that really hurts both of us. Actually, in those situations, I'm not sure what to do or what to say. Something comforting, I think, although I need some comforting too.

 

I really do think you came here to discuss.

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You know, the problem here is not necessarily always going to be how persistent he is or is not. The answer is in the other child. Because of the story of how you made your best friend, I am wondering if it is (or at least was) as hard for you to read social cues as it is for your DS. I would get him in the habit of approaching/asking only once, but gently. You can teach him to offer up one, "Are you sure you don't want to play _____?" if the child starts looking longingly in his direction. There are some really great social skills books available (even some specifically for toddlers and preschoolers) these days.

 

I wondered if anyone would pick up on the how I made my best friend thing. No, I wouldn't guess that I have problems reading social cues usually. I usually am very good at reading people IRL and my teachers always commented that I seemed to be empathetic and understanding and get along with everyone very well (except for the odd few). I very much knew what I was doing in her case. I knew I made her uncomfortable, but I knew enough about her interests to think she would enjoy being my friend if I was persistent. I tried to not overwhelm her all at once, but I chipped away by continuing to draw her out. I consulted her mom for advice and she encouraged me.

 

Honestly, people don't want to be rude and hurt your feelings. No one wants to say their kid doesn't want to play with your kid, regardless of the reason. And the parent with the shy child does not want to announce that their kid is shy or push their kid into uncomfortable interaction any more than you want to explain your kid's quirks and deal with his sadness over not finding a playmate again. Have you considered a play group? I might have missed if you posted about one.

 

Think about it from the other child's parents' perspective. What should he/she say exactly? What answer would you be happy with and deem not too rude? (I promise I am not being snarky here.) You can't pick, "He's shy," because it's not so great for that child to hear that day in and day out.

 

The mom had lots of opportunities away from her child's hearing to say something. Most of the moms I encounter (even the shy ones) have a lot to say about their kids, so when she kept saying they weren't very shy and would warm up I took her at her word. But see, I don't know that she cared about what was going on anyway. She might have been perfectly ok with DS's attempts to draw out her kids. She might have been enjoying the party and not given it a 2nd thought. Moms of shy kids on here are giving their thoughts and perspectives and what they think, but no one knows if it was even on her radar.

 

Assuming she actually knows her kids are shy or overwhelmed in that situation or not just interested in playing with 3-year-olds, I would have expected some comment like, "I think they're just going to hole up tonight." or "It's been a long day, and I don't think they really want to interact much tonight." or "They've been begging for some screen time and it's New Year's Eve so I'm just going to let them veg." or "Parties like this are a bit much for my kids so they'll just hang out in the back all night." or something that would indicate that I should distract DS from the fact that there are other kids present who are never going to play with him or even answer his greeting. But really, I don't know if it even mattered to her or if she thought DS was too pushy because she never made it clear what her thoughts were and just kept giving us hope. People on here are giving their thoughts, which is why I wondered what parents of shy kids might say when it is clear to them that someone more outgoing is going to get nowhere with your child.

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Now if in fact your original intent was the answers to these last questions you've asked, it could have been asked without bring up this exact family,and with just generic situations/terms. Then there would have been no bashing or judging of this family by any one on the forum.

 

As you've mentioned, this is a conversation. Can't my argument evolve? Do I have to have it all figured out before I post? Can people try to persuade me with their perspective and can I change my mind, or do I have to just take a beating because I put something unpopular out there. I explained my reasoning for mentioning this event rather than writing an essay first. I posted, I got feedback, I responded, I'm thinking things through. Who cares if these questions were my "original intent." They are what I'm asking for now and you're harping on the beginning of a conversation that is pretty far along.

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You never know. Perhaps the other kids were shy. Perhaps they were threatened within an inch to behave. Perhaps they didn't know what to make of such an outgoing younger kid.

 

I don't see where anyone did anything wrong, just differently for each family involved. They might have thought you and yours were just as odd as you found them.

 

Just put it down as a fluke and go on with life. Because you'll make yourself nuts trying to figure it out.

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I am sorry you and your son had a disappointing night. I don't blame you for feeling a little sad and rejected.

It sounds to me like maybe the Mom was just being lazy - allowing her children who are old enough to just sit and watch tv unsupervised in the back room to do so. She probably wanted to be left alone to hang out with the adults. Even if she had forced the issue about making them speak, I think it was going to be a bad night for your son. I mean, after she makes them say "hello" and then respond to, "Do you want to play?" what happens when the kids say, "No, we don't want to play?" It's not going to feel good from your son's perspective either way.

I feel badly for your son, though. Somehow the tv/DS thing makes this seem ruder to me than it would if they had brought books and were absorbed in them. Maybe that's just my bias. Something about watching a tv at a party bugs me, even for children, especially if the tv functions to allow the viewer to just, "tune out" everyone else. And I say that as someone who really likes tuning others out, lol.

 

Seriously? This didn't sound like a kid's party. The mom was 'lazy' to enjoy the party while her children were quietly entertained with an activity of their choice in another part of the house? The three-year-old wouldn't have felt less rejected if they had been reading books. Except from the perspective of the OP, it seems like the evening worked for everyone. I do feel for the OP. Three can be a tricky age and it sounds like she spent more time tending to her preschooler than visiting with the adult guests. We've all been through it and can appreciate how attentive she is to her preschooler's needs.

 

OP,

I do think your motives have been questioned and unfairly criticized in this thread. I see nothing braggy about what you said here. You tried to describe a situation and made a joke about socialization--a long-running joke on home schooling boards.

Describing your friendly son as "socially aggressive" is another unfair dig. I'm not sure why someone would think it appropriate to insult a three year old--particularly when he wasn't even doing anything wrong.

 

 

I used the term 'socially aggressive' to describe my child's interactions with some children when she was younger. I don't know the OP's child, and didn't attend the party, so I have no way to know if he's the 'in-your-face' type or just friendlier than average.

 

For what it's worth, my introverted child did outgrow the phase where it was painful to interact with strangers and spends every spare hour she can doing musical theater. My extroverted child has become much more socially cautious with age. Neither made the switch before the age of seven.

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Well, without addressing all the other tangents in this thread...

 

...my oldest was shy. Is shy, he can just advocate for himself now. Atm14, he can say "it's so loud here, all these people make me uneasy, I'm going to sit in the living room with my kindle and ignore you all". And oddly enough, people get that- he just calmly tells us he's had enough, goes off, and that is it. But at 5 or 7? He just gave the deer in the headlights smile, and ran off, trying madly not to offend but not to get himself into a situation he couldn't handle. His brother is 3 years younger, and not shy at all, but in the situation given he would rather hang silently with big brother than play with a 3 year old, legos be damned.I might have said little bro loves legos (he did!) knowing full well neither kid would be comfortable playing- just as a social construct. Now at their ages, it's all worked out, no one is hampered by their introverted nature, but as young kids, yeah- I could see this scenario play out.

 

3 and 5 is a huge difference, no matter how precocious the child or tantalizing the legos. I would chalk it up more to that than an unsocialized child.

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Listen, you have a social 3 year old. That is great. I don't know any 5 or 7 year olds who want to play with a 3 year old. Developmentally they are on different planets. No parent, or person of any age for that matter, owes any explanation to you as to why they don't want to interact with your child. As a parent it hurts to see our children dissapointed, but they are all dissapointed at some point.

 

You are also very lucky, LUCKY that you ended up being friends with your best friend at all. If a 13.5 year old girl kept trying to get my 12 year old to be her friend and getting advice from me, her mom, on how to do so my dd12 would run like hades the other way. I am sure you are a nice person, but the behavior seems like stalker behavior to me. I am an outgoing person so shyness on my part is not part of my opinion either.

 

Some parents view kids who don't respond to other kids or adults as rude. Some parents view kids who aren't taught to leave the other kids alone as rude.

 

It sounds like your dc was trying to make the best of an adult party that he was dragged to.

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Listen, you have a social 3 year old. That is great. I don't know any 5 or 7 year olds who want to play with a 3 year old. Developmentally they are on different planets. No parent, or person of any age for that matter, owes any explanation to you as to why they don't want to interact with your child. As a parent it hurts to see our children dissapointed, but they are all dissapointed at some point.

 

You are also very lucky, LUCKY that you ended up being friends with your best friend at all. If a 13.5 year old girl kept trying to get my 12 year old to be her friend and getting advice from me, her mom, on how to do so my dd12 would run like hades the other way. I am sure you are a nice person, but the behavior seems like stalker behavior to me. I am an outgoing person so shyness on my part is not part of my opinion either.

 

Some parents view kids who don't respond to other kids or adults as rude. Some parents view kids who aren't taught to leave the other kids alone as rude.

 

It sounds like your dc was trying to make the best of an adult party that he was dragged to.

 

If you had read all of my posts, you would see that I explained that I don't think anyone "owes" us an explanation. I just thought a parent of a shy child might smooth the way by a bit saying something. If someone doesn't find that helpful/necessary, whatever. But from my perspective it would have been nice to know to move on.

 

I'm glad my best friend of 18 years didn't/doesn't consider me a stalker. It's not like I was calling her, following her around, prying for information. I said hi to her at Sunday School, chatted about random things I discovered she was into, crossed my fingers and hoped I'd break through. No one else seemed to give her a 2nd thought after that first day when she couldn't talk to us. I would have missed out on a valuable friendship with my dear friend if I had taken her shy reluctance for a definite answer. I could see she was uncomfortable in her own skin. Her reluctance wasn't a reasoned rejection of me in any way; it was fear and was basically a no under duress. She's confirmed this in many long conversations about those days over the years. Her mom and I worked together in AWANA and became good friends and we talked about Amy. I had seen glimmers of a great person inside her mask and wanted to know her. Her mother knew she was a great person but was painfully inhibited and self-concious. Together we broke down some barriers. There is more than one way to approach an issue and sometimes leaving someone alone to grow/mature/overcome isn't the best or only route! I wouldn't give up on her and once she discovered that I genuinely liked her and she was safe with me things were amazing. Maybe your daughter wouldn't have liked it, but it worked in our case. I never said it was a blanket approach for every shy kid. She has thanked me for taking her along, opening her up to new experiences, encouraging her to take some social chances and talk to people. I knew her limitations socially and wasn't mean or teasing or too demanding of her need for quiet, peace, and safety. I was there to hold her hand and hug her and help her escape when she needed it, but I wasn't going to let her just languish and hide either. I gave her a nudge when the time seemed right as I grew to know her. Isn't that what parents want for their kids? A true friend who can build them up and help them with their struggles? Someone who is loyal and won't give up even when it's hard? Someone who gives them good advice and comforts them when they're in pain? I hope my son has such a stalker.

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People on here are giving their thoughts, which is why I wondered what parents of shy kids might say when it is clear to them that someone more outgoing is going to get nowhere with your child.

 

I honestly would not know how to say that politely to a mum that I am not very close with.

My older son is so obviously stranger aware that all friends already know what to expect. Most people within minutes of meeting him are able to sense that, it is so obvious.

My younger son is slightly shy and most times will say Hi while hiding behind me. His teacher's response when he is having a "shy" day and not willing to talk is "not today huh."

I was born in the "kids are meant to be seen and not heard" era so my parents were "lucky" in not having to explain.

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It sounds to me that what you might be wanting to chat about here are expectations. More specifically: what is reasonably expected of kids on either side of that exchange? It seems you're curious about what to expect as your social little guy gets older and what to teach him in order to have maturity be gained with as little pain as possible. Great goals, right there with you.

 

With my boys I guess I try to teach them two sides of a social coin. Be as polite and friendly to everyone as possible, and try to always give the benefit of the doubt (not expecting much) especially with people you don't know well. I can honestly say I've decided this is important to me because it's taken me to adulthood to get closer to that second part. I tend to be sensitive, and I'm pretty sure my kids are going to be, too. This was really hard for me when my first child was a bit younger- I worried about every exchange & experience and was fiercely protective of him.

 

I'm not saying there was anything you could have done or should be thinking differently, necessarily. But I can say I have worked with a LOT of kids aged 3-10 and I've discovered that often their actions (and their parents' actions) are not as logical or fraught with meaning as I might think. I try to be a bit tone-deaf to any potential slights or impoliteness without losing my own set of rules for how I will treat them.

 

Since you mention AWANA, maybe I can phrase it this way: help your sweet boy to approach people with all his heart (like he does) but also to give them lots of grace. It's not easy, people are both imperfect and a little crazy, but I think teaching your child with an eye toward emotional maturity is a huge gift to them.

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As you've mentioned, this is a conversation. Can't my argument evolve? Do I have to have it all figured out before I post? Can people try to persuade me with their perspective and can I change my mind, or do I have to just take a beating because I put something unpopular out there. I explained my reasoning for mentioning this event rather than writing an essay first. I posted, I got feedback, I responded, I'm thinking things through. Who cares if these questions were my "original intent." They are what I'm asking for now and you're harping on the beginning of a conversation that is pretty far along.

 

I have had started threads where my opinion evolves as I read people's responses so I know what you mean.

 

I am so sorry you feel hurt. Someone wiser than me said these are just words on the Internet, don't take it personally. The problem for me is that sometimes the words on the Internet trigger the issues I'm dealing with IRL. It looks like that is the case with you.

 

((((Andyjoy))))

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As to why the other mother didn't get involved: her kids are at a different point than yours. She can leave them and let them monitor themselves without having to watch them. This works fairly well for taking them to what appears to be an adult party. (3 children attending) At this point in life, she is attending the party. The kids aren't old enough to be left home, so she allows them to tag along and take care of themselves. Her conversation with you about her children was just polite making conversation with you. The why she didn't speak to her kids about their behavior- they were doing what she had asked/wanted them to do, allow her some personal/adult time. Also, moms of elementary aged kids tend to let their children handle their own interactions with other children unless there is a big problem. (And, it is usually best that way for that age.)

 

As to why the other children didn't play/respond: they were playing their ds's and watching tv. The interested look may have been just that, but not enough interest to get down and play. Or, it could be that he didn't want to play with you and your ds. Another 3 yo would probably not have any second thought about playing with a 3 yo and his mommy. A 5, 6, 7 yo likely would. Most 7 yos aren't going to be interested in playing with a 3 yo. A 5 yo...maybe...but would probably follow the lead of the older 7 yo instead. Also, they may have been tired and electronics are nicely mind numbing!

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Another thing to keep in mind is that kids generally are not going to automatically click together and want to play with each other simply by virtue of being kids.

 

We all experience this when our kids have friends and the moms don't necessarily click, and when the moms DO click but the kids don't.

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I had a couple more thoughts....my kids are extremely social, extroverted, talk to everyone...

 

BUT, they don't necessarily want to talk to an adult in the direction they want to send the conversation. So, if someone starts asking them how old they are, or what grade they are in, or the usual questions adults ask of kids, they are just as likely to give a one word answer and just walk away as they are to engage in conversation.

 

Plus, they may be extroverts but I am an extreme introvert. Especially in big social situations with people I may not know well. So, while they were not wanting to answer questions, and not wanting to play with a three year old, I would have no idea what to say. It wouldn't really occur to me to try and explain it away because it would just seem like kid behavior to me and if the situation kept coming up to the point where I felt like I should say something - that would be EXTREMELY uncomfortable for me. And I'd probably try to pretend I don't see it happening and avoid it any way I could.

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I don't think the kids were shy. I think they probably just thought some weird kid (weird as in never met him and he's talking to us) who was way younger than them wanted to play and they ignored him and went off to do their own thing. They were siblings so they had each other. I don't know why the mother would even think to say anything, her kids were doing what she told them that they were allowed to do so that she could attend the party. Many many parents are fine with bringing their children to a gathering, assigning them a list of do's and don't's and then letting them work out the details.

 

I understand that you needed to mircormanage the situation more because your child was younger. But in a similar situation, I probably would have given my 7 y.o. the "rules" told her to watch the 5 y.o. and went about my business trusting that if there were a huge problem she'd bring it to me. I do personally encourage my children to include others as a matter of conviction, but I don't expect it in others. I would absolutely not feel compelled to offer an explanation to another parent if my kids didn't talk. Actually I usually offer a somewhat apologetic "my kids are shy" accompanied by a wink and eye roll because they have no boundries when it comes to talking to strangers. Keeping them from overstaying their "welcome" is the biggest issue we have.

 

Being social goes both ways and includes learning to reading social cues. Just because you act friendly and want someone to play with you doesn't mean that they will be interested. Learning to drop it and move on without being upset is part of socialization. I have taught my child how to introduce himself and invite another child to play but then move on if that child doesn't respond. Sometimes he still struggles with this because as an uber-extrovert he simply can't fathom why someone wouldn't be interested. This particular child has difficulty reading social cues in general so your little guy may pick up the "rules" more easily.

 

I believe the reason you are receiving some criticism in this thread is that the intial post came across as really snarky, as if anyone who couldn't see the value in playing with your child must be socially backward in some way. The tone rang of a sense of superiority because your outgoing child walks up and talks to people. IMO, that is actually unusual for a child of that age and while not necessarily a negative I would probably invest more time in social cue training and less time labelling others shy. I will grant that in situations where children are usually segregated by age, most of them tend to hew to that system even when out in mixed age groups. My own experience has been that maybe 10-15% will play with a younger child without a second thought. Others will do so if there is no other options and a small percentage will hide in a closet rather than be caught playing with a little. :glare:

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My youngest can be extremely shy around everyone including grandparents and relatives that she sees on a regular basis. The only people that she's not shy around is us - her immediate family. I role play with her when we know that we will be around family or friends, but it doesn't guarantee that she will actually talk.

 

By the way, I think it's great that your ds is so excited and willing to play with the other kids!

 

I haven't read through the entire thread, but this is very similar to our kids. It's easy to say that parents should teach their kids to be polite, and I do agree with that - children do need to be taught to be polite. But, when you have a painfully shy child, making them be polite in public can end up being more painful to them than - as the parent - stepping in and speaking for them, or just letting them be silent. Our oldest ds was so shy when he was small that he'd simply bury his face in his hands if anyone spoke to him. Following the advice of others I decided that it was time that he learned to be polite and tried to force him to acknowledge the greeting of a person we spoke to every week. It was so painful for ds and hurt him so much that we never did it again! At 10 he has grown out of this and will reply when spoken to, but he never initiates the conversation or offers more than the basic answers. And like school17777's child......our kids are shy around people they know very well. We have friends who have been our friends our kids' entire lives....and our kids are still very shy around them. It doesn't matter how often we see these people either, the kids are still shy and are barely able to speak when spoken to. Saying that a kid should be polite is fine....but sometimes it's easier -- and kinder!! -- to just let the kid be shy, not embarrass them by making a big deal of how shy they are, and provide a way for the kid to survive the situation without making it even harder than it is for them.

 

And as for the Legos ..... were they Lego bricks, or Lego Duplo? Some kids would be too old for "baby toys" like Duplos, so while they might look interested, they probably wouldn't stoop to play with them. Being "big kids" now, it would be embarrassing to be seen playing with baby toys. :001_smile:

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To add further, life with an only of 3yo is much different than life with a couple older kids. When we go to social events, I never direct my kids to play with younger kids. I tell my kids to look out for each other and to have fun. Knowing they have each other and they enjoy playing with their sibs, I wouldn't keep tabs on who they were or weren't playing with. I did when my oldest was 3yo, but I am happily past that stage now. I would have told my kids they could have screen time at the party so I could socialize, and I am sure that's what they would have done.

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Those shy kids would have been my older two girls, ages 5 and 8. They are very shy and a socially "agressive" child will turn them completely off, no matter what the age. My 5 year old is *still* somewhat shy around my grandparents and she's seen them consistently (several times a month) for 5 years now! The only people she is 100% herself around are her immediate family (me, DH, her two sisters, and our 16 year old nephew), my parents, and my two sisters (and their husbands). That's all.

 

It takes lots of people to make the world go round.....outgoing, "never-meet-a-stranger" type people, as well as painfully shy ones as well.

 

And to the person who mentioned "manners" when talking to others, we work on that. You must not have a painfully shy child, obviously. Nor one that was diagnosed with selective mutism as a preschooler. It's not always as easy as just telling the child they need to "speak up and say something when someone is addressing you." You never know what the parents may be working on at home. If my painfully shy child didn't speak when spoken to, I would not jump all over them and address the issue in the company of everyone within earshot (that would just make the situation worse). It's something we would address in private.

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OP, I completely understand. My son (who's 11) was very much like your son at age 3. It was awesome and exhausting at the same time.

 

I also know parents who have kids who are very quiet and I think the mom probably had good reason not to try to force her kids to be polite. Maybe she thought they would warm up; maybe it happens sometimes.

 

I don't think you or your DS did anything wrong at all. I would cut the other mom some slack, though. I don't think she was lazy (I'm referring to a PP here, not your posts) since her kids were perfectly fine sitting and watching tv/playing nintendo.

 

I don't think you or your son were being obnoxious. There is nothing wrong with your son asking them a couple of times if they want to play with legos or you asking them a couple of normal questions. It sounds like you both backed off when it was clear they were uncomfortable. I don't see the problem.

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I think it was not on her radar. Her kids were "out of her hair" on New Year's Eve and that was probably good enough for her.

Absolutely. As a middle aged mother of four with two part time jobs in addition to homeschooling who rarely gets out to enjoy much adult "party" time, I heartily agree. My three youngest kids accompanied us to a friends' house on NYE. They didn't really know anyone at the party. My kids were not on my radar because they are 12, 10 and 7. I know them well enough to know that they would not be doing anything inappropriate and, in the rare instance that they might, one of my other kids would inform me so I could deal with it. It would not even be on my radar whether or not they interacted with other kids. In a play date situation (which I have had 17 years of, in one form or another), I would have been working on their social skills. At the NYE party, I would not do it unless a situation really needs my intervention. I am old, tired and unsocialized myself. :closedeyes: I was not going to be in major "parenting mode" during this event. There actually was a three year old at this event, and I have absolutely no idea if my kids interacted with her, if she tried to interact with them or if anyone noticed or cared. I am at a very different place in life than the OP is. I remember having one three year old so I understand some of the OP's expressed concerns. Having lived through four three year olds and now having a 17, 12, 10 and 7 year old, I am a different place. OP, you are going to need to give us old, tired moms some grace and not think of us as lazy or unconcerned. We've just put in our time and may be taking a three hour break at a party. It may be the only socializing break some of us have had for a very long time. :) (Internet explorer = no paragraph breaks - sorry!)
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My oldest is high-energy and outgoing. At 3, she could be a bit "in-your-face" about wanting to interact with other kids like the way the OP's child sounds from the description. But as she got older, she got better at gauging others' interest. My dad, the HS skeptic, is convinced that HS has ruined her because "she used to be so friendly and now she's less so" but he's wrong. She can still make friends quickly with a strange child if the interest is mutual, but she's no longer obnoxious about it when the other kid wants to be left alone.

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