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RAD: Denisemomof4 & Others


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Hey Denise and Others :)

 

The other day I was with a friend and she talked about RAD... how her adopted child had it... and their options surrounding it. I'd like to just say, "THANKS" for sharing info about it... allowing us to see a bit into your lives.

 

Sometimes when we share, we wonder if we're only venting, helping ourselves, perhaps boring others.

 

I'd like you to know that you've helped me, and I'm sure others, too!!

 

When she shared her story, I could believe her! I could understand her experience... because of yours!!

 

For our family I know that I'm not willing to change my life right now because of a child with RAD, but I know that I'd be willing to do respite care for a friend... and support them without wondering if they're crazy....

 

I know that I'd trust them if they say that their angelic child is not like that at home... that a day with them is close to "Hell on Earth"..... that they've gotten rid of their animals for their animal's safety.... That they can't sleep well through the night. (and on and on)

 

Thanks for giving us a glimpse of your lives... and know that I really do hope for complete (emotional) healing at the end... :)

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You are a good friend...

 

And Thank You to Denise and others here who have adopted children with all sorts of special needs and for giving completely of yourselves....AND for enlightening the rest of us.

 

Denise, you have helped me come to terms with many of my attachment disorders due to abandonment, neglective foster care experience and issues attaching to my own adoptive family. You have no idea how your experience has helped me deal with my own issues....and helped my brother through some of his.

 

:grouphug:

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I have to say, if it weren't for others telling me about their RAD kids I would have never known what it was. I can't tell you the relief I felt after living for two years with my child and having no idea what I was doing wrong. Finding out it was not me was just what I needed to look for the help my child needed. Unfortunately I was not able to find it around here and had to put on my homeschool mom hat and research, research research. Talking to other RAD moms, books, and youtube videos are some of the things I attribute to my child's wonderful year!

All that to say I am thankful for everyone who takes the brave step to come out and talk about RAD. I've been rebuffed enough to know how hard it is, but I won't keep quiet about it.

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  • 2 weeks later...

L has RAD imo, but I cant find much help for her because shes so young. Plus the incident that led to her RAD was 2yrs ago and the people I have to talked to about it, say thats too long ago for it to be RAD, but shes had the symptoms since then, i just didnt connect it.

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I'm always a little skeptical about labels for kids with behavioral issues. But having a foster child with a history of abuse and neglect and seeing their weird lack of attachment and aggression (which I suspect is RAD) makes me a whole lot less judgmental about other parents. I've really needed to rethink my approach to parenting this one..

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Jen, just from the tiny bit you said, it sounds like it could be PTSD. However, at some point, it all starts running together. PTSD is related to anxiety which could most certainly be related to mistrust in adult-child relationships where a child would exhibit signs of avoiding attachment or being indescriminate.

 

Momling, yes, really, it is absolutely necessary. If you parent these kids anywhere near the realm of typically, you'll go insane. Right now, we have chosen a combination approach highly based on connection and acceptance but with some redirection and certain consequences let it. It has made life MUCH more manageable than when we were trying to do it the other way around.

 

However, I still was a bit judgmental about the obnoxious lady at Once Upon a Child last night. We left she was so annoying. Of course, maybe she thought it odd that we didn't even seem to address a certain behavior we had going on. I don't know.

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  • 2 weeks later...
Hey Denise and Others :)

 

The other day I was with a friend and she talked about RAD... how her adopted child had it... and their options surrounding it. I'd like to just say, "THANKS" for sharing info about it... allowing us to see a bit into your lives.

 

Sometimes when we share, we wonder if we're only venting, helping ourselves, perhaps boring others.

 

I'd like you to know that you've helped me, and I'm sure others, too!!

 

When she shared her story, I could believe her! I could understand her experience... because of yours!!

 

For our family I know that I'm not willing to change my life right now because of a child with RAD, but I know that I'd be willing to do respite care for a friend... and support them without wondering if they're crazy....

 

I know that I'd trust them if they say that their angelic child is not like that at home... that a day with them is close to "Hell on Earth"..... that they've gotten rid of their animals for their animal's safety.... That they can't sleep well through the night. (and on and on)

 

Thanks for giving us a glimpse of your lives... and know that I really do hope for complete (emotional) healing at the end... :)

 

Your friend is SO very lucky to have you. i am so happy to hear that my story will be helping another RAD mom. RAD moms need help, understanding, sympathy and support. They all too often receive judgment, criticism, and hostility - both online and IRL. :sad: If you do decide to provide respite care, please consider this to educate yourself on how to do things in a way which will help her child: http://www.attachment.org/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=attachment&Product_Code=106&Category_Code=RESPITE

 

How sweet of you to post this!!!:grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

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Denise, you have helped me come to terms with many of my attachment disorders due to abandonment, neglective foster care experience and issues attaching to my own adoptive family. You have no idea how your experience has helped me deal with my own issues....and helped my brother through some of his.

 

:grouphug:

 

Faith - I got chills reading this. Words can't describe how deeply this has touched me. I am so shocked to know I have had this affect on you. :grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

 

As a child who suffered much of what my dd has, can you tell me if there is ANYTHING your adoptive parents could have done differently to help you? If you would be open to sharing here or through a PM, I would love to hear your thoughts on this. Also, how is your relationship with your adoptive parents now? Does your brother have a relationship with them? My biggest fear is that dd will turn 18 and we will never see her again, and/or she will go through life unattached and alone. Sometimes I cripple myself with my thoughts but I always force myself to let them go because I know fear is never good.

:grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

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I have to say, if it weren't for others telling me about their RAD kids I would have never known what it was. I can't tell you the relief I felt after living for two years with my child and having no idea what I was doing wrong. Finding out it was not me was just what I needed to look for the help my child needed. Unfortunately I was not able to find it around here and had to put on my homeschool mom hat and research, research research. Talking to other RAD moms, books, and youtube videos are some of the things I attribute to my child's wonderful year!

All that to say I am thankful for everyone who takes the brave step to come out and talk about RAD. I've been rebuffed enough to know how hard it is, but I won't keep quiet about it.

 

julie, there is a LOT of help in your area! For a child so younh (is it Lily Grace you speak of?). I would HIGHLY recommend Heather Forbes. She is WONDERFUL!!!!! I am sure in FL there must br soe sort of support groip for adoptive/RAD parents. Have you tried to look for one?

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L has RAD imo, but I cant find much help for her because shes so young. Plus the incident that led to her RAD was 2yrs ago and the people I have to talked to about it, say thats too long ago for it to be RAD, but shes had the symptoms since then, i just didnt connect it.

 

no child is too young to be helped. Also, the damage done to RAD kids is forever ingrained into them. They may heal enough to do well despite their traumas, they may not. My dd has been with us for EIGHT years. While she has largely healed, there are still some very troubling things we have to deal with. i am realizing now that we will likely always have issues to deal with but I have become stronger, and she really is doing so much better. The fact that your dd suffered years ago so it is too long ago to be affecting her is absolutely NOT true.

 

I would do all you can to research and work on attachment and bonding.

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I'm always a little skeptical about labels for kids with behavioral issues. But having a foster child with a history of abuse and neglect and seeing their weird lack of attachment and aggression (which I suspect is RAD) makes me a whole lot less judgmental about other parents. I've really needed to rethink my approach to parenting this one..

 

It is a well kkwn fact that RAD kids can NOT be parented like bio or normally attached kids. Sadly, this sets the parent up for criticism and judgment as ignorant outsiders see the one chikd being treated differently, and all too oftenit is assumed that the child is treated differently "because they are adooted.". It has even been saif right in this board numerous times. It is harder to take IRL.

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Jen, just from the tiny bit you said, it sounds like it could be PTSD. However, at some point, it all starts running together. PTSD is related to anxiety which could most certainly be related to mistrust in adult-child relationships where a child would exhibit signs of avoiding attachment or being indescriminate.

 

Momling, yes, really, it is absolutely necessary. If you parent these kids anywhere near the realm of typically, you'll go insane. Right now, we have chosen a combination approach highly based on connection and acceptance but with some redirection and certain consequences let it. It has made life MUCH more manageable than when we were trying to do it the other way around.

 

However, I still was a bit judgmental about the obnoxious lady at Once Upon a Child last night. We left she was so annoying. Of course, maybe she thought it odd that we didn't even seem to address a certain behavior we had going on. I don't know.

 

Pam - :grouphug:

 

Also, parenting RAD kids like you normally attached kids will actually make them sicker. They NEED different parenting. My dd NEVER would have come as far as she has if I parented her like my other three kids. In fact, I am certain she would be MUCH worse than she was at her absolute most horrific stage.

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Jen, just from the tiny bit you said, it sounds like it could be PTSD. However, at some point, it all starts running together. PTSD is related to anxiety which could most certainly be related to mistrust in adult-child relationships where a child would exhibit signs of avoiding attachment or being indescriminate.

 

In our experience this has been very true. Trauma issues do tend to be pervasive, confusing, and sometimes overshadow other diagnoses. It can get complicated and you can feel like you're really stuck in a difficult place. For our daughter, TF-CBT helped a lot. However, it did take a lot of time as well and we really had to buy into it and build it into how we parented her as well.

 

This link may be helpful:http://www.nctsn.org/sites/default/files/assets/pdfs/tfcbt_general.pdf

 

*Actually the entire site may be helpful to peruse. http://www.nctsn.org

Edited by LMV
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julie, there is a LOT of help in your area! For a child so younh (is it Lily Grace you speak of?). I would HIGHLY recommend Heather Forbes. She is WONDERFUL!!!!! I am sure in FL there must br soe sort of support groip for adoptive/RAD parents. Have you tried to look for one?

 

No, no it's my 15yo adopted daughter. I had a support group for a short time, but it disbanded when the moms running it had to give it up. I've talked to someone that works with Heather Forbes once and they did help a lot. My girl has had a great year and I think we are healing. We are thinking of letting her have some real teenage responsibility next year after having such a hard time the last few years.

The two adoption counselors I talked to here where I live had no RAD training and she manipulated the heck out of them. It was a really bad experience. We've read all the books and talked to other moms and came up with our own attack plan and we are seeing real fruit this year. I'm more hopeful than I have ever been! Cautiously so, though.

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I have a RAD kiddo, home 8 years adopted at 11 months old. He was so bad we were told by 3 different specialists that they wanted to help us with relinquishment, because they thought he'd never heal. How blessed we are that we stuck with it, for Josh is a delight and a treasure...but man, those first few years were AWFUL.

 

I remember the glares and stares in stores as he flipped out, I remember the judgment on our parenting as we did things that seemed so odd and not at all "nurturing" as we created boundaries and made him feel safe. I lost friends over it, I lost my job over it, I lost myself for for awhile.

 

What did I gain?

 

My Joshie!! Worth every moment of heartache and judgment we endured.

 

There are residual effects, night terrors from time to time, anxiousness if Mom is gone...but he is genuinely extremely loving, affectionate and deeply connected.

 

You just never know, afetr adopting Josh we adopted 3 older kids, ages 8, 10, and 11...not an ounce of RAD to be found. And I am grateful for our RAD experience because we actually felt we had been through hell and back already and came out OK, so why not adopt older kids??? It actually gave us the confidence to step out and try older child adoption, which proved much easier in many regards than our infant adoption!!

 

Cindy

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No, no it's my 15yo adopted daughter. I had a support group for a short time, but it disbanded when the moms running it had to give it up. I've talked to someone that works with Heather Forbes once and they did help a lot. My girl has had a great year and I think we are healing. We are thinking of letting her have some real teenage responsibility next year after having such a hard time the last few years.

The two adoption counselors I talked to here where I live had no RAD training and she manipulated the heck out of them. It was a really bad experience. We've read all the books and talked to other moms and came up with our own attack plan and we are seeing real fruit this year. I'm more hopeful than I have ever been! Cautiously so, though.

 

I totally u derstand using caution when being hopeful!!!!!

 

would you mind sharing here or in a PM what has worked?

 

I have found that my RAd does best when she has a very simple and quiet life. I do very, very little with her away from home. I assume we will be able to build up on our outings/days away but this year will be the first ever where I have no activities for her at all, and I will not have many playdates for her at all. Once I see her doing better and staying regulated longer and longer, I will SLOOOOOOOOOOOOOWLY add more in for her. My biggest mistake I ever made with her was doing too much. She herself told me she doesn't handle activity well, and she needs time DAILY in her room, alone, to decompress. I call it her coccooning time. It was hard on ME to trim away her life outside the home, but I absolutely know it is what she NEEDS.

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I have a RAD kiddo, home 8 years adopted at 11 months old. He was so bad we were told by 3 different specialists that they wanted to help us with relinquishment, because they thought he'd never heal. How blessed we are that we stuck with it, for Josh is a delight and a treasure...but man, those first few years were AWFUL.

 

I remember the glares and stares in stores as he flipped out, I remember the judgment on our parenting as we did things that seemed so odd and not at all "nurturing" as we created boundaries and made him feel safe. I lost friends over it, I lost my job over it, I lost myself for for awhile.

 

What did I gain?

 

My Joshie!! Worth every moment of heartache and judgment we endured.

 

There are residual effects, night terrors from time to time, anxiousness if Mom is gone...but he is genuinely extremely loving, affectionate and deeply connected.

 

You just never know, afetr adopting Josh we adopted 3 older kids, ages 8, 10, and 11...not an ounce of RAD to be found. And I am grateful for our RAD experience because we actually felt we had been through hell and back already and came out OK, so why not adopt older kids??? It actually gave us the confidence to step out and try older child adoption, which proved much easier in many regards than our infant adoption!!

 

Cindy

 

I am so happy for you, Cindy!

 

My RAD has also been home with us for 8 years, adopted at 14 months. We have one disturbing thing I hope to get her to stop doing (it's merely to push our buttons but is SO GROSS!) but she is getting better with that. This past year I have put up the strictest boundaries ever and you know what? She is a MUCH better kid. But MAN would I look mean to outsiders if we were still overly involved outside the home. I am so thankful my close friends and brother GET IT.

 

You know your adoption story isn't the statistical norm, but I am SO HAPPY for you. Having one RAD is all I can handle and I can say with certainty that I will never adoot again and I will never question fostering again. This work is the hardest ever and I just can't commit to it again. We have had horrific years but I finally am feeling peace now. It is WONDERFUL!!!!!

 

My poor dd also suffers horribly at night. Sleep issues abound. :(. But her PTSD symptoms which used to rule over her seem to be completely gone until bed time, which is huge. I can't believe how far we have come.

 

I do fear the teenage years with her, but I force myself to push those fears away.

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You just never know, afetr adopting Josh we adopted 3 older kids, ages 8, 10, and 11...not an ounce of RAD to be found. And I am grateful for our RAD experience because we actually felt we had been through hell and back already and came out OK, so why not adopt older kids??? It actually gave us the confidence to step out and try older child adoption, which proved much easier in many regards than our infant adoption!!

 

Cindy

 

We met our foster daughter right after her tenth birthday. She had been in state custody for almost four months at that point but we were her first foster parents as she spent all of the prior time in a PICU bed at one of our state Children's Hospitals. We were cautioned about RAD by several well meaning people (and by a few probably not so well meaning individuals). We were well aware that this was not going to be easy but we honestly couldn't see another option for her so we did some praying and decided we had to try. We weren't naive but we decided to keep an open mind and try a proactive and realistic approach.

 

Now she is twelve and she has become our daughter. She didn't attach to us overnight but we weren't expecting her to. Instead we saw some early tentative attachment start after a few months and then saw consistent overall (albeit not always linear) progress from there. She had significant health issues which complicated everything and addressing the PTSD was another challenge but she really has come so far. We still see a little insecurity in her attachment but this seems to fade a bit more every month. We’re unfortunately still waiting for a TPR now approaching three years after CP/FS originally removed her from her parents. It will happen, and we think that is probably the missing piece in all of this. She needs the security of the TPR as a promise that the past really is the past.

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We met our foster daughter right after her tenth birthday. She had been in state custody for almost four months at that point but we were her first foster parents as she spent all of the prior time in a PICU bed at one of our state Children's Hospitals. We were cautioned about RAD by several well meaning people (and by a few probably not so well meaning individuals). We were well aware that this was not going to be easy but we honestly couldn't see another option for her so we did some praying and decided we had to try. We weren't naive but we decided to keep an open mind and try a proactive and realistic approach.

 

Now she is twelve and she has become our daughter. She didn't attach to us overnight but we weren't expecting her to. Instead we saw some early tentative attachment start after a few months and then saw consistent overall (albeit not always linear) progress from there. She had significant health issues which complicated everything and addressing the PTSD was another challenge but she really has come so far. We still see a little insecurity in her attachment but this seems to fade a bit more every month. We’re unfortunately still waiting for a TPR now approaching three years after CP/FS originally removed her from her parents. It will happen, and we think that is probably the missing piece in all of this. She needs the security of the TPR as a promise that the past really is the past.

 

Your daughter spent four months in a PICU? How sad. :(. I am so glad she is with you now and doing better. What is a TPR?

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I wanted to thank Denise also for sharing. My twins don't have RAD, but mixing Autism, Bipolar and possible ODD together is making life very hard right now. Our doctor is starting to suggest removing my daughter from the home, but seeing others like Denise and realizing that living in what feels like a boot camp all the time with the limits, and locks, and alarms can be done and kids can stay at home, gives me hope.

 

Luckily we get alot of support for the kids, I get therapy for free, they get therapy for free, and we are on the waiting list for support from Children's Long Term Support in our state (they pay for respite) makes it a bit easier. But knowing other mom's are out there, going through similar things, helped me alot on the hard days.

 

Just the other day I was complaining that I am not allowed to have nice things, and realized, that others have it much harder. :(

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Your daughter spent four months in a PICU? How sad. :(. I am so glad she is with you now and doing better. What is a TPR?

 

TPR=Termination of Parental Rights

 

One parent voluntarily relinquished, pled guilty on the criminal charges, and went off to prison. The other parent appears to be using criminal and family court against each other to delay the inevitable conviction. They have appealed the TPR on every, and any, ground imaginable. Until the TPR goes through she is not cleared for adoption so we're in a bit of limbo on this.

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Faith - I got chills reading this. Words can't describe how deeply this has touched me. I am so shocked to know I have had this affect on you. :grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

 

As a child who suffered much of what my dd has, can you tell me if there is ANYTHING your adoptive parents could have done differently to help you? If you would be open to sharing here or through a PM, I would love to hear your thoughts on this. Also, how is your relationship with your adoptive parents now? Does your brother have a relationship with them? My biggest fear is that dd will turn 18 and we will never see her again, and/or she will go through life unattached and alone. Sometimes I cripple myself with my thoughts but I always force myself to let them go because I know fear is never good.

:grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

 

Denise, I know this is an older post....but I just saw it. My parents are both gone now. As far as our relationship, I spoke with my mom and dad daily, by phone when they live far from me....and then when dad passed away, mom moved to be closer to me. My brother had a deep love and attachment with our dad and an extremely strained relationship with our mom....and did not speak with her the last 8 years she was alive. I do not think it was an adoptive issue, but because our mom had some mental issues he could not cope with. I never had a close mom/daughter bond mainly because I do not think my mom knew how to be the mom. In her last few years, she called me mom.....there was a bit of confusion there....

 

I do not think adoptive parents knew of the attachment issues and PTSD associated with children who had been in foster care back in the 1960's. I was abandoned, then in a horrible foster home before my parents got me. My situation was different from my brother who was given over at birth.

 

There are so many nuances from family to family....honestly, all I can say is you are a wonderful mom. Your dd loves you. There will probably be some hard roads ahead, but in the end....we can only cross our fingers, do our very best, pray like crazy....and hope it all works out. That is really all we can do with any of our kids....bio or adopted.

 

:grouphug::grouphug:

Faithe

 

Oh, as far as dd being alone and unattached....well....I have been married almost 27 years, with dh for over 30... And have 7 children....not unattached, or alone. No one would have thought this would have been my outcome....but here I am with a loving, caring awesome husband and some great kids. Hth....and I think you are being really smart pulling dd from activities and giving her quiet, cozy, comfortable days to make her feel secure. I am doing similar with my kids this year....we need some regrouping time. Hugs!

Edited by Mommyfaithe
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I wanted to thank Denise also for sharing. My twins don't have RAD, but mixing Autism, Bipolar and possible ODD together is making life very hard right now. Our doctor is starting to suggest removing my daughter from the home, but seeing others like Denise and realizing that living in what feels like a boot camp all the time with the limits, and locks, and alarms can be done and kids can stay at home, gives me hope.

 

Luckily we get alot of support for the kids, I get therapy for free, they get therapy for free, and we are on the waiting list for support from Children's Long Term Support in our state (they pay for respite) makes it a bit easier. But knowing other mom's are out there, going through similar things, helped me alot on the hard days.

 

Just the other day I was complaining that I am not allowed to have nice things, and realized, that others have it much harder. :(

 

Above all, trust your gut. i have had many adoptive and foster moms tell me to disrupt. I have at times WANTED to disrupt. I have had therapists give me suggestions. EVERY single time I go against my mommy gut, it is a mistake. I keep on keepin on and I hope that in the end she will be thankful I did. If not, I know I tried.

 

The locks, the alarms, the tomato staking for EIGHT YEARS, all of it is our new norm. It sounds like a horror story but it is our life, just as my deficits from a head injury, dd12's health issues - ALL are a part of our life. We have learned to find peace and joy in it all, even though we have dark, hard days.

 

The longer you are on your journey, the stronger you become. Your plate is very full but YOU CAN DO IT. :001_smile:

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TPR=Termination of Parental Rights

 

One parent voluntarily relinquished, pled guilty on the criminal charges, and went off to prison. The other parent appears to be using criminal and family court against each other to delay the inevitable conviction. They have appealed the TPR on every, and any, ground imaginable. Until the TPR goes through she is not cleared for adoption so we're in a bit of limbo on this.

 

That's very difficult. :grouphug:

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Denise, I know this is an older post....but I just saw it. My parents are both gone now. As far as our relationship, I spoke with my mom and dad daily, by phone when they live far from me....and then when dad passed away, mom moved to be closer to me. My brother had a deep love and attachment with our dad and an extremely strained relationship with our mom....and did not speak with her the last 8 years she was alive. I do not think it was an adoptive issue, but because our mom had some mental issues he could not cope with. I never had a close mom/daughter bond mainly because I do not think my mom knew how to be the mom. In her last few years, she called me mom.....there was a bit of confusion there....

 

I do not think adoptive parents knew of the attachment issues and PTSD associated with children who had been in foster care back in the 1960's. I was abandoned, then in a horrible foster home before my parents got me. My situation was different from my brother who was given over at birth.

 

There are so many nuances from family to family....honestly, all I can say is you are a wonderful mom. Your dd loves you. There will probably be some hard roads ahead, but in the end....we can only cross our fingers, do our very best, pray like crazy....and hope it all works out. That is really all we can do with any of our kids....bio or adopted.

 

:grouphug::grouphug:

Faithe

 

Oh, as far as dd being alone and unattached....well....I have been married almost 27 years, with dh for over 30... And have 7 children....not unattached, or alone. No one would have thought this would have been my outcome....but here I am with a loving, caring awesome husband and some great kids. Hth....and I think you are being really smart pulling dd from activities and giving her quiet, cozy, comfortable days to make her feel secure. I am doing similar with my kids this year....we need some regrouping time. Hugs!

 

Thank you so much for this!!!

 

The selfish side of me hopes my dd will always be in relationship with me. I hope one day she will realize how hard I have tried. She has voiced this before, but I hope to hear it when she is an adult.

 

But if she went on to get marrid and have a happy marriage, I would be so incredibly happy for her!!!

 

I am sorry for your early start in life, and sorry for your complicated relationship with your mom. I am so glad your life with your own family is now healthy and happy!!!:grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

 

Again, I am so thankful for your sharing here.

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That's very difficult. :grouphug:

 

Thank you! It has been difficult, mostly because she really needs the assurance of the TPR to heal completely. We try to do the best we can with the situation we find ourselves in and that is what we're trying to do now.

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