Accelerated Reader Program - Thoughts?

[Bang!Zoom!]

The little one is entering a Accelerated Reader program that is quite different from last year. Last year the school logged hours spent reading classroom books only.

 

I read through her info packet last night, and this AR program collects "points" per book.

 

Is anyone familiar with this program?

 

In the packet it says that every child will have a "point goal" and are "challenged" to reach it. Reaching the goal is 20% of the grade they receive.

 

I am thoroughly lost on the the method they assign these "points". I went through the catalog last night online and it makes absolutely no sense to me.

 

Am I right to think that the kids sit with a computer after reading, take a button test and that's it?

 

Are they going to limit her choices of books to the books by the AR catalog or what they have permission to test on?

 

Help me iron this out. It's weirdin' me out.

[NoPlaceLikeHome]

I don't know a lot about the program but our local children's library head librarian did not love the program at all. She was happy to hear ds's teacher encouraged him to pick books he loved for assigned reading:)

[Bang!Zoom!]

Okay, that link cleared up a lot for me, thanks for that.

 

Points are scaled to the sheer volume of words. The idealism behind that system is based on exposure to words.

 

I could not figure out why the huge discrepancy between a genuine classic that has enough material to do a graduate level class being equal to a piece of unrated (but popular) fiction.

 

It's the sheer length of the book that has the point system tipping one way or the other.

 

There is something rumbling in my mental belly though. I feel like I just got off a roller coaster.

 

I smell money and corporation control.

 

Does anyone else feel like that?

[matilda]

Our school uses this program and we have never had a problem with it. My dc read *alot* and they have always found books that they can test on. The tests are not that hard. On my end, the program is seemless. As long as I make them read at home, they never have any problems. If your dc are not fond of the books that they have to read, talk to the teacher. There are plenty of choices.

[mich311e]

We're 3.5 weeks into school and it's our first year using AR (2nd grade).

 

My son was tested and I was super impressed at my son's score and range. ;) They do have a huge catalog. I have used the catalog in kindy and 1st grade to figure out what level books he was reading.

 

I would not like AR to be part of my son's grade - especially 20%! Yikes! My son is constantly reading and I don't want to make him only read AR books and then take the quizzes. Too much work and too much nagging on my part would be required. I much prefer to let him read what he wants.

 

So far he's only taken two quizzes. He usually reads a Magic Tree House book in a few days so I have him take a quiz for one of those. His goal for the first quarter is only 5 points, so 10 books at .5 points each would be sufficient. But if he reads a longer chapter book he could get 1 - 3 points.

 

I've heard many negative things about AR in the past. But then again I've heard of parents who can't stand reading logs. I'm one of those parents who does the bare minimum. I'm not going to make my son take a quiz on every book he reads nor do we log every minute he reads in his reading log. My bottom line is I don't want to destroy his love for reading.

Edited August 28, 2011 by mich311e

[mchel210]

http://www.arbookfind.com/default.aspx

 

We used this for a few years. I actually loved it. It worked perfect for our school. They used to make charts and competitions to see who could get the most points. It really pushed the kids to read a ton of books. Sometimes they read a bunch of low point books...but they usually had to remain on level. The new school we are in doesnt have AR books. I think the AR was a great motivator. (just my view :)) But there are a lot of books on AR list...and I cant imagine he couldnt find his book on it? Unless they are only going by the quizes that HIS school has purchased. That is a pain. That would limit the books he could read...but Im sure if you sat down and went through you could pick books for AR and let him read his own books in addition.

 

I still look up AR books and try to keep track at home but we dont have the quizes now. They use Reading Counts at school.

[Bang!Zoom!]

I guess it's not just the love of reading I feel is at risk; but content and understanding as well.

 

This reeks of fast-food education to me.

 

I guess my challenge is to try to figure out how to combine a more developed approach in harmony with that point system.

 

I'm worried that the reading time at school is being set aside for point accumulation and not the more developed skills of thinking about literature.

 

She does have a pretty competitive spirit, and I'm wondering if that is going to cause her to go a mile wide and an inch deep while there.

[Word Nerd]

My blood pressure went up just reading the subject line.

[Bang!Zoom!]

Well, going through her paperwork (this portion explains homework) a bit more, I'm reading this:

 

"Besides completing the math homework, the other homework expectation is for your child to read at home. Research tells us that for kids to become successful readers they must have lots of practice. The goals encourage children to read for 20 minutes each day, at least 5 times per week. One way we try to encourage this reading practice is by the Accelerated Reading Program."

 

I think it's safe to assume that AR point collection/goal achievement is going to be a home activity issue partially. I'll need to wait a bit and see if there is any time during the ordinary school day devoted to AR reading. There will have to be some sort of schedule for it I think because of the testing issue that goes along with it.

 

I read that the testing for a book could be expected to take 10 minutes per title, so there has to be something at the school for that to take place.

 

Something about that confuses me though.

 

I'm not understanding how they handle that part.

 

What's happening in your schools for the testing part? Is it like a special devoted space of time or when is it happening? Is it like one day a week, or as it's done?

[Word Nerd]

I guess it's not just the love of reading I feel is at risk; but content and understanding as well.

 

This reeks of fast-food education to me.

 

I'm not sure what you mean by fast-food education in this instance. At least at our school, AR points are accumulated on books the students read at home. They do separate assignments for literature studies and in-class reading. I don't want my daughter to have to be tested at all on the books she reads for pleasure. Why can't she just read something she enjoys for reading's sake? I just get irritated with linking pleasure reading with getting points and taking quizzes.

Edited August 28, 2011 by WordGirl

[Word Nerd]

What's happening in your schools for the testing part? Is it like a special devoted space of time or when is it happening? Is it like one day a week, or as it's done?

 

At our school, they take an AR quiz during computer time whenever they have finished reading a book.

[Bang!Zoom!]

I'm not understanding if the program is completely based on at-home reading, or reading while in the school.

 

Was yours completely based on at home reading, or a blend of home/school?

 

When I say "fast-food" I'm imagining a class of kids grabbing high point books, zipping through them with no discussion or human interaction.

 

Just read the book as fast as possible to take the test to achieve points <--fast-food reading.

 

I'm more inclined to want to include book discussion and supportive experiences when reading. Not just a multiple-choice test in ten minutes then bam...onto the next book.

 

What happens to a developing mind when they become accustomed to the idea of being tested on a book? Does it change the way they read it? Does it change the way they select books? Does it cause anxiety?

 

Oh man, I have so many questions.

 

I used to have to have my parents check out my books at the city library when I was a kid due to a system of "appropriate level" and my age.

Edited August 28, 2011 by one*mom

[regentrude]

I'm not understanding if the program is completely based on at-home reading, or reading while in the school.

Was yours completely based on at home reading, or a blend of home/school?

 

 

At our school, the kids could test on any book they had read- during school reading time, or at home.

 

When I say "fast-food" I'm imagining a class of kids grabbing high point books, zipping through them with no discussion or human interaction.

 

 

The AR program is an incentive to develop reading skills - it is not intended as a substitute for literature instruction. So, for a kid to successfullly read a high point book, it would require the child to read and comprehend 800 pages which would be good practice for reading skills.

In our school there was also in-class reading and discussion where the whole class worked on the same book, wrote about it, etc. (This had nothing to do with AR)

 

We actually had great experiences with AR during elementary school, because it was the only tool that allowed the teacher to differentiate (without incurring extra work) between strong and weak students - by simply assigning the students different reading levels (by computer test) and point goals. This meant that my DD was allowed to read 8th grade books in 2nd grade (and she topped out the scale at a reading level of 11 in 3rd) which was a life saver for her.

 

At a certain point, the program can be abused - for instance if a teacher is too restrictive with the assignment of reading level (telling a kid they can not read a certain book because it is too hard is just not good pedagogy.) This happened to us with one teacher out of the 12 teachers I encountered while my kids attended ps.

[regentrude]

What's happening in your schools for the testing part? Is it like a special devoted space of time or when is it happening? Is it like one day a week, or as it's done?

 

In our school, there were computers in the classroom, and the kids could use these to take AR tests at designated times during each day and when they had free time because they had finished their assignment.

Mine read a lot and usually tested several times a week. Other kids who were struggling readers took tests less frequently.

 

There was silent reading time in school set aside, but that had nothing to do with scheduling the testing - it just was part of the normal school activities which would happen even in a school not using the AR program

[Bang!Zoom!]

When this "assigned" reading level comes into play- how do they test for that?

 

Did your school have those reading level books available? Did you have to bring in library materials for it if they weren't available.

 

This building is a k-5 setting. I don't know that they will have that wide a range of materials to work with in the library. Would she have to bring in her own stuff to work with?

 

I guess I don't understand if it's a k-5 building if they have to purchase access to only k-5 selections or if it's the whole shebang up to 12th grade.

[ZooRho]

had one foster child once that did AR

 

HATE HATE HATE HATE AR

I think it kills the love of reading. IT is a ridicioulus thing for schools to do

forced reading will never turn to a love of reading. it is all about points and prizes

[regentrude]

When this "assigned" reading level comes into play- how do they test for that?

 

 

There was a computerized test, called the STAR test. There were reading comprehension and vocabulary questions of increasing difficulty, and this was used to determine in what difficulty range a child can comfortably read, and which level can be used to challenge the student without overwhelming.

 

Did your school have those reading level books available? Did you have to bring in library materials for it if they weren't available.

 

Our school had a school library where the students could check out books. the classroom teachers all had their own classroom libraries. And the students could use books from home. A catalog of AR books with their difficulty rating and point value was published on the school website, so parents can check which books from home would work.

 

This building is a k-5 setting. I don't know that they will have that wide a range of materials to work with in the library. Would she have to bring in her own stuff to work with?

 

Our k-4 school had many Middle school books and some Jr high level books available. There was enough reading material for my DD. When she topped out the scale, this did not mean that she HAD to read 11th grade books (which would often not be suitable because of subject matter) - but basically that she was allowed to get any book in the school.

Many elementary students read books at reading level 5, 6 and 7; there was a variety in our school, and I would assume most elementary schools would have appropriate books available. Have you checked the school website for information about AR?

[Caroline]

Many of the questions you are asking are going to be school dependent.

 

The AR program offers quizzes from easy kindergarten books through high school level reading like Hamlet, Walden, A Tale of Two Cities, etc.

 

Most schools own more quizzes than they do books. So even if a book is not available in the school library, the school might own the quiz.

 

Many PTA's will use funds to buy quizzes. At my kids' schools, the librarians would take suggestions as to what quizzes to buy for the school. Quizzes are not expensive, especially when bought in bulk, so librarians would order more quizzes quite often based on suggestions.

 

My kids always took quizzes before school started. AR was done with books read at home. Literature analysis was a different thing done at school in reading groups based by ability.

 

After two weeks of school, my fifth grader already has enough points to meet his goal for the year because he read two long books at the 8th grade level. His teacher just wants to instill a love of reading, so he made the goal low to encourage kids to read whatever they want and just take the quizzes if it happens to be an AR quiz. Different teacher have different ideas on this, and most teachers are willing to be flexible.

 

Our schools use the STAR test to determine reading level. Ours are usually a two grade spread, but kids are certainly allowed to go outside of it if they ask. My oldest's fourth grade teacher thought that many kids who read early missed some good books because their reading levels jumped so fast. She encouraged kids to read outside their level for good books.

[Bang!Zoom!]

Nothing on the school website about AR. It's not much information on anything really. Most pages are non-functional actually.

 

I guess I'm just going to have to wait and see how this is handled there.

 

I would have liked to align things at home to the program; but for right now, that's impossible to do without the finer details.

 

I guess my mind is floating off thinking that I should just push ahead with what I've already had planned out; and if it works with what they do, then fine. If not...big deal. I don't know if the classroom teacher would recognize anything independent anyway.

 

I cannot see how I could support a rapid pace of turnover style reading aimed at this point thing other than just cut in the reading time for it at home. I have her weekday schedule to start the evening reading right after her night bath time from 7:30-8:30, then off to bed.

 

Maybe just adjusting the free choice of books to align with titles with the AR program is the way to go here.

 

I can say I frankly don't care if she's picking up one book then switching to another without finishing it. I don't think I'm in the space where I'm quite ready to back this thing up at home until I understand it better and how it's done there.

 

I don't even know if her at home library is going to match what they deem to be her level.

 

The whole thing is kind of spooky, the metrics of it.

 

One more question.

 

Once this STAR test is done and the level assigned, how often do they go back and "check" or test for this "level"? I can't imagine that they just leave it at say, 4th grade or something and just say that's it for the entire year.

Edited August 28, 2011 by one*mom

[regentrude]

I have her weekday schedule to start the evening reading right after her night bath time from 7:30-8:30, then off to bed.

That's plenty - they are happy if the kids read 15-20 minutes at home.

 

I would have liked to align things at home to the program; but for right now, that's impossible to do without the finer details.

 

There is really not much to align because in the lower grades, at least in our school, there was no prescribed content (other than maybe, you have to read two non-fictions books a year or something like that). So, your daughter may well be able to use the books for AR that you assign her to read at home.

 

Maybe just adjusting the free choice of books to align with titles with the AR program is the way to go here.

I found that there was a HUGE number of titles in AR - most of the books my kids read anyway were included, so it's not as if you have to pick from a very small selection.

 

I don't even know if her at home library is going to match what they deem to be her level.

You can find out the reading levels of your books.

Here is a website:

http://www.arbookfind.com/default.aspx

 

Once this STAR test is done and the level assigned, how often do they go back and "check" or test for this "level"? I can't imagine that they just leave it at say, 4th grade or something and just say that's it for the entire year.

The way it worked in our school was the following:STAR testing happened twice a year. But when a kid with a certain target reading level got a certain number of tests on these books all right, the teacher would up the reading level. If the student reads and understands the book (and the AR test checks that), a good teacher will adjust the reading level accordingly, without having to do another STAR test.

Ask your child's teacher how she adjusts reading levels to account for student progress.

 

I think you are worrying too much about it. We found that AR was no big deal for kids who read anyway.

Edited August 29, 2011 by regentrude

[Caroline]

I think you are worrying too much about it. We found that AR was no big deal for kids who read anyway.

 

I totally agree with this statement. (and, well, everything else that was in this post.)

 

It has never been a big deal for my kids, who read a lot, and read good books.

[Bang!Zoom!]

We'll see, appreciate your help in finding my first day around this stuff.

 

Her pages from the teacher say there are certain point levels for awards. The kid is all glee'd about the limo ride at 200 points of AR award.

 

I have no idea what they are going to assign her as a reading level or goal. I'll share that information when I hear back.

[aly9712]

Don't stress yourself. They will recommend a level but kids are generally able to pick whatever books they want. The quizzes are very simple and are to encourage students who don't enjoy reading as well as check for overall comprehension. Kids take the quiz during any free time, if they finish working early, etc. Welcome to the world of public school. I wouldn't worry about trying to align this at home. This would be one of the areas of my least concern, especially if you have an on grade level or above reader.

[Bang!Zoom!]

This area was our biggest problem last year.

 

This school does only has whole group reading period. They do not have the ability to provide anything else. This is her strongest subject, she's probably going to reflect some accelerated ability in this program.

 

There is no way to address developing her current fluency in this school.

 

This program will probably be the only avenue she has to work on it during the school day.

 

I have no idea what to expect, I can only guess though some reading on AR and compare what I think it is by experiences of others.

 

Looks like there are a variety of thoughts on it.

[HeidiKC]

The way it worked in our school was the following:STAR testing happened twice a year. But when a kid with a certain target reading level got a certain number of tests on these books all right, the teacher would up the reading level. If the student reads and understands the book (and the AR test checks that), a good teacher will adjust the reading level accordingly, without having to do another STAR test.

Ask your child's teacher how she adjusts reading levels to account for student progress.

 

I think you are worrying too much about it. We found that AR was no big deal for kids who read anyway.

 

Our school handled it the same way, or they may have even tested quarterly. I also think you are worrying too much. I see the same thing at our school - for some reason parents get very concerned about points, reading level, etc. AR is just a program to make sure kids are reading on their own regularly, at their reading level, and comprehending what they are reading. It is definitely NOT a literature program. They'll get that elsewhere.

 

No, I doubt the school will have many books at high school level for your daughter to read. No big deal, since I assume you have plenty of books at home for her to read or that you check out from the library. You just go to the website and look up books in her range to find some good stuff, and check it out from the library. Or you look up the AR level of books you have or want her to read and see if what fits. Also - just so you know...they usually have the kids reading at a slightly lower level than what they score on the STAR test. I remember in 3rd grade my son scored 11.3 (11th grade, 3rd month), but the range they had him reading was something like 9.0-10.0. And the teacher was flexible and let him read books at a much lower level since I couldn't find a lot that he enjoyed or were appropriate for a 3rd grader. So don't be worried if the assigned range is lower than the score. This is reading for pleasure, so it should be a little easier.

 

I don't think every book a child ever reads needs to be discussed and dissected - sometimes it's just nice to ENJOY the books. If there are some books that she is reading that you think need discussing, you could still do that with her at home.

 

The tests are just making sure the child is comprehending the book - that's all it is meant to be. It isn't really a "TEST". But if the child is consistently scoring low on the tests, this might be a red flag to parents and teacher.

 

I found that the point requirements were not all that great, so in addition to the books he read for AR, I had plenty of time to have him read what I wanted him to as well.

 

Testing time: every morning from 8-10 the AR area is open (out in the hallways in a little "pod" so all can access it). I believe this is Language Arts time and so when the teacher is working with reading groups or something where she isn't instructing the whole class, the kids can come out if they are ready to take a test. Takes 5 minutes. Then they pick their next book and head back to class. Most of the reading will take place at home, but sometimes they have a chance to read quietly in class. It's up to them whether or not that is the AR book, but usually it is.

 

Hope this helps! Please try not to worry too much! It's just to encourage reading and to make sure they're getting enough of that done!

[Bang!Zoom!]

(We just had the most bizarre smoke/dust storm I've ever seen in my life. Just sayin- wow that was cool).

 

I hadn't gotten out of it until now that AR is pleasure reading based. That's new info for me.

 

I'd been looking at it the other way with all this technicalities/point business going on, and percentage of grade etc.

 

I don't think every book needs discussed and worked through either, I was envisioning this as every book carries test weight and pressure.

 

I honestly wouldn't care if she subtracted at negative on the 20% for AR at 100% failure if that was what it was about.

 

It's really freaky seeing this on paper for the first time and having no idea how it's actually implemented in the school.

 

I'm one of those overly passionate literature for the sheer love of it people and really do enjoy high level dissection and discussion when it's appropriate and adds to learning.

 

AR is intimidating and rather monstrous at first glance with all the regulations and structure attached to it.

[momma2three]

I've never heard of this program before today, so take my opinion with that in mind. I definitely see why people are dubious about the program, and I agree that it probably wouldn't fit into my perfect education world.

 

But there is a lot of very solid research that pure words read is actually what creates fluent and habitual readers. You can't be a fluent reader without a lot of practice, and you can't enjoy reading without being a fluent reader.

 

To get an idea of what it's like not to be a fluent reader, pick up a college level academic textbook in a subject you know little about. You will be able to read it, because you are literate, but it will be very slow and awkward and full of vocabulary you're unfamiliar with and probably some sentence structure you're not used to, and it will require a lot of concentration for you to be able to make heads or tails of it. Even if it's a subject you're interested in, it will not be fun reading.

 

Studies do actually show that even when you force kids to read, they grow to enjoy reading. That's what the push to include "sustained silent reading" in schools was all about. And this program doesn't necessarily sound like forced reading, but it is obviously an incentive that pushes quantity over quality.

 

I would hazard a guess that most children of parents who frequent this board don't actually need this push. They probably have parents who read a lot, and have been encouraged to read for fun from a young age. But, unfortunately, most children in America are not raised like that, and the idea behind programs like this is that in order to have any chance of making the next generation into a group of people who read for fun, drastic steps have to be taken to make sure kids actually get practice reading.

[HeidiKC]

Oh - wanted to add that if your daughter has good comprehension skills, she'll usually get 100%. I don't know what the questions are for harder books, but for the 2nd grade level I've seen the questions and they are like this:

 

What kind of sandwich did Billy make?

A. Ham

B. Peanut Butter

C. Fluffernutter

D. Egg Salad

 

I have mixed feelings about the AR program, but I've come to like it more than I used to. When my son was in 4th grade, he was a very good reader and read a ton. But when the competition was on, he was ready to read even more! The teacher posted the points of the top few kids or something. (So I don't think all points were posted). So if another kid had more points than he did, he'd want to read more to beat him. I'm not a huge fan of wanting to read for points' sake, but in the end it didn't matter if it made him read more. And it seemed like the kids were good about getting excited about books with lots of pages and sharing that excitement with one another.

 

Points are just because you can't really go by "number" of books, or it wouldn't really work if kids picked books with 8 pages! This program gives kids a huge variety of books (I look up book AR levels all the time and rarely is there a book that is not on the list), and they aren't stuck with books assigned by the teacher.

 

My advice (if you want it!) is don't even give this program another thought. Just make sure she's keeping up with the number of points required, and help select books at her level if necessary. She will probably always know how many points she has. They get printouts from the tests they take, and I think it includes accumulated points.

 

My main beef with the AR program is that parents (and some kids, often because of the parents) get stressed out about it, usually because they don't understand it's purpose or how it works. Usually by 3rd grade everyone is cool with it!

[Bang!Zoom!]

Laughing, your example just put me on the floor giggling. That was really cute!:lol:

 

Have you ever heard of an AR book ****NOT*** counting because the school didn't own the test?

 

Is that a very common thing?

 

I think for her and where she's at developmentally, some tromping around Hemingway would be awesome exposure right now.

 

What type of fish did the old man catch?

 

A. Guppy

B. Whale

C. Marlin

D. Filet-o-Fish

 

So, it's kinda like that?

[Carol in Cal.]

What I don't like about the AR program is the incentivizing away from pleasure to quantity, and the inane 'reading comprehension' quizzes that qualify you for points. The quizzes report on your learning of facts about the story, not on your total digestion of the book. I avoided these like the plague with my dd in favor of discussing what she read, encouraging her to summarize it, and talking about it in light of the other books that she was reading.

[mich311e]

I think you are worrying too much about it. We found that AR was no big deal for kids who read anyway.

 

 

:iagree:

 

So far it's been good for us. I'm looking at the letter from my son's school. The teacher says they devote 15 minutes of class time to AR reading and quizzing a day which leaves about 10 -15 minutes of at home reading.

 

I just logged in to see my son has taken 2 quizzes at home for books he's read and 3 quizzes for books he's read at school. (One of the at school stories was also part of the "SRA Imagine It" curriculum, so there really is a lot of different stories available on AR).

 

I don't know if they give the STAR test quarterly or just twice a year. I will ask at Literacy Night next month.

 

For now my son's reading range is 3.3 - 5.2. We've got a good range of books to work with. He could choose a book like The Sneetches and Other Stories by Dr. Seuss at level 3.4 for .5 points OR something longer like Superfudge by Judy Blume, also level 3.4, for 4 points.

[Bang!Zoom!]

They can take the tests from home?

[snickelfritz]

They can take the tests from home?

 

My student can, through the online system. It hasn't started yet, so I don't know the particulars. I glanced through the handbook.

 

Dd has to read 625 pages in the first quarter, for a grade. Anything 3rd grade level and at least 50 pages. This is separate from AR. Their AR is a goal and will be reported on the report card, but not graded. They may take tests at home, before or after school, or during DEAR time (which appears to be a daily occurrence.)

 

I am ok with the program. After reading Jim Trelease (who is big on considering total word exposure), I think there is SOME value in getting a large number of words under their belt and reading, reading, reading. So far, I've let her pick all of her reading books. When school has been in a bit longer(last week was our first full week EVER and we were all exhausted) I'm going to require some selections from the AO or great books list. That will count for her page total, if not AR. But, she's read 300 pages since last Thursday. So, I think all of the school requirements will be quickly met.

 

If she reads one classic novel a quarter and then I also read one classic novel a quarter during our snuggle time, PLUS all of the non-fiction that she enjoys, and all of her pleasure reading......I'm ok with that. The school's summer list has many classic books. The kids don't have to follow that and can choose their own, but I used it heavily last summer and plan to continue to do so.

[piraterose]

Just wanted to chime in. My daughter's school uses the Reading Counts program that is very similar to AR. My daughter obtained 150 points last year (I would say the middle of her class - but her class was a group of well-behaved, advanced kids the teacher was assigned because of the death of her husband). All that was done in school - I think she could have read at home as well, but my daughter's interest in picking up a book on her own is very low, so she only reads her 15-20 minute at home.

 

The teacher started out with 5 baskets and everyone had to start in the first basket (basket probably had 20-30 books in it) and work their way up in the world - (I think that after a certain amount of 90-100% scores and you could move up to the next basket). You do not get a point for a score under 70%. Tests were 10 question each.

 

I have a feeling the most advance kids started reading books from home or library during the second half of the year, after they grew out of the baskets.

 

Also with RC (not sure about AR) the books points level is weighted based the grade the child was in and the level of the book - Boo read some 3rd level books that she would get 3 points for, versus 1st and 2nd grade level books.

 

RC is not based strictly on length, but also difficulty - it could be a 1,000 word book, but if it only had a 2.1 grade level, is got lower points than a 700 word 3.2 book.

Edited August 29, 2011 by piraterose

[MBM]

AR made my son, back in fifth grade, detest reading. (Thankfully, it was the only year he had to do it.) He tested well and was assigned a ridiculous number of points. To rack up the points, he had to read as many as six hours per weekend day. Crazy. Not surprisingly, he retained little of what he read and felt reading was a painful chore. Not what I wanted. It didn't help that his teacher made the students write a two-page paper as well. I finally insisted that his points be lowered because he was getting so stressed out.

 

I especially disliked the point system. For example, A Midsummer Night's Dream is given a mere 3.0 points (from the ARbookfinder site). I think that's ridiculous. A middle schooler could easily spend a significant period of time reading that. The criteria just seemed odd to me.

 

My preference is for literature to pull kids in because it's interesting not because they have to attain a certain number of points to possibly get a thing (my son's school did not do the rewards). My son went from waking up in the morning wanting to read to dreading and avoiding it.

 

I know others like AR; I don't. Just not my cuppa.

[HeidiKC]

Have you ever heard of an AR book ****NOT*** counting because the school didn't own the test?

 

Is that a very common thing?

 

Well, beginning last year, our school switched to the online system (as someone else mentioned) and I'm guessing that is either the way the program is now handled or else most schools will go that way. And that means that the schools no longer buy certain tests - they just have access to ALL the tests in the AR program. So you might check on that. So if they are now using the online program where they have access to all tests, you'd just need to check online for a particular book. If they are NOT using the online program, they still probably have a huge selection. It's more the newer books for which they might not have tests.

 

If they don't have the online program, that'll still be no problem for you. You can just ask for a copy (maybe actually from the librarian? she's the one in charge of the program at our school) of the books in a certain range. It sounds like she'll need books in the higher range - so that'll be easy since the school probably has fewer at that end. OR you could compile a list of books yourself and e-mail the librarian and ask if she has tests for them. But I'm betting they have access to the online program.

 

Oh - our school does not allow the kids to take their tests from home. The parents can view their progress and such, but no testing.

[Bang!Zoom!]

Those are good thoughts, very helpful.

 

I tried calling out to the school to ask a few questions, but today is "go team" party district wide, no one in the buildings today to talk to. Today is the day before school.

 

Somehow that strikes funny..but anyway...

 

I wrote down a few notes and questions and I'll try to talk to the librarian about it.

 

The kid hasn't been through all the Newberry titles, so there is probably some opportunity there; I'd imagine the school has most all of them. I hope they own the Newberry complete anyway.

 

On open house day the librarian was out taking photos and so it was closed.:glare: lol- I thought that was super-weird for a note on the library doors.

 

I noticed also on the AR site that there are other things to gain "points" on besides books. It looks like Scholastic has a tie-in here also; they say that the Time Jr. magazine also qualifies as part of it.

 

I guess I'm getting the sense that schools have different levels of access and materials which equate to whatever program level they purchased.

 

Still learning.

 

I'm wondering if there is just some very brief review sheet I could create upon her exiting a book. Just to see if she can pinpoint the different literature structures, the very basic ones of plot/character conflict/resolution - this type of thing.

 

Not a full blown analysis, but just something that that shows me that she is able to identify points in a story or book that goes beyond the ingestion of text and words.

 

I don't know that she's in the space where it would be gigo-speed cycles; so I'm not feeling much threat there.

 

Ah, one more question...

 

When this "level" is assigned- do your schools behave strictly on the confinement of staying within the levels they have recorded?

 

Let's say Jr. Bucksnort here is assigned a level of 5.6 or something...do they tell the kid, "Nope, you can have the 9.0 book because you are out of your assigned range."

 

Do they allow the kids to move below and above their tested/recommended level?

[HeidiKC]

When this "level" is assigned- do your schools behave strictly on the confinement of staying within the levels they have recorded?

 

Let's say Jr. Bucksnort here is assigned a level of 5.6 or something...do they tell the kid, "Nope, you can have the 9.0 book because you are out of your assigned range."

 

Do they allow the kids to move below and above their tested/recommended level?

 

Totally depends on the teacher. As I mentioned earlier - my son's 3rd grade teacher allowed him to read books in the 4th-6th grade range, although his "assigned range" was somewhere around 9th-10th grade. But it didn't make a lot of sense to me for him to be reading those books (high school level) - he wouldn't enjoy them, there were situations I didn't want him encountering, I wanted him to be able to enjoy all the same books his peers were getting to read. He would have missed all sorts of good books for elementary-aged kids, and it was nice that they were excited about them together at school. I felt that if I wanted to challenge him, I could have him read different/harder stuff at home (and I did). His 4th grade teacher also allowed him to read closer to his grade level.

 

There was also a point where I felt like the teacher had upped his point requirement too high, so that he didn't have enough time to read the books at home that I was requiring (higher level). So I talked to her about this and she was fine lowering the point goal for him.

 

If there was ever a book for which there was no test, his teacher would let him just do a little "oral quiz" with her. She'd ask a few questions to test comprehension and then give points for that book. Not sure how she decided how many points, but I didn't care. I figured she had enough to worry about without me questioning the point value of a book she allowed that wasn't on the purchased AR test list!

 

I think it would be unusual to allow a student to "read up". Not sure what the point of that would be. The point of AR is to have the child reading and enjoying books that are at or below his/her level, and aren't a struggle. I'd just save the above-level books for at home.

[mich311e]

I think the range is just the goal for my son. Since he's a 2nd grade I'm not really going to expect him only to read 3rd, 4th and 5th grade level books. But like I said, bare minimum here - we do what's required. He'll meet his point goal, no problem.

[Word Nerd]

My daughter's 3rd grade teacher was a stickler about reading within the assigned range. Her 4th grade teacher didn't care as long as they weren't reading a bunch of Junie B. Jones books to get their points. Unfortunately, the books in my daughter's assigned AR range aren't necessarily age-appropriate. For example, I don't want my 10-year-old to read the Twilight books just because she can. There are a lot of children's classics that are in a lower reading level than her target, and I also don't want her to skip those.

[aly9712]

My daughter's 3rd grade teacher was a stickler about reading within the assigned range. Her 4th grade teacher didn't care as long as they weren't reading a bunch of Junie B. Jones books to get their points. Unfortunately, the books in my daughter's assigned AR range aren't necessarily age-appropriate. For example, I don't want my 10-year-old to read the Twilight books just because she can. There are a lot of children's classics that are in a lower reading level than her target, and I also don't want her to skip those.

 

 

Yes, I think this is why teachers try to suggest books within a certain range. Even if a 2nd grade child is reading levels at say a 6-8th grade level, you don't want them necessarily having free range to pick any book within those levels- as the topics for pre-teen/teens may not be appropriate for your child. Nor are teachers going to be rechecking the content for every kid to make sure there's nothing in there that may not be age appropriate. The point of AR is not to teach reading or do any sort of literature anaylsis. It's merely to gauge basic comprehension and hopefully encourage a few reluctant readers. My dd is language gifted as well, so I understand your want to make the best use of her time. AR is not going to be it, it's one of the hurdles she'll just have to jump as part of the public school experience. Again, I wouldn't stress out about this. I sorta *cringed* at the idea of creating an extra exit worksheet for these type of books. Are you doing a language curriculum at home for afterschooling? This should really be an easy peasy hurdle for dd.

BTW- I LOVE sonlight..... good luck!

[regentrude]

In general, we found the nonfic levels needed to be lower than fic levels in order to pass the quizzes.

 

:iagree:

Same here. That was a cause of much frustration for mine. Because the quizzes had insane questions like "how many miles do these whales swim" or " how many species of snakes live in xyz" or "how fast is a humming bird" which have nothing to do with reading comprehension - this is rote memorization of numbers and definitely not the goal when reading nonfiction books.

So, be careful and have them pick easier non-fiction books than their fiction reading level.

[Bang!Zoom!]

Ya, there's a pretty through plan for the LA afterschooling here.

 

I hope to blend the two - that being the PS requirements & home plans.

 

The AR structure really threw a curve ball here.

 

I am tracking her at home stuff against what the PS work reveals, if I see a dip in her ability in one area, I'll shift that around at home to support any deficits or struggle out there.

 

I built a chart to monitor the progress or needs across basic subjects. Ya, I know..OCD..but that's who I am.

 

http://afterschoolingtah.blogspot.com/p/monthly-recap.html

 

Me, personally- I don't think I have it in me to experience another year like last years. That was a total disaster.

 

Oh, the stories..(I'll spare ya.) It was bad though.

 

ps: thanks for the link, off to read :)

Edited August 29, 2011 by one*mom

[zenjenn]

Holy crap, sorry I didn't have time to read all the responses, but I *HATE* the AR program. HATE! My daughter's class used it - required by her teacher - in 1st grade. It is one of the many reasons I pulled her out. She was AR "leveled" into something ridiculously low. She had undiagnosed dyslexia at the time - but the thing is, she loves books and was an excellent context reader. Her AR level was probably spot-on for nonsense words or cold-reading something that disinterested her, but if permitted to read books of interest she could move to a much higher level. She was not allowed. :( When I pulled her out, I noticed AR levels were listed on many of the books we checked out. Naturally I noticed that my daughter chose the lower AR level for nonfiction, but much higher AR levels for novels about fairies and such. Not allowed at public school though!

 

THAT SAID, I'm sure a GOOD teacher could use the AR system as a tool to guide but not restrict what children read.

 

Fascinating Anecdote.

 

Long after I pulled my daughter from public school, I was at the library at the beginning of the summer, checking out books. I was waiting to ask a question of the children's librarian, and in front of me was a mother with her son who looked to be about 10 or 11 years old.

 

Apparently her son was not a great reader. I hear mom explaining to the librarian that his teacher had insisted that her son work on some AR reading program over the summer and it HAD to be AR level 2.4.

 

So the librarian asks the boy what topics he is interested in. Boy says he is interested in Japan, martial arts, and dinosaurs. So librarian, doing her best, pulls up the AR computer thing and starts listing off books of those topics that are in the AR program.

 

Every time the boy points to a book that interests him, he is told by mom "No, that book's AR level is too high." and any time the librarian points out one of the correct AR level, the boy complains that it looks babyish.

 

Of course, all these books ARE babyish to a boy of his age! They are designed for 2nd graders!

 

I eventually couldn't keep my mouth shut, and gently tried to persuade mom and the librarian that if they'd just stop looking at the computer screen and walk two steps to the bookshelves, they could go to the right section and find tons of books on the topics that interested him and just pick some out. My PERSONAL philosophy, and from experience, is that even if they are not the "right" AR level, if they are truly of interest to the reader, the effort will be made to decode the book and reading is practiced and thus improved. TA-DA! It's not rocket science.

 

Mom would hear nothing of it. She bought the AR program hook, line, and sinker. Boy ended up leaving with books that very clearly did not interest him, but he was satisfied that they were not too babyish at least, and they were the right AR level.

 

The whole exchange just made me want to scream!

Edited August 29, 2011 by zenjenn

[zenjenn]

By the way, I continue to see those AR tags on the books we get from the public library. My daughter chooses books at, above, AND some below - even well below, her approximate reading level. I think there is value in all three!

[JennyD]

Holy crap, sorry I didn't have time to read all the responses, but I *HATE* the AR program. HATE! My daughter's class used it - required by her teacher - in 1st grade. It is one of the many reasons I pulled her out. She was AR "leveled" into something ridiculously low. She had undiagnosed dyslexia at the time - but the thing is, she loves books and was an excellent context reader. Her AR level was probably spot-on for nonsense words or cold-reading something that disinterested her, but if permitted to read books of interest she could move to a much higher level. She was not allowed. :( When I pulled her out, I noticed AR levels were listed on many of the books we checked out. Naturally I noticed that my daughter chose the lower AR level for nonfiction, but much higher AR levels for novels about fairies and such. Not allowed at public school though!

 

THAT SAID, I'm sure a GOOD teacher could use the AR system as a tool to guide but not restrict what children read.

 

Fascinating Anecdote.

 

Long after I pulled my daughter from public school, I was at the library at the beginning of the summer, checking out books. I was waiting to ask a question of the children's librarian, and in front of me was a mother with her son who looked to be about 10 or 11 years old.

 

Apparently her son was not a great reader. I hear mom explaining to the librarian that his teacher had insisted that her son work on some AR reading program over the summer and it HAD to be AR level 2.4.

 

So the librarian asks the boy what topics he is interested in. Boy says he is interested in Japan, martial arts, and dinosaurs. So librarian, doing her best, pulls up the AR computer thing and starts listing off books of those topics that are in the AR program.

 

Every time the boy points to a book that interests him, he is told by mom "No, that book's AR level is too high." and any time the librarian points out one of the correct AR level, the boy complains that it looks babyish.

 

Of course, all these books ARE babyish to a boy of his age! They are designed for 2nd graders!

 

I eventually couldn't keep my mouth shut, and gently tried to persuade mom and the librarian that if they'd just stop looking at the computer screen and walk two steps to the bookshelves, they could go to the right section and find tons of books on the topics that interested him and just pick some out. My PERSONAL philosophy, and from experience, is that even if they are not the "right" AR level, if they are truly of interest to the reader, the effort will be made to decode the book and reading is practiced and thus improved. TA-DA! It's not rocket science.

 

Mom would hear nothing of it. She bought the AR program hook, line, and sinker. Boy ended up leaving with books that very clearly did not interest him, but he was satisfied that they were not too babyish at least, and they were the right AR level.

 

The whole exchange just made me want to scream!

 

Just reading this story made me want to bash my head against a wall.

[mich311e]

Our first negative with the AR program.

 

My son had library at school yesterday. Usually he brings a book home from the school library. I asked him why he didn't bring anything home. He said "I couldn't find anything I wanted. Well, there was a cool dragon book but she(librarian) said they didn't have a quiz for it so I couldn't check it out."

 

grrrr - :confused: I'll be asking his teacher about that.

[Bang!Zoom!]

I'm waiting with baited breath here as well.

 

Ya..see something like that would get me teleport-speed into the school library, I hope there is a reasonable explanation and secondary path for the library checkout system there.

 

Try to stay open-minded and hope it was a communication error.. or all options were not offered maybe?

 

If it ends up being a stupid thing and rule-based stuff...ah..then you have something to deal with there. Yuck.

[mich311e]

I'm open-minded. I'll save my question for literacy night, coming up in a few weeks. No sense in bugging the teacher on it right now. Just a minor annoyance for my son - I feel like he wants to read something he should be able to. But if it was too young a book for him then I can see that.

[snickelfritz]

Our first negative with the AR program.

 

My son had library at school yesterday. Usually he brings a book home from the school library. I asked him why he didn't bring anything home. He said "I couldn't find anything I wanted. Well, there was a cool dragon book but she(librarian) said they didn't have a quiz for it so I couldn't check it out."

 

grrrr - :confused: I'll be asking his teacher about that.

 

My first thought is that, for the first week, they wanted them to pick an AR book to get everyone started in the AR program? Although, him coming away with no book points away from that. I know my dd picked out a book 2 Fridays ago from the library. This week, they all took tests. I "think" to get a baseline level and show the kids about the tests. I don't know if, every week, they will be limited to AR books from the library. I do know their AR stuff is a goal and not required. On top of library books, they can check out books from the teacher and we are still using the public library. So, dd will have no shortage of reading material.

 

Maybe I'm giving too much credit.:D