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Just started PR and I have questions...


Katie.Louise
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I am so excited to start my Phonics Road 1 with 2 of my daughters. Some background.... the dds that I am using this with are 2nd and 5th grades. So, we are going to accelerate through this. I have read all the PR posts that I can find, but I have some questions.

 

1) When teaching the card marked "ear", why does does it only teach it as the /er/ sound as in early, not the sound /ear/ too? I am new to the WRTR methods, so I am just curious.

 

2) In the video, on some of the cards she says the sentence on them too. Are we supposed to teach them that part as well? For instance, on the "oa" card, she says "O, the two letter coat" Is that what my girls are to memorize? "EE, the double e"?

 

3) Since we are accelerating and once we get to week 5, do we work the words one day and test on them the next, plus work on a new list that same day? Ex.- On Monday, test on list 9 and work on List 10; on Tuesday, test on list 10 and work on list 11. Only do this as long as they are understanding and keeping up?

 

I'm tired and I hope my questions make sense.

Thanks,

Katie

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1) When teaching the card marked "ear", why does does it only teach it as the /er/ sound as in early, not the sound /ear/ too? I am new to the WRTR methods, so I am just curious.

Well, PR isn't Spalding, and so you're not doing WRTR methods (properly, that would be Spalding methods, as the WRTR is the manual for Spalding Method). :001_smile:

 

Ear doesn't sound the same as early, does it? Ear is a phonogram; when it shows up in a word (and right now you'll only teach the sound of ear, not the word that is used as an example) your dc will underline all three letters together, showing that it is saying /er/. In the word "ear," the ea will be underlined together, showing that it is saying the first sound of that phonogram (ea, which has 3 sounds). Clear as mud? (In the word "clear," your dc would mark the ea as one phonogram, showing that ea says its first sound, as opposed to underlining ear, which would change the pronunciation of the word. Try saying "clerly." See?)

 

2) In the video, on some of the cards she says the sentence on them too. Are we supposed to teach them that part as well? For instance, on the "oa" card, she says "O, the two letter coat" Is that what my girls are to memorize? "EE, the double e"?

I haven't seen the PR video, but with Spalding, we say "oa of boat," to differentiate it from "oe of toe." Both oe and oa have the same sounds, each says only one sound, and there's no rule for either one's being used. In such cases we use what we call a "crutch," which is just a clue that helps dc remember.

 

Personally, I don't teach dc to say "ee the double e," because that phonogram also has only one sound, and it's the only phonogram that has that sound for its only sound, if that isn't too confusing. :lol: IOW, every other phonogram that says the long e also makes 1 or 2 other sounds as well (e, ea, ey, ie--all have more than one sound). EE doesn't need a crutch...but if you want to, yes, you would teach your dc to say "EE the double e."

 

3) Since we are accelerating and once we get to week 5, do we work the words one day and test on them the next, plus work on a new list that same day? Ex.- On Monday, test on list 9 and work on List 10; on Tuesday, test on list 10 and work on list 11. Only do this as long as they are understanding and keeping up?

 

A PR expert will have to answer that.:001_smile:

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I have three kids using PR. I accelerated my second dd through PR1 and am accelerating her through PR2.

 

1) When teaching the card marked "ear", why does does it only teach it as the /er/ sound as in early, not the sound /ear/ too? I am new to the WRTR methods, so I am just curious.

Ellie gave a good explanation. Ear says /er/ as in early. Ear uses ea, which says /E/ /e/ /A/. It says /E/ in ear.

 

2) In the video, on some of the cards she says the sentence on them too. Are we supposed to teach them that part as well? For instance, on the "oa" card, she says "O, the two letter coat" Is that what my girls are to memorize? "EE, the double e"?

Yes, "O, the two-letter toe" for oe, etc.

 

3) Since we are accelerating and once we get to week 5, do we work the words one day and test on them the next, plus work on a new list that same day? Ex.- On Monday, test on list 9 and work on List 10; on Tuesday, test on list 10 and work on list 11. Only do this as long as they are understanding and keeping up?

 

There aren't really spelling tests in level 1 (or two?). There are in level 3. You are simply teaching the words on the weekly spelling list. Once you finish the list for week 9, you simply move on to the list for week 10. The words show up in their readers and can be used in their sentence compositions as well. When I accelerated my second dd (8yo), we did about a list per day in level 1. In level 2 we are doing two weeks per calendar week.

 

Level 3 starts with spelling lists and a review of all the words they learned in levels 1 and 2. So, again, don't feel a need to add spelling tests in the first two levels. :)

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Well, PR isn't Spalding, and so you're not doing WRTR methods (properly, that would be Spalding methods, as the WRTR is the manual for Spalding Method). :001_smile:

 

Ear doesn't sound the same as early, does it? Ear is a phonogram; when it shows up in a word (and right now you'll only teach the sound of ear, not the word that is used as an example) your dc will underline all three letters together, showing that it is saying /er/. In the word "ear," the ea will be underlined together, showing that it is saying the first sound of that phonogram (ea, which has 3 sounds). Clear as mud? (In the word "clear," your dc would mark the ea as one phonogram, showing that ea says its first sound, as opposed to underlining ear, which would change the pronunciation of the word. Try saying "clerly." See?)

 

 

I haven't seen the PR video, but with Spalding, we say "oa of boat," to differentiate it from "oe of toe." Both oe and oa have the same sounds, each says only one sound, and there's no rule for either one's being used. In such cases we use what we call a "crutch," which is just a clue that helps dc remember.

 

 

 

This makes complete sense. Thank you Ellie, for taking the time to explain those things. I don't remember much of Kind. or 1st grade, but I don't believe I was taught to read phonetically. I don't know if I was one of those experimental groups that were taught more the sight reading way, or maybe I just didn't pay much attention. :lol:I just don't remember learning the phonograms. I hope phonics road will teach me along with my girls. I used phonics pathways to teach my girls to read and it doesn't really do things this way either. I wish I would have learned the Spalding method when they were younger. Thankfully we can use something like Phonics Road to catch us all up. My 5th grader is not good at sounding out new words and trying to decode them. I really pray that this will help her in that area, plus spelling. Ellie is my youngest dd's name too!

Thanks so much!

 

I have three kids using PR. I accelerated my second dd through PR1 and am accelerating her through PR2.

 

1) When teaching the card marked "ear", why does does it only teach it as the /er/ sound as in early, not the sound /ear/ too? I am new to the WRTR methods, so I am just curious.

 

Ellie gave a good explanation. Ear says /er/ as in early. Ear uses ea, which says /E/ /e/ /A/. It says /E/ in ear.

 

2) In the video, on some of the cards she says the sentence on them too. Are we supposed to teach them that part as well? For instance, on the "oa" card, she says "O, the two letter coat" Is that what my girls are to memorize? "EE, the double e"?

 

Yes, "O, the two-letter toe" for oe, etc.

 

3) Since we are accelerating and once we get to week 5, do we work the words one day and test on them the next, plus work on a new list that same day? Ex.- On Monday, test on list 9 and work on List 10; on Tuesday, test on list 10 and work on list 11. Only do this as long as they are understanding and keeping up?

 

There aren't really spelling tests in level 1 (or two?). There are in level 3. You are simply teaching the words on the weekly spelling list. Once you finish the list for week 9, you simply move on to the list for week 10. The words show up in their readers and can be used in their sentence compositions as well. When I accelerated my second dd (8yo), we did about a list per day in level 1. In level 2 we are doing two weeks per calendar week.

 

Level 3 starts with spelling lists and a review of all the words they learned in levels 1 and 2. So, again, don't feel a need to add spelling tests in the first two levels. :)

 

I was watching week 5 video yesterday (we are still on weeks 1-4), and I thought that she said I would test them on that list the following day. But, I may have completely misunderstood what she meant.

 

Do you mind if I ask you, when you were accelerating did you just drill the sounds with flashcards (and dictation maybe) until they have them all down, then move on to the word lists? They already seem to be remembering the sounds faster than I am. :lol:

Thanks for your help,

Katie

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This makes complete sense. Thank you Ellie, for taking the time to explain those things. I don't remember much of Kind. or 1st grade, but I don't believe I was taught to read phonetically. I don't know if I was one of those experimental groups that were taught more the sight reading way, or maybe I just didn't pay much attention. :lol:I just don't remember learning the phonograms. I hope phonics road will teach me along with my girls. I used phonics pathways to teach my girls to read and it doesn't really do things this way either. I wish I would have learned the Spalding method when they were younger. Thankfully we can use something like Phonics Road to catch us all up. My 5th grader is not good at sounding out new words and trying to decode them. I really pray that this will help her in that area, plus spelling. Ellie is my youngest dd's name too!

Thanks so much!

 

I was watching week 5 video yesterday (we are still on weeks 1-4), and I thought that she said I would test them on that list the following day. But, I may have completely misunderstood what she meant.

 

Do you mind if I ask you, when you were accelerating did you just drill the sounds with flashcards (and dictation maybe) until they have them all down, then move on to the word lists? They already seem to be remembering the sounds faster than I am. :lol:

Thanks for your help,

Katie

 

I still drill the phonics cards with all of them. Once all the cards get mastered, I start over with the deck again. :) They get plenty of dictation practice with the phonograms as we are doing the spelling lists. It has been awhile since I watched the early PR DVDs. I could be the one doing it wrong, but my way is working. :)

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This makes complete sense. Thank you Ellie, for taking the time to explain those things. I don't remember much of Kind. or 1st grade, but I don't believe I was taught to read phonetically. I don't know if I was one of those experimental groups that were taught more the sight reading way, or maybe I just didn't pay much attention. :lol:I just don't remember learning the phonograms. I hope phonics road will teach me along with my girls. I used phonics pathways to teach my girls to read and it doesn't really do things this way either. I wish I would have learned the Spalding method when they were younger. Thankfully we can use something like Phonics Road to catch us all up. My 5th grader is not good at sounding out new words and trying to decode them. I really pray that this will help her in that area, plus spelling. Ellie is my youngest dd's name too!

 

Thanks so much!

Even if you had been taught to read phonetically, it would probably not have been like Spalding (SWR and Phonics Road are relatively new products). :001_smile:

 

I was kind of wondering if you're thinking that PR is the same thing as Spalding? Because it isn't, you know. :001_smile:

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I was watching week 5 video yesterday (we are still on weeks 1-4), and I thought that she said I would test them on that list the following day. But, I may have completely misunderstood what she meant.

 

I'm using PR 1, but not accelerating. I also wondered when we were supposed to test, and when asking around on the board I was told that you test the previous day's words each day. It's not really a test - you just ask them to spell the words from the previous day. Any time they miss a word, you keep going over it, testing it again until they get it right. So on day 1 of week 5 you cover the first words. On day 2 you review those words and then do the new words. On day 3 you review the day 2 words, plus any of the day 1 words they missed on day 2 and then do the new words. On day 4 you review the day 3 words, plus any of the words from days 1 and 2 that they missed, then the new words. And so on and so forth. There are a couple times in the program that you are directed to spend an entire day reviewing all the words you've covered so far. It's working pretty well for us like that. :)

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I'm using PR 1, but not accelerating. I also wondered when we were supposed to test, and when asking around on the board I was told that you test the previous day's words each day. It's not really a test - you just ask them to spell the words from the previous day. Any time they miss a word, you keep going over it, testing it again until they get it right. So on day 1 of week 5 you cover the first words. On day 2 you review those words and then do the new words. On day 3 you review the day 2 words, plus any of the day 1 words they missed on day 2 and then do the new words. On day 4 you review the day 3 words, plus any of the words from days 1 and 2 that they missed, then the new words. And so on and so forth. There are a couple times in the program that you are directed to spend an entire day reviewing all the words you've covered so far. It's working pretty well for us like that. :)

 

Okay, that is what I was thinking I was supposed to do. You do this all through dictation of the words, right?

 

Thank you for your help.

Katie

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We just do spelling test on day 5 each week. I type about 25 words (starting with week 1) into spelling city. Anything he gets wrong is written on a piece of paper and we go over it at that time. The next week, the spelling test list starts with any of the words that were wrong last time and new words from our lists up to max 25 words. Again if anything is wrong, we go over it and it goes on the list. If he gets a word right that was previously wrong, I put a plus next to it. Once there are three pluses in a row, the word goes off the list. :)

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Even if you had been taught to read phonetically, it would probably not have been like Spalding (SWR and Phonics Road are relatively new products). :001_smile:

 

I was kind of wondering if you're thinking that PR is the same thing as Spalding? Because it isn't, you know. :001_smile:

 

 

No, I have read so many threads about PR and can't keep all of these things straight. I don't know anything about the Spalding method either. I have not read WRTR, but recently picked up an old copy of it. It all makes my head spin right now. I don't have time to research extensively the details. I just need something to get my younger children spelling and reading better (as in being able to decode larger words they have never encountered).

 

In the introduction section of my PR it says that Dr. Orton developed remedial teaching methods working with Gillingham and Spalding. He also, "challenged Spalding to apply his method for all normal primary school children." It then says that Spalding went on to write WRTR in 1957 to train classroom teachers in Orton's method. She (B. Beers) says that PR builds upon these methods.

 

I'm just curious why you think I wouldn't have been taught via Spalding method?

Katie

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We just do spelling test on day 5 each week. I type about 25 words (starting with week 1) into spelling city. Anything he gets wrong is written on a piece of paper and we go over it at that time. The next week, the spelling test list starts with any of the words that were wrong last time and new words from our lists up to max 25 words. Again if anything is wrong, we go over it and it goes on the list. If he gets a word right that was previously wrong, I put a plus next to it. Once there are three pluses in a row, the word goes off the list. :)

 

Would you do this if you are accelerating? We do a 4 day/wk, so I wouldn't be able to do all of the words from 4 weeks of words. Or, do you just choose the ones you want to test them on?

Thanks,

Katie

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I'm just curious why you think I wouldn't have been taught via Spalding method?

 

Not to answer for Ellie, but my answer to that is that hardly anyone was taught that way in public school back then and hardly anyone is being taught that way in public school now. Also, Spalding and Spalding spin offs are pretty intense and it's very unlikely you would completely forget a method like this. For one thing, instruction definitely wouldn't have stopped at a first grade level, but would have continued for several years. You probably remember spelling tests in school, right? If you were taught using a Spalding method, all of your spelling tests in grade school would've been based on this method and you'd remember learning the words based on the phonograms and the spelling rules. There's just so much to these methods that it's hard for me to imagine a person completely forgetting ever learning anything like it.

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Not to answer for Ellie, but my answer to that is that hardly anyone was taught that way in public school back then and hardly anyone is being taught that way in public school now. Also, Spalding and Spalding spin offs are pretty intense and it's very unlikely you would completely forget a method like this. For one thing, instruction definitely wouldn't have stopped at a first grade level, but would have continued for several years. You probably remember spelling tests in school, right? If you were taught using a Spalding method, all of your spelling tests in grade school would've been based on this method and you'd remember learning the words based on the phonograms and the spelling rules. There's just so much to these methods that it's hard for me to imagine a person completely forgetting ever learning anything like it.

 

Okay, this makes sense. I don't know.... it is scary how much I can't remember these days. :lol:

Thanks!

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  • 2 weeks later...

Katie,

The explanation given about testing the next day is the format offered in PR. How one accelerates is really a matter of preference. I like to take note of words that were tough to spell out, or ones that use new phonemes. Then, I make sure we practice those the next day, but may not have them enter the words into the notebooks again. Other days, we write them all out. You may even switch to the 'Test" on the last day of the week. Whatever is comfy for you!

 

Who are you accelerating?

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