How do HOD books compare to SL books?

[jer2911mom]

After reading a lot of threads about both programs, I am seeing these general conclusions:

 

1. Sonlight uses more books.

2. HOD wants you to savor the books and not feel rushed through them.

3. HOD holds off on some books to allow for more maturity before reading them.

4. HOD uses a lot of the same books as Sonlight.

5. SL uses Usbourne books.

6. HOD uses CLP books.

7. SL uses historical fiction to create an emotional connection with the reader.

 

So here are my remaining questions:

 

1. Is HOD mostly historical fiction as well, or a blend with something else? I have the catalog, but since I don't know the books, it's hard for me to tell. How would you classify their books compared to SL?

 

2. What books does SL use that HOD doesn't? What will we miss? What types of books are these? Are they possibly eliminated due to maturity of content, sharing of different beliefs, or something else?

 

3. Does SL use more books with a missions/cultural/international focus than HOD?

 

4. In your personal opinion, which program has the "right" amount of books? I hear that some SL users feel rushed to "get through" the books. Does more books translate into more learning/coverage of material? Does SL feel "fuller" and more "complete" than HOD? Or is it just "too much"?

 

5. Which program has more interesting/engaging/intellectually stimulating spines? Or are they both doing this in their own ways?

 

6. HOD seems to tend toward Christian authors where possible. How do you feel this affects worldview? Does SL give a more balanced approach to history and still teach biblical discernment at the same time? Which program do you think will help a child know the Word, be able to discern the truth, be able to speak the truth with conviction, and yet still have a knowledge of other cultures and religions and be able to engage comfortably with those who share differing viewpoints? I guess my concern is with how much HOD is going to share different viewpoints. Since all the guides aren't written yet, it's hard to tell.

 

7. HOD starts off light in LHFHG as far as literature goes. Do you feel SL gives more depth in reading overall? Or does HOD catch up to SL in this as the levels progress?

 

Thanks!

Kathy

[Dinsfamily]

The only question I can address is the right amount of books. We're starting our 3rd year with SL. I do know that some think SL schedules a lot of books but we read through the read alouds much faster than scheduled. It's hard to stop reading when you have dc begging for one more chapter. We're only in Core 1 but as we move up in cores, my dc's attention span will lengthen so I don't anticipate the load getting too heavy for us. From hanging out on the SL boards, I've found that we aren't uncommon. Bible and history have been the right amount for us. Although I often get requests to read more in those subjects too, my answer is usually no because I don't want to rush through the topics and we only have so much time in the day.

 

Now, it hasn't been a problem for us to accelerate the RAs because I just add in other fabulous children's classics when we get too far ahead in the reading schedule. Our current added-in read aloud series is The Chronicles of Narnia. After we're done, we'll start Little house in the Big Woods. There are so many great books to read and so little time :D

 

I just wanted to give you another perspective on the reading load especially since you're looking at the younger cores anyway (right?).

[texasmama]

Haven't used HOD, but I wanted to chime in on the read alouds with SL. Most days (we do the four day a week program) I end up reading aloud about an hour to an hour and a half. This is not a problem for me, and we actually add in other read alouds as we find ones we are interested in. My oldest son often begs for "one more chapter".

 

SL's goal in its history/literature/read aloud choices seems to be to choose well-written and interesting/emotionally compelling selections which all tie in the period of history being studied using historical fiction, biographies, etc. The secondary goal is a Christian worldview. We have only done Cores 1-4 so I can only speak for those Cores. With the exception of Missionary Stories from the Millers (Core 1+2, I believe), which is evangelical (obviously), the program is not based on the Bible or with the primary goal of learning the Word. (We don't use the SL Bible program or language arts so I speak only of the parts of the program we do use.)

 

I hope that helps answer your question, as least from the perspective of SL. SL is a great fit for us at this point and I plan to use it until it is not. (I anticipate using it through 8th grade and then evaluating the high school years as they come and perhaps making a change.)

[birchbark]

I would say you are correct in your conclusions with maybe the exception of #6. The CLP books are only used as spines in Little Hearts and Beyond Little Hearts.

 

Questions:

1. HoD makes an effort to have a variety of genres represented: adventure, biography, historical fiction, mystery, fantasy, non-fiction, folk tale, humor, and poetry. I only did one year of Sonlight, but I would say HoD has a smaller percentage of historical fiction and more variety.

 

2. I think HoD holds off more mature content for older levels than does Sonlight. But I wouldn't say the difference is glaring.

 

3. Yes, at least in the younger levels.

 

4. Another way to ask this is how much of your schoolday do you want spend reading? With Sonlight you spend a lot more time reading and a lot less time writing and doing hands-on. (Actually, no hands-on.) With HoD you spend less time reading and more time writing and doing hands-on.

 

5. HoD did for us.

 

6. To be honest, I think training in discernment will come more from the teacher than the program. Again, in the early levels, HoD may be a little more careful or "conservative" in their choices. It is hard to say at this point where they will end up as opposed to SL as they are still writing the upper guides.

 

7. My opinion is that HoD does "catch up."

 

I've mentioned this before, but since we love both HoD and SL's books, I use SL's titles for library request lists. We have good success finding them in our library system. As hmschooling said on another thread, unless you use SL's LA, it ends up being a pricey reading list. You really won't be missing much at all if you use their books as supplementary or free reading.

 

Now if you dislike writing across the curriculum or doing frequent (tho simple) hands-on and art, and would rather spend your time just reading and reading, then SL will be a better fit. I would not allow the book choices alone to be your determining factor. It is so simple to add them in if you want.

Edited February 14, 2011 by birchbark

[jer2911mom]

The only question I can address is the right amount of books. We're starting our 3rd year with SL. I do know that some think SL schedules a lot of books but we read through the read alouds much faster than scheduled. It's hard to stop reading when you have dc begging for one more chapter. We're only in Core 1 but as we move up in cores, my dc's attention span will lengthen so I don't anticipate the load getting too heavy for us. From hanging out on the SL boards, I've found that we aren't uncommon. Bible and history have been the right amount for us. Although I often get requests to read more in those subjects too, my answer is usually no because I don't want to rush through the topics and we only have so much time in the day.

 

Now, it hasn't been a problem for us to accelerate the RAs because I just add in other fabulous children's classics when we get too far ahead in the reading schedule. Our current added-in read aloud series is The Chronicles of Narnia. After we're done, we'll start Little house in the Big Woods. There are so many great books to read and so little time :D

 

I just wanted to give you another perspective on the reading load especially since you're looking at the younger cores anyway (right?).

 

You are right, I have a Ker and a 3 year old, so I am looking at the younger cores. I'm really glad to hear your experience that it hasn't been too much reading and you are even able to add in The Chronicles of Narnia and the Little House books. We want to do those, too! Thanks so much for your response!

[jer2911mom]

Haven't used HOD, but I wanted to chime in on the read alouds with SL. Most days (we do the four day a week program) I end up reading aloud about an hour to an hour and a half. This is not a problem for me, and we actually add in other read alouds as we find ones we are interested in. My oldest son often begs for "one more chapter".

 

SL's goal in its history/literature/read aloud choices seems to be to choose well-written and interesting/emotionally compelling selections which all tie in the period of history being studied using historical fiction, biographies, etc. The secondary goal is a Christian worldview. We have only done Cores 1-4 so I can only speak for those Cores. With the exception of Missionary Stories from the Millers (Core 1+2, I believe), which is evangelical (obviously), the program is not based on the Bible or with the primary goal of learning the Word. (We don't use the SL Bible program or language arts so I speak only of the parts of the program we do use.)

 

I hope that helps answer your question, as least from the perspective of SL. SL is a great fit for us at this point and I plan to use it until it is not. (I anticipate using it through 8th grade and then evaluating the high school years as they come and perhaps making a change.)

 

Thanks, Carol. It is interesting to hear your perspective on the bible portion. It's hard to find feedback on that.

[jer2911mom]

I would say you are correct in your conclusions with maybe the exception of #6. The CLP books are only used as spines in Little Hearts and Beyond Little Hearts.

 

Questions:

1. HoD makes an effort to have a variety of genres represented: adventure, biography, historical fiction, mystery, fantasy, non-fiction, folk tale, humor, and poetry. I only did one year of Sonlight, but I would say HoD has a smaller percentage of historical fiction and more variety.

 

2. I think HoD holds off more mature content for older levels than does Sonlight. But I wouldn't say the difference is glaring.

 

3. Yes, at least in the younger levels.

 

4. Another way to ask this is how much of your schoolday do you want spend reading? With Sonlight you spend a lot more time reading and a lot less time writing and doing hands-on. (Actually, no hands-on.) With HoD you spend less time reading and more time writing and doing hands-on.

 

5. HoD did for us.

 

6. To be honest, I think training in discernment will come more from the teacher than the program. Again, in the early levels, HoD may be a little more careful or "conservative" in their choices. It is hard to say at this point where they will end up as opposed to SL as they are still writing the upper guides.

 

7. My opinion is that HoD does "catch up."

 

I've mentioned this before, but since we love both HoD and SL's books, I use SL's titles for library request lists. We have good success finding them in our library system. As hmschooling said on another thread, unless you use SL's LA, it ends up being a pricey reading list. You really won't be missing much at all if you use their books as supplementary or free reading.

 

Now if you dislike writing across the curriculum or doing frequent (tho simple) hands-on and art, and would rather spend your time just reading and reading, then SL will be a better fit. I would not allow the book choices alone to be your determining factor. It is so simple to add them in if you want.

 

Thanks, birchbark, for your reply. I think part of the problem is I don't know how much reading we want to be doing. All I know is I wanted to do a lot more reading this year than we did in LHFHG, and I am not wanting to repeat that experience. I gather that it keeps going up as you progress in HOD, so I'm trying to determine how much I want to wait! I understand what you are saying about being able to supplement with SL books. My problem is that I don't know which ones are good ones to pick, and it is taking a lot of work to compare the two programs to see where the overlap is (since HOD uses quite a few SL books), since the topics are so different each year, and since HOD's literature is not tied to history in the emerging readers, DITHOR, and some of the read-alouds. I think if I had already used SL some, it would make it a lot easier to know which SL books I want to pull in.

 

Regarding the hands-on factor, I'm undecided. My daughter does enjoy the hands-on activities we do for the most part, and I can pull my 3-yr old in on most of them, which they enjoy doing together. I'm not sure this hands-on factor needs to continue in this way past another year or two. I'd still have hands-on in science with SL. And I'd plan to do an art program for hands-on there. I don't know how much of LHFHG has actually been hands-on for history. It is usually related to the history topic/theme of the day in some way, but is usually more of an art project or science project in general, or the dramatic play. I feel like I wouldn't know about the hands-on factor until I tried SL and determined if we really felt like we were missing something. For me, it's more important to be reading together more at this age, which is what has really been missing for us this year. I'm finding if it's not scheduled, it's not getting done, and going to the library has been challenging at best. I feel like we would be doing a lot more learning/sparking her interest and enjoyment in learning with more books this year rather than the hands-on activities, which are a creative outlet but not necessarily a learning/intellectually stimulating experience. She doesn't seem to want to pursue any interests this year and we aren't having many engaging discussions after reading the LHFHG books. Something tells me the SL books would have sparked her interests/challenged her more this year.

[ALB]

FWIW, we are also doing LHFHG and we also LOVE reading books. My dc could both sit for much longer periods of time to listen to good books than what LHFHG requires. I'll admit that I also found this frustrating in the beginning, but then realized that I still have lots of free time in our day after our 90 min. of LHFHG for additional reading. We do a version of workboxes, so I just put another chapter book in a workbook each day and we're reading through that at a good pace. I don't focus on discussions afterwards, but we naturally have them. I plan to draw from SL books and other lists to keep this going. I also have a book basket next to our couch where I rotate really great picture books and simple science, geography, art, etc. books. I tell our kids to each pick one or two from the basket several times a day. I'm finding that adding great books is pretty easy if I'm just a little bit intentional.

Looking ahead to Beyond, I think our reading time will increase, but I'm considering using 2 deluxe packages simultaneously (via the library or Amazon gift cards). I think kids do vary in their listening stamina since some have trouble with paying attention to the Burgess books, which has never been an issue here.

[Dinsfamily]

Thanks, birchbark, for your reply. I think part of the problem is I don't know how much reading we want to be doing. All I know is I wanted to do a lot more reading this year than we did in LHFHG, and I am not wanting to repeat that experience. I gather that it keeps going up as you progress in HOD, so I'm trying to determine how much I want to wait! I understand what you are saying about being able to supplement with SL books. My problem is that I don't know which ones are good ones to pick, and it is taking a lot of work to compare the two programs to see where the overlap is (since HOD uses quite a few SL books), since the topics are so different each year, and since HOD's literature is not tied to history in the emerging readers, DITHOR, and some of the read-alouds. I think if I had already used SL some, it would make it a lot easier to know which SL books I want to pull in.

 

Regarding the hands-on factor, I'm undecided. My daughter does enjoy the hands-on activities we do for the most part, and I can pull my 3-yr old in on most of them, which they enjoy doing together. I'm not sure this hands-on factor needs to continue in this way past another year or two. I'd still have hands-on in science with SL. And I'd plan to do an art program for hands-on there. I don't know how much of LHFHG has actually been hands-on for history. It is usually related to the history topic/theme of the day in some way, but is usually more of an art project or science project in general, or the dramatic play. I feel like I wouldn't know about the hands-on factor until I tried SL and determined if we really felt like we were missing something. For me, it's more important to be reading together more at this age, which is what has really been missing for us this year. I'm finding if it's not scheduled, it's not getting done, and going to the library has been challenging at best. I feel like we would be doing a lot more learning/sparking her interest and enjoyment in learning with more books this year rather than the hands-on activities, which are a creative outlet but not necessarily a learning/intellectually stimulating experience. She doesn't seem to want to pursue any interests this year and we aren't having many engaging discussions after reading the LHFHG books. Something tells me the SL books would have sparked her interests/challenged her more this year.

 

I do think it's going to be hard for you to know which is a better fit until you try both. You can try SL and go back to HOD if it doesn't fit. The different S&S of each program won't make a bit of difference with the young ages of your dc. As a bonus, SL has the 18 week guarantee. I tried HOD early on because I like the philosophy of the program but it was not a good fit for me or my dc. It was a good experiment to find out what works for us.

 

We're like you in that we get plenty of hands-on from science, art, map work, and math. Occasionally, there will be a craft in one of the SL history books that will catch our attention and we'll do it but we don't need more. That's definitely an area that varies from family to family. There is a company called Handle on the Arts that sells inexpensive books that provide hands-on projects to coordinate with the early SL cores. I've heard they're great but we wouldn't find the time for them.

[Ellie]

I don't know about that; I only know that if I tried to do HOD with my dc, they would look at me as if I'd lost my mind, and then get up and leave the room.:001_huh:

[abrightmom]

To be honest, I think training in discernment will come more from the teacher than the program. Again, in the early levels, HoD may be a little more careful or "conservative" in their choices. It is hard to say at this point where they will end up as opposed to SL as they are still writing the upper guides.

 

:iagree: . . . whatever curriculum you choose it should fit your goals as closely as possible. But at the end of the day that curriculum is a tool that you use; a platform from which you teach; etc. You are able to teach your children what you want them to learn in the milieu of every day life (worldview, global missions, Bible). It isn't ONLY about the schooling or the curriculum. Discernment can be taught to a degree but it also comes with spiritual growth/maturity after a person is saved!! Our children will come to Christ by God's grace and if/when they do then that is the point from which spiritual/Biblical discernment will begin to grow. Up to then it is knowledge that we are giving them along with the Gospel.

 

Without specifically answering your questions I can make a general statement based upon using some SL and some HOD. We are using HOD and plan to stay with it. There is a lot to love about Sonlight though. I particularly love their missionary story choices. :001_smile: They become wonderful read alouds and library builders. But, as an overall curriculum plan I believe that HOD is the best choice for our family because it is Christ centered and Word saturated, it is balanced, it is flexible (you have some say in what read alouds and DITHOR books you'd like to tackle), it is age/level appropriate, it has a beautiful skill progression, the middle grades are rigorous, fantastic literature and teaching resources. :001_wub: Sonlight chooses neat books but I prefer HOD's choices. I also prefer HOD's skill progression. Sonlight is mainly a booklist. I realize there are some things built in here and there with Sonlight (workbooks in Cores 3&4, research in Core 5 which I've heard very mixed reviews about, Bible reading planned, beautiful music for Scripture memory) but SL's main draw is the lovely booklist. That can be used/folded in as needed or desired. Another issue here has been content. After using Core 1 which my oldest LOVED I decided that I wasn't comfy with giving my kiddos the exposure to some of the topics (i.e. Greek myths - yuck, quite a few naked/nearly naked pictures in the history resources - again, yuck and a lot of Sharpie use). Anyway, I prefer HOD's approach to protecting my kiddos eyes/minds/hearts until they're a bit more mature. I used to think that it wasn't a big deal but it has become very important to us to wait on some of those topics! :001_smile:

 

You can choose HOD or SL and give your child a fantastic, Christ centered, Word saturated life/education. It all boils down to how you are using that tool and how you live all of life both in and outside of school time.

 

I still think I'm going to buy some upper SL Cores for myself to read :D along with some of the HOD guides. I want to study both for myself. I was never educated this way and boy does it look like fun!

[Nojo317]

1. Is HOD mostly historical fiction as well, or a blend with something else? I have the catalog, but since I don't know the books, it's hard for me to tell. How would you classify their books compared to SL?

 

We're using Beyond and the history spines are fictional about real events and people. However, there are pages in the spine that are non-fiction (e.g., a page that explains how a birch bark canoe was made.)

 

2. What books does SL use that HOD doesn't? What will we miss? What types of books are these? Are they possibly eliminated due to maturity of content, sharing of different beliefs, or something else?

 

Here's a news flash - whatever program you use, you're going to miss a great book used by some other program. There are some books I really liked in WP, but overall that program wouldn't work for us. We'll live.

 

It seemed to me that the books were similar in both SL and HOD (reading suggestions, that is) and in some instances even the same. But overall, I think both programs use different books. I'm personally thankful that HOD doesn't rely on Usborne books; I find a lot of evolution ideas in them and for that reason don't think they belong in a Christian curriculum when there are so many other choices available. I appreciate that HOD's author has taken the time to find them.

 

3. Does SL use more books with a missions/cultural/international focus than HOD?

 

HOD doesn't seem to have a missions's focus like, say, MFW. Their focus is a Charlotte Mason approach to studies.

 

4. In your personal opinion, which program has the "right" amount of books? I hear that some SL users feel rushed to "get through" the books. Does more books translate into more learning/coverage of material? Does SL feel "fuller" and more "complete" than HOD? Or is it just "too much"?

 

Me personally, I think HOD has the right amount of books whereas SL seems to have too many. I feel that way because I like the CM philosophy of education; I don't want to rush through books and worry about keeping up with the schedule. I want to slow down and really learn what we're reading, and enjoy it! Others may thrive on devouring books one after the other!

5. Which program has more interesting/engaging/intellectually stimulating spines? Or are they both doing this in their own ways?

 

I think this is a matter of personal preference. I happen to enjoy the spines we're using in HOD, and am looking forward to what's been planned in each of the future programs I hope to use.

 

6. HOD seems to tend toward Christian authors where possible. How do you feel this affects worldview? Does SL give a more balanced approach to history and still teach biblical discernment at the same time? Which program do you think will help a child know the Word, be able to discern the truth, be able to speak the truth with conviction, and yet still have a knowledge of other cultures and religions and be able to engage comfortably with those who share differing viewpoints? I guess my concern is with how much HOD is going to share different viewpoints. Since all the guides aren't written yet, it's hard to tell.

 

I personally want a Christian worldview, so I'm OK with HOD's choices. A Christian worldview doesn't necessarily mean that it doesn't look at other sides, but that it looks through the lens of the Bible. That's perfect for us! I think HOD will help me give my children the foundation they need in their faith/truth so that when the time comes they can intelligently defend what they believe. Also, one of the books HOD will be using in their upcoming guide is from Apologia - the "What we believe" series.

 

7. HOD starts off light in LHFHG as far as literature goes. Do you feel SL gives more depth in reading overall? Or does HOD catch up to SL in this as the levels progress?

 

HOD starts off lighter, but gets increasingly difficult from what I've researched (I'm planning on going the long haul with it.) The reason they start off lighter is that they're trying to 1.) prepare kids for the work ahead slowly and 2.) lead them into increasing amounts of independent work. From beginning to end, a student will cover American history, world history, and geography (the last guide to come out), plus opportunities to add on Shakespeare, US States, etc. It seems like a comprehensive curriculum.

[Tree House Academy]

I don't know about that; I only know that if I tried to do HOD with my dc, they would look at me as if I'd lost my mind, and then get up and leave the room.:001_huh:

 

:confused: Care to elaborate on why?