At a loss for History/Literature

[Hunter's Moon]

About 20 weeks into school, and really, I'm totally lost when it comes to History and Literature.

 

I really, really, really wanted to do Literature with History. Because last year in PS I did U.S. I, I needed to do U.S. II this year. So, I was going to do 20th century American Literature this year, but it just never got done.

 

I didn't have the money to buy a History/Lit. program for 11th grade, and I just figured I could throw it together myself.

 

I stumbled upon Ambleside, and I thought it would be great to use. They went by time period though, so I would have had to use a bit of 19th century (Year 10) and a bit of 20th century (Year 11) and threw a list together from their suggested readings for History and Lit.

 

Once again, it just never got done. I threw together a few lists, but they were never followed.

 

I'm just going nuts trying to figure this out. I've looked through a few U.S. History books, but none seem to fit the bill for what I need.

 

Right now, I am reading Frankenstein. This is seriously the first book I've read for Literature. I read half of The Great Gatsby and half of A Death in the Family.

 

For History, I started Chapter 19 at this site today but idk if it will get continued.

 

I know, it has to do with a lack of self-discipline, but I'm just so frustrated. I really don't want to do U.S. II. I think it is dumb that they split up U.S. History into 2 years in my school. I wouldn't be having this issue if they hadn't split it up. Every curriculum I have found was for U.S. History in 1 year. All the ones split in two years are for middle/elementary ages.

 

I am just at a loss. At this point, Lit. and History don't match, I have no clue how to catch up or where to go from here.

 

I really like Ambleside, but because of U.S. II and Ambleside only have a few things for U.S. II, I can't really use it.

 

I would love to do Year 7 or 8 with Ambleside, but because I need to finish U.S. History, I don't really have that option.

 

I'm just confused, at a loss, frustrated, disappointed and have no clue what to do from here.

 

I hate how the U.S. History is set up that I'm doing now, but I guess I have no other options.

 

I guess this was more of a vent than anything. My mother doesn't know how to help me. Getting mad at her isn't helping anything.

 

Suggestions, advice, anything appreciated.

 

Thanks.

 

ETA: I understand there will be things I don't enjoy, but I just don't learn from textbooks. I retain nothing. That is why I like the living books approach, but I'm just so confused. How am I supposed to fit 100 years of History into a few books, you know? I don't know how to get the most from those books because I was always just taught to learn to take a test. That is no way to learn, and I know that, but really, what other options do I have so late in the game??

Edited February 2, 2011 by BeatleMania

[Greta Lea]

If you don't, then I say skip it and do AO's year 7 and 8.

 

My son wanted to study 20th century history this year, so we are using AO's year 11 *lite*. I'm also reading a LOT of the readings also and am finding the readings enjoyable.

 

Don't follow what your p.s. is doing if you do not have to.

[Hunter's Moon]

If you don't, then I say skip it and do AO's year 7 and 8.

 

My son wanted to study 20th century history this year, so we are using AO's year 11 *lite*. I'm also reading a LOT of the readings also and am finding the readings enjoyable.

 

Don't follow what your p.s. is doing if you do not have to.

 

I know, but how can I just leave U.S. History hanging? I feel like it'll look bad on my transcript to have only done half of U.S. History.

 

ETA: Also, what do you have your son do after a reading? Narration, essay, etc.? I'm just struggling with how to turn A.O. into a History AND Literature credit. I don't know what to do after reading.

[swimmermom3]

Stephanie, remind me again of what your state requirements for graduation are, please. Do you have to have two years of US History? Is that a state requirement or only for your old high or district? How are you tracking your credits for graduation? Are you under a charter school (guessing not) or will your transcript be your own? Your answers to these questions will help us give you better responses. Don't beat yourself up about how things have gone; it is a learning process. Just move forward. We are all here to help.:D

[swimmermom3]

If you don't, then I say skip it and do AO's year 7 and 8.

 

My son wanted to study 20th century history this year, so we are using AO's year 11 *lite*. I'm also reading a LOT of the readings also and am finding the readings enjoyable.

 

Don't follow what your p.s. is doing if you do not have to.

 

I know, but how can I just leave U.S. History hanging? I feel like it'll look bad on my transcript to have only done half of U.S. History.

 

ETA: Also, what do you have your son do after a reading? Narration, essay, etc.? I'm just struggling with how to turn A.O. into a History AND Literature credit. I don't know what to do after reading.

 

I think what Greta is suggesting is that you can combine what you have done so far with studying 20th century world history and label it all under 20th century history. Hopefully, she'll correct me if I am wrong.:D This would make your literature easier to plan and far more enjoyable to read.

[Hunter's Moon]

Stephanie, remind me again of what your state requirements for graduation are, please. Do you have to have two years of US History? Is that a state requirement or only for your old high or district? How are you tracking your credits for graduation? Are you under a charter school (guessing not) or will your transcript be your own? Your answers to these questions will help us give you better responses. Don't beat yourself up about how things have gone; it is a learning process. Just move forward. We are all here to help.:D

 

The required subjects are: Reading, writing, English language and grammar, geography, arithmetic, drawing, music, history and constitution of United

States, duties of citizenship, health (including CPR), physical

education, and good behavior. Mass. Gen. Laws Ch. 71, § 1.

 

These are the laws as outlined on hslda.org

 

The woman donwtown in charge of alternative education knows nothing about homeschooling and what is/is not required. I hadn't planned on doing Health this year, so when I brought down my LOI, she grilled me on why I wasn't including Health into my year, because the local public schools get it done now, why wasn't I? I told her I was going to cover it in Senior Year and she still wasn't happy I wasn't doing it this year, but couldn't do anything about it.

 

I did end up doing Health this year though because last minute I decided to switch Health and Astronomy so I'll do Astronomy most likely my Senior Year.

 

I figured the requirement "History and Constitution of the United States" meant all of U.S. History, not just half. I can't ask the woman downtown because she'll tell me what she thinks, not the actual laws.

 

Duties of citizenship, I assume, is Government and Economics which once again, I really don't want to do, but I guess I have to next year.

 

I did Health all three years in middle school, I've done U.S. History in middle school, and everything else listed in middle school, but because this woman downtown who will be signing the paper stating I did everything required of me can't see I did that stuff, she wants to see it my last two years of high school.

 

I am not under a charter school so the transcript will be my own, but I've read in some places that a letter from the school district is required to really be "graduated."

 

I plan to do 4 years of Math, 4 years of English, 4 years of History, 4 years of Science (3 years of Lab), 3 years of foreign language, 1/2 year of Health, I already have 2 1/2 credits for fine arts from 9th and 10th grade. I am pursuing a career in the medical field, so colleges will really be looking more at my Math/Science courses and not really caring whether I finished U.S. History, but I worry the woman downtown won't sign the paper for me if I don't finish U.S. II. There is nothing I can do to get around her. Even my guidance counselor from High School commented on how uncooperative and incompetent she is.

 

I just feel like self-education should be freeing, and it is in some instances, but I feel restricted by all these requirements.

 

Thanks, I appreciate your questions and support. Any other questions I'll be glad to answer if they'll help.

[Nicole M]

I only have half a second here, but wanted to pop in to say that you, my dear, do not lack self-discipline. Please do not beat yourself up about that. Gracious! You are an inspiration. What you are trying to do, without a guide, is astounding. I have said it before, even Dante had Vergil. You're getting through this by your wits.

 

I hope others will chime in. Off the top of my head, I wonder if Hippocampus would be of any help? I think it's free.

[Hunter's Moon]

I think what Greta is suggesting is that you can combine what you have done so far with studying 20th century world history and label it all under 20th century history. Hopefully, she'll correct me if I am wrong.:D This would make your literature easier to plan and far more enjoyable to read.

 

I had considered this in the beginning of the year, but I feel like it is too late to even start planning this.

 

I don't know what to do while/after reading. I retain a lot of information from reading "living books" but I feel like I need some kind of exam to call it a credit.

 

I suppose I could just do 20th century History into November or December of my Senior Year so I could get in 36 weeks, but I just don't know what would make those courses worth one credit each. I would love to read Charlotte Mason's series, but I feel like I need to plan and do this all now or will be behind forever.

[Hunter's Moon]

I only have half a second here, but wanted to pop in to say that you, my dear, do not lack self-discipline. Please do not beat yourself up about that. Gracious! You are an inspiration. What you are trying to do, without a guide, is astounding. I have said it before, even Dante had Vergil. You're getting through this by your wits.

 

I hope others will chime in. Off the top of my head, I wonder if Hippocampus would be of any help? I think it's free.

 

I truly do appreciate that.

I feel so overwhelmed and sometimes forget what I do accomplish.

Thank you.

[PeterPan]

Stephanie, you're understandably very frustrated! Now can I ask, are there any homeschoolers near you? They are a very generous bunch, and I think someone would be willing to loan you materials.

 

Next, I think the most important thing in your whole post is your comment that you *just don't learn from textbooks*. You have a career aspirations for a master's in OT, so it's time to beat this beast! You're going to have to meet it head-on and figure out what *you* have to do to make upper level learning work for you. Want a story? I went away at 16 to a school for the gifted (woo-woo!), mainly because they had a russian program I wanted to study in. Got there and flopped horribly. Nuts, I flopped at AP chemistry that year too! But that kind of flopping isn't a sign to stop. It's a sign you need to learn new methodology. I kept (stole, paid for, refused to return) the Russian textbook, took it home, and studied that thing, pouring over it, line by line, every night, until I not only learned the russian but learned what *I* needed to do to learn from a textbook. I went back, retook the AP Chem class, and was one of the top students. You *have* to learn how to beat your beast.

 

How to do that? Nan in Mass has had some great posts lately on study skills. It helps if you have something to work with. It doesn't have to be a fancy or dry or boring textbook. There's a 20th Century visual encyclopedia of history that SL uses http://www.amazon.com/Visual-History-Modern-World/dp/1847323359 which might be at your library. You can read a two-page spread each day and work through it. http://www.sonlight.com/300-00.html Here is the list of lit they recommend, which again you might be able to get through your library. Or if someone in your homeschool group can loan you an Abeka or BJU textbook, use that. But take it in LITTLE CHUNKS, a page or two a day, and make notes as you read. Many textbooks are actually meant to be outlined, which people don't realize. My dd feels she doesn't learn well from textbooks either, but she does much better when she outlines the material. Try it. If you don't know how, post what you're trying to outline with a scanned page and people will show you how. It's a skill, and you can learn it, honest.

 

Are you doing anything for writing? If you can get a hold of a textbook, it will have some writing assignments. Janice in NJ recently recommended the Webster's New World Student Writing Handbook, which you might find very helpful. It has every type of writing with THOROUGH, and I do mean THOROUGH explanations of how to make it happen. If nobody is helping you, this is the book you want! Start with Chapter 5-Analogy and start working through the book. Read the chapter on how to write an analogy paper. Now what were you reading about in your history spine that day? Take something from it and use it as the TOPIC for that Chapter 5 writing method. There are 40+ chapters, so you could do 1 a week and have it last you through the rest of next year as well.

 

Don't sweat lit analysis. Just read the books and enjoy them. If you find yourself flustered by them, then what you need to do is read the introduction in the book or use Wikipedia to learn more about the book. Read the Wikipedia article, read the book, then find a MOVIE of the book. It's enough, really and truly. You can learn lit analysis later, but you want to go into college able to read a text to learn and able to write. THOSE are the important things. What you take from the Great Gatsby is not, promise. :)

 

Well hopefully that didn't fluster you even more. I really feel for you. That's not ideal to be in this position. Nevertheless, you can use it for your good by learning how to study. Don't idealize what everyone got from their high school education. Some schools are really poor and some are really great, but very few people here feel like they got the education they WANTED. You're going to be fine.

[PeterPan]

Stephanie, you might want to check the law in your state. Where I worked, in a particular university admissions department, we took the homeschooler's transcript at face value. Unless you are legally required to deal with this woman, or unless your prospective college has specifically stated they want it, I wouldn't fiddle with it. The year of health does not matter, mercy. Colleges don't care if you did health or not. You just need units to satisfy your college's minimums for entrance without deficiency.

 

This woman may be asserting herself because she thinks you need the help, NOT because you are responsible to listen to her, kwim? (Say I who don't know MA law, lol.)

[Hunter's Moon]

Stephanie, you're understandably very frustrated! Now can I ask, are there any homeschoolers near you? They are a very generous bunch, and I think someone would be willing to loan you materials.

 

Next, I think the most important thing in your whole post is your comment that you *just don't learn from textbooks*. You have a career aspirations for a master's in OT, so it's time to beat this beast! You're going to have to meet it head-on and figure out what *you* have to do to make upper level learning work for you. Want a story? I went away at 16 to a school for the gifted (woo-woo!), mainly because they had a russian program I wanted to study in. Got there and flopped horribly. Nuts, I flopped at AP chemistry that year too! But that kind of flopping isn't a sign to stop. It's a sign you need to learn new methodology. I kept (stole, paid for, refused to return) the Russian textbook, took it home, and studied that thing, pouring over it, line by line, every night, until I not only learned the russian but learned what *I* needed to do to learn from a textbook. I went back, retook the AP Chem class, and was one of the top students. You *have* to learn how to beat your beast.

 

How to do that? Nan in Mass has had some great posts lately on study skills. It helps if you have something to work with. It doesn't have to be a fancy or dry or boring textbook. There's a 20th Century visual encyclopedia of history that SL uses http://www.amazon.com/Visual-History-Modern-World/dp/1847323359 which might be at your library. You can read a two-page spread each day and work through it. http://www.sonlight.com/300-00.html Here is the list of lit they recommend, which again you might be able to get through your library. Or if someone in your homeschool group can loan you an Abeka or BJU textbook, use that. But take it in LITTLE CHUNKS, a page or two a day, and make notes as you read. Many textbooks are actually meant to be outlined, which people don't realize. My dd feels she doesn't learn well from textbooks either, but she does much better when she outlines the material. Try it. If you don't know how, post what you're trying to outline with a scanned page and people will show you how. It's a skill, and you can learn it, honest.

 

Are you doing anything for writing? If you can get a hold of a textbook, it will have some writing assignments. Janice in NJ recently recommended the Webster's New World Student Writing Handbook, which you might find very helpful. It has every type of writing with THOROUGH, and I do mean THOROUGH explanations of how to make it happen. If nobody is helping you, this is the book you want! Start with Chapter 5-Analogy and start working through the book. Read the chapter on how to write an analogy paper. Now what were you reading about in your history spine that day? Take something from it and use it as the TOPIC for that Chapter 5 writing method. There are 40+ chapters, so you could do 1 a week and have it last you through the rest of next year as well.

 

Don't sweat lit analysis. Just read the books and enjoy them. If you find yourself flustered by them, then what you need to do is read the introduction in the book or use Wikipedia to learn more about the book. Read the Wikipedia article, read the book, then find a MOVIE of the book. It's enough, really and truly. You can learn lit analysis later, but you want to go into college able to read a text to learn and able to write. THOSE are the important things. What you take from the Great Gatsby is not, promise. :)

 

Well hopefully that didn't fluster you even more. I really feel for you. That's not ideal to be in this position. Nevertheless, you can use it for your good by learning how to study. Don't idealize what everyone got from their high school education. Some schools are really poor and some are really great, but very few people here feel like they got the education they WANTED. You're going to be fine.

 

I appreciate your thoughtful answer.

 

I agree, I need to learn how to read a textbook better. I was never taught to outline, and I have been thinking about it a lot.

 

For writing, I am using an SAT prep book and working on SAT writing prompts. I will look into that book though.

 

We were trying to get involved in a homeschool co-op around here, but it was more for the parents. We were in the process of looking for another when our car broke down so that might not be an option right now.

 

Now that I have the Kindle downloaded on my computer, I can buy a lot of books on Amazon cheaper, so what books I need really aren't the issue anymore, it is more of what I should read.

 

I appreciate your advice and will definitely be looking into the things you mentioned.

 

Thanks.

[Hunter's Moon]

Stephanie, you might want to check the law in your state. Where I worked, in a particular university admissions department, we took the homeschooler's transcript at face value. Unless you are legally required to deal with this woman, or unless your prospective college has specifically stated they want it, I wouldn't fiddle with it. The year of health does not matter, mercy. Colleges don't care if you did health or not. You just need units to satisfy your college's minimums for entrance without deficiency.

 

This woman may be asserting herself because she thinks you need the help, NOT because you are responsible to listen to her, kwim? (Say I who don't know MA law, lol.)

 

Legally, I have to report to her. Massachusetts requires approval to homeschool. (Not that they often deny because it would be on them to state why.)

 

But, I do see what you're saying and have been thinking on it a lot. I don't think my top 3 colleges require the letter, but I do know one is a bit more strict with homeschoolers so maybe the letter would be good for them. That is my #3 college though, so if I don't get into #1 or 2, then I'll be applying to #3 (They all have rolling admissions so I'm applying to 1 and 2 in August and only applying to #3 if I am not accepted to 1 or 2.)

 

ETA: Plus, I took every single MCAS test required in my state since I was in Public School at the time, so maybe my MCAS scores will outweigh the need for the letter.

[PeterPan]

Stephanie-Just so you know, I didn't mean any of that chastisingly. My dd is dyslexic, so I *know* what it means to say a kid doesn't learn well from a textbook. Guess I should have even said that. The outlining helps her. Nan in Mass has boys who also struggle with using traditional books and need to go the extra mile. So there are ways to beat the beast and get through. It's just extra-hard for some people.

 

Oh, and I don't think I would have made heads or tails of half of the recommended high school lit just reading it on my own either. If you look for kiddie versions first, it will help. Like with Shakespeare there are children's book versions. Lots of classic books have movies (Jane Eyre, Wuthering Heights, all the Jane Austens, etc.). I wouldn't hesitate to use those helps. They do in school you know. My senior year we read Jane Eyre and watched the movie. I think there's even a movie of the Scarlett Letter.

[Nicole M]

You know, I don't think that text books are designed to teach. Most of us learn best from teachers or in responding, in writing or with another person, to what we've read. Text books are designed to reinforce what happens in a classroom. They are themselves, often (but not always), a kind of outline of the essential topics covered in a course. I would not get overly concerned about learning to learn from a text book, honestly, but find a way to access whatever content you are seeking through whatever means you can.

[Hunter's Moon]

You know, I don't think that text books are designed to teach. Most of us learn best from teachers or in responding, in writing or with another person, to what we've read. Text books are designed to reinforce what happens in a classroom. They are themselves, often (but not always), a kind of outline of the essential topics covered in a course. I would not get overly concerned about learning to learn from a text book, honestly, but find a way to access whatever content you are seeking through whatever means you can.

 

I do learn best through living books because for me, I can set myself into the book so it is like I am there. In that way, I remember it because I "experienced" it.

When I read a chapter in a book, I can tell you exactly what happened, and I can usually tell you months later about the book, as well.

 

However, I do see the importance in learning to outline a textbook. We were never taught this in school (actually, I think my 7th grade History teacher taught us, but not formally.) We were rarely given enough textbooks per class to take home, so learning to outline wasn't really important. But I do see what you mean, that they are generally an outline of what happens in the course.

 

I plan to use a college level Anat. and Phys. textbook next year, because I really don't like Apologia, so learning to outline before hand will probably be a good idea.

[Nicole M]

I do learn best through living books because for me, I can set myself into the book so it is like I am there. In that way, I remember it because I "experienced" it.

When I read a chapter in a book, I can tell you exactly what happened, and I can usually tell you months later about the book, as well.

 

However, I do see the importance in learning to outline a textbook. We were never taught this in school (actually, I think my 7th grade History teacher taught us, but not formally.) We were rarely given enough textbooks per class to take home, so learning to outline wasn't really important. But I do see what you mean, that they are generally an outline of what happens in the course.

 

I plan to use a college level Anat. and Phys. textbook next year, because I really don't like Apologia, so learning to outline before hand will probably be a good idea.

 

Good thinking! I didn't mean to say that outlining isn't a useful skill, just that for humanities type courses, it will not be a skill that is super-helpful in the long run. (I don't think I ever used a text book in college for a non-science class. Except music theory, maybe.) For the sciences, yes, it's essential, but typically you would be taking notes from another source, like a lecture, either live or on video.

[Susan C.]

Stephanie,

Where are you at in US History? Civil War? Reconstruction? Did you do American Literature to that point as well? Do you have access to a library? And, what is your budget?

 

I have ideas...... my son did US History with books and I can look at my records to remember what he read. Some may be available at the library, but some may not be. My daughter is enjoying her American Lit. book that Janice in NJ recommended. You can learn from the teachers edition with notes in the margins for about $15. This book also has history in it as well as a time line at the beginning of each chapter. This could tie whole books together. You might also see if your library has Joy Hakim's History of US (10 volumes) that you can check out one by one. You would start at where you left off in US History 1, so you would only need to read about 5 of them. They are very interesting, and an easier read.

 

Being a little behind might mean whole books will not let you cover much ground, so the Hakim books might be a good compromise to get you the history information you need. They are not textbook!

 

Also, if there is a college library nearby, see if they have any literature books you could check out. Also, Barnes and Noble (bn.com) rents textbooks now for a reasonable price.

 

Let me know if you want any information about the lit book or a book list. If it is any comfort, we are covering the second half of US History this semester because here you do all of US History in one year. And, we did whole books for my son, all US in one year.

[PeterPan]

Stephanie, textbooks are meant to be read slowly. You have to take the time to do that visualization and connection making yourself. Hakim would be terrific, but again take the time to outline it and make notes as you read. Then at the end of each chapter make a writing assignment for yourself (using that SAT prep book or the Webster Student Writing Handbook, even something fictional or artistic, or whatever you like). That way you're getting into it and reflecting even more, making it your own.

 

Anatomy is going to be a bit different. That's sheer quantity.

 

I had classes in college where the tests were based on the lectures, others based on the textbook, others without a textbook. It just totally varies, depending on the topic and material. You want to have lots of skills in your study toolbox and figure out what *you* have to do to make textbooks, long memorization lists of vocab, etc. work for you. Each thing may require a different technique. You might look for the book "How to Study in College" that was mentioned here lately.

[swimmermom3]

Stephanie, is it okay if I start a thread asking for clarification on the Massachusetts' requirements? The part that you stated in not specific enough. In fact, I did find a couple of Massachusetts high schools without two specific years of U.S.history. So let's get that part clarified, if we can.

 

In the meantime, to make your life easier, you may want to take Susan C. up on her offer. With the combined knowledge of the board, we should be able to put together a basic schedule for you for the rest of the year. Let's get you on a path first and then we can worry about skill development, otherwise it all can feel overwhelming.

 

Susan C., your lit book sounds like a good place to start. Which one is it? I have a sophomore in American Studies right now, so I can pull from his work in looking for essay prompts and materials outside the textbook.

 

Take a deep breath and just let us know where you are at in the history at this moment.

[Stacy in NJ]

look kinda horrible. :001_smile:

 

I'm a lit person and these would not be my selections.

 

Put together a list of more interesting selections, print off study guides or cliff's notes or sparknotes, then just read.

 

I'd suggest choosing titles by major American authors for your time frame. The most important ones are: Mark Twain, Nathaniel Hawthorne, Stephen Crane, John Steinbeck, Ernest Hemingway, and F. Scott Fitzgerald.

 

I'd pick the following titles:

Adventures of Huck Finn

House of the Seven Gables or Scarlet Letter

The Red Badge of Courage

Grapes of Wrath

For Whom the Bell Tolls

Great Gatsby

 

 

Both Huck Finn and Gatsby are consider the must reads for high school.

 

I'd also get a Norton's Anthology for American Poetry. I don't know what your library situation is, all of these can be had a decent one.

 

HTH, Stacy

 

P.S. I could never make it tall the way through Moby Dick (ugggg).

 

ETA: Walt Whitman & Robert Frost (poetry) and Henry David Thoreau (Walden) are also must reads.

 

For history, if you're having a hard time with a textbook or the thought of one, I'd sugget the last 5 volumes of The Story of US by Hakim. These are written for a bit younger kids, but Sonlight uses them for high school. I read some of them along with my ds and learned so much and really enjoyed them as well. Again, you can probably get them at your library. Look for volume 5-10.

Edited February 2, 2011 by Stacy in NJ

[Hunter's Moon]

Thanks, everyone! I still have some shoveling to do so I have to be kind of quick.

 

I'm on World War I as of now.

 

I can spend, probably, about $40 or so. We do have a library nearby, but no car, and in the winter the walk can be hard so I'm not against buying a few books.

 

Swimmermom3, I would love if you could start a thread on the Mass. requirements. That would be very nice. I'd start my own but I'm not entirely sure what to ask, any ideas?

 

Susan C., no, I did not do American Lit. up to that point. Last year while covering U.S. 1 in school we did Greek literature and Shakespeare. Also, I would love if you could give me some info. on the lit. book and even the book list. I could probably buy most books on any lit. list from abebooks or amazon so that way I can write in it, keep it longer than the library, etc.

 

Thank you everyone, I really appreciate all your help.

 

I was thinking of using Ambleside Year 11 and doing 20th century and maybe throwing in a few extra American Lit. books, but I've already read 4 of the books on the list. I wouldn't mind reading To Kill a Mockingbird or Fahrenheit 451 again, but I read them both in school where we did annotating as well.

 

I'm open to any American Literature lists you all might have.

 

I really appreciate all the help, thank you all.

[Hunter's Moon]

For history, if you're having a hard time with a textbook or the thought of one, I'd sugget the last 5 volumes of The Story of US by Hakim. These are written for a bit younger kids, but Sonlight uses them for high school. I read some of them along with my ds and learned so much and really enjoyed them as well. Again, you can probably get them at your library. Look for volume 5-10.

 

Is it called The Story of US or a History of US? Amazon only have a History of Us by Joy Hakim.

[Susan C.]

Is it called The Story of US or a History of US? Amazon only have a History of Us by Joy Hakim.

 

History of US by Hakim is correct, and for WW1 on, you only need books 8, 9, & 10.

 

My lit book's ISBN is (for the teachers, which is just like the students with notes in the margin that will be very helpful for self teaching):

 

United States in Literature, Scott Foresman, ISBN 0-673-29391-2

 

I got it from half.com.

 

I have to go out, and will give you our book list a little later!

[PeterPan]

Stephanie, you said in one of the threads that you now have Kindle for your computer. There is a library system someone mentioned somewhere that anyone can join (via web) for just a pittance, like $10 a year, that would allow you access to tons more books as e-books. You need to see what you can find that way. In our state any library in the state has to give residents library cards. So for instance if a big city near you (state capital?) has a super library system, get a card from them and access their ebooks. Just trying to stretch your dollar here.

 

Hakim you might be able to borrow from someone. It's in thin volumes, so you could borrow one, read for two weeks, then borrow the next.

[mcconnellboys]

And if you're looking at WWI forward, why not read some living books by Albert Marrin, who writes terrific books for the modern US time period (centered mostly around the wars)?

 

Some of his works include:

 

The Great Adventure (Theodore Roosevelt)

Stalin

Hitler

Overlord: D-Day

The Elephant and the Tiger (America in Vietnam)

Mao Tse-Tung and His China

The Secret Armies (WWII)

The Airman's War (WWII)

Victory in the Pacific (WWII)

Years of Dust (The Dust Bowl)

 

And there are more, I think.... Many libraries carry Marrin's books....

 

For lit to go along, how about things such as:

 

WWI - watching All Quiet on the Western Front; reading Hemingway's A Farewell to Arms; read McCrae's poem "In Flanders' Field" and read about the background of it; watch the old movie about Sergeant York (by that name)....

 

WWII - read or watch or listen to Anne Frank's Hiding Place, if you don't already know this story and/or choose other books from this time period you might not be so familiar with:

 

Flags of Our Fathers

Letters from Iwo Jima

The House of Sixty Fathers

I Never Saw Another Butterfly

In Kindling Flame

My Friend, the Enemy

Number the Stars

and there are others....

 

For Vietnam, read:

 

Water Buffalo Days and/or The Land I Lost

 

Read modern literature/ short stories:

 

Sherlock Holmes

Edgar Allen Poe

Agatha Christie

Isaac Asimov's science fiction stories

 

Read modern poetry:

 

Cummings, Frost, Sandburg, Yeats, Langston Hughes, etc.:

 

http://www.literaryhistory.com/20thC/20CAmericanandBritish.htm

[Susan C.]

OK, here's what I would do. If I put what my son did, there will be a whole year and there will be too many books. I will separate history and literature. For history, at a minimum, I would read Hakim's Books 8, 9, and 10. For whole books pick a few from this list if you have time, it would probably be too much to read all of them, all of what is in these books is covered briefly in Hakim's books:

 

Up From Slavery, Booker T. Washington

The Jungle, Upton Sinclair

Stalin, Albert Marrin

Hitler, Albert Marrin

 

You could watch these movies:

Hiding Place

Sound of Music

Anne Frank (the Masterpiece Theater one)

 

For literature, I would pick and choose from the lit. book in my post above at minimum. This book is large, but a good portion of it is modern. So, it wouldn't be too much to do the traditional authors up to early 1900s. I would pick one whole book to add to this. Here are some to pick from, there are many others:

 

To Kill A Mockingbird, Harper Lee

My Antonia, Willa Cather

 

My dd read Scarlet Letter last semester, we will probably read My Antonia this semester. The rest of her lit will be the textbook. A lot of American Lit. is learning about how the authors wrote about what was going on historically at the time. There is also a lot in this text about interpreting the selections and we are learning a lot from this. For American Lit. I prefer to cover more pieces in a text, rather than a few whole books. Also, for us, it is easier to plug away at a text. Three to ten pages a day will get you quite far and you will learn a lot.

 

History and literature are not subjects that we are devoting a large amount of time to. Chemistry is taking up a good bit of time, Spanish is too. So that is why I simplified the history and lit.

 

I hope this helps. Don't feel like you have to read a ton of books and write an insane amount of papers. Just read through and enjoy it!

[3andme]

I think you've gotten some good suggestions on the literature side, for history you might want to look at Paradigm Accelerated (PAC) American History. They have a two year program that is designed for independent study. You could start with the 3rd and 4th volumes. They are designed to be more engaging and less dense than the typical textbook. They have an accompanying activities book with worksheets and quizzes. Since your budget is limited you could buy one volume at a time. Here's a review from Rainbow Resource and a discussion on another forum. They apparently are reformatting the books but you can still buy Vol 3 and Vol 4 at pacworks.com or cbd.com.

[LBS]

a senior directing my own studies, which is so admirable!!!, I would get two books: Don't Know Much About History: Everything You Need to Know About American History but Never Learned by Kenneth Davis and a good anthology style textbook that has done the selecting for you, and put it all into one volume. Something like this one. I have the newer edition, both cost about $4.50 on Amazon, but I linked to this one, so you could see the contents. I spend wayyyyyyyyyyyy too much time selecting and mulling over exactly what to read with history.

 

Another thought: get something that has a nice website and tests/exams like A Patriot's History. There are used copies for $7ppd on Amazon. Here's the website. Line up your lit and maybe some documentary stuff off the Internet, using the syllabus....you can do this! Dive in where you feel like it.

 

I did better when I could look around a bit, not face one book, gotta read it, right now, or else. I like plain/simple textbooks. It feels organized to me. Not sure why, but there you are.

 

I certainly hope this might help, and others have given you very expert advice. Have fun with your learning.

 

LBS

[Hunter's Moon]

Thank you, everyone!

 

I'll be kept very busy this weekend doing lots of research on this stuff and picking through it all.

 

I appreciate it :)

[Greta Lea]

My son mostly reads, then orally narrates to me. He doesn't just retell (simple narration), but puts his thoughts, opinions and even questions that he'd like answered (that I often can't answer...he'll search for the answer himself) in his oral narration.

 

I wish my son would blog about what he's studying. Since you already have a blog, I think this would be a wonderful tool for you to use. Also, it would great for other folks to see what "self-education" looks like on a regular basis from reading your blog entries about what you are reading and learning.

 

Also, I agree with the other poster who said that the gal "downtown" that is giving you all the advice (about a health credit and such) thinks you NEED her help and advice. The only thing she knows is p.s., so that's the advice you are gonna get from her.

 

You've got it together, really you do.

 

Also, about studying American history or 20th century history...if that's not what you want to study right now, just put it on the back burner and study it next year.

[Nan in Mass]

A no-money, no planning way to cover lit and history:

 

I'm in a hurry, so forgive me if this sounds rather abrupt. I'll get back to this later, but it will probably be a few days.

 

I live in Massachusetts. You need to get your plan approved by this lady every year? You submitted a plan saying you were going to do US History 2 this year, right? And you gave her the name of a textbook? What are you doing for a "mutually agreed upon form of assessment"?

 

The trouble with plans is that in the pursuit of the perfect plan, the one that covers everything and is best for you, you can get bogged down and not get anywhere.

 

I think you have two choices - either complete your plan, albeit sketchily, or make a new plan. How much of the textbook have you managed to get through so far? If you are more than halfway through your textbook, I would finish it. I just wouldn't finish it the way you have been doing it so far. Use it as a spine. Think of it as a plan. Look at each chapter (look at - don't read straight through). Read all the section headings and picture captions. Look at every paragraph and read any bits that sound interesting. Try to figure out, without straight reading it, what it covers and what it expects you to learn from it. Say it turns out to be about the depression. If your book has questions at the end of the chapter, look at them. Can you answer any of them from your quick look? Would it be too hard to go back and try to find the answers? If not, go back and find the answers and write them down. Voila - you are done with the chapter. Just answer one set of questions per chapter. Don't try to do all the sets. If your book doesn't have questions, then it is even easier. Now that you have figured out what the chapter is about (roughly), go to the library and get out some books about it. Don't plan this ahead of time. Do it on the spot. Even better would be to take your textbook with you, figure out what the next three chapters cover, and then look for books. Look for books that have lots of pictures, like the Time Life series books. Don't try to get books on every aspect of every item in every chapter. The idea is to find one or two books about some aspect of the chapter that you found interesting. This being US history, your library is bound to have something for almost everything. Then pick a few aspects that you don't find as interesting but that your textbook seems to emphasize and look them up in the encyclopaedia. Pick something and write a short paper (one page or so - think 5 para paper), so you will have some written work to show. Do that for every chapter. It wouldn't cost anything and it requires NO planning. Meanwhile, do the literature that appeals to you most with Ambleside. Forget about matching them up. If I were you, I would finish the history first, as fast as I could, and then I would relax and concentrate on the literature the rest of the year. Again, I wouldn't pre-plan it. I would pick a book, look up the author in an encyclopaedia (or wiki) and read about him or her, then read about the book itself on wiki or in an encyclopaedia at the library, just so you have some idea of why it is considered important. I would write half a page (a list) of what was going on in the world at the book was written (not took place), using a timeline from the library. Then I would read the book. Then I would do a paper or a project about the book. Do you know how to write a literary paper? If not, I can give you some simple directions that might help. Then pick a new book and read it. If it is something that you are having trouble making yourself read because it seems rather dry, try getting the tapes or cd's from the library and listening to the first few, until you are "into" the book. Or listen all the way through. Knit or something while you listen.

 

Will you have gaps doing it this way? Yes. But you will get it done. And you will learn. And you will get to do the things that you think are most interesting, and because they are interesting to you, you will learn from them and remember them. How do you know you have done enough to count it as a credit? Sit down and do the right number of hours. Aim to cover a minimum of 8 books a year for literature. Make a few of them plays or very short novels or collections of poetry or short stories, and only a few of them really fat books. You have finished US history when you have done something for each chapter of your history book, even if it wasn't what the book laid out to be done. If you feel this isn't enough, and you really want to learn how to learn out of a textbook, I have just gathered for my own use some information on taking notes, reading textbooks, and making outlines, and I will pass it along to you, if you wish. But I think at this point, you should use that textbook a different way and hurry along through it and then move on to the lit, which you seem to like better.

 

Just an idea...

 

-Nan

[Hunter's Moon]

A no-money, no planning way to cover lit and history:

 

I'm in a hurry, so forgive me if this sounds rather abrupt. I'll get back to this later, but it will probably be a few days.

 

I live in Massachusetts. You need to get your plan approved by this lady every year? You submitted a plan saying you were going to do US History 2 this year, right? And you gave her the name of a textbook? What are you doing for a "mutually agreed upon form of assessment"?

 

The trouble with plans is that in the pursuit of the perfect plan, the one that covers everything and is best for you, you can get bogged down and not get anywhere.

 

I think you have two choices - either complete your plan, albeit sketchily, or make a new plan. How much of the textbook have you managed to get through so far? If you are more than halfway through your textbook, I would finish it. I just wouldn't finish it the way you have been doing it so far. Use it as a spine. Think of it as a plan. Look at each chapter (look at - don't read straight through). Read all the section headings and picture captions. Look at every paragraph and read any bits that sound interesting. Try to figure out, without straight reading it, what it covers and what it expects you to learn from it. Say it turns out to be about the depression. If your book has questions at the end of the chapter, look at them. Can you answer any of them from your quick look? Would it be too hard to go back and try to find the answers? If not, go back and find the answers and write them down. Voila - you are done with the chapter. Just answer one set of questions per chapter. Don't try to do all the sets. If your book doesn't have questions, then it is even easier. Now that you have figured out what the chapter is about (roughly), go to the library and get out some books about it. Don't plan this ahead of time. Do it on the spot. Even better would be to take your textbook with you, figure out what the next three chapters cover, and then look for books. Look for books that have lots of pictures, like the Time Life series books. Don't try to get books on every aspect of every item in every chapter. The idea is to find one or two books about some aspect of the chapter that you found interesting. This being US history, your library is bound to have something for almost everything. Then pick a few aspects that you don't find as interesting but that your textbook seems to emphasize and look them up in the encyclopaedia. Pick something and write a short paper (one page or so - think 5 para paper), so you will have some written work to show. Do that for every chapter. It wouldn't cost anything and it requires NO planning. Meanwhile, do the literature that appeals to you most with Ambleside. Forget about matching them up. If I were you, I would finish the history first, as fast as I could, and then I would relax and concentrate on the literature the rest of the year. Again, I wouldn't pre-plan it. I would pick a book, look up the author in an encyclopaedia (or wiki) and read about him or her, then read about the book itself on wiki or in an encyclopaedia at the library, just so you have some idea of why it is considered important. I would write half a page (a list) of what was going on in the world at the book was written (not took place), using a timeline from the library. Then I would read the book. Then I would do a paper or a project about the book. Do you know how to write a literary paper? If not, I can give you some simple directions that might help. Then pick a new book and read it. If it is something that you are having trouble making yourself read because it seems rather dry, try getting the tapes or cd's from the library and listening to the first few, until you are "into" the book. Or listen all the way through. Knit or something while you listen.

 

Will you have gaps doing it this way? Yes. But you will get it done. And you will learn. And you will get to do the things that you think are most interesting, and because they are interesting to you, you will learn from them and remember them. How do you know you have done enough to count it as a credit? Sit down and do the right number of hours. Aim to cover a minimum of 8 books a year for literature. Make a few of them plays or very short novels or collections of poetry or short stories, and only a few of them really fat books. You have finished US history when you have done something for each chapter of your history book, even if it wasn't what the book laid out to be done. If you feel this isn't enough, and you really want to learn how to learn out of a textbook, I have just gathered for my own use some information on taking notes, reading textbooks, and making outlines, and I will pass it along to you, if you wish. But I think at this point, you should use that textbook a different way and hurry along through it and then move on to the lit, which you seem to like better.

 

Just an idea...

 

-Nan

 

I had planned to use Bridgeway Academy, so that was what the plan stated. I didn't state a specific textbook, I just said in the resources list whatever Bridgeway Academy provided me. She said that was fine and approved it. All I have to do is give her an end of year progress report when I go to hand in the LOI for next year.

 

I was using different textbooks for the different time periods, so not one specific book. I do have a few History texts available, but none that have "everything." One isn't really a textbook, more of a brief overview. The other is a PS textbook, and it is hard to use without a teacher because it seems there are bits and pieces missing where the teacher would fill me in. I have a bunch of encyclopedias (missing a few letters in one set) but I do have W so I've been reading about World War I and Woodrow Wilson out of there.

 

I wanted a 100% laid out plan, and I understand that now that might be too late, but I'm just not a "by the seat of my pants" type of person, but I think I'll have to adjust and be that way until next year.

 

Thank you for the advice, I never thought of this perspective.

 

I'll be doing a lot of thinking this weekend.

 

Thanks!

[Nan in Mass]

If I were you, I would use ONE of your two textbooks, whichever you prefer, as a spine and not worry about covering it all. Yes, a good teacher would fill in a lot. They would also skip a lot. No program will cover everything. Just use an outline and fill in the bits that you are most interested in. People spend their whole lives studying one particular aspect of US history. There is no way you can cover it all in two years. At this point, aim to be done with the class in a brief and painless way and then promise yourself that when you are done with school, you will read lots of US history to fill in some of the gaps. I know many adults who read history for fun. It is actually one of the easiest things to self-study as an adult. If you are interested (and it sounds like you are) then think of this course as just giving you a brief outline that you will spend the rest of your life filling in. Honestly, this is an approach that many, many classes take. It just isn't that obvious as a public school student. The teachers present the material as though they were covering all there was to cover. So do the textbooks. I think a lot of what is confusing you is that now that you are educating yourself, you can see for yourself that the textbooks and the teachers are falling very short of covering everything. They can't, and neither can you. You have to pick and choose. It isn't so bad to leave yourself curious about some things, to leave some things to learn when you are 70 years old and retired.

-nan

[Hunter's Moon]

If I were you, I would use ONE of your two textbooks, whichever you prefer, as a spine and not worry about covering it all. Yes, a good teacher would fill in a lot. They would also skip a lot. No program will cover everything. Just use an outline and fill in the bits that you are most interested in. People spend their whole lives studying one particular aspect of US history. There is no way you can cover it all in two years. At this point, aim to be done with the class in a brief and painless way and then promise yourself that when you are done with school, you will read lots of US history to fill in some of the gaps. I know many adults who read history for fun. It is actually one of the easiest things to self-study as an adult. If you are interested (and it sounds like you are) then think of this course as just giving you a brief outline that you will spend the rest of your life filling in. Honestly, this is an approach that many, many classes take. It just isn't that obvious as a public school student. The teachers present the material as though they were covering all there was to cover. So do the textbooks. I think a lot of what is confusing you is that now that you are educating yourself, you can see for yourself that the textbooks and the teachers are falling very short of covering everything. They can't, and neither can you. You have to pick and choose. It isn't so bad to leave yourself curious about some things, to leave some things to learn when you are 70 years old and retired.

-nan

 

That is exactly how I feel and thank you for reassuring me that its okay not to cover everything.

[Nan in Mass]

It took me YEARS of homeschooling to figure that out, despite many people saying it over and over again, including TWTM. Sigh. It is no surprise that you are feeling confused. I suspect that lots of other people will pop up tomorrow and say the same thing. Remember that the author of this spine-and-fill-in-just-a-little method is a professor at a good university (SWB) and try to be reassured.

Hugs

Nan

[swimmermom3]

Nan, you are more awesome than you realize.:D

[Susan C.]

Yes, Nan, you are wonderful. I just read your "how to study a textbook" to my 11th grade daughter, and she begged me to save it somewhere so she could refer to it. She said it is the BEST thing she has heard for studying!

[Brenda in MA]

It took me YEARS of homeschooling to figure that out, despite many people saying it over and over again, including TWTM. Sigh. It is no surprise that you are feeling confused. I suspect that lots of other people will pop up tomorrow and say the same thing. Remember that the author of this spine-and-fill-in-just-a-little method is a professor at a good university (SWB) and try to be reassured.

Hugs

Nan

 

:iagree: It also took me years of homeschooling to feel comfortable tweaking courses to the point Nan describes. Once you reach that point, it is pretty liberating. I would be much more hesitant about skimming a spine and filling in when you're learning math and science, but with history and literature, if you like to learn (which from all accounts you do), you will be filling in those areas the rest of your life.

 

Best wishes,

Brenda

[Nan in Mass]

I would not do that for math, either, but a relative is a math teacher. She helped me with planning precalc at the beginning of the fall and she didn't even want to open the textbook without some sort of list of what my son was really going to need to know, so she could tell me which chapters to cover! (Blitzer precalc is laid out in chapters with sections - problems at the end of every section and a review of the chapter at the end.) Every one of her AP students passed AP calc, so I guess she knows what she is doing. Once she had picked out which chapters to cover, she said he should do all the odds, not pick and choose, and do all the review problems. She suggested doing the review problems first, as a pretest, and if he got them right, then skipping that chapter. I had to find her a syllabus for the CC precalc (taking CC calc next) before she'd even talk to me. It turned out that the CC covered the first 2/3 or 3/4 of the textbook and only got to the end bits if there was time. I could have done it myself, it turns out, but I was much to afraid. Math is an entirely different animal. In fact, math is not an animal at all - it is a plant. It is a subject that is almost entirely skill. There is content, but we seldom have time to get to it. The skill involved in "doing" history is really critical thinking, close reading, research, interviewing, and writing, almost none of which are taught in the history spine itself. When you use a history book as a spine, it gives you more opportunity to practise the skills involved in history. Tigersgrowl, please do your math book thoroughily, or I will worry myself sick about you and feel guilty forever. I suspect that you can get away with not quite getting to the last chapter or two, but it definately isn't the sort of thing where you can just do the bits that interest you. It would be like skipping the verbs in a foreign language because they didn't interest you. Think about your subjects and if they are content subjects, then you can use the spine method, but if they are skill subjects (math, foreign languages, music theory, drawing, computer programming, etc.), you probably want to investigate before you start using the spine method.

-Nan

Edited February 4, 2011 by Nan in Mass

[Nan in Mass]

I am very happy it is helping someone. It was hard-won knowledge.

[Hunter's Moon]

Nan, you are more awesome than you realize.:D

 

:iagree::iagree::iagree:

[Hunter's Moon]

I would not do that for math, either, but a relative is a math teacher. She helped me with planning precalc at the beginning of the fall and she didn't even want to open the textbook without some sort of list of what my son was really going to need to know, so she could tell me which chapters to cover! (Blitzer precalc is laid out in chapters with sections - problems at the end of every section and a review of the chapter at the end.) Every one of her AP students passed AP calc, so I guess she knows what she is doing. Once she had picked out which chapters to cover, she said he should do all the odds, not pick and choose, and do all the review problems. She suggested doing the review problems first, as a pretest, and if he got them right, then skipping that chapter. I had to find her a syllabus for the CC precalc (taking CC calc next) before she'd even talk to me. It turned out that the CC covered the first 2/3 or 3/4 of the textbook and only got to the end bits if there was time. I could have done it myself, it turns out, but I was much to afraid. Math is an entirely different animal. In fact, math is not an animal at all - it is a plant. It is a subject that is almost entirely skill. There is content, but we seldom have time to get to it. The skill involved in "doing" history is really critical thinking, close reading, research, interviewing, and writing, almost none of which are taught in the history spine itself. When you use a history book as a spine, it gives you more opportunity to practise the skills involved in history. Tigersgrowl, please do your math book thoroughily, or I will worry myself sick about you and feel guilty forever. I suspect that you can get away with not quite getting to the last chapter or two, but it definately isn't the sort of thing where you can just do the bits that interest you. It would be like skipping the verbs in a foreign language because they didn't interest you. Think about your subjects and if they are content subjects, then you can use the spine method, but if they are skill subjects (math, foreign languages, music theory, drawing, computer programming, etc.), you probably want to investigate before you start using the spine method.

-Nan

 

Definitely! Most of my time is spent on my PreCalc and Chem. I'm adding in more time for Italian as well.

[Nan in Mass]

Phew! That is as it ought to be. Make sure you spend a large portion of your time building skills and you will be all set. : )