Need advise re AskDrCallahan College Algebra with Trig..

[Alyce]

I'm looking for an Alg 2 program for my ds. I do not like TT, we're using that now and just don't like it. I have Lial's but I was also looking at AskDrCallahan.

Has anyone used it? Can you tell me what you liked about, what you didn't like about it? How does it compare with Lial's.

[Jann in TX]

College Algebra is a step above Algebra 2.

It can also be called Algebra 3.

[gardenschooler]

I'm curious if anyone has opinions on this. They list this course as Alg II/Trig, and this is the description and text. After this, it goes straight to Calculus.

 

Has anyone ever used this? Opinions on the text/course sequencing?

 

I've considered getting the Dr. Callahan dvds to go w/Jacob's Geometry next year, and I might consider using this for Alg II.

 

We're doing Lial's Algebra this year, and I might do that for Alg II after geometry, but I'd really like to know about this program. I'm getting tired of teaching math, and I also need something for calculus down the road.

[Bev in B'ville]

We started off with Jacob's at the beginning of our school year. Dd, who normally loves math and does well, *hated* the videos. Dr. Callahan stands in front of the board with the problems that he's trying to explain, obscuring the view. My dd actually started hating math and got teary eyed everytime she did Geometry, frustrated that she wasn't getting it.

 

We switched to TT Geometry, which we found to be quite nice. It had lots of proofs (dd was doing proofs on every test, some of them quite long). As the proof is in the pudding, so to speak, dd took the ACT for practice this year (she's only 14 yo). She scored in the 90th percentile for math (27). This was before she finished TT Geometry and had not gotten to the trigonometry part of Saxon yet, so I expect next year her score should increase some. (I'm having her take tests early because she has test anxiety and I'm hoping the more she tests, the more she'll get used to being tested.)

 

Dd also did Saxon Alg. 2 concurrently so next year (i.e. beginning July 1st) we're moving on to Larson's Precalculus. My son will be using Lial's Intermediate Algebra (Alg. 2) next year concurrently with TT Geometry. Two different children, two different methods. Oh well.

 

Watch the lecture demos online and have your child watch them as well. I should have done that sooner.

 

HTH,

Bev

[langfam]

I'm with Bev on this one. The standing in front of the board was a real issue for us. You can email him and ask for a sample DVD, so you can decide for yourself.

HTHs

[Jann in TX]

A few (older) Algebra 2 texts offer Trigonometry. Often this Trig is not quite as meaty as what is found in a PreCalculus course.

 

College Algebra is an extension of Algebra 2. It is not a full year class--it is a one-semester course like Trigonometry. If you put the two together you get what is now called 'PreCalculus'.

 

There are a few older Algebra 2 programs that contained enough material so that College Algebra was unnecessary (but not to ALL students).

 

Younger students (high school) have a better chance at understanding Calculus if they have completed a PreCalculus course.

 

Back in the 'dark ages' Analytical Geometry was a required course that was taken either before or concurrent to Calculus 1. This course has been 'assimilated' into other courses--most current Algebra and Geometry programs have much more 'coordinate Geometry' than they used to...

[gardenschooler]

We started off with Jacob's at the beginning of our school year. Dd' date=' who normally loves math and does well, *hated* the videos. Dr. Callahan stands in front of the board with the problems that he's trying to explain, obscuring the view. My dd actually started hating math and got teary eyed everytime she did Geometry, frustrated that she wasn't getting it.[/quote']

 

EEEK! I cannot afford to have this happen. We've had success with math so far, and I want to keep it that way.

 

 

We switched to TT Geometry, which we found to be quite nice. It had lots of proofs (dd was doing proofs on every test, some of them quite long). As the proof is in the pudding, so to speak, dd took the ACT for practice this year (she's only 14 yo). She scored in the 90th percentile for math (27). This was before she finished TT Geometry and had not gotten to the trigonometry part of Saxon yet, so I expect next year her score should increase some. (I'm having her take tests early because she has test anxiety and I'm hoping the more she tests, the more she'll get used to being tested.)

 

Is it my imagination, or do I recall on this board even people who call TT's algebra sequencing into question to say that TT's Geometry is 'complete' as far as all the topics?

 

 

Thank you for answering, Bev. I thought I remembered that there was a problem with the dvds. I really don't have money to waste on something that isn't going to be good, and I hate to have to start over late in the school year.

 

I want to use Jacob's, because I thought it was challenging and all that....but honestly, I don't have any confidence in my ability to teach it. And I'm not all that revved up to try, anymore. I want to put my energy into history and literature for high school, and just follow along w/dd for math, using some kind of program that will help me a lot. In other words, I don't want to sit there and try to figure out how to present and explain the math anymore, but I'm happy to watch dvds with her and try to keep up with it.

 

And now, in the other thread, I'm reading about the lack of proofs...can someone just tell me what is really WRONG with TT Geometry? Would it be the end of the world if we used it? Should we add something to it? We could always go back to Lial's for Alg II, so we wouldn't have any confusion on what's what in our Algebra sequence, *if* the dvts would give us what we needed. But that's another year - right now I just really need to get geometry figured out!!

 

 

Jann? Anyone?

[gardenschooler]

A few (older) Algebra 2 texts offer Trigonometry. Often this Trig is not quite as meaty as what is found in a PreCalculus course.

 

College Algebra is an extension of Algebra 2. It is not a full year class--it is a one-semester course like Trigonometry. If you put the two together you get what is now called 'PreCalculus'.

 

There are a few older Algebra 2 programs that contained enough material so that College Algebra was unnecessary (but not to ALL students).

 

Younger students (high school) have a better chance at understanding Calculus if they have completed a PreCalculus course.

 

Back in the 'dark ages' Analytical Geometry was a required course that was taken either before or concurrent to Calculus 1. This course has been 'assimilated' into other courses--most current Algebra and Geometry programs have much more 'coordinate Geometry' than they used to...

 

Well, it doesn't sound like that sequence is one I want to try, then. It sounded too good to be true. So maybe we'll do:

9th - Geometry (but WHICH ONE?):confused:

10th - Lial's Alg II

11th - Lial's Pre-Cal

12th - ?

 

And then calculus? How much do those dvts actually teach, anyway? We haven't used them for Introductory Algebra, but if I'm going to stick with Lial's, I'll need them later. Dd is very pleased with Lial's, it's just this whole geometry quandary. I would just need the dvts to be something that will lead us along, kwim? Even for Pre-cal and Intermediate Alg. I'll worry about calculus later - this should be in a class, right? I mean, we're not going to try that at home. Not with me. That's crazy, right? Do cc's offer some kind of high school level calculus? I'm sure we'll just do that, if that's the case.

 

ARGH on high school! Can we turn back the clock, please? Now I'm getting into new territory in almost everything. I should have never let my guinea pig go off to school! :001_huh:

 

And light you can shed will be much appreciated, as always. And no, we haven't had this conversation before. Well, just pretend we haven't, 'k?

[langfam]

My 2 cents.

 

DD had completed Saxon all the way through 1/2 of Advanced Math, so did quite alot of geometry. She wanted to stop with Saxon and opted to do geometry.

 

We have Jacob's 3rd edition and a sample DVD from Dr. Callahan. ...didn't work for her. So we tired TT. She finished it in April.... sometimes doing 2 lessons because she really enjoyed it. She even made the comment that SAT Math section was easier having done TT geometry. I don't know if it's because she already had lots of geometry Saxon though in bits and pieces then when she saw the whole picture it made sense to her or that TT is really quite good.

 

I know she did at least 2 proofs per lesson and per test. She really enjoyed TT. I know there have been lots of complaints about TT, but I wonder if it's just their Algebra program that's scant.

 

She's doing the SAT today! So,,,we'll see!

[Jann in TX]

Proofs are NOT on any college prep test.

 

Proofs CAN be a great way to learn/practice logical reasoning. They can also turn a good math student into a math hater!

 

Geometry in general is NOT needed for most higher math courses--like Calculus.

 

My feelings about Geometry are similar to my feelings about diagramming sentences. Diagramming did not 'work' for me--I'm a bit ADD and those lines going every which way--just confused me visually--not my learning style. Geometry did not 'work' for me when I was in high school--I HATED it ('could have been my DRY teacher...)--but I LOVED Algebra and the 'logic' of mathematical progression--I did not need formal proofs to learn that.

 

I LOVE teaching Geometry. My middle dd is taking Geometry this year in PS--I re-teach her every lesson--she prefers my teaching style. I also tutor most of dd's friends as well. I have a small group of homeschoolers that I've just finished teaching Geometry to...

 

TT's Geometry is more than adequate when it comes to the Geometry needed for college prep tests. It does NOT make the student 'think' as much as more rigorous courses--but it still works.

 

My middle dd's Geometry program covered much more material than TT's--it was an honors course. This dd will most likely go into a heavy math/science field and the rigour of the course was good for her--even if I had to re-teach every lesson!

 

My oldest dd will NOT complete a Geometry program. She has some learning differences and at almost 18 we are just trying to make it through the Algebras--College Algebra will be her last math course (Forever. she says). It is all that is needed for the certification she hopes to get at the local CC.

 

My personal top picks for Geometry--Jacobs and Chalkdust (Larson). These programs can be adjusted for a variety of student levels but that usually takes someone who has experience and knows what to assign. For the average student who just needs a Geometry credit--and wants to be prepared for college prep tests then TT is a good option.

 

I hope these rambles have not offended any true Geometry lovers. (I've had several students over the years who LOVED Geometry but struggled through Algebra.)

[dkholland]

This is what I replied regarding the Dr. Callahan Alg. II/Trig...

 

My son is ahead by two levels in math and he has always sailed through any math course. This one has been extremely difficult for him. Dr. Callahan is easy to watch but my son comments on how what he demonstrates in the DVD for the lesson many times has no examples of what will be covered in the book! I feel like math needs to be practiced to learn it, and there are not nearly enough practice problems for a student of 14 (which my ds is!) The books breaks up the practice in Three sections (A - easier problems, B - more difficult, and C - harder and more appplication problems) I finally have had him do all the A (even though there are only answers to the odd in the back) and all the odd of section B. There are lots of problems in the book to practice but Dr. Callahan only assigns some in each section. The book course works from the assumption that your student has already had experience with some Algebra II because there were things assumed that my son had never touched on (he went through Jacobs Alg. and Geo.) This course is set up as a college course. There are onlyl about 8 problems on each test.

 

He has struggled and learned this year and that has been good. But, it also has made his confidence drop dramatically and he now does not care for any math! Every chapter has been a struggle. His former math teacher looked at the college text that is used and she said she did not get into some of that stuff my ds was asked to do until higher up in college - she was a math major and has a grad degree in mathmatics!

 

It is a hard program and could be used by a very bright student (or older, maybe) who loves a challenge.

 

We have a friend who is also using it and her ds has struggled a little less than mine and found he could get through the Trig part easier than the Alg. II.

 

I have decided that my ds needs another year of Alg II/Trig to prepare for the SAT...so we have signed him up for the Functions, Statistics, and Trig class with The Potters School. I also feel he needs a live class in which to discuss problems and a math teacher who can guide him through the tough stuff.

 

Sorry so long! Let me know if you need any more info on the program!!