debbiec Posted December 10, 2010 Share Posted December 10, 2010 DS is taking PreCal I this semester at community college (DE). My understanding from the catalog is that PreCal I is basically College Algebra + and PreCal II (second semester) is Trig. So, here lies the question and dilemma ~ DS will likely make a high C unless he pulls a low B by some miracle in PreCal I this semester. He has not been diligent at all in keeping up with homework assignments and seemed surprised when he failed (58) test 2 of 4 this semester :glare: when he walked in and took the test cold turkey and had not done ANY homework for three weeks. (He made an 82 on the one he actually half way prepared for). So, we are wondering if we should continue on with PreCal 2 (trig) in spring. Let me mention that DS is almost exclusively an A student....except math. He really dislikes it. Geometry (in public school) was extremely painful for him. Our umbrella and local school district both count a one semester course of college PreCal as a full high school credit and they both tell me he can count PreCal 1 as high school precal. Really? :001_huh: It seems to me that a typical high school precal course includes trig and he would be getting shorted some math education if I tried to do that. Not being a math person (who has a BFA that required NO college math at all) I would not know. And I'm not one to cut corners. In the bigger scheme of things, he will likely be a biology major and may need nothing beyond precal except maybe statistics (so I'm told). Your thoughts ~ :bigear: Debbie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Susan C. Posted December 10, 2010 Share Posted December 10, 2010 It might be different in each state. Here, one semester would be a whole year's credit. And, the C would be weighted to a B (college classes taken in high school have a 5 point A). I'm going to take a guess at what is going on since something similar happened here. He might be overwhelmed. Ds took Calculus as a freshman in college, he tested ready for it. But, he wasn't. It hit too hard too fast, and he just got lost. No saving it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debbiec Posted December 10, 2010 Author Share Posted December 10, 2010 (edited) Yes, it's also one semester = a whole year's HS credit here as well. I'm mostly concerned with content and not credits though, if I'm making sense at all. He is taking Anatomy and Physiology (for science majors) and is the top student in the class (and one of the top students she has ever had), so I don't know that DE is overwhelming him as much as his sheer dislike for math. Edited December 10, 2010 by debbiec Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elizabeth in WA Posted December 10, 2010 Share Posted December 10, 2010 (edited) In the bigger scheme of things, he will likely be a biology major and may need nothing beyond precal except maybe statistics (so I'm told).Debbie This will depend on the school he goes too. Some schools now require some variety of "Calculus for Biology Majors" and sometimes even "Differential equations for Biology Majors" as many biological models use these. Population biology is one area using differential equations, and there were others not coming to mind right now. Some schools (perhaps many?) still require little or no math for Biology majors, however. Is there a comprehensive final in the course? If there is and he gets less than a B on that, I think retaking the course would be more valuable foundationwise than continuing on. Math for biologists is (I think, because I actually took the "scientists and engineers" series, not the biology series) Trig light. ETA: http://www.bio.brandeis.edu/biomath/menu.html has some nice discussion of the use of math in modern biology if you scroll down. Edited December 10, 2010 by Elizabeth in WA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiana Posted December 10, 2010 Share Posted December 10, 2010 If he is planning on being a biology major, he will probably have to take algebra-based physics. This will have a trig prerequisite. Many schools also require a calculus course for biology majors. This calculus course is usually calc-lite (no proofs, mostly applications, not much trig) and has a prerequisite of college algebra. There's no way I'd give him the semester off to forget what he's learned in Precalc 1 before university. He should do one of the following: 1) Review precalc 1 at home, reworking with a different text, so he can take trigonometry at university. 2) Retake precalc 1 at the college if his grade is THAT bad, and do the work this time. 3) Take precalc 2 anyway. Look at the universities he's interested in. See which math and physics they require. Perhaps present it as 'If you can pass these math courses now, you can go the whoole rest of your university career without any math! yaaaayyyy!' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regentrude Posted December 10, 2010 Share Posted December 10, 2010 If he wants to major in biology, he will most likely have to take an algebra and trigonometry based physics class (the university might require them to take a calculus class as well). Without trigonometry, he will not be able to do that. I see many biology students struggling with math in their physics class, so it really is important that he gets a good foundation, even if he does not like it. So, I see the question of credits as a secondary issue. Of course he could take trigonometry once he gets to university. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
April in CA Posted December 10, 2010 Share Posted December 10, 2010 HI Debbie, As an alternate resource, you might want to take a look at Thinkwell precal. I don't have personal experience with that particular course, but my older son used Thinkwell Calculus for a semester during his senior year of high school (did the equivalent of one sem of college calc). He felt very well prepared for his college calculus class this semester - just finished with an A. Perhaps the different format would help your son review and progress through the material. Hope this helps! Blessings, April Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debbiec Posted December 10, 2010 Author Share Posted December 10, 2010 Thanks ladies! Due to the funky spring schedule for PreCal II (trig) he will be taking it as a double paced 4th quarter class. I hate that but that will give him the 3rd quarter to review again. We bought the Math Lab kit and have not cracked it open and will probably do that for review.....and just carry on to PreCal II in March and get it knocked out. Many thanks about the Biology math information. He's planning on pre-med for sure, not even a question about that, but is not absolutely sure he will be a biology major ~ but very possibly. His A&P instructor taught at a local medical school and for some mysterious reason, is starting teaching adjunct at the community college which is just down the road (?) She has advised him to major in something he really wants to learn besides biology (but take the required classes for the MSET), because medical school is long and hard and he won't get another opportunity to learn other things after that. That is a subject for a whole new thread (undergraduate majors for pre-med students ~ biology or other?). Again, many thanks ~ Debbie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Susan C. Posted December 10, 2010 Share Posted December 10, 2010 It might be the teacher as well. Ds has a friend that failed college algebra (and it was the same teacher that failed ds in calculus), retook it with a different teacher, got an A. Ds even said if that teacher ever taught calculus, he would retake it (but so far, he hasn't). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debbiec Posted December 10, 2010 Author Share Posted December 10, 2010 I'll definitely look at that April ~ hubby feels like he needs to continue with PreCal, but maybe not at the CC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debbiec Posted December 10, 2010 Author Share Posted December 10, 2010 Well, the teacher is kind of ..... OK, I cannot think of a good word here. For example, on his last test he made an 82 on, he didn't show ALL of his work, but most of it, and made some deviations of how he got the answer...though the answer was correct. (I understand that it is important to show what the intructor wants, and have talked to son about this, so I don't fault the instructor except for his comment) The instructor counted the whole thing wrong and wrote in bright ink "Lucky Guess!" DS found it kind of offensive. Maybe I'll look at another instructor, but as everyone knows, getting the times you want isn't always easy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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