small vent...my mind is numb....

[galtgrl]

We've been trying to figure out whether it's more cost-effective for dd's to rack up college credits online (or through community college)

OR

concentrate on getting the most merit aid they can find and going the traditional 4 year college route.

 

Why oh why is it so hard to get a simple answer to this question? I've gone through so many "if this, then that..." scenarios that it's making my brain hurt.:tongue_smilie:

 

Ok, I'm done now. Carry on.:001_smile:

[creekland]

From the little experience I have... if your student tests really high (top 5% or so overall - and/or in the top 25% of where they want to go - assuming the college offers merit aid), then merit aid and 4 years is the way to go.

 

If the student is more average for the school they want to attend, then racking up other credits and doing a transfer would save money. With this route, be certain the credits will transfer. Not all will be accepted just "anywhere."

 

If you qualify for need based aid, consider that into the equation too.

 

You won't really get a "true" one answer fits all equation as colleges can offer aid for things like diversity (including geographical) or certain majors that make situations unique (even for the same applicant at different colleges)!

 

For my top scorers, we're going the 4 year route, but with some potential credits from the cc. If they transfer, great, if not, so be it. The classes will at least help them get accepted.

 

For my youngest... we're still thinking 4 year, but more because hubby and I went that way and thoroughly enjoyed ourselves. Unless he chooses differently, we want him to have a similar experience to the rest of the family at the college of his choice even if we end up paying more.

[Grace is Sufficient]

From the little experience I have... if your student tests really high (top 5% or so overall - and/or in the top 25% of where they want to go - assuming the college offers merit aid), then merit aid and 4 years is the way to go.

 

 

I'd love to hear what others think on this... It sounds like you're saying merit aid, if you're testing scores are in the top 25% for the school, and if the school offers decent merit aid, will bring the cost down to equivalent of CC?

 

If so, that's encouraging news!

 

Thanks,

Debbie

[Jane in NC]

I'd love to hear what others think on this... It sounds like you're saying merit aid, if you're testing scores are in the top 25% for the school, and if the school offers decent merit aid, will bring the cost down to equivalent of CC?

 

If so, that's encouraging news!

 

Thanks,

Debbie

 

One thing I want to mention is that the definition of "decent" merit aid varies from pocketbook to pocketbook. Secondly, I have noticed that some schools provide a limited number of full rides and a small number of merit aid packages, while other schools provide no full rides but a greater number of middle of the road (50%) tuition merit aid packages. (Note that some colleges provide no merit aid--only need based only. So if your family is lower income or has multiple children in college, a college that agrees to meet your need may be the way to go.)

 

Many community colleges are extremely inexpensive so I would be hard pressed to see even a generous merit aid package (unless it is a full ride) bring the total cost that low.

 

My son took courses at our local CC but is now attending a liberal arts college that does not recognize CC credit. Frankly, there is a world of difference between the two institutions. I think our CC serves its purpose but academically it is not up to par with my son's LAC. Not the message that some want to hear and not a message with which all will agree. But that is our experience. To me there is more to the equation than the pocketbook.

[creekland]

I'd love to hear what others think on this... It sounds like you're saying merit aid, if you're testing scores are in the top 25% for the school, and if the school offers decent merit aid, will bring the cost down to equivalent of CC?

 

If so, that's encouraging news!

 

Thanks,

Debbie

 

It CAN, but it's not a guarantee. One needs to factor in those other things that make a candidate attractive to a school and whether or not the school offers merit aid + any outside scholarships won. We are almost paying more for my middle son to take 2 cc classes than for my oldest to attend a 4 year school. We are paying more if we eliminate the room and board cost for my oldest (but, of course, that is a real cost).

 

I agree with Jane that our cc classes here are NOT (in general) of the same caliber as the 4 year school. BUT, they are better than our high school offers. (Edited to add our high school offers "college in the high school" classes that give a student college credit that is SUPPOSED to be similar to the cc.)

[Mommyfaithe]

Our CC has phenomenal programs and is technically a state university. all credits are accepted throughout the state....It was exponentially cheaper for us to go the CC to 4 year school even with merit aid and low income aid. My kids also received really fantastic scholarships when they transferred to their 4 year schools making their choice small private colleges cost about the same as the CC.

 

Just our experience.

Faithe

[TravelingChris]

CC vary as widely as no CC. My dd took one class in person in FLorida and learned a lot and had a short paper every week (basically 18 papers). She learned as much as she would have learned at most colleges in an intro to psychology class and more than she would have learned at many, since the writing of the papers cemented the information in her head a lot better than a midterm and final would have.

Currently she is taking a Criminology course online from a CC. It is much more rigorous course than was offered at the undergraduate level at the four year institution from which I received my master's degree in Criminal Justice. Are they today maybe using the same book? It is certainly possible. But in the CC class, she writes multiple essay answers every week, she had the hardest midterm I have ever encountered (and this is with me graduating from a top ten college and then taking all the coursework for a master's and doctoral degree in the same field). She also has a major paper to write, and a half hour speech to do as a final (we are still trying to figure this one out like does the teacher want a audiofile of this or a written out speech since we are over 2000 miles away).

[LinRTX]

Well, my oldest 2 went to the same school. He went all 4 years and all the merit scholarships he was offered paid for his tuition and books for all 4 years. We paid housing.

 

The next went to the CC for her first two years, got her associates degree and then transferred to the university. She is getting scholarship money based on her 4.0 for her CC classes, but it does not pay everything. The merit aid is just not as good for a transfer. But she did not have the SAT scores to get the merit scholarships from the beginning. (This child just freezes for these big tests.)

 

This is a state school. I'm not sure about private ones.

 

Linda

[creekland]

CC classes vary widely and schools we've talked with that don't accept their credits or don't accept credits within ones major tell me that they simply don't know the quality of that class.

 

Public schools almost always accept credits from their own state's cc. It's their way of saying the classes are equal (but in reality, I still heard the same complaint about the quality varying from state U profs). Many times they will also accept them from other states. Private colleges tend to be pickier and less are accepting credits simply because they can't depend on the quality.

 

I know my boys both have loved their cc classes. My oldest who is now a freshman at a 4 year school has told me he can see a big difference in quality. My middle son is just in two cc classes now, but already tells me the profs don't cover as much as he was expecting they would. Very frankly, while he loves his classes and is learning a bit, he told me he's learning even more just from reading the book(s). He just had a microbio test and got a 98.5% on it and told me it was super easy. In his class there were only 4 A's, 10 B's, 4 C's, 8 D's, and 17 F's. I think the prof is having to "limit" her class by the ability of her students - and the ability (or reading/work ethic) is simply not as up there as I will be expecting from his 4 year school, but then again, he's also looking at attending a higher level 4 year school. If he attends our state school (Pitt - likely to be free for him based on merit), his credits will transfer. If he goes to some private options (his first choice if we can afford it - will depend on aid packages), they may or may not transfer. For either, I hope to have him talk with profs there to see IF he should accept the credits or retake the course just to be on par with other sophomores (or freshman) who take it there. If he's behind in knowledge due to the cc course, it won't help him to have credit for the course. I only care about that one because it will be in his major. If he gets credits for his Effective Speaking class he'll take them anywhere. If not, no great loss. I still suspect he will have gained from it for interviews (scholarship and otherwise).

[Alyce]

Alot is going to depend on the college you're looking at and their policies. The amount of merit aid varies widely. Some say that entering as a transfer student hurts you but that too varies. The only way you're going to be able to answer this is go to the colleges and ask them directly, even if you are only curious and doubt you'd apply. My dd took 20 hrs of credit at our CC with dual enrollment. At the school of her chose it didn't matter how many credits you got as a dual enrolled student you still applied as a freshman. So she was a freshman but was a half a semester ahead of her fellow students which will help her in the long term because she is a double major. She found the CC very helpful. The biggest thing she liked was that it had put her being responsible for herself and her courses while she was still at home and could get daily encouragement. I did not do anything for her CC courses except to encourage her. She passed or failed on her own merits. She said that most of her freshmen class mates were having problems adjusting because they weren't used to being told just once what was expected. They were so use to being reminded of what needed done and being given chances to go back and retake tests etc that they had a hard time functioning in college. DD got a full ride.

 

Ds is taking CC college courses after he's graduated. Because of this he had to apply as a transfer student. It was his choice to go to CC because of a goal he wanted to meet with one of his extracurricular activities. He applied to the same college his sister is going to (They are one of the few that has what he wants) at least in our state. He plans to attend starting next fall. He has been accepted and he too will get a full ride.

 

In this case being a transfer didn't matter and having CC credits while in high school didn't matter. I'm saying this to illustrate what I said earlier. Many people have told you their experiences but you really won't have any right answers because it really does depend on the schools you apply to and the best way to answer your questions is to research for yourself.

[justamouse]

Our CC has phenomenal programs and is technically a state university. all credits are accepted throughout the state....It was exponentially cheaper for us to go the CC to 4 year school even with merit aid and low income aid. My kids also received really fantastic scholarships when they transferred to their 4 year schools making their choice small private colleges cost about the same as the CC.

 

Just our experience.

Faithe

 

 

I believe our CC is the same.

[readwithem]

One thing I want to mention is that the definition of "decent" merit aid varies from pocketbook to pocketbook. Secondly, I have noticed that some schools provide a limited number of full rides and a small number of merit aid packages, while other schools provide no full rides but a greater number of middle of the road (50%) tuition merit aid packages. (Note that some colleges provide no merit aid--only need based only. So if your family is lower income or has multiple children in college, a college that agrees to meet your need may be the way to go.)

<snip>

 

To me there is more to the equation than the pocketbook.

:iagree: Jane you're fabulous.

[readwithem]

One thing I want to mention is that the definition of "decent" merit aid varies from pocketbook to pocketbook. Secondly, I have noticed that some schools provide a limited number of full rides and a small number of merit aid packages, while other schools provide no full rides but a greater number of middle of the road (50%) tuition merit aid packages. (Note that some colleges provide no merit aid--only need based only. So if your family is lower income or has multiple children in college, a college that agrees to meet your need may be the way to go.)

<snip>

 

To me there is more to the equation than the pocketbook.

:iagree: Jane you're fabulous.

[galtgrl]

Many people have told you their experiences but you really won't have any right answers because it really does depend on the schools you apply to and the best way to answer your questions is to research for yourself.

 

 

Yes, I know *sigh*. We're at the very beginning of researching our options, however, and it just gets overwhelming at times.

 

I think we can write the state uni. off completely, but that's about it.

 

I still have a few years to wrap my head around it all. :tongue_smilie:

[creekland]

Yes, I know *sigh*. We're at the very beginning of researching our options, however, and it just gets overwhelming at times.

 

I think we can write the state uni. off completely, but that's about it.

 

I still have a few years to wrap my head around it all. :tongue_smilie:

 

I think almost all of us think it's overwhelming at first, but step by step, it isn't too bad. My best advice is not to burn any bridges, but let your student know there is a financial aspect (for those who have one). Mine know they can pretty much apply anywhere they like to "see what happens," but their final choice has to be made with our finances in consideration. My oldest was able to go to his first choice. If I'd seriously considered the sticker price at first it would have never been on the table.

 

Now... we're kind of spoiled (with merit aid and a couple of outside scholarships) in the aspect that I'm "expecting" similar results for my middle son (who scores higher), but I know it might not happen at his first choice school. He knows it too. Fortunately, he's quite flexible, so isn't as likely as my oldest to fall in love with just one school. We'll know more after we do some visits this spring.

 

We'll see what happens with my youngest when the time comes. "I'm" convinced a 4 year school is right for my family, so we might have to pay more when his turn comes. Time will tell. We'll also see how the cc classes go his junior or senior year.

[emubird]

Our experience has been that you just can't tell. So, yes, you're not imagining it, you really can't figure out what will be best. It will depend not only on which college your child eventually goes to, but also their major, whether they are in the honors program, what their test scores are, and even the particular year they go to the school because policies change overnight. It will also depend on who else applies in the year your child applies -- are they stronger candidates that will knock your child out of the running for the full ride scholarships?

 

I'm of the opinion that one should just worry about getting a good education in the here and now and let things sort themselves out later. You will drive yourself crazy if you try to play the game just right. And then you'll find out you did the wrong thing anyway.

 

My oldest has a a few AP credits -- but only the calculus ones are going to do her any good. The history ones won't because she ended up in the honors program that requires they take all the honors classes -- which will duplicate the history credits. If she had decided to take AP physics or chemistry and IF she had gotten a 5 on them, then they would have counted for something -- but I'm not convinced she would have had as good a background in those areas if she had gone the AP route. If she'd got only a 4, she would have got nothing from them (credit wise) and would still have to take the class.

 

She did take a number of dual enrollment classes. She finished the language requirement, but then ended up in a program that didn't require a language. She did some engineering courses that would have got her ahead, but then went to a school with no engineering program (there were other things she wanted from a college as well). I think all these classes were good for her, but they aren't going to save us any money.

 

If your child is planning on a science field, I'd suggest trying to get the math out of the way. That seemed to be the one thing that transferred -- but even that doesn't always transfer. And this will only work successfully if your child is ready for that math. After that, I'd go for the basic science courses like chemistry and physics -- but only if you're reasonably sure they're going to transfer. Although, if they don't transfer, at the least your child will find the first year a lot easier than it would have been otherwise. The reason for getting these classes done is that they allow the student to start in the sophomore year of the science sequence. Taking composition is easy and possibly will get the student out of a class, but it doesn't move the student forward in the sequence, so it may not really save any time in the end.

 

A lot of colleges would prefer students stay for the whole 4 years. It's not all financial. They just find that it makes for a better student body if everyone is around for the same things for the same amount of time. (If it were financial, they'd be happy to graduate their full ride scholars early, but they never encourage this.) Also, the students find that they would like to be there for the whole 4 years. There are internships and things that really make it worth their while to take their time before getting out on the job market (and might be the deciding factor in whether they ever get a job). It's not just the fun and games (although those are enticing too!).