How do you know when to move them ahead?

[KLA]

Just because they are quick to learn new concepts and understand them - does that mean they should work faster or skip stuff??

 

Both my children (2nd and 3rd grade) work ahead in all subject areas but I feel uncertain about how to decide how and when and how much to advance them. For example, they have both worked quickly through Spelling Workout but rarely miss even one word on the pre-test. I still have them do the exercises for fear that they will miss something. My daughter wants "harder words" but I'm afraid to skip lessons.

In math, they both do Saxon a year ahead and never struggle to learn the new concept. They make careless mistakes in their work (copy wrong or label wrong) but rarely b/c they didn't understand. I just have them plug along, rarely skipping anything because i want them to have strong in fundamentals.

But I wonder if I'm holding them back? How do you know and make these decisions? I'm not interested in moving them fast forward just because I can but I do want them challenged and not stagnating. Ideas? Thank you.

 

KLA

ds 9, 3rd grade

dd, 8 2nd grade

[homewithtrinity]

If they are not making mistakes and understand the concepts let them work at their own pace. Eventuallly there will be times you will need to spend several days on one topic just to get the hang of it.

 

On the spelling, follow the lessons sticking so they get the basics. But there is nothing wrong with some harder words with simmilar spelling patterns being added to challenge them.

[nmoira]

Just because they are quick to learn new concepts and understand them - does that mean they should work faster or skip stuff??

Maybe. Sometimes you can simply choose more a more challenging curriculum.

 

I let 6yo DD self pace in most subjects. Math is the easiest. DD does as much as she can in 15-20 minutes. I do, however, try to make it challenging for her as I don't want her to think math should be effortless. She uses the Singapore Intensive Practice books instead of the workbooks, and we supplement with Primary Challenge Math. Same thing for Latin and Spanish, we do an alloted amount of time rather than an allotted amount of work. Since we school year round and she and her sister get along well playing alone, we have short school days.

 

With some other subjects, I have her plod along (unless she makes a big deal of wanting more). I have her do one page of Megawords per day. Grammar we do in concentrated units once per year; it's also integrated into Latin. These subjects are finite in nature, so I see no advantage pressing too far ahead. She's working through a LA program designed for gifted students, and though she's working at an accelerated level, I have no desire to have her keep accelerating; 3 years is enough.

 

Both my children (2nd and 3rd grade) work ahead in all subject areas but I feel uncertain about how to decide how and when and how much to advance them. For example, they have both worked quickly through Spelling Workout but rarely miss even one word on the pre-test. I still have them do the exercises for fear that they will miss something. My daughter wants "harder words" but I'm afraid to skip lessons.

Can you not just give her supplemental lists of more difficult words? IIRC, that's standard practice for advanced students in the SWO TM's anyway.

 

In math, they both do Saxon a year ahead and never struggle to learn the new concept. They make careless mistakes in their work (copy wrong or label wrong) but rarely b/c they didn't understand. I just have them plug along, rarely skipping anything because i want them to have strong in fundamentals.

From what I understand of Saxon, its incremental nature would make it difficult to compact or accelerate. Is this your sense?

[Storm Bay]

With math: One of my dd's did Saxon. We skipped a lot of the problems as it was far too much review for her. We school year round, so when we got the the next book, we skipped all the review chapters at the beginning.

 

My other two are doing Singapore Math, which has worked better for my mathy kids. I do have them do all in the workbook, but they go as fast as they need/want to.

 

With going quickly in math, I've found that results have varied with my dc. My eldest has a mind like a steel trap for math, but my second needs more review as she forgets some things if she goes too long without doing them. She has less and less trouble with forgetting as she gets older.

 

For some subjects, I've found it better to go deeper, rather than faster.

[nmoira]

 

For some subjects, I've found it better to go deeper, rather than faster.

:iagree: We do this with history.

[pixelroper]

For some subjects, I've found it better to go deeper, rather than faster.

 

:iagree: I struggled with moving ahead, not skipping, I found dd needs to be challenged or she falls asleep. I now realize this is not the easiest to do with curriculum mostly for the traditional year or adapted from a classroom. I do some customizing--mostly I go deeper.

 

I have to go over math in particular to make sure there is balance between practice and new concepts, found deeper usually works better here too. When I used Saxon, I put a specific time on class time, I covered however many lessons I could during that time. Then the worksheet for the last lesson covered. Spelling is one I had to go faster in. I switched to StWR and kept testing until she started to get words wrong.

[Donna]

I know my kids need to move ahead or skip when I teach them something and they ask questions or show that they understand more than what I have taught. For example...my then 4yo was to learn the concept of 1/2 and 1/4 but during the lesson she started drawing her own shapes and dividing them and coloring them to show 5ths and 8ths, etc... or earlier this year at 5yo I showed her double digit addition then accidently gave her one that needed carrying and she did it effortlessly without being shown how.

 

I work with Saxon because I like the way it keeps everything fresh by spiralling. I like the order and my kids like the way it looks. I have tried Singapore but found it too unorganized and my dd thought it was "baby work" because of the cartoons.

 

I accelerate Saxon by skipping lessons when she knows the concepts...she learned to count all the coins in Saxon 1 so when it came up again in 2 and 3 she did the problems but skipped those lessons. I only have her do one side of the page because she "gets it" instantly. Her brothers have done the upper Saxon grades and I skip the first few "review lessons" at the beginning of each book because we school year round plus pick and choose among the problem set problems about 10-12 each lesson.

[Plaid Dad]

For example, they have both worked quickly through Spelling Workout but rarely miss even one word on the pre-test.

 

Is it possible they're natural spellers? We don't do a formal spelling curriculum with my dd. If she's unsure about a word, I write it out for her once and then she knows it forever. Not all kids are like that, but if yours are, a formal spelling program may not be the best use of their (and your!) time. Just a thought.

[KarenNC]

You might consider looking at something like Spelling Power for spelling. In it you work only on the words you don't already know how to spell. It has placement tests to help find the level of words that is appropriate, along with a section listing a wide variety of activities to do to help learn the words. One book goes up to adulthood and can be used with all your kids. I got ours used for $15 (the version without the cd copy of the exercises and forms, which are also printed in the book--but you can order just the cd for $5).

[KLA]

Thank you for all the suggestions. I will ponder them.

 

I'd love to hear more about how you evaluate when and how to advance them. Like I said, I do not want them to miss practicing the fundamentals by moving them ahead but i certainly do not want to stifle them with boredom. I face this in every subject.

 

Thank you for your wisdom!

KLA

[nmoira]

 

I'd love to hear more about how you evaluate when and how to advance them. Like I said, I do not want them to miss practicing the fundamentals by moving them ahead but i certainly do not want to stifle them with boredom. I face this in every subject.

DD either knows the work, or she doesn't. That is the extent of our evaluation. Specifically what type of fundamentals are you talking about? Gaps can be exciting things for bright kids to overcome. Do you pretest upcoming topics? You could perhaps give them a chance to "challenge for credit" along the way.

[KLA]

I like your ideas. Thank you.

 

By fundamentals, I mean things like math facts or two digit multiplication or long division. Here is an example, right now, we are finishing up Saxon 3. She understands everything we have covered and knows her math facts (not super fast but accurate). I have a feeling I could stop Saxon 3 (we are on lesson 120) and start Saxon 5/4 ans she would be just fine. But this goes so against the grain. Would finishing Saxon 3 be great practice and solidify things or would it be overkill and unnecessary. She's not a complainer and just works pretty diligently on whatever I give her - so thats no an indicator.

 

I might just be overthinking it all - just that end of the year pressure of "am i doing enough?" - thank you for your time and thoughts. Its helpful.

KLA

[nmoira]

I like your ideas. Thank you.

You're welcome.

 

By fundamentals, I mean things like math facts or two digit multiplication or long division. Here is an example, right now, we are finishing up Saxon 3. She understands everything we have covered and knows her math facts (not super fast but accurate).

IMHO, with bright kids it's best to separate this kind of mastery from conceptual mastery. No matter what level your kids are working at, you can still drill them occasionally for speed, or give them a handful of multiplication or long division problems. A topic like long division might take a bit of time to completely master because of the mechanics involved. Since they'll be using it often you can check each time to make sure they've still "got it." One way I make things a bit more challenging for DD is to have her to all 1 digit multiplication, and all two digit addend and subtrahend calculations mentally. One in ten problems I'll have her write out to reinforce form (she hasn't yet hit 2 digit by 2 digit multiplication).

 

I have a feeling I could stop Saxon 3 (we are on lesson 120) and start Saxon 5/4 ans she would be just fine. But this goes so against the grain. Would finishing Saxon 3 be great practice and solidify things or would it be overkill and unnecessary. She's not a complainer and just works pretty diligently on whatever I give her - so thats no an indicator.

This might be something to ask in its own thread. You'll benefit from other Saxon users' experience, maybe here and on the curriculum board. I'm not familiar with Saxon's scope and sequence and don't have a sense of how much is repeated from year to year.

[Storm Bay]

I'd love to hear more about how you evaluate when and how to advance them. Like I said, I do not want them to miss practicing the fundamentals by moving them ahead but i certainly do not want to stifle them with boredom. I face this in every subject.

 

Thank you for your wisdom!

KLA

 

We let our eldest go ahead up to 2 grades, but then there were other things we needed to focus on. She went back to being 1 grade ahead in most subjects. Just last week we had to re-evaulate when she starts high school. Academically, there's no question she's ready, however she is not only a year younger than ps peers (not that she's going back to ps), but she is young for her age, still tiny (over 5 feet now but a whopping 80-81 pounds) and it doesn't look like she'll be ready to go to university/college at 17.

 

So we're doing an interim year, so to speak, and calling it 8/9 (I made the mistake of registering her a grade ahead our first year of homeschooling in case dh didn't like it and she had to go back to ps). We won't backtrack, but will take time to go deeper. We're going to do a 1.5 year Ancient history course starting midyear next year (but can only count the official gr. 9 year part of it). We'll be reading some histories written in the classical era and middle ages along with SWB Ancient History spine and original writings. We'll incorporate the history of science and mathematics. In science we'll take the time to read various theories and theologies on the origins of the universe and of life. We'll question the prevalent scientific definitions and notions to see what she thinks of them (eg. why are only falisifiable theories considered good science?) Etc. Because we'll have the time. That's one advantage to having had her work ahead. She won't have to rush through Algebra 2, either, which is good because math is something she hates (we took 2 years for Algebra 1 because she was 11 and hates math.) But she loves the theoretical aspects of it, so we'll be working on that, too.

[pixelroper]

I have a feeling I could stop Saxon 3 (we are on lesson 120) and start Saxon 5/4 ans she would be just fine.

 

You would be fine.

 

But this goes so against the grain. Would finishing Saxon 3 be great practice and solidify things or would it be overkill and unnecessary. She's not a complainer and just works pretty diligently on whatever I give her - so thats no an indicator.

 

 

In my experience w/Saxon (1-5/4) the end is the meat. I would finish 3 then gave another placement test. You may be surprised. The first 30-40 lessons in Saxon are review (the traditional school year in a classroom) these are the ones I skip unless I have skipped a grade. Are you schooling year round?

[KLA]

with the Saxon assessment. We'll likely finish Saxon 3 and then maybe cruise through the beginning of Saxon 5/4 and do the same with my son in 6/5.

 

We do not school year round but they do do math everyday in the summer.

 

Again - thanks for all your thoughts everyone!

[Kay in Cal]

We do the pre-test in SWO and base the exercises on how many ds misses. If he misses more than three, he does all the pages. If he misses 1-2, he does one or two exercises. If he gets them all correct, we do the "bonus words" for fun, and put it aside to do the next chapter the next day. When he finishes the series, I figure we'll move on to vocabulary...

[H0MEFree]

If they are not making mistakes and understand the concepts let them work at their own pace. Eventuallly there will be times you will need to spend several days on one topic just to get the hang of it.

 

 

 

I agree. Mastery is the key.

You do not want to kill the love for learning. That would be more of an "evil"... kwim?

 

You can always try out "older" material and if they are challenged- great! If they struggle... back off.

Just watch and be sensitive. :)

[Myrtle]

I moved my older son ahead based on how well I thought he had mastered the material.

 

However, my second son enjoys working two, three, or four days of work in one sitting. It's his idea and he can do that much work because it's easy for him so he is getting ahead without me doing anything at all.

[Leila]

The same with my son, in terms of Spelling workout, I didn't want to skip a lesson even though he knows the words all ready. So this year we used Spelling Power, so we can move on to his phase. He only studies words he has trouble spelling, so it helps me a lot.

In terms of Math, we're doing Horizon and Singapore this year, but it was too easy for him, but still my goal is to master the fundamentals so, I just let him finish it. We will be switching to Teaching Textbook this coming school year and he'll do Math 6.We'll take it slow from there and just see how he does. Most of his subject are ahead for his age. He's only 8, but even if I know he can handle more, I don't want to rush him. I want him to enjoy school.

 

Leila:001_smile: