This started out as an SAT, SAT II, PSAT, ACT, AP, CLEP Roll Call and it mushroomed..

[Janice in NJ]

OK. Time to get serious about this transcript.

Here is what I've heard. Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

SAT is pretty important. Ideally? Take it during at least the junior year, and again in the fall of the senior year. (All scores 9th grade and above stick with you though. You can't delete scores from your "record.")

 

PSAT. Take it in the fall of the sophomore year for practice. Take it in the fall of the junior year for REAL. Cross your fingers, and try not to be bummed if you don't become a National Merit Scholar. (NMS often get full scholarships though. Right? So it's pretty awesome if you can do that.) There is a lower level below a "Scholar" that will cough up some scholarship money though. Right?

 

ACT. Also a good test to do. You can choose which scores you have sent to colleges though. Correct? So if the student takes it and BOMBS it, you can do a do-over. It tests more that just reasoning though. Right? Subject matter is included.

 

SAT II - a strong college application has at least three of these. Some colleges I have looked at required three.

 

AP. Take a class. (or not). Test is given once a year. Pass the test with a 4 or a 5 and the colleges might give you credit. Cool.

 

CLEP. Same as AP - except given more often. This doesn't seem as prestigious as an AP score - Is it just me? If a student took a bunch of these along with AP would it affect their freshman status? Yikes! Because I've looked at the prep books for Western Civ I and we are doing all of this. Why not take the test?

 

SO.......... I'm having a hard time thinking about all of this. It ends up looking like our junior and senior years are almost NOTHING but jumping through hoops. Somehow it just wasn't what I envisioned with the "ta-da" of a classical education. I wanted to spend our time exploring philosophy, the sciences, and the wonder of real mathematics. I wanted to spend our days reading novels, and I wanted my son to pursue his passions before he heads out into the "real world" of college, work, and life in general. Now it looks like almost all we will be doing is studying for tests - and trying to cram in course work.

:(

Duh to me I guess.

 

How did you all handle this and finish up your kids' coursework and educate your younger kids without neglecting the fact that you have a life - or at least you should..... One day at a time? Ya'll must have a clearer head than I do. I just can't seem to hold my brain still long enough to envision this....

 

Maybe if I write it down, it will make more sense.... I'm thinking that things could look like this:

 

9th:

-Geometry

-Biology

-Western Civ Part I (Through 400 AD)

-High School Composition (Outside Class)

-Literature I (Ancients - TOG; along with a few novels (Silas Marner; Great Expectations; Jane Eyre; Dr. Jekyl; Till We Have Faces; Ben Hur); and the first 1/2 of a short story collection with discussion)

-A Beka Grammar 9 & Vocab Classic Roots B & C

-Spanish II (We have done the first 1/2 of the BJU course for Spanish II; I haven't decided if we should finish it this year or wait and finish it next fall. His schedule is SO full right now. This month he has just been doing Rosetta Stone to mark time.)

-Small Engine Repair Course (CLE) with a independent study project

-SAT Prep

 

10th:

-Algebra II (Or Precalculus - I haven't decided; we've done a lot of Alg II material already but I don't think we will have time to complete PreCalc in one year. He's not fast enough yet.)

-Chemistry with SAT II Test in Spring

-Western Civ Part II (Through 1648) with CLEP Western Civ I Test

-AP English Lang & Composition Class with Test in Spring

-American Literature (Yea! The novel!)

-Spanish II (or III if we decide to finish II this year.)

-Automotive Repair Course (CLE) with a independent study project

-SAT Prep with PSAT in the fall

 

11th:

-Precalculus with SAT II Math II Test

-Physics with SAT II Test

-AP American History with Test and SAT II Test

-British Literaure

-Spanish III with SAT II Test

-A technology course. Probably computer programming - or electronics - or not sure.... I'm sure that there's a project in here somewhere. Ds and his grandfather are talking... they've come up with some pretty cool ideas and I've also been in touch with some of dh's friends - I've already received an internships offer from a friend who co-founded what became NJ's fastest growing tech company two years in a row. He said that he would love to have ds for a summer internship.

-PSAT in the fall

-SAT practice in the spring?

 

12th:

-AP Calculus

-AP Science - Probably Physics but he won't have the calculus base to do real physics - AB exam? Isn't that an algebra based course? NOT happy with this notion! Can you tell? I feel like I'm short changing him here - big time!

-AP English Literature with SAT II Test

-American Government

-All of that college stuff in the fall......... including the SAT

-SAT in the fall

 

I don't even know if you can do this. Can you take three AP exams? Aren't they all given on the same day? What if you're sick that day..... this is ridiculous...... We're up to six SAT II tests. Dumb. Really dumb. I WANT TO STUDY PHILOSOPHY and ECONOMICS and ELECTRONICS and Computer Programming and....... I have listened to too many wonderful courses by the Teaching Company to pretend that this schedule is anything other than an absolute PAIN!

It looks like we are going to have to cram the rest of Spanish II into this year. Sigh. Can you tell that I don't want to?

 

OK. Question. If we finish Spanish II this year and then do Spanish III in his sophomore year and manage to pull down a decent SAT II score, will he have to take a foreign language placement exam TWO YEARS later when he starts college? This kid HATES languages. I don't want him to have to start over and do this all over again, because I am almost SURE that he won't remember ANYTHING from his sophomore year. He memorizes the stuff, learns to apply it, takes the test, and then is completely content to let it leave his brain. It's a struggle. And I honestly can't see why we should bother if he is going to have to take it over again in college. He is probably going to be an engineering major; I'm almost certain of it. Who has the skinny on this one?

 

So - has anyone else taken the time to lay this all out and then realized that you are really, really tired. I'm really tired. :cool:

 

I think I need a counselor. Anyone for hire for phone counseling? I always thought I would pursue a very non-traditional path, but I'm starting to feel a strong pull toward "normal" clear-cut programs with accepted hoops. Learn the material. Fill in the bubbles. Get the score. Learn the next set of material.

And try to cram your passions in around the edges. There is just something about this that makes me SO uneasy. I suspect that I will find peace if I pursue what is "normal" and standard and discover that ds is going to be a good student. I just don't know. I just have so few benchmarks.

 

But.... I just want to teach. I just want to learn. I'm so tired or playing curriculum development manager and guidance counselor. Somehow I feel like I'm being tricked here into giving up my dreams. Mr. Popper didn't give up his dreams. That's why he was the only one who actually LEFT Stillwater....

But how can you stand with one foot each on two different islands?

What's wrong with me?

HELP!

 

Posting here. I guess. The cool thing is that I can delete this post (I think) if I decide that I don't actually want ya'll to know that I'm losing it here..... :eek:

...but I think I am... and I've eaten all of the chocolate. There's none left. Nada.

 

This is stupid. This should not be this hard. Every time I try to figure this out, I get wrapped up in my own leash. Can it be that I'm just not smart enough to figure this out? But I'm supposed to. This is my job, right? THIS is what I'm supposed to be doing! Organizing an education! How is it that ya'll haven't been dragged off to the looney bin yet?

 

Peace. Mmmm. That.

Janice

 

Enjoy your little people

Enjoy your journey

 

P.S. I was just about to hit post when the 14 year old ds interrupted to read a passage from Silas Marner to me. He was smiling broadly as he read. "This is great mom. Listen to this...."

I just don't want to lose that. Please tell me that we won't lose that! Please assure me that we have nothing but happy times ahead! (It's OK. You can lie. I won't know any better. ;))

[Karen in CO]

Wow Janice.

Relax. You have lots of tests planned out. It is good to see where the test might fit in. It is also good to plan to take a SAT II math plus one or two other SAT II's depending on what the colleges you are looking at require.

 

If you son doesn't like languages, I don't think I would plan to take an SAT subject test at the end of the sequence. Just do the language and be done with it.

 

Our subject test results were required to be submitted before our application was considered complete. So any testing done during the senior year needs to be complete before January. Don't plan to take any that year unless it is in the fall. Most kids classically educated will do well on the SAT literature test. It was one of the easier one which is why my ds picked it for a last minute subject test.

 

What I found was that my ds didn't have time to study what he wanted to specialize in and what I wanted for him to have completed. He only finished through pre-calc and didn't study history at all this year. He did however take two years spanish, a year of french, and 4 semesters of cc japanese and is taking a semester of Italian now. I could have never planned that for him. Just make sure that there is room for you dc to change your well-laid plans.

 

Relax. You can do it.

[Myrtle]

Janice,

 

My husband and I have spent a lot of time discussing this very issue.

I think we've decided that the chances of our kids getting a scholarship is not great enough to sacrifice the philosophy and real math. What if we sacrifice what the education we really want for the hopes of a scholarship and the scholarship doesn't come through? It will have been for nothing. Perhaps our youngest is the closest to having the temperament it would take to accomplish such a thing.

 

We'll gladly pay for their courses in community college and they can transfer to a university from there.

 

There is a point in time in which realilty makes classical education impossible. I think this is why it was always the domain of the upper classes--they didn't have to worry about their kids making a living and getting scholarships. They could send the kid off to study the classics and pay for the tutors or tuition and after college the kid would inherit the family land and business.

 

The rest of this chickens have to work for a living and worry about banausos as well as paideia.

[Jodi-FL]

The best thing you could do is to go the colleges of your child's choice and see exactly what they require, and go from there.

 

As for me and our kids, we're with Myrtle. We've decided not to sacrifice the kind of education we want to give them for a scholarship they may not get. That's not our kids' goals, nor ours. They're aiming high, in the direction they feel they've been given gifts/talents (not necessarily academic--oldest dd wants to be a pastry chef, for example) and do their very best.

 

We explore all those options for each kid as they get close. Next year we'll have 3 in high school, and I want to be able to enjoy it.

 

The college board website will have answers to your questions about how many AP exams you can take at a time, etc.

 

take a deep breath, talk with your kid, combine your goals so you can be on the same page.

[periwinkle]

SAT II - a strong college application has at least three of these. Some colleges I have looked at required three.

 

 

Well, I thought ds had a strong college application, but he didn't have any SAT II scores;)

 

Really, as Jodi suggested, I think it would help if you investigated specific requirements from your ds's possible colleges. If the schools my ds wanted to attend had required more testing, more requirements, we may have gone that direction. OR we may have not...the whole jumping through hoops just because I'm a homeschooler really irritates me (Georgia Tech thread below!)

 

As far as foreign languages, colleges differ in their approach to this one. The college ds will be attending grants him exemption from foreign language study in college just because he finished 3 years of high school with a B or better. Another local college requires you to take a proficiency test to prove you have mastered 2 years of high school language. And the list goes on........

[Jane in NC]

Janice, I am giving you an award for longest post to date!

 

One of the problems that I had in thinking about high school initially was trying to determine our path. There are students who have had very successful experiences doing CC or AP or CLEP or whatever, but their path is not necessarily my son's path. One of my friends who has produced two engineers through homeschooling swears by CC and CLEP. Her sons attended a state university which accepted the credits no questions asked. But the schools themselves are changing what is acceptable. Formerly a '3' on certain AP tests would earn credit at some schools; now students almost universally need 4's or 5's. Some selective schools do not recognize CLEP. The mantra is and will always be "Ask the College".

 

My son, who at one point appeared to be leaning toward engineering, is now talking about archaeology. (In fact, he told the eye doctor who asked him about college this morning that he is interested in too many things!) He recently told me that he has no desire to attend a large state university and would really prefer a smaller world. If he goes out of state, many schools will not recognize CC credits from NC. I think it will be wise for him to have a couple of CC courses on his transcript to demonstrate that he is capable of doing college level work in a classroom situation, but I think it would ultimately be a waste of time for him to take a number of CC classes, particularly at a CC which I think is an inferior school. (No flame wars, please. I taught at this school but know that there are better CCs out there!)

 

So let's get down to brass tacks. Last year, as a freshman, my son took two tests: ACT (which fulfilled the NC requirement for an annual achievement test) and the National Latin Exam. I did not have him write the essay part of the ACT but will have him do that this year. My son enjoys Latin and does well on the NLE. I am looking for ways to distinguish his transcript. An interest in Latin, backed up by these non-Mommy numbers, may help.

 

This year, my son will add an AP Biology test and a SAT-subject test in Biology. Next year, however, he will take chemistry at the CC. Are there other AP tests in his future? Probably Latin. Maybe Computer Science. But there is more to life than just the test. My son plays sports, participates in 4-H and assists at a wounded bird rehabilitation center. If he spent his days only preparing for standardized tests, he would be a dull boy indeed.

 

Jane

[TRILLIUM]

I think that in high school a lot of the drive needs to come from the kids. Some kids are very goal oriented. They actually like the challenge of an AP or SAT subject tests. It also depends on what other options you have available. I know some can start CC course before they are 16. We can't. Many school want to see evidence that your child challenged themselves. The form of that challenge will depend on the kid and the options they have.

 

Help your child think about where they want to be after high school. And realistically discuss what they need to do in high school to get there. There may be some silly hoops to jump through. Does the kid want it enough?

 

And life is certainly not determined by the college one gets into.

[Puma Mom]

I'll comment on the Spanish. My ds applied as an engineering major and the norm for them for a foreign language is 2 high school years or 2 college semesters. Ds did two college semesters and is done. No more Spanish.

 

Even the colleges that required 3 years of one language only required 2 years for the engineers.

[Jan P.]

I had my ds take the SAT every year from sophomore to senior. It is "kind of" required by our umbrella school. Yes, the all the scores will be sent to the colleges, but as far as I know every college accepted the highest score. My ds applied to Covenant College, Belhaven, Appalachian State, and the University of South Carolina at Sumter. His scores were accepted at all of these schools. He also did not take one SAT subject test. He took two courses at USC Sumter (computer science and intermediate algebra). He took these his senior year, but only his algebra course had any bearing on his application since it was taken during the fall. If you go the cc route then definitely get a course or two in before fall of senior year. My ds also took the ACT, but he did awful on it. I didn't send the scores to anyone. My ds received scholarship offers at every school, and Belhaven was the best offer. However, it still wasn't enough for my ds to attend because dh didn't want to take out a loan. :( So ds is attending the University of SC at Sumter on a Life Scholarship (for SC residents), and he even has a job there! I'm happy to have him home, and he is able to be very involved in my church. Things didn't go exactly the way that I wanted them to go, but it isn't a bad situation either.

 

I am glad that I stuck to my guns and did as much of a classical education as I could for my son. He is doing great in college, and I'm extremely proud of him. Have your dc take tests if they need to, but don't let them rule your life.

 

Blessings,

[Gwen in VA]

Wow that is a LOT of tests!!!!!

 

Before you go too far in planning which test to take when, I would really sit down and think about the colleges you could imagine your child going to. Find out what those colleges give credit for and what tests they encourage high schoolers to take.

 

Different colleges require and/or desire and/or give credit for different things. Our local community college gives NO credit for AP exams! (REALLY!) Many of the more elite colleges give NO credit for CLEP exams. Some of the more elite colleges give NO credit for any classes taken at a community college.

 

I think it would be an unusual college that would both require SAT-II's and give credit for CLEP's, so I would guess that you probably don't want to do both. (Check with the colleges!)

 

My kids did no CLEP exams because almost none of the colleges they are applying to give credit for them. So why bother?

 

Lastly, for some folks taking both the ACT and the SAT may be a good idea, but it is certainly not required. My kids took the SAT early (January of junior year) and did fabulously, so neither ever even considered doing the ACT. The ACT score would add nothing to their transcript. If you have a specific reason for doing both, by all means do, but you don't have to!

[Jan P.]

Gwen,

 

The reason my ds tried the ACT was because he had a low score on the SAT. He didn't prep for the ACT as he should have. If I remember correctly, he also had the flu! We gave up with the ACT and stuck with the SAT.

 

FWIW

[Nan in Mass]

I can't tell you yet whether this works because my son is a junior.

 

So far, we've stuck with the education we want for our children and they want for themselves, and almost completely ignored the rest of the world. Almost. We aren't expecting scholarships, so we aren't jumping through many hoops. We've shaped the education to the child. Sometimes that looks more like severely warped the norms and flexed schooling to the max possible while sticking with the general idea of TWTM flavoured classical education. My son travels for months at a time, during which he does no formal academics. We're doing great books aloud at a VERY slow rate, discussing them in an almost totally unguided way, and substituting drawing for writing quite a bit. We don't want to do 20th century depressing literature so we've substituted scifi. We didn't want to do biology so we substituted natural history, ham radio, and human anatomy for the first two years of science. We're rather slow at Latin, so we will have two credits for three years of Latin (and then probably switch to some French). My son is just reading the history book, and possibly writing a few papers, not discussing it (except where it intersects with the rest of life) or answering the questions in the book (except to read them before he reads the chapter and keep them in mind). We've opted to do NEM math because it is applied and top-down even though my son gets most of the problems wrong. We've opted to do Conceptual Physics even though it is physics-for-poets because it contains the useful bits of physics that I think my son will remember. And we're doing it awfully slowly because we have constant interruptions by new woodpeckers on the feeder and cool perpetual motion discoveries and the need to verify that yes indeed there are 7 1/2 gallons in a square foot by tracing around milk cartons. We're counting on geometry to fulfil the function of logic. I refuse to give grades because they would make it so I couldn't teach properly and would impede my children's learning. All that is just to give you an idea of how we've flexed things. We have a general strategy of math, great books, Latin (which I'm counting on for historical perspective, English grammar, and English vocab), music, drawing, gymnastics, and science every year when we are "doing school", and reading and/or traveling when we're not. In things with textbooks, I try to keep us making some forward progress even if it is slow, and in math, I am super careful to finish a book each year (that being the limiting factor if your child suddenly wants to become an engineer). Other than that, I try not to worry and just aim for teaching them the things I think are important to being good people.

 

So, what about college? I hope mine go. There are many, many colleges out there. Some are going to be out of reach financially or because they are too high academically and won't take my children. Some more are going to be out of reach because of the educational choices we are making, like no AP tests and no grades and a transcript listed according to subject instead of time (to accommodate those subjects covered in a more ahem flexible manner, like music at 10 minutes a few times a week for 4 years = 1/2 credit). Some are going to be out of reach of my older one because he isn't particularly academic (despite being talented and intelligent) and doesn't test very well. That is ok. I'm all for not closing any doors (why we are doing a math book per year), but not at the expense of my children's education.

 

As far as I can see, having ruled out scholarships, there are three main reasons to take those tests. One is for college credit. This seems to be if-y at best. Each college is different. If you know what college you are going to go apply to, then you can take this into account. Otherwise, it isn't very useful. And getting credit might mean that instead of getting used to the college experience while taking freshman level classes, you have to do it struggling with upper level classes that assume you covered a particular set of material in their particular basic level classes. We aren't interested in transfering credit. Another is because colleges require them. There are lots of colleges out there that require only SATs or ACTs. We're just going to have to go to one of those. Again, if at this point you know where you are going to apply and are sure you aren't going to change your mind, then you can tailor the education to that particular college's requirements. It isn't going to require PSATs, SATs, ACTs, CLEPs, and APs. The last is validating the mummy transcript. This reason is one that does concern us, especially since we aren't grading, but because my son doesn't test well, we are choosing to do the validating with community college classes. Besides, there are some subjects I can't teach well, like writing, and some that I think are very hard to reproduce at home, like certain laboratory sciences. I also want to ease my son back into the classroom/school situation before we dump him into college.

 

So where does that leave us? PSATs sophomore year for practice, SATs junior year and if score isn't as high as we think it might be senior year, a CC class in most areas (composition, chemistry, pre-calc, speech, and drawing - notice the heavy "communication" emphasis), and a reduced choice of colleges.

 

We could verify the mummy transcript with CLEPs, or SAT2s, or APs, classes at our high school, or online classes, but we have a nice CC here and it serves other purposes as well. I spoke with an admissions person at Hampshire, an alternative-y independent college, and she said in my son's situation, she would want to see SAT scores even if they weren't very good and 3 or 4 academic CC classes as demonstrative of his ability to handle college work. As someone pointed out, to apply to college, you have to get those CC classes in BEFORE you apply, which means you can't wait until senior year.

 

Phew! This is long! I went through a similarly depressing stage of my high school planning, before I worked out that an alternative, so I sympathize.

 

A few more bits of advice:

 

Get The Homeschoolers Guide to Portfolios and Transcripts by Heuer. It explains how to structure and document all that flexability in a way that will appeal to colleges.

 

Look at the NARS material for ideas on how to make your own course and its requirements. I'm sure you have ideas, but I found it comforting to compare my requirements to those of other people so I knew if I was requiring too much work or too little.

 

Cafi Cohen's books are useful for ideas, too, and comforting.

 

I kept (keep) track of the mishmash of everything we do by getting a notebook at the beginning of high school and dividing it into basic subjects like math, world history, writing, great books, natural history, chemistry, ..., leaving room for others as they occurred. Then when we do something, I write it down in the approapriate place. I choose, sometimes arbitrarily, which catagory to write the item in; I don't write anything in two places. Then, in the end, I'll move a few things around if need be and divide it into classes. I'll give them nice specific descriptive labels, like Ancient Literature and Analysis, and then make a transcript. Since my son is a junior, I've done a partial/tentative transcript a number of times in an effort to make sure we're covering the things I want us to cover. I also keep in mind what colleges are expecting to see (generally not a problem for classical homeschoolers) - 4 English, 4 math, 4 science including some lab sciences, 4 social studies, at least 2 foreign language, and some art or music. I have no problem taking a few grand subjects like peace studies and great books, and documenting them in a more conventional way as 4 years of English, 4 of social studies, and a few electives. We could easily call all our science Natural History 1-4, since it all IS natural history and we're looking at it all from that perspective, but I'm not going to GRIN.

 

I call our homeschooling style cosy-casual, since a lot of it is accomplished reading aloud or talking in front of the fire with the dog on our feet. Honestly, high school doesn't have to be the end of the good part of homeschooling. You have to put a firm limit on the academics and not let them take over your whole lives and crowd out other educational things like travel and building projects and volunteer work. And you have to not be afraid to cut down the possible colleges list a bit by picking and choosing which tests. Choose how you are going to validate your transcript and how you will demonstrate that your child is capable of doing college-level work, and then try not to worry. Not worrying is the hard part - sigh. Ask me how I know!

 

Hope this helps.

-Nan

[Janice in NJ]

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you to you gals! Thanks for talking me down off the ledge.

Not a good place.

Peeking over into the dark abyss wasn't fun. :eek:

I don't know WHY I EVER think it is going to be a productive pursuit.

 

Truth be told though. Ya'll got me thinking, and THAT is always good. I started poking around in the realms of testing, and specific schools, and all things scary for folks like me who NEED to know things but don't KNOW them yet ... I'm finding out that this isn't really the big, bad, scary thing that I thought it was. I know it's cliche, but "knowledge is power" for me. At the very least, it is the power to say NO to the ledge. :D

 

Rather than falling over the edge - you lifted me by my chin and pointed me in the direction of sunlit pastures... and gave me the confidence that WE REALLY could go there - to an amazingly cool place without sacrificing ANYTHING. NA DA!

 

How DO you do that?

It means so much.

What would I do without you?

 

THANK YOU SO, SO MUCH!

 

Peace,

Janice

[JFSinIL]

The school's do allow more than one AP test - if they overlap, there is a time slot built into the testing schedule for kids to take whatever test they missed due to conflicting test schedule. What a convoluted sentence - hope it makes sense.

[Donna J.]

SAT II - a strong college application has at least three of these. Some colleges I have looked at required three.

 

 

Have you all found this to be true today??

 

TIA

[Murphy101]

You don't normally need to do the SAT and the ACT. Get the practice/review books and see which one fits your student best. Some kids do better on one or the other. We are doing the ACT precisely because they can repeat it for better scores.

 

PSAT - take it if you feel your child has a shot and being a merit finalist. Otherwise, not much point to it as far as I can tell. No college requires it that I'm aware of.

 

SATII are great. Do them if and when they fit your over all academics. Don't sweat colleges saying they want it. If you can demonstrate comprehension of the subject in other ways (AP, CLEP, portfolio...) then the school can and usually will take that into consideration when you apply.

 

AP vs CLEP. I have no idea why there is so much hype over AP, when the CLEP is actually covering a higher level of material. (AP is, in theory, advance placement into college. CLEP is placement out of a college course.) what colleges will accept of either depends on many variables. Score. Major. Number of advance credits allowed. And so forth. For either, just taking the course/test isn't enough. They need a high score for it to get them anything in any college. (tho technically the CLEP is pass/fail, most colleges won't give credit unless you meet their score requirements.)

 

This year, we are doing ACT and a CLEP. In fact, we are about to take the West. Civ. I at the end of this month. I don't have to jump through hoops, I don't have to worry about getting AP approval for my course, and it doesn't require a written component (which my oldest would hate). After we complete West. civ. 2, I will contemplate the value of taking the world history sat2.

 

I am not an expert.

Nor do I play one on tv.

I'm just a mom in the trenches sharing her opinion based on her individual on-going journey.

Opinions subject to change at the whim of various detours in life changing those experiences and expectations previously presented.

Author not responsible for global or national educational flaming hoops or other obstacles that may unexpectedly and very likely arise at any given point in the education process.

[choirfarm]

You don't normally need to do the SAT and the ACT. Get the practice/review books and see which one fits your student best. Some kids do better on one or the other. We are doing the ACT precisely because they can repeat it for better scores.

 

.

 

I know this is an old thread. I'm going to disagree here. I think you should definitely take BOTH the ACT and the SAT. Different schools accept different ones. Different kids do well on one or the other. Also, some schools like Baylor and LeTourneau superscore. They take the highest math score they get and the highest verbal even if they are on different tests. Your test scores help determine how much merit aid you get. The Baylor rep said many kids take their SAT 4 times to get more aid. They had a ton of them taking the SAT in June after their senior year to get a couple thousand more in scholarships.

 

Christine

[memphispeg]

This is just our first year of homeschool, unfortunately (jr. year in highschool!!!!). The dd and I decided on the SAT and ACT, first. We will see which one she does "better" on and re-take it (after more-focussed studying). She will take the AP and the SAT II in Bio and USHistory. She will take the Math II SAT II. This should show that "Mom's Curriculum" was valid. We decided against the AP english exams. This way she can spend more time enjoying the literature and working on the actual courses (writing papers, etc.). Next year she will probably do AP Calc. for placement purposes as well as the German SAT II for the same reason.

The thing that gets me is that all this testing is soooo expensive. Almost like a black hole for money. One reason we homeschool is that we do not have v. much these days. We need money for books and class supplies.

[Julie in MN]

You don't *have* to do both the ACT and SAT. Most colleges have a preference, which is usually SAT on the coasts and ACT in most of the center of the country. I think most colleges will accept either, but really you only need to work on one, if you want, especially if you are planning to do all those other tests.

 

Julie

[Murphy101]

You don't *have* to do both the ACT and SAT. Most colleges have a preference, which is usually SAT on the coasts and ACT in most of the center of the country. I think most colleges will accept either, but really you only need to work on one, if you want, especially if you are planning to do all those other tests.

 

Julie

 

:iagree:

 

This is not a question necessarily of requirement or right vs wrong.

 

Each family really needs to determine what their priorities and abilities are best spent.

 

None of these exams are free in either time or finance and none of them define the student as a whole.

:)

[Jane in NC]

I have no idea why there is so much hype over AP, when the CLEP is actually covering a higher level of material.

 

 

I am questioning this statement. More colleges give credit for AP than CLEP. Why would that be true if CLEP covered a higher level of material?

 

The LAC that my son attends does not recognize CLEP credits but does give credit for certain AP scores. We have seen this to be the norm at the more competitive schools.

 

Perhaps the AP/CLEP situation is best addressed as "ask the college".

 

Jane

[Murphy101]

I completely agree that whether CLEP and or AP for any subject will be accepted should be asked of the colleges. Absolutely that will be the final answer source.:)

 

As for why colleges do what they do - there is a many headed question.:tongue_smilie:

 

According to College Board:

 

1438 four year colleges accept CLEP.

 

1611 four year colleges accept AP.

 

1209 four year colleges accept both.

[Susan C.]

Hi Janice :)

 

What I did with ds and will do with dd:

 

PSAT - Neither of my dc will score high enough to get anything. So scratch.

SAT - Do practice tests at home, first test, end of junior year. Ds only improved that score by 10 points in the fall of his senior year. So no more. Dd is taking her first this June. We finish school in May, and prep for three weeks, just SAT prep.

SAT II - Didn't do any. I would do them only if the college your dc might want to attend requires them.

CLEP - I couldn't figure these out. The gist of what I got was take the test (for us 45 min. away, not many dates), before its scored, decide it you want to have it scored and sent??? My brain fritzed out, and we didn't do any.

ACT - Ds got a good SAT score, so skipped this too. We'll see for dd. One good thing about ACT is that you are not penalized for guessing, you are for SAT.

AP - Not happening with me as the teacher, and not happening at homeschool. There needs to be something left of me after this is over. And I have heard from those how have gone that route that it is quite difficult to get a decent score on the AP test. A know of one mom who jumped through the hoops of getting a class or two classified AP, but didn't have her ds do the test. Not for me. Both of my kids are good students, but they are creatives. A good compromise for us is honors, and I have done a few classes that were enough to be considered honors.

[Susan C.]

A very old thread, I hope Janice sees this and has stayed off of the ledge!!

 

:)

[Janice in NJ]

Neat thread. Even though this lady was NUTS! Much thanks to the gals on the board for talking her down.

 

The lad who was reading Silas Marner is a senior this year. College acceptances are coming in - from good secular engineering schools. And who would have thought? Merit aid.

 

When we get all of the data and the lad makes a decision, I'll share it with ya'll.

 

Testing: I came to my senses.

 

SAT and ACT. My other two kids will do both. Worked well for us.

 

SAT II in Physics

 

No AP's for college admission info. He is taking AP Calc this year but the test won't show up until after the college decision is made.

 

No CLEP's. We thought about it last summer. But there was no time to study for the actual test which is probably good; his #1 choice right now doesn't accept them. Instead ds did a summer-long senior project in engineering: hydronic heating. Great choice! A terrific experience for him.

 

Ds took one course dual-enrollment at the CC his senior year. A fabulous experience for him. Just terrific in so many ways! And he decided not to take another course in the spring because he wanted to get a part time job. Another great choice. Who would have thought?

 

I get it now. I get SO much now. You really do have to try to make the path fit the child. They just can't shine using someone else's flashlight - no mater how many promises are listed on the box. :001_smile:

 

Peace,

Janice

 

Enjoy your little people

Enjoy your journey

Edited March 14, 2011 by Janice in NJ

[Storm Bay]

A very old thread, I hope Janice sees this and has stayed off of the ledge!!

 

:)

 

Yes, and I hadn't paid attention at first and thought that Myrtle was back.

[creekland]

Neat thread. Even though this lady was NUTS! Much thanks to the gals on the board for talking her down.

 

The lad who was reading Silas Marner is a senior this year. College acceptances are coming in - from good secular engineering schools. And who would have thought? Merit aid.

 

When we get all of the data and the lad makes a decision, I'll share it with ya'll.

 

Testing: I came to my senses.

 

SAT and ACT. My other two kids will do both. Worked well for us.

 

SAT II in Physics

 

No AP's for college admission info. He is taking AP Calc this year but the test won't show up until after the college decision is made.

 

No CLEP's. We thought about it last summer. But there was no time to study for the actual test which is probably good; his #1 choice right now doesn't accept them. Instead ds did a summer-long senior project in engineering: hydronic heating. Great choice! A terrific experience for him.

 

Ds took one course dual-enrollment at the CC his senior year. A fabulous experience for him. Just terrific in so many ways! And he decided not to take another course in the spring because he wanted to get a part time job. Another great choice. Who would have thought?

 

I get it now. I get SO much now. You really do have to try to make the path fit the child. They just can't shine using someone else's flashlight - no mater how many promises are listed on the box. :001_smile:

 

Peace,

Janice

 

Enjoy your little people

Enjoy your journey

 

 

I was curious as to how it all worked out. Thanks for the update!

 

As for us, oldest did the ACT and SAT - did better on the ACT. He had one cc class, but that's it and it (all) got him exactly where he wanted to go with decent merit aid.

 

Middle did the PSAT and ACT - did better on the ACT, so will be skipping the SAT. I have planned two SAT II's for him this summer. He's also done two cc classes already and might add one more next year (his senior year). That will be it. We'll see what happens.

 

Youngest son? (currently 9th grade) I'm just starting to think about his plans. Right now I have the PSAT on the horizon for him for next year. Then we'll see where he goes from there. I'm not that concerned just yet. ;)

[Brenda in MA]

I get it now. I get SO much now. You really do have to try to make the path fit the child. They just can't shine using someone else's flashlight - no mater how many promises are listed on the box. :001_smile:

 

Peace,

Janice

 

Janice,

 

I love this quote! So true. Your ds's path sounds similar to the path my son took. One problem I'm having now, though, is that next ds in the pipeline is sooooo different from his older brother. I hate having to recreate the wheel. I really wish they came with instruction manuals!!!!

 

Peace to you as your son makes his decision,

Brenda