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Unusual situation ... or at least *I* think it is


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My daughter is 19 and just officially graduated from a not-so-good, not-so-informative, online school. I just had her do it to say that she graduated because I didn't think she ever would. The situation is that she (and I) wish we had NOT gone that route or at least would have picked a better online school even if it had taken her longer. We also agree that she needs more schooling before she can really do anything else. She hasn't even taken Algebra 1 yet and has had very little science. She knows a lot about World History and reads very well (started when she was 4). I feel like I have short-changed her, but know there is no way to go back in time to fix this. She is very willing to do whatever it takes to redo high school. Is there any way we can do this in 2 years or less? I would like to give her some options so she feels like she has some control over this situation. I hope I am making sense here.

 

Thanks,

Luanne :(

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I'm wondering how the online school could graduate her without algebra? Or science? Aren't those state requirements?

 

Has she taken the ACT or SAT?

 

I'd have to know a little more detail about exactly where she stands before I'd know what to suggest.

 

What are her goals? Where exactly is she as far as math and science are concerned?

 

I'm sure if you provide a little more information, you'll get plenty of help here.

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Like I said ... the online school was not very good at all. She just took a general math course. She has done pre-algebra. I don't think she has even had Life science yet... so basically 6th grade science was her last science class. There were chemistry and biology classes she took with the online school, but she didn't understand them at all and was allowed to use her book to do the tests. Those were the classes she scored lowest in too.

 

She has not taken the ACT or the SAT and I know if she did right now, she would do VERY poorly on either test.

 

She would like to go on to college. She started taking a Wedding Consultant course online and decided that isn't what she wants to do. She was actually thinking something along the line of Geologist, Detective, Photography, and writing books. She has varied interests (as you can probably tell)

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Could she attend a community college nearby and start with a *Beginning Biology/Geography* class? And then work up to a chemistry or physics class in the sequence the college has set up? Concurrent with a Beginning Bio class, she may be able to enroll for Beginning Algebra. You mentioned, she reads well - how are her writing skills?

If science/math is the main concern, I don't think she needs to *redo* High School but rather fill the gaps with specific classes. Here in CA, a student does not even need to have graduated from High School to attend community college part-time. No ACT or SAT's are required.

 

She'll have time to make it up, especially since she is motivated.

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I'm wondering how the online school could graduate her without algebra? Or science? Aren't those state requirements?

 

 

There are usually no state requirements for homeschoolers to graduate, so yes, this on-line school could make up its own requirements.

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There are usually no state requirements for homeschoolers to graduate, so yes, this on-line school could make up its own requirements.

 

:o I think I knew that, but forgot it.

 

But if states can determine what subjects are mandatory for K-8,even for private homeschoolers (right? no?) I don't understand about high school not having guidelines. Am I confused? I sure feel like it.

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But if states can determine what subjects are mandatory for K-8,even for private homeschoolers (right? no?) I don't understand about high school not having guidelines. Am I confused? I sure feel like it.

 

I know that in TX, there is NO follow-up for homeschoolers. We do not report to ANYone.

 

IF on the rare chance some authority figure actually bothers asking us about homeschooling, we need only submit a statement that we are indeed teaching the required subjects of reading, spelling, grammar, mathematics and a study of good citizenship..but the state does not specifiy the scope n sequence.

 

My biggest questions would be:

 

1. Is there any hurry for her to go to college? I'd have no qualms about my kids spending more time on general education stuff if they didn't feel ready for a college atmosphere or class. She's only 19!!! It's really not that dire, imnsho :cool:

 

2. Will your budget allow you to enroll dd in a correspondence school that has a solid reputation? Or do you need more budget friendly options to get her "up to speed"? Do you have any local co-op classes that you can take advantage of?

 

3. Are there any personality issues you need to work around? is she REALLY motivated to learn, or just doing the miniumum to squeak by? would she learn better w/ hands on stuff, video courses, or does she need a tutor to really work WITH her?

 

4. Off the top of my head, I'd encourage her to spend a lot of time at the nearest natural history museum to explore her interest in geology, and maybe see if she can apprentice w/ a local photographer for a short time.

 

good luck!

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. . . that are designed to get students up to speed.

 

Frequently, if you go to the CC, they will give placement tests as pre-requisites to enrolling, and will direct the student to appropriate "remedial" classes. These courses don't count toward college credit or toward graduation, but they are great for helping students coming from various backgrounds to get ready to move on.

 

--Jenny

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I, too, would be inclined to investigate the community college option, assuming that you live under an hour's drive from one. They offer all subjects at a remedial level. I just checked the CO cc system and their admission process includes an assessment at the college rather than requiring an ACT or SAT.

 

Though remedial classes may not count toward a degree, taking them at the CC would allow the student to move on in life socially and be with young people her age who are doing similar level work.

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:o I think I knew that, but forgot it.

 

But if states can determine what subjects are mandatory for K-8,even for private homeschoolers (right? no?) I don't understand about high school not having guidelines. Am I confused? I sure feel like it.

 

Yes, they can decide which subjects are mandatory. But it usually is not content-specific. IOW, it's *usually* something like "Subjects must include math, English, state history, and science," not specific like "three years of English to include American, British and world literature; one year each of world and U.S. history, one year of algebra..."

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Agreeing with the posts to pursue Community College or maybe a vocational track at a university (these seem to be popping up). Chances are that there are more students ill-prepared out there than we realize given the increase in remedial courses a colleges these days so she won't be alone. Don't fret about the past but focus on where she can met all her needs going forward. It's great that you are there to guide and help her!

 

Mary

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That sounds like an idea worth checking out. Or maybe she could study for her GED if she needs that to get in? I was asking about the ACT/SAT because I think it's needed here in TN to go to cc, so I thought it might be in other states.

 

 

Don't just assume that the ACT or SAT is needed to enter a community college. I thought the same thing, but then I talked to a teacher at our local community college. She said at their cc that the student only had to take a placement exam. I would contact the cc that you are interested in your dd enrolling and ask them what the requirements are.

 

Also, staying at home and learning some algebra at home wouldn't be a bad thing. If you have the money then try something online. There are many very good online courses other than the one you tried. Did you know that the University of Tennessee has a distance learning option for high school kids? You could contact them to see if your dd could take particular courses (not all four years of high school). I think you can take individual courses from them. I looked into it over a year ago for my senior at the time. However, I'm not sure of what the cut off age is for their high school classes.

 

Onlline options I think I would use:

Scholar's Online

Potter's School

University of Pennsylvania (high school courses)

Writing Assessments

Write At Home

Keystone High School

 

HTH,

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My son is doing this and I can't say enough good things about it. Here, you just need to take a placement test. It is multiple choice and untimed, if I remember correctly. It has three parts - math, reading, and writing. If your daughter does poorly on the math, all that will happen is that she will need to start the math sequence lower down, with the general math instead of with algebra and she won't receive college credit for the class. No biggie. Our community college has lots of cool majors, like airplane pilot, graphic artist, nursing, cosmetology, child care, accountant, ... or you can major in liberal arts or pre-engineering and transfer after the 2 years. If you have a 3.0 or better grade point average, the state university will automatically accept you and you can continue to pay community college tuition. Here, they are friendly, helpful, dedicated people. To sign up, you can just walk in and they will walk you through what to do. I think we needed to bring some form of id and it took several visits to get all the testing and paperwork done, but it was easy. You can apply for financial aid, too. I know that the quality of community colleges varies from place to place, but ours has been great so far, the perfect bridge between homeschooling and college, with the nice safety net feeling that if for some reason college doesn't work out, he will be well on his way to getting an associates degree in a career. Ours also offers "certificate programs". These are like the associate degrees for a career, but without the general education classes so they can be completed in less time.

In the meantime (since this is the first week of classes here and it might be too late where you are to sign up for the spring term), people have said good things about Aleks math.

HTH

-Nan

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I also wanted to chime in about the community college option. I used to tutor adults who often had serious educational gaps (this was adult literacy tutoring, so you can imagine how and why that was the case - not saying this is your dd's situation!). We usually recommended that they work toward a GED, if needed, and then go on to CC if they wanted a college degree. I was really impressed with the offerings at the CC for people who needed remedial work even after the GED. And the nice thing about CC is that people of all ages routinely attend - no one will ask why she didn't start at 18 or why she's taking whatever courses she needs.

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Yes, go and talk to them. They can help you fill out the forms to apply for financial aid or explain how to get a loan. Financial aid can take the form of an on-campus job (easier to fit in around your classes), a reduction in tuition, a loan, or a combination of the above. Sometimes they even take into account the other expenses involved, like books and transportation. Almost all people who go to college have some sort of financial aid. You can't tell whether you can afford it or not until you go into the school and ask how much you would *really* have to pay. Many, many people begin their careers paying off school loans. There are low-interest government loans available that you don't start paying back until a few months after graduation (long enough to find that job and get settled into it). Even if you can't afford for your daughter to go full-time, perhaps she could take just one or two classes, science for example, at the CC and work on the rest at home with you. But you can't tell until you go and fill out the forms and they process them. Hopefully you will be pleasantly surprised.

-Nan

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I was hoping to just pull something together at home for her.

 

I am wondering about cost also. When I checked the cc that looks most suitable for my dd, tuition cost for *one credit* was $150. That means a single remedial course is probably going to run $500 or more (not counting transportation costs).

 

CC is still a bargain here compared to the tuition costs of other school, but it seems to me these costs put even CC out of reach for a lot of students. I can see taking out loans if you're going to be able to pay them back from a better job, but what I am seeing is that an AA and often even a BA does *not* guarantee a reasonable well-paying job afterwards.

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I'm friends with a family who 'home schools' in our town. They have 8 children at home--ages 1-25. The oldest is profoundly handicaped. The oldest son is in the military (he is the only child that attended public schools).

This family does NOT provide their children with any education above the 1st or 2nd grade level. Their 2nd grade son does not know his alphabet yet... My oldest dd is friends with their 15 yr old dd--she has not had ANY school work for the past 2 years (their mom will by workbooks at Wal-Mart if the kids ask for them)--she just babysits the younger ones or works cleaning apartments with her mother. They are really nice people--but education is not a priority. They are NOT unschoolers they are ANTI-schoolers...girls just need to know how to cook and clean and make babies... teenage sons dig ditches and fence posts and other manual labor jobs as soon as they are able to get work...If the children want to learn/school they have to do it on their own--a very sad situation.

 

One of the older daughters (20yrs) was 'graduated' from their homeschool without knowing how to write a complete sentence--and math skills were about a 4th grade level (at least she had learned to read on her own). She really REALLY wanted to go to college. She is now in her 3rd year of community college and is finally taking classes for actual college credit. Basically she used the community college for her highschool level courses. It will take her 7 years going full time to complete a bachelor's degree.

 

Most community college placement tests will test writing and math skills. The will offer remedial--non-credit courses to help bring the students up to credit level.

 

Your dd will need the equivalent of Algebra 1 and Algebra 2--don't worry about Geometry--these can be learned in less than one year. Science courses can be taken that are similar to highschool level (many homeschoolers use these for actually highschool credit--dual enrollment). Depending on your dd's writing ability she may need to take/pass a non-credit writing lab class to qualify to take courses like Science, History...

 

She really does not need a full highschool program--especially at her age. I really suggest talking with your local community college counselor--they are used to working with students in your dd's situation and will be able to answer your questions and help your dd to set goals that she can reach.

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I was hoping to just pull something together at home for her.

 

As others have said, Community College will be your best bet, particularly in your state. Classes are $77 per credit (or about $240 per 3 credit course) which is about half the price of most online high school programs. She doesn't have to take the SAT or ACT in CO, just sign up for the placement test. They also have a distance learning option here: http://www.ccconline.org/ .

 

At 19, your daughter should be able to get a job waiting tables or something to help offset the cost. She shouldn't do work study if she can help it because the jobs they offer pay a pittance. It's not going to be easy, but if she's motivated (and you said she was), then she should be able to buckle down and do it. My 17yo has been working as a busser and hostess at the local grill in order to pay for her college classes since she turned 16. It began as a sort of punishment for rebellion...long story...but paying for her classes has been a huge motivator for her to do well. We pay for her car insurance and gas, but her classes are her responsibility. She paid for 14 hours last semester and is paying for 17 hours this semester. Colleges almost always offer a payment plan option, so this is entirely doable.

 

Honestly, at this point in time, I don't think putting high school together at home is a reasonable option. She needs to get out there and stretch her wings and take on some responsibility for her education.

 

Barb

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Luanne -- I would highly recommend going the community college route. At least in Colorado, the community colleges are decent, the credits are guaranteed transferable (within the Colorado college system), and they even offer online classes. The prices are pretty cheap,too.

 

She would need to apply and take some placement tests -- and she will most likely need to do some remedial work in math. That is perfectly fine -- they have plenty of those classes with good individual tutoring available (I know this from personal experience).

 

They have counselor's available she can talk with who can help her select the correct classes -- for instance, she may be ready for introduction to Literature but probably doesn't want to take Biology I just yet.

 

The community colleges also have excellent activities, ranging from student government to sports, that would give her an opportunity to get involved with other "involved" students (people who are older or working full-time don't usually do the extra stuff).

 

Since she has graduated from high school, she is eligible for financial aid -- and make sure she checks out any transfer scholarships; for some, you have to sign up the first semester to get the most money.

 

good luck -- and email me if you have any questions, I attended Pikes Peak Community College for two years and my son also took classes there. All the Colorado Community colleges are consolidated into the same system, so they all operate very similiarly.

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  • 2 months later...
I was hoping to just pull something together at home for her.

 

Unless you are able to teach high school math & science totally on your own, or unless she can work through them on her own, there are no free/cheap options. But I'm guessing that if you had been able to, or she had been able to, that you would have done it already.

 

ALEK's is relatively cheap. It's online and $20 per month. They have algebra I, though I wouldn't call it a complete course. She could at least sign up for the free month, take the assessment, and see where she scores.

 

However, I really agree with the others, that despite the cost, it would be good for her to work with the community college. Maybe it would be best to start with her GED, but the community college counselors should be helpful. If the fact that she "graduated" prevents the GED and that is the best route, I would be honest about the quality of the schooling and withdraw the "graduated" title. As a homeschooler, you get to decide whether she graduated or not. Decide after you find out what the best option is.

 

At her age, many, many people work their way through school. That sounds like it would be a good option for her. She can take a couple courses at a time while doing some work. Waiting tables, as someone suggested, is good money for unskilled labor, and you can get jobs exclusively at night, so that you're free during the day to take classes. Good luck!

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Don't just assume that the ACT or SAT is needed to enter a community college.
You're right, you can't assume that. WA community colleges don't require them. But Gardenschooler is right about TN community colleges -- they do require the SAT or ACT (most specify the ACT). That's what they use for placement.
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:o I think I knew that, but forgot it.

 

But if states can determine what subjects are mandatory for K-8,even for private homeschoolers (right? no?) I don't understand about high school not having guidelines. Am I confused? I sure feel like it.

 

Most states only specify what subjects should be covered but not in which sequence or how much depth. And only PA has any requirements for graduation (as far as I know, those are optional unless people want the state-approved diploma).

 

There's nothing to understand. It just is what it is :-)

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I was hoping to just pull something together at home for her.

 

Have you checked into the cost of c.c.? It might not be as bad as you think.

 

And just because she has graduated doesn't mean you can't do more with her at home in the areas she's weak in.

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