titianmom Posted March 9, 2010 Share Posted March 9, 2010 (edited) Hi, I have a girl who can write a basic essay already but could use some help with motivation as well as perfecting a good essay. She writes because she has to.... I've just discovered MCT (Michael Clay Thompson) materials on another thread and I've been to the website. Frankly the sample looks a bit dry but I'd like to hear from others who use it regularly. Would this program help her? Can you start in the middle of the program like this? Also, she has an LA program already that explains the components of writing but she rarely applies it and I usually have to make her start over. THis is an attitude problem more than anything, so if it's pretty dry, MCT may not help her much. Kim Edited March 9, 2010 by titianmom addition Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shawna in Texas Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Hi, I have a girl who can write a basic essay already but could use some help with motivation as well as perfecting a good essay. She writes because she has to.... I've just discovered MCT (Michael Clay Thompson) materials on another thread and I've been to the website. Frankly the sample looks a bit dry but I'd like to hear from others who use it regularly. Would this program help her? Can you start in the middle of the program like this? Also, she has an LA program already that explains the components of writing but she rarely applies it and I usually have to make her start over. THis is an attitude problem more than anything, so if it's pretty dry, MCT may not help her much. Kim swimmermom3 has both Town and Voyage. Do a search on the K-8 board because we've discussed the writing quite a bit. I'm only in Town and we cover each lesson twice so we are only halfway through. We don't find it dry or boring in the least. I find his instructions to be very clear, not condescending, and explicit. I think that if she can already write a pretty good paragraph, then Essay would work out well. I'm not sure if Essay is as grammar enriched as Town. MCT really wants to make sure you have the grammar down. I don't know if it would help with motivation, though. In the Town book, it's almost deceptive. He gives these super simple assignments with such depth, that she doesn't really think she's working that hard until she sees the final result. I think it's definitely worth a look. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
titianmom Posted March 10, 2010 Author Share Posted March 10, 2010 I'll check the other board. Motivation is an issue, here. She was a great little worker until puberty hit. Sigh. I told her once that we can fix ignorance, but laziness is forever. :) Kim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Marple Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Hi Kim, I'm using Magic Lens and Essay Voyage with 9th and 8th. I wish I could answer your questions, but we have really only begun with Essay Voyage and I'm not sure I can tell you what you want to know. I chose Essay Voyage because it seemed to build on what the boys already knew. They have had a good amount of training in the 5 paragraph essay, but I wouldn't call them "comfortable" with it. They still make errors with topic sentences, sentences that have NOTHING to do with the paragraph, writing good intros and conclusions, etc. I felt that Essay Voyage would give them more experience in writing a *good* paragraph. We have used a variety of writing programs over the years (esp. with the oldest 2 boys) and, IMO, Essay Voyage is the least dry of the bunch. But it might not be your flavor. Like most things I use, I will probably tweak it to fit my needs which may mean altering the assignment a bit. But, like I said, we've only just started it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
titianmom Posted March 10, 2010 Author Share Posted March 10, 2010 (edited) Mine isn't *that* much diff than your boys. Most of her paras are good but she occasionally doesn't match verb tenses or uses the same word too many times or whatever. Not perfect but at least organizationally it's good and she stays on topic for the most part. And I keep preaching that there can be more than 5 paras, ha! IT's okay to steer away from the format a bit as long as the components are all there, with maybe some nice transitional paras. I was reading MCT's thoughts on Research papers and had to laugh, because we've (hubby esp) had professors who said just the opposite, that they didn't want ANY opinion in a research paper at all, and MCT lists it as the least desirable type of research paper - no opinions, just facts. :) (This was at the Master's level, too...) Just shows you that every professor does something different. And it depends upon the class. English vs, say, an Econ class. Excerpt from MCT's Classics in the Classroom, About Research Papers: "Furthermore, the research paper offers the teacher a way to force students to comprehend and articulate abstract ideas. In fact, I give my students a handout that helps to teach them that the research paper can be a vehicle for outstanding intellectual creativity. Organized from the least desirable at the bottom, to the most desirable at the top, here it is: (Notice what's at the bottom...) Copyright 2006, Royal Fireworks Press Advanced Thinking in Research 1. Creation of Ideas (What he considers the most desirable): A. Production of an elaborate entirely new and original critical or interpretive idea, theory, or model. A highly elaborated original idea regarding the subject researched, with possible brief presentation of other preexisting ideas as a framework for presentation of the new idea. An elaborate, detailed case made for the validity of the original idea, based on factual, logical, and or expert evidence also discovered in research. Example: The undiscovered theme in the plays of Bernard Shaw. B. Comparison of researched ideas with self-created interpretation of ideas. An elaborate comparison of competing researched ideas, supporting neither, resolving in favor of a more valid original critical or interpretive idea, theory, or model, with a case made for the validity of the original idea. Example: The inadequacy of three theoretical models of social mobility, with a new model suggested. 2. Evaluation of Ideas A. Evaluation of compared competing ideas. Close comparison of two or more competing ideas discovered in research, with a case made supporting some, one, or none of the ideas, on the basis of factual, logical, and or expert evidence also discovered in research. Example: Why the particle theory of gravity is a better model than the wave theory of gravity. B. Evaluation of an idea discovered in research. Close examination of an idea discovered in research, with a case made for or against the idea, on the basis of factual, logical, and or expert evidence also discovered in research. Example: A refutation of J.M. Whistler’s attacks on the originality of Oscar Wilde’s theories of art. 3. Reporting of Ideas A. Comparison of competing researched ideas. A close comparison of two or more competing ideas, with no outside case made for or against any of the ideas. Example: Randall Jarrell’s vs. D.H. Lawrence’s thoughts on the poetry of Walt Whitman. B. Thesis report of researched idea. A presentation of a critical or scholarly idea, with no attempt to evaluate the validity of the idea, to compare it with other competing theories, or to challenge the idea with evidence or ideas of one’s own. Example: Randall Jarrell’s interpretation of the poetry of Robert Frost. 4. Reporting of Facts—Not Allowed (What he considers the least desirable): Though there is a scholarly place for high-quality factual reports, I do not allow students to do them as research papers in my class. I feel that students need to learn to discuss ideas, and that the research paper is a good opportunity for them to practice articulating literary and intellectual ideas. A. Theme biographical fact report. A report of factual information clearly and intelligently organized around a central theme. No production of original ideas. This variety is not acceptable in a research paper for my class, since I wish you to focus your discussion on ideas, rather than facts. Example: Charles Dickens’s relationship with his family. B. Encyclopedia-style themeless chronological biographical fact report. Inappropriate for advanced scholarship. Example: The life of Charles Dickens, from birth to death. Only the themes in category 4 are not acceptable for research papers in my class—students must discuss literature, not authors. The nature of the theme a student selects will depend heavily on what emerges in the research. It is impossible for a student to decide in advance to do a theme from category one, simply because the student regards that category as more advanced. " END Excerpt. Edited March 10, 2010 by titianmom clear out junk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EKS Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 I am using Essay Voyage with my 8th grader. The short answer is yes, I think EV would be just fine for a 9th grader. However, my son didi think that the voyage theme especially of Grammar Voyage was a bit much, but the theme is much less prominent in Essay Voyage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.