Consequences for viewing porn?

[Chris in VA]

I need some help coming up with consequences for viewing porn on the computer by my 17yos. Yeah, that one. He not only viewed it but also tried to cover his tracks. We already have Safe Eyes on the computer, but I forgot to log out. He's not allowed to use it without permission, so he must have done it after I was in bed. The computer is in the den, in full view of everyone, but, as I said, I went to bed, and my husband wasn't in the room all night.

 

He's not a Christian or of any religious belief, he has been s...ually active and doesn't buy it that porn is harmful in any way. Anyone got any resources of a non-religious type that might tell him why it's so bad for you?

 

Pls don't respond to this post if you are of the opinion that porn is not harmful--you are certainly entitled to your perspective, but that's not the kind of help I'm looking for. TIA

[Renee in NC]

Take away his computer priveleges in your house. You aren't going to convince him that it is wrong and he has shown that he won't respect your wishes.

 

Password protect the whole computer and don't let him use it for anything. If he needs it for school, he can go to the computer lab or the library.

[Chris in VA]

Yep, we've pretty much done that (take away comp privleges). Anything else?

[SonshineLearner]

No library. Is there a secular person that might believe porn is bad?? Since he's not a Christian, that's not going to be something that persuades him. Is he in public school this coming year?

Lots of physical labor that doesn't include being with guys who swear and curse.... On my computer, I can make it so that you can't use the computer after a certain hour. When I had a family member that was causing problems at home, I checked out an island that you can drop off teens. I'm starting to think that most teens should be dropped off at 15 and picked up at 20...off some island set up to protect their minds, and make them work all day...and they'd sleep all night:-)

 

Sorry for what your family is dealing with...Action and Prayer.... Let us know how it's going...

Carrie

[Renee in NC]

Yep, we've pretty much done that (take away comp privleges). Anything else?

 

What consequences have worked for his other behavior issues? What do his future plans entail? What is your goal?

 

I am not real big on punishing older teens, but bounaries are good. If he wants to look at porn, you can't stop him unless you remove all access, which means not letting him leave your sight.

 

I don't know that *anything* would be effective at this point due to his lack of respect for authority (if I am remembering the right teen.) Is there anyone whose opinion he respects?

[Tree House Academy]

Take the computer out of your family room. Put it in your bedroom or in a locked closet area. It sounds drastic and like a PITA, but he is not 18 yet and he still lives in your home. He has to obey your rules. I would also confront him on what he did and perhaps, if applicable, ground him by taking his car keys away for a week (or whatever else it is that he loves to do/use). At 17, it is so hard because they are SO CLOSE to being adults.

 

If he likes porn, you likely won't stop him from looking at it. There is an abundance of it out there - internet is just one place. Movies/videos are readily available and likely he has friends who are over 18 who can buy it for him.

 

As for why it is harmful if you are not Christian, I am not sure that is possible to explain. It is toxic to a marriage, but he is NOT married either. When I was 9 mos preggo and going into labor with my first child, my ex husband was tying up the phone line (read: I couldn't reach him to say, "I am on my way to the hospital in LABOR!) downloading Pamela and Tommy Lee porn. :( So....ask me how I know about the porn in a marriage thing. Oh, and note I did say my EX husband....

[Love2Smile]

I totally feel for you! I think the op's have given you some great advice..just wanted you to know I'm thinking of you

[springmama]

A friend caught her teen son looking at porn once and I believe she told him that since he enjoys looking at filth, he can clean. I think over the course of a few days he cleaned all of the windows, baseboards, gutters, etc. I'm sure there were other consequences that probably had to do with their Catholic beliefs.

[anotherclassicmom]

I wonder if you can come at it from the angle that it makes woman seem like they are s*x toys, not to be valued. It will cause him and his future spouse nothing but pain if he thinks that porn is real life. I would try to discuss it in the sense of how it is not real life, and it will effect his view on women in a negative sense. It will affect his daily life if he lets it get him hooked into needing a fix at work, (fired) or if his future spouse is not into it (divorce) or if he begins to see people in his daily life and fantasize (sex crimes) even in talk. People are very sensitive to se*xual harassment now.

 

Not sure this helps, but I would give it everything in my power to try before he reaches 18.

[LaxMom]

No library. Is there a secular person that might believe porn is bad?? ...

Carrie

 

Yes. I believe, particularly in young, inexperienced people ("inexperience" being lack of the fully developed social understanding that comes only with, well, experience in the world), that such viewing creates a terribly skewed, one-dimensional view of women and appropriate interactions between people.

 

I don't take exception to nudity. I don't take exception to graphic depictions of s-x. I take exception to depicting any human in a role that does not accept them as a wholly formed person, and porn tends to portray people only as interactive objects.

 

Such a point of reference is damaging to interpersonal relationships. It gives viewer the impression that people are a disposable commodity, without depth or worth in their own right.

 

I have no advice about consequences that you haven't already thought of, though. Sorry.

[Dana]

Is there a secular person that might believe porn is bad??

 

I'm secular and I believe porn is bad.

I don't have links to any data, so I doubt this will convince the OP's son in any way, but these ideas may give some starting points to look for data.

 

I believe porn creates unrealistic body image representations in the brain. You're building neuron connections for unrealistic images and sexual behavior. This can prevent you from being content with reality (true for both men and women).

 

The porn industry is harmful to the people involved. Women are active for only a brief period of time and abuse is rampant. I read Jenna Jameson's autobiography through the library and find her very pitiful. I don't know if reading about the people involved might provide some empathy for your son and see the actors as humans instead of objects.

 

I thought Boogie Nights did a good job of representing the porn industry. Overall a very boring movie even with the sex and nudity. But it does show some of the damage the industry does.

 

There was also a 20/20 or a Dateline show - years ago - about the porn industry. It traced one actress from entering the industry to "success" in it. Again, very pitiful.

 

Don't know if this gives any help.

In the meantime, I'd also pull the computer to your bedroom. Good luck.

[HFClassicalAcademy]

I don't have teens, but just shouting out some advice. It doesn't matter if he's almost 18, is 18, or 100. If he is living in YOUR house...he needs to follow YOUR rules. As to punishment... I agree that he should have all computer privileges taken away. On top of that, I would have him write out reasons why porn IS bad.....over and over and over again. This might sound childish, but it is a punishment he won't forget.

 

From a non-religious perspective as to why porn is bad. Here are some reasons to get you started. BTW, all I did was google why porn is bad.

 

1) Pornography feeds lust of the eyes and lust of the flesh, which are never satisfied. It leaves the viewer craving more and more in order to achieve the same "sexual high."

 

2) Pornography sexualizes the viewer's mindset. It warps and perverts their perspective such that sex is unnaturally elevated in their thoughts. Porn's images are stamped into viewer's brain with the aid of hormones released during sexual arousal. Even if a person decides to stop looking at porn, the past images can remain for years or even a lifetime.

 

3) Pornography promotes destructive practices and can lead to progressive addiction.

 

4) Pornography intensifies an individual's drive to serve oneself, rather than serve others. For example, masturbation, which typically accompanies looking at pornography reinforces a self-centered sexual orientation (i.e. lust), which can detract from a person's ability to give and receive love.

 

5) Pornography addiction can lead to debt. The convenience of credit card transactions on the internet encourages covert spending without limit.

 

6) By viewing and/or purchasing porn, viewers are supporting the porn industry and facilitating its growth. By viewing porn, the viewer is also contributing to the sexual exploitation of whoever or whatever is in the images he or she is viewing.

 

7) Looking at porn can damage the viewer's family relationships, not to mention increasing the chance of his or her spouse and children finding the material.

 

8) Looking at porn at work could damage the viewer's reputation, decrease his or her productivity and lead to job loss. It could also inspire unhealthy and/or inappropriate relationships with co-workers.

 

9) Looking at porn can damage the viewer's current or future marriage sex life.

 

10) Looking at porn will increase the viewer's tendency to lie, because he or she will have a natural desire to keep it secret to avoid criticism, embarrassment, shame and/or having to surrender their habit.

 

These were gotten from http://www.porn-free.org/porn_is_bad.htm

 

HTH a little!!

Liz in NC

[swellmomma]

A friend caught her teen son looking at porn once and I believe she told him that since he enjoys looking at filth, he can clean. I think over the course of a few days he cleaned all of the windows, baseboards, gutters, etc. I'm sure there were other consequences that probably had to do with their Catholic beliefs.

 

This is similiar to what I have done. Ds10 is so young but I have caught him online looking for porn. I have password protected the computer, put on parental controls and made him clean like there was no tomorrow. I have done similar things for other bad behaviour, like when he was swearing a lot, I told him since he like "potty talk" so much he could clean potties, so he scrubbed our toilets and also had to pick up the neigbors dog poop (they have 3 dogs) for a week. The swearing was pretty much done at that point. The porn he leaves it be for a while and then like 4-6 months later I catch him again if I have forgotten to log off or something. So then we go back to cleaning etc

[Mom0012]

I think not allowing him to use the computer is a reasonable consequence. I really wouldn't do anything beyond that with a child his age.

 

Lisa

[woolybear]

Swellmomma--this is in no way judging you (because I truly see the possibility of myself being in your shoes) but I am wondering how a 10 yo even has the idea to look for such things. I could understand more if he was in school but hs keeps kids away from some of that influence. I suppose there could be neighborhood kids, stuff you stumble over, older family members (cousins,etc.). I'm just thinking out loud here. I have a ds turning 9 next week and I can just see because of his personality that if he had any awareness of it at 10 he would try to do the same thing. So, I guess I'm wondering how your son learned of it (if you know or if I'm not prying too much.)

 

One of the main problems I see with porn in general and particularly for a young man(boy) is the lack of reality. People think that what they see is real and therefor would likely expect real women to behave the same way.

 

Woolybear

[Lisa in Jax]

I'd do two things:

 

1. I'd take away all computer access for a while. If this means that you have to password protect your modem, do so. If it means that the computer itself is password protected, and you have to log him on each time, do so.

 

2. His dad and I would then sit beside him at the computer (with no 'littles" nearby/at home) and go to the site he went to. Then, have him explain to you what he saw in it, while you sit calmly by. This will embarrass him, but frankly, that's the point IMO. Ask him how he'd feel if you (or his cousin, grandmother, sister, etc.) were pictured that way. Make him feel discomfort with the topic. Don't let him get out of it by squirming -- you model calm, dispassionate behavior (even if it's hard!) and make him think about what he's viewing and what it means to the people shown in terms of dehumanizing them.

 

Just my two rupees,

 

Lisa

 

P.S. I also agree with having him do chores to make up for disobeying you.

[caitlinsmom]

I have no useful advice that hasnt already posted but I have a story to add. One of my very best male friends got pulled into the whole thing. His addiction became so bad that he no longer could have sexual relations with women. It wasnt enough to stimulate him any longer because it was no longer a body stimulation it was all mental. He had to go to counseling for a couple of years after it ruined nearly all his close relations and work. This is extreame situation but the sad truth is that it is a common situation. It has taken him a few years to be able to handle a relationship with a women the emotional intimacy being the hardest.

 

Anyway it might be worth sharing with your son so that he sees that it isnt just a little eye candy. It can have devestating effects not only on relationships with others but also on his own personal self esteen and worth. It all starts small and soon it is an avalanche.

 

Good luck

[Melissa in St Louis]

Ask him how he'd feel if you (or his cousin, grandmother, sister, etc.) were pictured that way. Make him feel discomfort with the topic. Don't let him get out of it by squirming -- you model calm, dispassionate behavior (even if it's hard!) and make him think about what he's viewing and what it means to the people shown in terms of dehumanizing them.

quote]

 

This is what I was thinking, as well. How would he feel if someone was looking at his sister that way. All women are daughters, sisters, mothers etc to someone.

[stripe]

2. His dad and I would then sit beside him at the computer (with no 'littles" nearby/at home) and go to the site he went to. Then, have him explain to you what he saw in it, while you sit calmly by. This will embarrass him, but frankly, that's the point IMO. Ask him how he'd feel if you (or his cousin, grandmother, sister, etc.) were pictured that way. Make him feel discomfort with the topic. Don't let him get out of it by squirming -- you model calm, dispassionate behavior (even if it's hard!) and make him think about what he's viewing and what it means to the people shown in terms of dehumanizing them.

 

Wow. I was thinking myself about how would one articulate the humanity of the people who have involved themselves is this, and this is a very interesting tactic. Also the idea of explaining in mundane words what someone is doing kind of takes the excitement out of it. I am not sure what I think about it, but it is thought-provoking, and, in my opinion, better than the "you like dirty stuff, so go clean windows," which I can certainly understand, but I think is ultimately a bit....silly and irrelevant. (Not the same as saying that you need to work off excess energy by helping around the house.)

 

 

There was also a 20/20 or a Dateline show - years ago - about the porn industry. It traced one actress from entering the industry to "success" in it. Again, very pitiful.

I saw a Frontline program on the porn industry a few years back and it may be the most disturbing thing I've ever seen in my life. (Seriously.) The violence coupled with sexuality aspect was especially horrific [at one point, the Frontline crew shooting the making of a porn film left the set because of what was going on].

 

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/porn/

 

The entire program is available for viewing online.

[KingM]

What your son is doing is using the porn as a masturbation aid. That's the point of it.

 

I think you can limit access to the computer, but you won't stop a 17 year old from masturbating. He'll find and hide a magazine or something.

 

My opinion is that you should state your rules--no porn ever in our house--and then tell him that he can't use the computer because he hasn't followed that rule. But if he doesn't think it's wrong, there's nothing else you can do. And since it's legal, the best you can do is limit his access to it for the next year or so and then he'll be on his own and he'll probably get a computer and spend a lot of time looking at the stuff until hopefully he gets it out of his system.

[kalanamak]

 

He's not a Christian or of any religious belief, he has been s...ually active and doesn't buy it that porn is harmful in any way. Anyone got any resources of a non-religious type that might tell him why it's so bad for you?

 

 

It bringeth much spam upon your head.

 

Ban computer use. My mother used to say "whose bread you eat, his song you sing".

[Renee in NC]

It bringeth much spam upon your head.

 

Ban computer use. My mother used to say "whose bread you eat, his song you sing".

 

It also brings many viruses upon your computer.:glare: My mother's computer techs regularly have to clean up people's computers from porn viewing.

[Remudamom]

Swellmomma--this is in no way judging you (because I truly see the possibility of myself being in your shoes) but I am wondering how a 10 yo even has the idea to look for such things. I could understand more if he was in school but hs keeps kids away from some of that influence. I suppose there could be neighborhood kids, stuff you stumble over, older family members (cousins,etc.). I'm just thinking out loud here. I have a ds turning 9 next week and I can just see because of his personality that if he had any awareness of it at 10 he would try to do the same thing. So, I guess I'm wondering how your son learned of it (if you know or if I'm not prying too much.)

 

Woolybear

 

I'm sorry, but I can't let you get away with this. How ridiculous to imagine a 10 yr old doesn't wonder about things. Any 10 yr old knows how to google, and all they have to do is google one word, and find all sorts of awful sites. Good grief, they could probably just google "girls" and get into trouble. Get real.

 

BTW- I believe I'd tell him if it happened again in my house he could pack his bags.

Edited June 28, 2009 by Remudamom

[specialmama]

The fact that these women are somebody's daughter is pretty eye opening. Does your son have a sister? Pointing out to him that these women are all victims, and they're all somebody's daughter and sister may help. Although, he may not *fully* get it till he has a daughter of his own.

 

You can dole out all the punishments you want, but he's old enough that you really can't stop him. This is a heart issue, so you need to deal with how wrong it is. To do this without God, well, good luck... but there it is.

[swimmermom3]

I wish I had something helpful to add, but I don't. Our most effective weapon here with our 14-year-old has been his older sister. She let him know what she thought about it, how it made her feel, and what she thought about the guys who brought it to school. He loves her very much and was in tears by the time she was done with him. If he were older, I don't know if he would be as receptive. Perhaps there is a girl your son respects that would be willing to talk to him about the issue.

 

One word of caution which I'm sure most of you know: all safeguards on your computer can be bypassed in a matter of minutes. If you think there is a possibility that one of your dc is viewing inappropriate materials, the only absolute safeguard is no computer activity at all or you sitting there every minute they are on.

 

I'm sorry you are dealing with this issue right now. It's no fun. :grouphug:

[Hillary in KS]

The only "consequence" can think of is for your dh to sit with him and page through the material. Perhaps asking questions like, "Is this what you think your mother and I do?" or "This woman may be someone's mother or sister. Do you want men thinking of your mother as you're thinking of this girl right now?"

 

Sometimes a little shame and putting a human reality to the image can make a lasting impression.

[yvonne]

looking at the stuff until hopefully he gets it out of his system.

 

Great to see a man weigh in on this, KingM. Thanks!

 

Do you think, once a boy starts looking at porn, that they can ever "get it out of his system"? Or does it just pull him in more and more, like an addiction? It seems like it would take a huge, conscious, long-term, struggling effort to stop.

 

With so much computer use today, I worry about one of my boys stumbling across online porn and what that would mean long-term.

 

yvonne

[swimmermom3]

Looks like specialmomma and I were thinking along the same lines at the same time. At least in our home, hell hath no fury like a sister who thinks her younger brother is behaving like scum.:D

[amy g.]

I also wanted to address how a 10 year old might stumble across porn.

 

DS was writing a term paper about video games. One of the books mentioned a scene that was taken out of a game. He went to Wikipedia to look up the name of the company that made the game, and right there at the bottom of the page was a list of further info including one titled 'sexual positions". He could have very innocently clicked on "reversed cowgirl" or some other topic.

 

I was so glad that I was sitting right next to him. He hasn't been to school since preschool, and does not watch TV or spend hours unsupervised, but he still could have stumbled upon something that might have opened the door to viewing porn.

[kiana]

I also wanted to address how a 10 year old might stumble across porn.

 

DS was writing a term paper about video games. One of the books mentioned a scene that was taken out of a game. He went to Wikipedia to look up the name of the company that made the game, and right there at the bottom of the page was a list of further info including one titled 'sexual positions". He could have very innocently clicked on "reversed cowgirl" or some other topic.

 

I was so glad that I was sitting right next to him. He hasn't been to school since preschool, and does not watch TV or spend hours unsupervised, but he still could have stumbled upon something that might have opened the door to viewing porn.

 

 

There are so many ways to accidentally find porn, and there are also jackasses out there who think it's hilarious to trick people into following links to porn sites. Once such a site has been stumbled upon, it's quite common to revisit similar sites in horrified fascination. Keep an eye on your kids! Filters don't catch everything.

 

With regards to the original post ... regardless of whether he agrees with you about it being bad (he's 17), it's still your house, your rules.

[Danestress]

If you don't want porn in your house then you really don't have to convince him that porn is bad. You just have to convince him that this is your house and you intend to make the rules in it and that anyone who wants to live there has to follow those rules. Remind him that those same rules would apply to anyone else - that your adult friends and family members are also not allowed to bring porn into your home, but that you haven't even mentioned that to them because they are adults and almost all adults operate under the assumption that you only look at porn in your own place.

 

So let him know that (1) He can't use your computer anymore at all period unless you sign him on but you may or may not choose to ever sign him on (2) He's free to move out whenever he feels like it and that even if he's underage, he's free to live somewhere where he likes the rules better and you won't call the police or insist him move home and (3) He should be especially motivated to establish a great career where he can support himself under his own roof, you think that will be an awesome development, and when he's doing that, he can look at all the porn he likes and you will keep your opinions on it to yourself because it will be his home.

[ThatCyndiGirl]

It will affect his daily life if he .........begins to see people in his daily life and fantasize (sex crimes) even in talk. People are very sensitive to se*xual harassment now.

 

 

 

 

This needs to be addressed. It is a common misconception, but sex offenders do not become sexually agressive because of porn!!!

 

Sex crimes are about POWER AND CONTROL not level of arousal!! They do not happen because people get all turned on and can't wait to have sex.

 

Power and control. Not sex. Sex is simply the weapon with which they offend.

[Chris in VA]

Thank you for your helpful replies. My son does not currently live with me, but is in treatment for drug and alcohol addiction. We see porn as the same thing--different substance, but an addiction. We are bringing it up in family counseling, and the rule is no porn, just like no other addictive substances, in our house.

 

KingM is completely right, it is a masterb...tion aid. I believe m is between ds and his body, but he is using women as objects, not seeing them as people. It doesn't help that his own cousin has pics on her FB that could be categorized as soft porn. He sees women all over the place who he feels have chosen a life in the stripping or porn industry, and does not see the exploitation that takes place. He doesn't have a clue about the damage it can do.

 

We cannot change his heart, but we can make the rule for our home. It's hard to let go of trying to control, but it's an area I'm working on in many ways.

 

I may bring this up to his counselors at treatment, and have them deny his move to the next level--it's a program where kids do certain "heart and head" work in their treatment, and then move on to the next level. He is almost on Upper Peer, one step away from coming home. He says he is committed to not using drugs anymore, and I believe him, but now he says they are nitpicking other behaviors and he's "not in treatment for that."

 

The deceit, doing what he wants when he wants, not being a man of integrity/trustworthiness, and his view of women as objects are all areas of concern we hope to continue to address. It doesn't help, either, that there are so many young women out there who like attention from a cute, nice but "bad" boys, and are willing to feed his sexual desires (and their own)--several of the ones he's hung out with (both with and without our knowledge) have come from places of very low self-esteem and, often, MI or SA. I wish he'd be around girls who would say no, but there's always one who will say yes. It's not their fault that he is getting the messages he's getting--I'm in NO way blaming young women for his choices. Just wish girls weren't offering, just like I wish there weren't any drug dealers around.

 

Always a journey.

[swimmermom3]

Oh Chris, I'm so sorry. You sound like a great mom who is doing everything that she can. Peace to you and your family. :grouphug:

[Renee in NC]

You have added a whole other dimension to it now - yes, I would tell his counselor. Yes, it is an addictive behavior that *you* cannot control, but you can control its use in your own home (and should!) I don't see how "punishment" would be effective in this situation other than natural consequences (such as not being able to move on to the next level.) It sounds as if he is not ready anyway (based on his statements about "nit-picking.")

 

:grouphug:

[Chris in VA]

Thanks, DQ (do you mind if I call you DQ? lol). It is hard for me to be courageous enough for me to take away his level movement. But I am finding that things are better brought into the light; they lose the power they seem to have when in the darkness.

[Dirtroad]

I have no useful advice that hasnt already posted but I have a story to add. One of my very best male friends got pulled into the whole thing. His addiction became so bad that he no longer could have sexual relations with women. It wasnt enough to stimulate him any longer because it was no longer a body stimulation it was all mental. He had to go to counseling for a couple of years after it ruined nearly all his close relations and work. This is extreame situation but the sad truth is that it is a common situation. It has taken him a few years to be able to handle a relationship with a women the emotional intimacy being the hardest.

 

Anyway it might be worth sharing with your son so that he sees that it isnt just a little eye candy. It can have devestating effects not only on relationships with others but also on his own personal self esteen and worth. It all starts small and soon it is an avalanche.

 

Good luck

 

I think this is an excellent example of the results. This boys (OP son) will never find a real woman to satisfy him as a wife & his relationship will be extremely stressful & he may face impotence. A REAL woman can't compete with a fantasy or image of perfection.

 

I was exposed to images as a child (magazines that my Dad had).... it haunts me to this day & often makes me look at sex as dirty.... not a gift from God OR the natural relations of a man & woman (non-relegious).

 

It also makes women meat & of little value. It is horrible.

[Dirtroad]

I'm sorry, but I can't let you get away with this. How ridiculous to imagine a 10 yr old doesn't wonder about things. Any 10 yr old knows how to google, and all they have to do is google one word, and find all sorts of awful sites. Good grief, they could probably just google "girls" and get into trouble. Get real.

 

BTW- I believe I'd tell him if it happened again in my house he could pack his bags.

 

Oops... sorry, but my 10 year old doesn't google and isn't allowed such time on the internet. There is nothing he needs yet that isn't in a book or that can't be found by me online.

 

Thankfully, due to our careful movie selection & very little tv.... he can be a happy 10 year old B.O.Y. and knows little to nothing of sex.

 

Someone told him or showed him.

 

BTW.... I do agree on being tough with this behavior. LIke the pack you bags! It is such horrible stuff!

Edited June 28, 2009 by Dirtroad

[KingM]

Even if you can't change his attitude about certain things, I would keep working on the message of respect for women. See if you can find common ground in avoiding porn that is degrading or humiliating in its message. This sort of thing could be destructive to his future relationships, even if he grows out of youthful indiscretions.

[Peggy in Va]

I thought you were referring to this son when you said, "yes, that son." Not a judgment, just looking for clarification on my part,

 

We see porn as the same thing--different substance, but an addiction.

 

As someone who has had close experience dealing w/ people who suffered from addictions, I agree with you 100%. It is possible that I am wrong, but I really don't believe for a single minute that this is a case of "teenage boy being curious or just looking for arousal".

 

We are bringing it up in family counseling, and the rule is no porn, just like no other addictive substances, in our house.

 

 

I would definitely bring this up.

 

We cannot change his heart, but we can make the rule for our home. It's hard to let go of trying to control, but it's an area I'm working on in many ways.

 

 

Chris, I can appreciate what you're saying about control, Lord knows I need to work on it. But you know as well as I do that if you don't enforce the rules and to a certain degree "control" the situation, you cross the line to enabling.

 

I may bring this up to his counselors at treatment,...

 

 

Again, I would definitely do this. And if he gets upset, too bad.

 

He says he is committed to not using drugs anymore, and I believe him, but now he says they are nitpicking other behaviors and he's "not in treatment for that."

 

This, to me, says he trading one drug of choice for another that perhaps he feels is more acceptable or not as dangerous.

 

It's not their fault that he is getting the messages he's getting--I'm in NO way blaming young women for his choices. Just wish girls weren't offering, just like I wish there weren't any drug dealers around.

 

 

Not to hold our ds harmless, but a friend of mine who is the mother to 7 girls made the comment to me once that it's always the girls fault. I think she felt like males had physical needs and if the girls would just say no and not lead them on the world would be a better place. But again, this is a completely different issue.

 

Always a journey.

 

 

And unfortunately it's frequently a bumpy ride.

 

I wish I had some more, better advice to give you. I know you've been through a lot w/ this ds. Keep in mind that the good Lord never gives us more than we can handle, although sometimes the load feels pretty darn heavy at times.

 

:grouphug: and I wish you, your family and especially your ds luck.

[EmilyK]

When I was in college in the early 80s, I saw a great documentary that showed how badly women were treated in the porn industry and the way porn affected what men looked for in women. It was pretty horrifying to everyone in the audience. I wish I knew if it were still available.

 

This probably isn't going to help the son at issue -- I agree he may be trading addictions and his counselors should know -- but I think some guys I know (middle aged now) were convinced as teens that it was all so tacky and low class and that kept them away from porn, since they wanted to be cooler than that.

 

I agree with the poster that sexual assault comes from power and abuse. That said, sadly I know of someone who escalated to an attempted sexual assault after that porn with that theme could no longer do it for him. The treatment center in prison has a long waitlist ... and the counselors thought these crimes were certainly on this rise because of this sort of porn access.

And I think it starts with treating women as objects, which is what porn teaches.

[Kathy in MD]

.......Not to hold our ds harmless, but a friend of mine who is the mother to 7 girls made the comment to me once that it's always the girls fault. I think she felt like males had physical needs and if the girls would just say no and not lead them on the world would be a better place. But again, this is a completely different issue........

 

I'm sorry, but I just had to interrupt. There are women from 3rd world countries who are kidnapped and sold into the s*xtrade. There are girls who came to this country with the promise of school and living quarters in exchange for household help who are kept in slavery and forced. There are young girls who are molested without dressing provocatively. I get tired of "it wouldn't happen if the girls didn't offer it"

 

Yes, there are women who offer it freely, or may be provocative. But it's not provocative behavior that causes people (both men and women) to kidnap women to sell into the s*xtrade. That's caused by men out to buy services.

 

BTW, the info about women being kidnapped came from a PBS program (Frontline?) about women from the former Eastern block countries being lured to other coutries, primarily Turkey, with the promise of work. There they had their passports removed and were sold into the trade. Info about girls being lured to the US and being kept virtual slaves came from the Wash. Post a few years ago. Several such cases came to light then.

[Chris in VA]

I agree--I absolutely agree. All I was saying is that I wish the girls Ds has been with had said no. That does not take away his responsibility at all. And I was mostly referring to the girls he has physically been with, not the porn issue. Just to be clear--

[anotherclassicmom]

I'm sorry that my statement was misunderstood. I did not mean sex crimes in the sense of horrific crimes. I'm talking the mild sexual harassment crimes that happen. They are considered crimes. I have seen college kids that are obsessed with porn talk nasty to girls, touch them inappropriately and describe their dirty ideas. This was more of what I was referring to. (Just to back up my opinion, I was in college when this was happening)

 

This needs to be addressed. It is a common misconception, but sex offenders do not become sexually agressive because of porn!!!

 

Sex crimes are about POWER AND CONTROL not level of arousal!! They do not happen because people get all turned on and can't wait to have sex.

 

Power and control. Not sex. Sex is simply the weapon with which they offend.

[Haiku]

 

He's not a Christian or of any religious belief, he has been s...ually active and doesn't buy it that porn is harmful in any way. Anyone got any resources of a non-religious type that might tell him why it's so bad for you?

 

 

I'm not a Christian and I think porn is harmful. However, I don't think it matters whether your son thinks it is harmful or not. It is YOUR house and YOUR computer and I am assuming that YOU pay the internet bill. Your house, your rules.

 

Suspend internet privileges. Password protect all accounts. If your son knows how to bypass that, keep the network cable with you.

 

I know that it's very popular to try to work with "young adults" (your son is not a kid, imo) on these issues, but my feeling is that if someone lives in your house, they respect your rules, whether they like them or not.

 

Tara

[Haiku]

A friend caught her teen son looking at porn once and I believe she told him that since he enjoys looking at filth, he can clean. I think over the course of a few days he cleaned all of the windows, baseboards, gutters, etc.

 

Awesome.

 

Tara

[KidsHappen]

The only book that I have ever found that deals with this from a secular point of view is Pornified by Pamela Paul. I can also tell you that you would have a very hard time convincing your son that this is wrong or a bad idea or has the possibility of causing problems. You can not change the way he thinks or feels about the matter. What you can do it say, "MY HOUSE, MY RULES!" so not in my house. And then do your very best to make it impossible for him to access it in your house. So sorry you are dealing with this. :grouphug:

[rafiki]

.

[Peggy in Va]

I'm sorry, but I just had to interrupt. There are women from 3rd world countries who are kidnapped and sold into the s*xtrade. There are girls who came to this country with the promise of school and living quarters in exchange for household help who are kept in slavery and forced. There are young girls who are molested without dressing provocatively. I get tired of "it wouldn't happen if the girls didn't offer it"

 

Yes, there are women who offer it freely, or may be provocative. But it's not provocative behavior that causes people (both men and women) to kidnap women to sell into the s*xtrade. That's caused by men out to buy services.

 

BTW, the info about women being kidnapped came from a PBS program (Frontline?) about women from the former Eastern block countries being lured to other coutries, primarily Turkey, with the promise of work. There they had their passports removed and were sold into the trade. Info about girls being lured to the US and being kept virtual slaves came from the Wash. Post a few years ago. Several such cases came to light then.

 

I'm very sorry if my comment that was directed to Chris' statement offended you, but I completely understood what she was saying.

 

In know way did I mean to imply that the women who are victims should be held responsible for the many horrific events and situations that occur on a daily basis. These deplorable acts of violence on the mind, body, and spirit of these women are beyond sad; and I don't think, by the grace of God, that they are anything we can truly even begin comprehend unless we have been victims ourselves. Unlike most wounds, these scars sometimes never heal.

 

My comment, however, was based on the observations of a mother who, in an effort to keep her daughters chaste, believed that many problems involved in such an endeavor wouldn't exist if girls didn't lead boys on and/or just said no. Believe me, in no way was she implying or even thinking of the girls and women who are forced to endure the acts you are referring to. She was simply talking about your average teenage/young adult female.

 

There are young girls who are molested without dressing provocatively

. Yes, I know, I was one of those girls. However, it does not blind me to the fact that premarital acts take two parties, often with both parties consenting.

[specialmama]

Yes, I know, I was one of those girls.

 

 

Wanted to offer Peggy a hug first... :grouphug: I'm so sorry you went through that. :grouphug:

 

 

I know people say it (sex crimes) are about power. I agree... in some cases. But porn viewing can become addictive, and spur on crimes. There are many criminals who have admitted that porn urged them on. They became addicted to it, had to keep raising the bar so that more shocking things were seen, then they just committed the crime. I lived in Toronto in 2003, when 10 yr old Holly Jones was taken from her walk home from school. Her assaulter, and killer, was watching porn at the time, and he just got an urge and did it. Quote: "Briere (the killer) gets an automatic life sentence with no chance of parole for 25 years. Briere told the court he was consumed by desire after viewing child pornography. He then abducted and killed Holly." He's not alone. There have been studies done through Focus on the Family where they've asked criminals what spurred them on, and the majority (if not all) said porn. I can't find that link right now, but here's one of Ted Bundy, admitting it was porn that inspired him to kill at least 35 women. http://www.citizenlink.org/turnsignal/A000009143.cfm You know, I'd let your son watch this clip, and go through some of the articles that Focus lists when you search for p*rnography. He needs a sober reality check if he thinks this is harmless.

 

ETA: I found some more stuff about that study. Here is an article about the study that details many s&x crimes spurred on by porn*graphy http://www2.focusonthefamily.com/docstudy/newsletters/A000000761.cfm and the actual study done, which was led by a cross-sampling of society (Christians, atheists, Jews, etc) was called the Attorney General’s Commission on Pornography, which you could google.

Edited June 29, 2009 by specialmama